I Never Thought I Would See This

[jdobbin]

Gutless little SOB. Had to sneak up behind, real brave. Should send the little SOBs to Afghanistan, see how tough they really are...

I've never heard of that town before. Is that something typical of that bar?

A lot of people in bars are like that. Think they're tough but attack from behind.

[guyser]

I've never heard of that town before. Is that something typical of that bar?

A lot of people in bars are like that. Think they're tough but attack from behind.

Man, you never heard of Morrisburg? You should get out of Manitoba once in awhile. There is more in this world than Winnipeg , Brandon and The Pas ya know.

It is south of Ottawa, west of Cornwall...near the border. Frankly, it is in a spot I know little about,other than it is Upper Canada

Every town, every city, every everything has asshats like the guy that jumped the Soldier. Maybe not a bar in Petawawa nor Borden, but they are out there.

[jdobbin]

Man, you never heard of Morrisburg? You should get out of Manitoba once in awhile. There is more in this world than Winnipeg , Brandon and The Pas ya know.

It is south of Ottawa, west of Cornwall...near the border. Frankly, it is in a spot I know little about,other than it is Upper Canada

Every town, every city, every everything has asshats like the guy that jumped the Soldier. Maybe not a bar in Petawawa nor Borden, but they are out there.

I've been to Ottawa but never south of the city but I envisioned the area as more of the heartland of the province, not a place that would jump soldiers. However, I guess you're right...every town has someone you shouldn't turn your back on.

Speaking of Ontario, I've been to quite a lot of the province but it is just so damn big. I don't think people in the west realize how urbanized it is and how much industry there is from town to town. The census showed Barrie, not Calgary, was the fastest growing city. I don't know anything about Barrie.

[guyser]

Speaking of Ontario, I've been to quite a lot of the province but it is just so damn big. I don't think people in the west realize out urbanized it is and how much industry there is from town to town.

And most people who LIVE here dont believe how big it is. I just tell them if they were to drive due south, they would be in Florida before I was out of Ontario.

[jbg]

Hero beaten

Andrew Seymour, The Ottawa Citizen

Published: Monday, March 12, 2007

A Canadian soldier awarded a Medal of Military Valour for braving enemy fire in Afghanistan is angry after he says was jumped from behind and taunted by four men who beat him up in a Morrisburg bar on the weekend.

© The Ottawa Citizen 2007

That's one side of the story.

Making judgements without the other side is just journalism and/or sensationalism. Exactly what we expect from the media.

Great for selling newspapers... not a good way to run a country.

Is there ever an excuse for attacking someone from the rear? The same people who'd excuse that would excuse Palestinians' attacking Canadian tourists because of their "anger" at Israel (link). Your neutrality is despicable.

[jbg]

Did you really need to quote the whole article to make your 'point'?

You don't think this 'beating' was a bad thing? You think it shouldn't have been 'reported'?

Or do you just like to type things sometimes for really no reason?

We already see his posting content and morality are bottom of the barrel.

[Argus]

Baylee, stop bothering us.

Pardon me? Not sure who that was intended for, but...

I think the title of this thread made the discussion wide open for what we, the posters thought they would never see.

And in my case, as I said.

I never thought I would see this, Canadian soldiers killing Canadian soldiers, so much so, that one would be charged with manslaughter.

That another would be shot and killed while he was just resting in his tent.

I would think that other people on this forum who SAY they also are soldiers, would be quite upset by thesr events.

Apparently not

You never thought you'd see a firearm accident? Really? Because, like, guns never go off by accident, not ever. Nope. Never. They're perfectly safe.

And you never thought you'd see a soldier kill someone improperly, illegally, go against rules? Not ever? This shocks you? Because, like, it's never happened before, right?

I think you are too easily shocked to have lived for very long, too easily shocked to have opinions of any value.

[Army Guy]

Jenny:

I never thought I would see this..

Canadian soldier kills another Canadian soldier who was just resting in his tent, despite rules that say weapons are not to be loaded and ready to kill while on the base.

( unfortunate accidents happen, and whom ever is responsable will have to live with this the rest of his life)

Canadian soldier who killed yet another Canadian soldier charged with manslaughter

(After an investagation charges were laid, by military police, again a very unfortunate accident)

Canadian soldiers open fire on and kill an unarmed mental ill Afghani man who was doing nothing more than begging.

