What must we do to protect our White culture?

[guyser]

Nevertheless, in ranting against foreigners, quebecers, Muslims et al, he is clearly decrying the way English Canada's traditional culture and traditions have been under constant erosion, and the growing numbers of "other" which are swamping many Canadian cities.

Ya sure? Like what has eroded? Funny, I see it as having being expanded and culturally enriched. This city was boring way back when. I know I know, your white little enclave is now multi coloured.

Hell, the majority of people in Toronto weren't even raised in Canada. It is a city of foreigners with only varying acquaintance with Canadian culture. In the neighbourhood where I used to live I was the distinct minority, and English was rarely heard. Why should that be the case in Canada? Why should I be made to feel like the minority in my own country because of idiotic immigration policies designed by elitists who don't have to live with the results?

You lived in a neighbourhood with other than English speaking people. Bet it was a pretty good place, maybe with moms home most of the time, the children supervised and lots of good eats. But nope, you just decry the language.

"Made to feel like a minority"....ah the great tactic of promoting falsehoods. No one but your own sense of entitlement , aside from your intolerance and ignorance, makes you feel anything.

[Rue]

This is in response to the love comments from Moxie which I quote with quotation marks;

"do we continue to allow them to drain the White cultural lifeblood out of Canada"

"I prefer to ignore those who freak out when they here the term "White Man""

"Why are "White" and "Native" peoples excluded from multicultual events, why are they denied funding?"

"For the following special interest groups cash is abundant: Pakies, East Indians, Lebanese, Greek, Asians etc."

"Name something the above group did to shape or mold this country? "

"where is this multiculture horse shit everyone blathers on about. IT doesn't exist, it's a lie perpetrated by the Liberals to get the VOTE from immigrants and minorities of color."

"In Canada we have Christmas, Easter, Valentines Day, our roots and our culture is Christian White, "

First of all Moxie you made an earlier comment that Canada is not democratic nd then you accused it of being both socialist and facist at the same time. I would suggest you try travel outside Canada and understand what it is to live in a totalitarian state before you whine about Canada. I would also suggest your confusion as to facism and socialism may stem from the own confusion you indicated comes from you being half-Scott, have aboriginal which you sprinkled in your comments.

I would ask anyone to look at any of the above comments. This Argus is what this post is about. It is not about a sane, rational discussion on all of us creating and sharing a common Canadian vision-it is about hating those perceived different then the writer and of course someone like Leafless attracts posters such as the above.

As for you Moxie, you use racist words suck as Paki and I suppose that makes you feel tough right?

I am not going to waste to much energy but to say one thing-if you want to come on this forum and suggest funding for the groups you mentioned is larger then those for the other groups you mentioned, prove it. You can't because your comments are simply you expressing your own subjective presumptions. You know damn well you haven't a clue what the actual funding is handed out.

More to the point you don't go to any multi-cultural events because if you did, you would know that many aboriginal communities make it a point to reach out to other communities in multi-cultural and multi-faith events and so do man English and Scottish groups.

You would not know that because you are too busy making it up as you go along. From the sounds of your confusion as to what facism and socialism are and your claiming Canada is not democractic, I doubt you have ever travelled anywhere where you have had to understand what it is like to live without freedom.

I think you are so consumed with your own self-hatred and confusion as to what you might be like Leafless you have emersed yourself in the hate exercise that comes from a soul that can spit out what it isn't but can't say what it is and resents anyone he thinks can say what they are.

Moxie, maybe its time instead of being afraid of what you might be and imitating people that hate aboriginals simply because of their culture, maybe you should find out about that culture and your Scottish one, reconcile them and share them with others. If you think Leafless is going to sit and have a beer with you and let you move into his neighbourhood, grow up. You are right. To him you will always be a half-breed and no sucking up to his hatred and trying to join him, won't make the hate from him go away.

Many minorities think if they turn into tormentors the other tormentors will leave them alone. Got news for you Moxie. You can't escape being tormented unless you learn to accept yourself.

Now you want to act all tough like Leafless be my guest. We have an expression for people who try sound tough by imitating racists-its called a toothless man condemned to finding the rest of his life the only food available is tough steak.

[Rue]

No, actually it is not. First, you are simplifying what he said and altering it to meet with your own preconceptions. He is not talking about people who don't "think or look like him" he is talking about foreigners who come here with their own cultural baggage, their own belief system, their own patriotism, in many cases, for their own country, and have little if any intention of assimliating into Canadian society.

Leafless posted"Simple question.

What must White Canadians do to protect our White cultural and Christian associated traditions, that have been ravished or undermined by Quebec culture, Aboriginal culture and immigrants and their imposing cultures?

Canadian streets are now full of ethnic foreigners, our hospitals are full of Islamic Muslim doctors and stores full of ethnic help and our English language being attacked by forces of government to impose the French language

No, pretty sure that Leafless was talking about anyone NOT white , including but not limited to other non-white CDNs.

As for alterations, I dont think Rue is the one trying to meet any preconceptions. Leafless missed by a country mile whatever he was trying to say.

Guyser he didn't miss what I said at all and that is precisely why he told me to f..ck off and called me a "fag". He panicked. He has no idea what he is and if he's asked to state it, of course he lashes out. Its supposed to scare me and deflect from the fact he can't answer. That is what cowards do. They first come on and sound all tough and tell others what they aren't and what they can never be, then when he's confronted and asked a simple question-just what are you Leafless, all he can do is cling to the negatives.

I challenge anyone to read ANY thing Leafless has said and show me what his culture is. I know you can tell me what it isn't.

I also think Guyser that the difference between ScottUSA or Argus is I know where they are coming from. I totally disagree with them but I know where they come from and I get it and I get what they say. I do not think they hate anyone but they have strong values they want to honour. I do not doubt either as men nor do I need to debate them or get in their face as to their beliefs. Leafless I do because he is a man who

in fact exploits people like Scott and Argus and pretends he is with them when he despises what they stand for as much as he does what I stand for because when push comes to shove I do not think for a second Argus or ScottUSA will place me in a camp because I disagree with them-and that is something Leafless has no time of day for. What he has stated isn't defining what he is-its a pretense for trying to change the law simply to favour what-ever is best for him at any given moment.

Postit got it dead on. If you read what went on in Nazi Germany you had Germans stating that National Socialism was designed to protect their culture from the threat of Jews and non Christians. Soon it turned onnot just Jews but Christians, socialists, gays, and traditional conservatives who I would equate with Argus.

It became simply a philosophy of marginalized men who had never made much of themselves in life, suddenly being able to wear a brown or black shirt. They had not a clue what they stood for like Leafless, and so they needed to wear uniforms to compensate and make those uniforms seem like that is what they stood for. When you listen to

Hitler's speeches and those written by Goebbels there are ample references to what Germans were not, but when it came to express what they were, the references to Aryanism became confused. They began to bastardize references to Hindu or Zoroastrean/Persian culture.

The people attracted to this were people who felt they could not get good jobs or others were taking their jobs away from them. So they put on a brown or black shirt, dressed up in riding pants and did sometimes no different then what Leafless has done with his words-warn people about the demise of a culture as a result of vermin from within.

And then yes it atrracted the Moxies, more and more people not certain of who they were suddenly feeling they could be something important by putting down others.

All Adolph Eichman was, was a failed chicken farmer. Goebbels an unemployed failure. Gerring- a heroin addict who kept his predeliction to have sex with young boys hidden-Rudplph Hess, a chronic depressive alcoholic. Yah a bunch of tough guys. Hitler, was simply a dysfunctional failed artist who could not sustain an erection and had an inability to be spontaneous or create as manifested in his art and his book Mein Kempf which is a remarkably fragmented and disjointed discourse that says what he hated and wanted destroyed but could not describe what he wanted to build. In fact Hitler needed a man like Wilhelm Schrier or others to build for him because he had no vision. It was why he could not sustain leadership in battle. His mind could not create and improvise, it could only react, then label and compartmentalize as is the case with anyone who can't find their way to being able to think but can mimmick.

In any event Guyser what I find truly sad is that the Leafless comments tend to incite others who also hate themselves as we saw iit Moxy.'s responses Its sad humans can be so easily influenced by another's intolerance and no you will never see Leafless debate someone like me with words. He would have no clue where to start because to debate me he will have to say what he is, and under no circumstance willl he do that.

Its sad because this entire line of posts is nothing but a sham- a platform for one man to couch his hatred and sucker others into his bidding my giving it the appreance of a cultural discussion.

I have yet to see one line in this series of posts defining what this culture is being defended.

This was as I said never a discussion about how we define and share a common Canadian vision-it was and still is about one man feeling the world is out to get him to he must get the world before it gets him.

And no I do not expect anything but swear words, and words like fag and Paki coming out of it. Its not rocket science now is it.

Edited July 13, 2007 by Rue

[Rue]

Thank you for the response Argus.

You stated you believe Argus and I quote you; "is not talking about people who don't "think or look like him" he is talking about foreigners who come here with their own cultural baggage, their own belief system, their own patriotism..."

To me Argus when you label people as "foreigners who have their own culture and belief systems...their own patriotism....that is just a fancy way of mincing the words and it means people who don't look or think like youand no it has nothing to do with my preconceptions, it has to do with simply reading the context in which the above is stated.

You and Scott USA for that matter, I do realize refer to people coming to Canada who have as you would say little if any intention of assimliating into Canadian society. By that I know you two are referring to honouring the laws of Canada and putting Canada first. Me and the vast majority of minorities have no problem with that comment. It is true. But that is not what Leafless is talking about. You and Scott are, not him. Read what he says and what he writes. He is not talking just about people who will not honour the laws of Canada as you and Scott are-he is talking about people who do not physically look like him or have the same blood not whether they are patriotic or not. He uses his labels and categories not because he wants to include new Canadians who will be patriotic and follow the laws, but precisely because he does not want them period. Yes Argus I did read what he has said.

You stated, "Yes, I know that if you really stretch the case that Hitler accused Jews of being outsiders."

I will not go there with you Argus because I have read the posts that come from you and Scott USA and I know you are honourable men and such concerns I have would not be directed to men like you when you discuss wanting minorities to put Canada first. I raise such concerns only with the views of Leafless.

Much of your concerns about Canadians needing to share a common Canadian vision and putting that vision first is precisely what new Canadians want when they come hear. They come hear to be Canadians not hyphenated.

I think what has happened is because Canada lacks a common vision it spreads wide spread signals it can be anything to anyone and all immigrants know that is not possible but some think they are supposed to play that game and demand rights-they think that is what they should do to be a good Canadian. You must admit this country's governments force feeds all of us this notion we are all victims in some sort of special interest group. Isn't that what Leafless is doing now. Creating for himself a victim's group and trying to get himself disability benefits?

Don't confuse the vast majority of new Canadians or immigrants with a minority who come to this country to abuse it. I can assure you there are as many immigrants just as fed up with people who come here simply use iut as a pit stop convenience store.

What I am saying Argus is those people who use Canada as a pit stop, are what you and ScottUSA are referring to. What Leafless is referring to are loyal, hard working minorities, who believe in this country and everything it stands for. I read what he writes Argus. I know what he refers to. His comments are not concerned with the same group you are. I read his words he is making negative generalizations about loyal Canadians who he thinks are getting things he thinks come at his expense.

Ask him Argus. Ask him directly if he has a problem with minorities who put Canada first.

"You seem unwilling to accept the fact that there are people here who ARE unpatrotic to Canada, who hold to their old belief systems as firmly as if they were still in the land of their upbringing."

Lol. Don't let my genuine bleeding heart Liberalism fool you. I know damn well there are people coming to this country who are terrorist sympathizers or criminals. But what I am saying is this. New Canadians don't like them any more then you do. They come here to get away from them and the last thing they want, is them coming here.

So yes Argus I do get it.But those minority of new Canadians that bring their shit here, new Canadians do not like them any better then you. They are more likely to cerce and commit crimes on their own kind before you.

You ever notice how its more likely a new Canadian will wear an I am Canadian shirt or get all happy at Canada day then a third generation Canadian? Why is that? You really think that is the fault of immigrants or should we also be directing this lack of Canadian vision back to Canadians precisely like Leafless who have become lazy and take what they have for granted and whine and complain when they can't have things their way.

"Just what do you think constitutes being a "Canadian"? Anyone who gets the paperwork? For many of us, it means more than that."

Again you know where I stand Argus. I said it earlier. Canada means basic things. It means believing in all our laws and not opting out of those we don't like. It means believing in freedom of speech and permitting debate and having open elections. It means everything the Canadian soldiers in Afghanistan and Korea and World War Two and One and in Cyprus and in Serbia and in the UN peace forces in the Middle East stood for-it means believing we put reason before anger- and respect for our country before individual needs. It means not accepting terrorism as a legitimate expression of political will. It means precisely a parliamentary legislative system that comes from British and French traditions and laws but also incorporates many aboriginal traditions in the laws.

It means understanding who the aboriginals are and what systems they had in place, and then how the French and British came and what happened next. It then means knowing what the contributions of the Chinese and the Sieks were, how the blacks came here from the underground and then how the Irish, Dukhabors, Jews, Ukrainians, Armenians, etc., all then came here for the same reasons-to find new opportunities after fleeing political oppression and/or weather catastrophes.

It is about people turning adversity into opportunity. It is about people finding what all humans want- a home and a job and a place to raise children safely.

It means not having to be afraid to practice one's religion.

The only difference between you and me Argus and why our take on Leafless is different can be explained this way. See I know what Canada did ito defeat the Nazis. I was fortunate my father was in the war and I was able to grow up learning from the vets by going to the vet's hospital and legion.

I know who they were. I know how many of them were Scottish and Irish and English. I also know there were aboriginals and French and Jews and Ukrainians and others in that army, etc.

I know what they died for. I know they died so I could live in freedom. The only reason I have a bit of a different take is because while I have no problem being loyal to the vision those men died for and are dying for now in Afghanistan you bet I have a problem with Mckenzie King and his rabid anti-semitism and refusing to take in Jewish refugees from the holocaust. See I know the same country that has given me everything I have and will always be grateful for was also led by McKenzie King and other anti-semites like his kind including facist sympathizers and anti-semites in Quebec where I was born, who if they had their way would never have allowed my kind here and could have cared less if we were all exterminated. So no, as much as I love this country I don't kid myself for one second either and neither does any minority. We all know what the Leaflesses of Canada stand for and what they want. We have no illusions. Don't mistake having no illusions with having preconceptions. What I am saying is we know a duck when we see a duck.

None of us Jew, gentile, Christian, black, etc., want to be tred upon and have it suggested because we have a different culture or skin tone this in itself makes us a threat to Canada and that is what Leafless said and he will never retract it Argus.

You and Scott argue classic patriotism which you apply to all equally, white or non white. That is not my problem or what I disagree with.

Leafless is talking something entirely different.

Oh I read it. He is saying there is no opportunity to show one's loyalty and come and build this country-he is not about giving people a chance-

he is about avoiding giving them a chance because he feels they will take his job away. No more no less.

That is why Argus I may not be gay but I sure as hell will defend them when Leafless rights diatribes against them. I may not be French or aborignal

or Muslim but I sure as hell won't sit while he excludes them. I have no choice Argus. I would be a pathetic excuse of a Jew if I sat back and

said nothing and I would be a pathetic excude of a Canadian and a man if I sat back and said nothing.

Honourable men who follow a code of decency do not sit back while others bully and try exclude people simply because of their

birth right.

As for the future Argus, whether we like it or not, unfortunately we will have more terrorism attacks that will polarize us and challenge our pluralism and it

will do exactly what terrorists want it to do, fuel bigots to create racist back-lash which in turn will alienate minorities and then make them easier to recruit

as terrorists. I know the cycle. I saw it in Northern Ireland, Cyprus, Israel-Gaza-West Bank, Lebanon. The names change, but the game is the same.

That is why you won't see me assuming anything negative about Muslims or anyone else. I know damn well from seeing it first hand that the only way

the West will win this war going on now isif reach out to moderate Muslims and form an alliance with them. I know that and the terrorists sure as hell know

that.

Great civilizations and countries are built through a vision that reaches out and forms lasting peaceful relationships built on the basis of mutual respect.

That is all I am saying Argus and I regret being such a long winded bleeding heart but it has to be said.

Edited July 13, 2007 by Rue

[ScottSA]

Guyser he didn't miss what I said at all and that is precisely why he told me to f..ck off and called me a "fag". He panicked. He has no idea what he is and if he's asked to state it, of course he lashes out. Its supposed to scare me and deflect from the fact he can't answer. That is what cowards do. They first come on and sound all tough and tell others what they aren't and what they can never be, then when he's confronted and asked a simple question-just what are you Leafless, all he can do is cling to the negatives.

I challenge anyone to read ANY thing Leafless has said and show me what his culture is. I know you can tell me what it isn't.

I also think Guyser that the difference between ScottUSA or Argus is I know where they are coming from. I totally disagree with them but I know where they come from and I get it and I get what they say. I do not think they hate anyone but they have strong values they want to honour. I do not doubt either as men nor do I need to debate them or get in their face as to their beliefs. Leafless I do because he is a man who

in fact exploits people like Scott and Argus and pretends he is with them when he despises what they stand for as much as he does what I stand for because when push comes to shove I do not think for a second Argus or ScottUSA will place me in a camp because I disagree with them-and that is something Leafless has no time of day for. What he has stated isn't defining what he is-its a pretense for trying to change the law simply to favour what-ever is best for him at any given moment.

Postit got it dead on. If you read what went on in Nazi Germany you had Germans stating that National Socialism was designed to protect their culture from the threat of Jews and non Christians. Soon it turned onnot just Jews but Christians, socialists, gays, and traditional conservatives who I would equate with Argus.

It became simply a philosophy of marginalized men who had never made much of themselves in life, suddenly being able to wear a brown or black shirt. They had not a clue what they stood for like Leafless, and so they needed to wear uniforms to compensate and make those uniforms seem like that is what they stood for. When you listen to

Hitler's speeches and those written by Goebbels there are ample references to what Germans were not, but when it came to express what they were, the references to Aryanism became confused. They began to bastardize references to Hindu or Zoroastrean/Persian culture.

The people attracted to this were people who felt they could not get good jobs or others were taking their jobs away from them. So they put on a brown or black shirt, dressed up in riding pants and did sometimes no different then what Leafless has done with his words-warn people about the demise of a culture as a result of vermin from within.

And then yes it atrracted the Moxies, more and more people not certain of who they were suddenly feeling they could be something important by putting down others.

All Adolph Eichman was, was a failed chicken farmer. Goebbels an unemployed failure. Gerring- a heroin addict who kept his predeliction to have sex with young boys hidden-Rudplph Hess, a chronic depressive alcoholic. Yah a bunch of tough guys. Hitler, was simply a dysfunctional failed artist who could not sustain an erection and had an inability to be spontaneous or create as manifested in his art and his book Mein Kempf which is a remarkably fragmented and disjointed discourse that says what he hated and wanted destroyed but could not describe what he wanted to build. In fact Hitler needed a man like Wilhelm Schrier or others to build for him because he had no vision. It was why he could not sustain leadership in battle. His mind could not create and improvise, it could only react, then label and compartmentalize as is the case with anyone who can't find their way to being able to think but can mimmick.

In any event Guyser what I find truly sad is that the Leafless comments tend to incite others who also hate themselves as we saw iit Moxy.'s responses Its sad humans can be so easily influenced by another's intolerance and no you will never see Leafless debate someone like me with words. He would have no clue where to start because to debate me he will have to say what he is, and under no circumstance willl he do that.

Its sad because this entire line of posts is nothing but a sham- a platform for one man to couch his hatred and sucker others into his bidding my giving it the appreance of a cultural discussion.

I have yet to see one line in this series of posts defining what this culture is being defended.

This was as I said never a discussion about how we define and share a common Canadian vision-it was and still is about one man feeling the world is out to get him to he must get the world before it gets him.

And no I do not expect anything but swear words, and words like fag and Paki coming out of it. Its not rocket science now is it.

If there is a subject I know inside and out, with all sorts of academic letters attached to the knowledge, it's WW II and its associated philosophies, particularly Nazism, and that is very much one of the reasons I am terrified of what may come here. Just as an aside, I'm fortunate enough to be editing some translations from Yiddish at the moment...holocaust survivor historical testimonials...and at the risk of copyright infringement, although I believe this material is at the moment not covered by copyright, I'd like to post a bit here, just so that all those to whom the holocaust is a far away thing in a far away time can get a bit closer to it for a moment. For those who aren't familiar with Yiddish, "shetl" means 'town' or 'city':

...My dear father Moshe Yosef, a thin and sickly Jew, a God fearing Jew: He was loyal and devoted to us, but he only knew a few years of happiness and pride. He had the luck to die in 1940 before the horrible massacre. I believe that afterwards many were envious of him.

Pinyeh my dear brother, also knew only a few years of happiness. His aspiration to travel to Eretz Israel was very intense. He stayed alone with my mother until the last days, and they were murdered together.

And now, last but not least, I especially want to honor the memory of my dear devoted mother, Chaya Yehudis, daughter of Avraham Abah, of blessed memory, since I don’t have the opportunity to go to the mass grave in Kamin (although there is almost certainly no remaining trace). May my short memoir serve as a tombstone.

[]

With the outbreak of the terrible war, the shtetl was threatened by the danger of becoming occupied by the German murderers. The Red Army arrived. A great many Jewish refugees arrived from Poland. Everything changed, food, articles and merchandise vanished. Shops were closed down. In the beginning, chaos ruled. They didn’t pray in the Beis Medrash; they arranged a minayn (quorum) at Faivishe’s home. The Lisheh Jews became united, no longer on different sides, we held ourselves together. I was then drafted into the Red Army. I was envious of my friends who stayed in Lisheh. Bidding farewell to my home, to my mother, was very hard. Her bitter tears when bidding me farewell were a kind of farewell forever.

In 1944 after the liberation, I wrote to my mother and I received an answer from Chanah Asher’s, the only girl who survived. Of course, her answer was a very bitter one. I also received an answer from the N.K.V.D., on the reverse side of the postcard that I sent, with these words: “Tovarishtsh Swartz, vasheh vsiyeh rodstvieniki fogibli ot ruk niemietzkich zachvatshikov v-1942 godu.” All of your relatives were murdered by the fascist kidnappers in the year 1942. And that is how I learned about the sad news.

Lisheh and its surrounding suburbs is no more. It has vanished. Deaf and mute are the walls of the ruins that absorbed the prayers; the sounds of ecstasy and grief. Everything is destroyed, the houses, the Beis Medrash. There is no trace of the holy cemetery. Everything which was beloved and dear was mercilessly cut away by the murderous hands. They deported my mother to Kamin and, together with all the Kamin Jews, she was brutally murdered on 27 Av 5702.

The delicate figure of my mother Chayah Yehudis, uncle, aunts, relatives, and all the Jews of Lisheh and Kamin and its surroundings will always stand before us and we will never forget and never allow anyone to forget.

May their souls be bound up in the purity and holiness of all the Jewish communities that were destroyed.

And may God revenge their blood.

It's gone, but you can feel the visceral agony in the quaint old world translation...something I tried to keep as much of as possible in the edit. And the rage.

In another thread I brought up one vision of what might happen when, and I use "when" instead of "if" advisedly, the economy tanks or a massive attack hits North America and fundamentally disrupts our lives, or even a slow dynamic begins to take place. It can't happen here? Of course it can...we've just forgotten. The other side of the coin is exactly what you point out above, although I think you're being grossly unfair in deigning to be able to 'know' what motivates Leafless. We are building a Balkans, and one way or another the future will, I believe, be very dark.

Edited July 13, 2007 by ScottSA

[Moxie]

LOL quite the bullie aren't you Rue, well as I predicted the namby pamby crowd would snot and bawl. Since you felt the need to "Personally Attack" me I'll respond in kind.

Rue wrote: As for you Moxie, you use racist words suck as Paki and I suppose that makes you feel tough right?

Well as far as Paki goes my neighbour uses it all the time discribing himself is that word like the N word off limits to us half whites Rue?

Rue wrote:

More to the point you don't go to any multi-cultural events because if you did, you would know that many aboriginal communities make it a point to reach out to other communities in multi-cultural and multi-faith events and so do man English and Scottish groups.

Well ole sage of bovine poo I've attended hundreds that's how I know who gets to participate and those who are excluded. Been out of Torona lately their buttercup. The Native Community stage their OWN events because they are never included in the Feds Multicult love fest. Diddo for the Scots and the Irish they are funded on the Provincial lever. Ya don't get out much do ya.

Rue wrote: You would not know that because you are too busy making it up as you go along. From the sounds of your confusion as to what facism and socialism are and your claiming Canada is not democractic, I doubt you have ever travelled anywhere where you have had to understand what it is like to live without freedom.

Again really sorry to disappoint ya there little man but I've lived all over Canada from Sea to shining Sea including the Rock. I've also traveled to the US and Europe, you been past Hasting Street lately son? Regarding Facism well the liberals haven't used violence yet to keep us dependant on the state but I can see it in our future if they get into power yet again. Currently the liberals senators did "Blackmail and threaten" our PM (the fella that was elected not appointed to the gravy train by his fellow fiberals) to allow kyoto or they'd veto the budget. You know the budget that was passed by those elected MPs. Following me their sunshine, the only time Canadians are allowed to participate in a democracy is when we vote the rest of the time our duly elected politicians do as they wish to appease the minority ergo a socialist country. When the will of the majority is suppressed for the minority it's a socialist country. Well I could mention Quebec, but lad you ain't that bright.

Rue wrote:

I think you are so consumed with your own self-hatred and confusion as to what you might be like Leafless you have emersed yourself in the hate exercise that comes from a soul that can spit out what it isn't but can't say what it is and resents anyone he thinks can say what they are.

LOL there you go again with your socialist namby pamby horseshit, my heavens you people use the word hate like a light sabor sword. It has no power over those of us who just don't care what the left/left think. Pityfully funny group.

Rue wrote:

Moxie, maybe its time instead of being afraid of what you might be and imitating people that hate aboriginals simply because of their culture, maybe you should find out about that culture and your Scottish one, reconcile them and share them with others. If you think Leafless is going to sit and have a beer with you and let you move into his neighbourhood, grow up. You are right. To him you will always be a half-breed and no sucking up to his hatred and trying to join him, won't make the hate from him go away.

I'm not the least bit afraid, I am a half breed. Leafless didn't strike me as a racist only someone who values Canadian Culture but you haters on the left/left hate Canadian Culture because it distroys your myth of Multi CULT. And a Cult of fools follow it happyly along, enjoy your ignorance. I'm a hater of Multicult and damn proud of it. Canadians don't need to cower anymore because bullies such as yourself lost your power several years ago. Suck it up skippy. As for power sharing with Leafless, leaf you can have all the power, I work alone.

Rue wrote:

Many minorities think if they turn into tormentors the other tormentors will leave them alone. Got news for you Moxie. You can't escape being tormented unless you learn to accept yourself.

LOL buttercup I have a degree a trade license and a business diploma spare me your Mall Psychology 101. Your Narcissistic attitude is funny thou. I'll take your advice and place it on the compost pile, ta thanks for the manure of words.

Rue wrote:

Now you want to act all tough like Leafless be my guest. We have an expression for people who try sound tough by imitating racists-its called a toothless man condemned to finding the rest of his life the only food available is tough steak.

LOL there ya go again because I think Canadian Culture is important and should supercede new immigrants culture. Dah it's okay for the Islamic Countries to do it but not us Westeners. Like I care what you think, shove it up your well you get the idea. As for being tough, oh you have no idea son-none. Bully me again and you'll see what I'm made of. I responded this time with humour trust me I can burn your retinas with my words.

P.S Rue, you are the one who is a racists hater, what did us white Canadians ever do to you? Did we take your spot in the poggy line, welfare line, Cousin It wasn't allowed in through the back door visa vie a container pier in Vancober?

[Posit]

There's no such thing as "Canadian" culture. (except perhaps some tokens borrowed from immigrants). It is a myth.

... it's WW II and its associated philosophies, particularly Nazism, and that is very much one of the reasons I am terrified of what may come here.

Its already here. You exemplify what you fear. And while you may attempt to provide a rational argument to racism and bigotry, no matter....it is still racism and bigotry. When you can truly acknowledge that then the fear of fascism will have reversed its course.

[Leafless]

[

I challenge anyone to read ANY thing Leafless has said and show me what his culture is. I know you can tell me what it isn't.

This thread has nothing to do with the culture of Leafless.

But if you want to talk about culture, let's talk.

My family has roots in Canada since around 1879.

My cultural is purely Canadian oriented and not associated in any way shape or form from where my family originally immigrated from and place no importance on any other cultural trait that has been inherited by family members over many decades of living in Canada.

I believe in the founders of this great country England and it is their culture and language and laws that have made Canada a great country and no one else's.

England GAVE us Canada and the Queen is still Canada's head of state and the monarchy is an important part of Canada's history and the least we can do is be forever grateful this gift.

I believe in capitalism and freedom.

I believe in the institutions that have formed backbone of Canadian cultural and traditions.

But what I don't believe in is corrupt federal political parties who have been trying in earnest to change the cultural face of Canada for interest that can be best described as not in the best interest of majority White English speaking Canadians.

This is what people like Rue and guyser don't understand, our loyalties and believes are different.

they place their faith in a constitution that was written behind closed doors like some communist country without the participation of Canadians to accept or reject Canada's so called racist and discriminatory so called 'Charter of rights and Freedoms'.

I don't know what the nationality of Rue or guyser is but I bet dollars to donuts it is non-White or a Quebecer.

[lost&outofcontrol]

Please define "white" culture first.

[ScottSA]

There's no such thing as "Canadian" culture. (except perhaps some tokens borrowed from immigrants). It is a myth.

... it's WW II and its associated philosophies, particularly Nazism, and that is very much one of the reasons I am terrified of what may come here.

Its already here. You exemplify what you fear. And while you may attempt to provide a rational argument to racism and bigotry, no matter....it is still racism and bigotry. When you can truly acknowledge that then the fear of fascism will have reversed its course.

Yes, no doubt bland agreement and passive accceptance of everything that happens around you is far preferable to directing it in some way. Why do your ilk persist in trying to shut people up by trotting out these idiocies like "bigotry" every time someone has an opinion on the world they'd like to live in? How lame.

[Posit]

I believe in the founders of this great country England and it is their culture and language and laws that have made Canada a great country and no one else's.

So we're back on the track that "white" culture is really "Anglo Saxon protestant" culture...right?

I'll repeat just for you....there is NO such thing as "Canadian culture". Your idea that it somehow stems from English blue blood is as obtuse as Quebequois believing there is such a thing as pur laine.

In order for a particular people to express a culture it must be accompanied by cultural icons and traditions. Canada has none of these and I challenge anyone to present any that haven't originated in another culture. If we are talking about English culture that is one thing but Canadian culture is not English culture and certainly no where near anything resembling a "white" culture.

IF you agree that Canada is multicultural (and denounce the concept that it is exclusively white or "English") then you might have a chance at making an argument outside of the framed bigotry and racism presented thus far. Then we can also include hundreds of icons and traditions that together form Canada as a cultural nation.

The fact is there is no exclusive culture that defines Canada. It just doesn't exist.

Edited July 14, 2007 by Posit

[Posit]

......in trying to shut people up by trotting out these idiocies like "bigotry" every time......blah blah blah.....

I've not tried to shut you up. Rather your "bigotry" IS an opinion...just a rather ignorant and uneducated one.....

Edited July 14, 2007 by Posit

[ScottSA]

......in trying to shut people up by trotting out these idiocies like "bigotry" every time......blah blah blah.....

I've not tried to shut you up. Rather your "bigotry" IS an opinion...just a rather ignorant and uneducated one.....

Ignorant and uneducated, huh? I sincerely doubt you have the slightest notion...not the slightest.

[ScottSA]

The fact is there is no exclusive culture that defines Canada. It just doesn't exist.

I think that's his problem. People like you, wandering blissfully toward the edge of the cliff assuring everyone that the way down will be entertained with "vibrant" and "diverse" street festivals, and accusing everyone who doesn't like the side effects of all this peachy "harmony", including Asian gangs, bullets flying, bomb plots hatching, and any number of new found ills, of being "bigots." Hell I'd rather be a bigot any day than a deaf, dumb and blind lemming.

[Leafless]

So we're back on the track that "white" culture is really "Anglo Saxon protestant" culture...right?

Sorry to disappoint you Posit but Christianity is the main religion in Britain to-day.

Christianity is the religion of Britain. Sure there are many Protestants but there are many Catholics and most of the world's religions are practiced in Britain.

In Canada the main religion also is Christianity but their are more Catholics than Protestants and this is reflected by the majority White English speaking Canadians.

http://www.woodlands-junior.kent.sch.uk/cu.../religions.html

I'll repeat just for you....there is NO such thing as "Canadian culture". Your idea that it somehow stems from English blue blood is as obtuse as Quebequois believing there is such a thing as pur laine.

You sound like a very bitter, envious person to be so critical of the White majority culture.

There are many components to the White established culture like consumerism, materialism, theater, our institutions, television, only to name a few.

Canadian culture has nothing to do with "English blue blood" but yes English history and borrowed traditions include. the ENGLISH LANGUAGE, CHRISTMAS, REMEMBRANCE DAY, EASTER, FISH AND CHIPS, DRINKING TEA. We even have images of the QUEEN printed on our money.

In order for a particular people to express a culture it must be accompanied by cultural icons and traditions. Canada has none of these and I challenge anyone to present any that haven't originated in another culture. If we are talking about English culture that is one thing but Canadian culture is not English culture and certainly no where near anything resembling a "white" culture.

We do have cultural icons nasmely famous Canadians. Here are some famous Canadians:

#1 Avril Lavigne

#2 Pamela Anderson

#3 Romeo Dallaire

#4 Shania Twain

#5 Nelly Furtado

#6 Estella Warren

#7 Sum41

#8 Shannon Tweed

#9 Barenakedladies

#10 Keanu Reeves

#11 Celine Dion

#12 Alanis Morissette

#13 Peter North

#14 Bryan Adams

#15 Neil Young

#16 Jim Carrey

#17 Natasha Henstridge

#18 Jennifer Tilly

#19 Sarah McLachlan

#20 Leonard Cohen

And we do have traditons already mentioned including our special one, Canada Day.

IF you agree that Canada is multicultural (and denounce the concept that it is exclusively white or "English") then you might have a chance at making an argument outside of the framed bigotry and racism presented thus far. Then we can also include hundreds of icons and traditions that together form Canada as a cultural nation.

Of course Canada is multicultural.

I never did say Canada was exclusively White.

What I did say is that White English speaking Canadians are the majority in Canada that are mostly responsible for maintaining and the carrying on of White or Western cultures and traditions.

The fact is there is no exclusive culture that defines Canada. It just does not exist.

Your off in deep space somewhere. I have just proven it is the majority culture and traditions that define Canada.

How can there be other cultures when we are all Canadian culture by name?

I will go so far to say there are Canadian sub-cultures that chose to be identified that way, but that is what they are minority subcultures if they choose not to participate in Canada's majority culture.

[Posit]

You've proven nothing. Those people are just as famous in the US and some overseas. They have nothing to do with "culture" let alone "white culture" especially since you have mixed Quebequois, Ukrainian, Aboriginal, etc. in the list.

Icons are the symbols of culture. Such as poutine being a Quebequois cultural icon. There are no specific identifiable Canadian symbols that come close to identifying culture.

Religion is religion. The majority don't define culture either. It has nothing to do with elections or majority rule. Culture is represented by long-standing traditions. Christmas and Easter are religious holidays. Of course if you are talking about Cinter Claus, St. Nicolas or any of the many borrowed iconic myths well then you know where this goes. We'd have to examine German and Dutch culture first to see if those traditions have anything to do with Canada. The Easter Bunnny falls into the same hole - a borrowed myth. Many of those dearly held religious traditions actually come from pagan rites.

Religious traditions stem from the European dominance in Christianity and then we'd have to look to immigrants for bringing them here to Canada.

Canadian culture is myth. No bitterness here. Just an assertion you can't prove your myth.

Funny how ScottSA complains about lemmings when he follows the worst of leaders - his own blind ignorance. But let's not talk about your incompetence. I challenged you to prove Canadian or White culture through the use of traditions and icons. So far all you have proven is your uneducated assumptions.

Edited July 14, 2007 by Posit

[ScottSA]

Funny how ScottSA complains about lemmings when he follows the worst of leaders - his own blind ignorance. But let's not talk about your incompetence. I challenged you to prove Canadian or White culture through the use of traditions and icons. So far all you have proven is your uneducated assumptions.

Would you like to have a contest over how many letters is appended to each of our names? Or how much of the world each of us has seen outside the insular neverneverland of the west? And while we're wondering which one of us is smarter, better educated, and more travelled, why don't we examine some of your notions...

Never mind icons, what about government? Did we all get together in a rainbow of colors and decide we'd like to have democracy? Well, no. Even the ridiculous myth making the rounds in the US about democracy evolving from the Iroquis doesn't apply. Parliamentary democracy evolved in Britain, not a skin tent in the northwoods. Or a yurt, for that matter. Our predominant religion, our tradition of freedom, including free speech, our economy, our predominant language, the philosophy from which our ideas spring; even your marxist mindfarts; all of it comes from the west. Even the third world immigrants came here on planes and ships developed in the west. Pretending that we don't have a culture well rooted in western traditions is foolish and displays a profound ignorance on your part. Denying that it is in danger of being lost is just plain stupid.

[Posit]

If you have that many letters after your name, all it proves is that you can't spell......

Say something smart

BTW I said prove it. Stop making arguments based on your myth and prove the icons.

Edited July 14, 2007 by Posit

[ScottSA]

If you have that many letters after your name, all it proves is that you can't spell......

Say something smart

BTW I said prove it. Stop making arguments based on your myth and prove the icons.

We're not speaking in Urdu. When you get up to pee, you have a sit down toilet, not one of the fascinating footpad toilets of the east. When you fly, you fly in a western invention, when you drive, you drive in a western invention, when you pedal, you pedal in a....why am I bothering to explain what any moderately sentient human being knows already? Are you quite alright? Just having a fit of the Really Stupids?

[Posit]

American INVENTIONS not cultural icons. Try again.

You obviously don't understand what a cultural icon or tradition is.

Edited July 14, 2007 by Posit

[KO2]

I told my kids that rather than be afraid or prejudiced of "Coloured People" they should think of marrying one, so that we of the strawberry blond and fair complexion might have offspring with more melanim? in the skin. Survival of the fittest. Generational protection for my offspring as our ozone layer depletes.

I'm proud to say my son took me up on my wisdom.

I have two lovely grandchildren who don't appear as if they will need to worry about skin cancer.

My motto from genetics is; the bigger the gene pool, the better the mix.

Edited July 14, 2007 by KO2

[Peter F]

If you have that many letters after your name, all it proves is that you can't spell......

BTW I said prove it. Stop making arguments based on your myth and prove the icons.

ScottSA won't say it. He aludes; he hints; he uses innuendo; he gets others to say it for him; But he will not say it for himself.

I think that's his problem. People like you, wandering blissfully toward the edge of the cliff assuring everyone that the way down will be entertained with "vibrant" and "diverse" street festivals, and accusing everyone who doesn't like the side effects of all this peachy "harmony", including Asian gangs, bullets flying, bomb plots hatching, and any number of new found ills, of being "bigots." Hell I'd rather be a bigot any day than a deaf, dumb and blind lemming.

What is he trying to say? Why would an obviously well educated man, with many letters behind his name, piss-ant around? Why is he so terrified of actually saying what he means?

Parliamentary democracy evolved in Britain, not a skin tent in the northwoods. Or a yurt, for that matter. Our predominant religion, our tradition of freedom, including free speech, our economy, our predominant language, the philosophy from which our ideas spring; even your marxist mindfarts; all of it comes from the west. Even the third world immigrants came here on planes and ships developed in the west. Pretending that we don't have a culture well rooted in western traditions is foolish and displays a profound ignorance on your part. Denying that it is in danger of being lost is just plain stupid.

More piss-anting around. Make your point, man.

Say something smart

Now that was funny...

[KO2]

He does lack depth

[Posit]

Now I get...after a good night's sleep:

Would you like to have a contest over how many letters is appended to each of our names?

ScottSA, Blah, Blah, Blah, Blah.

I would count sixteen letters after your name.....I would considered that a no-contest contest. You win!

[cybercoma]

I've yet to see anything in this thread that indicates white culture needs to be protected or that it is under "attack" in any way shape or form.

edit: typo "what" should've been "white"

Edited July 14, 2007 by cybercoma