( We've already covered this, and yet you continue to bring it up, this man failed to heed serveral warnings including a warning shot, what you failed to mention was his vest had all kinds of electronic wires over it much like a sucide bomber would have)

Canadian soldiers kill unarmed Afghani citizens.( so many times now , just pick your own example)

( yes, give us an example where an investagation has proven wrong doing, and charges where not laid)

O h wait.We had a serious example of Canadian soldiers torturing and murdering a man , what?

15 years ago.

Those involved were charged and punished, one was found not metally stable due to a sucide attempt, he actually hung himself.

Seems the LIBS decided to protect these Canadian soldiers by shutting down the enquiry

Bullshit...again those that were guilty were charged, and sentenced, and an entire Regt was disbanded, explain how that was protecting those soldiers involved ?

I would think that other people on this forum who SAY they also are soldiers, would be quite upset by thesr events.

Apparently not

What is it about soldiers that piss you off ? your not bayleafs sister are you ?

[Shakeyhands]

do any of you not find this story a little odd? I used to bounce as well, though in a smaller bar, and I never, ever saw a one sided fight, ever. There are always two sides to a story and this one is missing half.

[jenny]

Bullshit...again those that were guilty were charged, and sentenced, and an entire Regt was disbanded, explain how that was protecting those soldiers involved ?

]

What is it about soldiers that piss you off ?

I agree, they were charged and convicted.

It was the enquiry that was shut down early by the Libs.You know that. '-)

And how is it that bringing up true stories of Canadian soldiers killing Canadian soldiers and civillians make a person anti soldier?

I mean sheesh, all these stories are there to read in any major newspaper

Thats the same mentality as acusing one of being anti American just for bringing up horror stories about bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Iraq

And you never thought you'd see a soldier kill someone improperly, illegally, go against rules? Not ever? This shocks you? Because, like, it's never happened before, right?

I guess if someone can be shocked about someone being beaten up in a bar I can be shocked about those things.

Besides I didnt say I was shocked.

I said I never thought I would see those things happening.

by Canadian soldiers

Its the American soldiers you EXPECT to be doing those things

[Canadian Blue]

Sorry, apparently the CF is made up alot of individuals, some of whom are shit apples.

Sorry that the CF hasn't made it up to, I don't know, God's standard.

[Army Guy]

Jenny:

I agree, they were charged and convicted.

It was the enquiry that was shut down early by the Libs.You know that. '-)

the inquiry had served it's purpose, those guilty were charged, it's recommandations were forwarded, and the government shut down a complete Regt. What more did you expect ? and how was it protecting soldiers involved , your words not mine.

And how is it that bringing up true stories of Canadian soldiers killing Canadian soldiers and civillians make a person anti soldier?

I mean sheesh, all these stories are there to read in any major newspaper

Thats the same mentality as acusing one of being anti American just for bringing up horror stories about bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Iraq

It does when everything you bring up or post is negitive. hence the question what has our nations soldiers done to piss you off ? i think it's a fair question, when taken in context with your continous bashing.

That and your misrepresenting the facts to suit your claims....

[dlkenny]

Baylee, stop bothering us.

Pardon me? Not sure who that was intended for, but...

I think the title of this thread made the discussion wide open for what we, the posters thought they would never see.

And in my case, as I said.

I never thought I would see this, Canadian soldiers killing Canadian soldiers, so much so, that one would be charged with manslaughter.

That another would be shot and killed while he was just resting in his tent.

I would think that other people on this forum who SAY they also are soldiers, would be quite upset by thesr events.

Apparently not

I'm sorry to break this to you but that's the way that war is. I don't think most people understand what it is like to live life knowing that at any moment you could be dead, that there are people on the other side of a fence who are foaming at the mouth for a chance to kill you. The extreme pressures and duress that these brave people face often boils over and causes internal disputes. Things happen, accidents happen, internal violence happens; my cousin just came back from Afghanistan and he won't even talk about much of what he saw. War is horrific and how do those Canadian soldiers that killed the "innocent" afghans know that the people they're shooting at aren't taliban suicide bombers? They've got a very specific order to shoot if anyone disregards orders at a checkstop and frankly that's what they do, they have to. In their mind it's either "him or me" and in a war you have to choose the former. Unfortunately sometimes that means civilian casualties...that's what war is. As far as the soldier killed while resting in his tent, who's to say that the perpetrator wasn't suffering from Post Traumatic Stress disorder? Think back to after other conflicts the number of soldiers that came back and wound up in asylums or prisons because they simply couldn't fit back into "normal" society. It's one thing to be against the war, it's quite another to bash our troops without fully understanding what they endure.

[Canadian Blue]

dlkenny, great post, I agree 110%.

[jenny]

It does when everything you bring up or post is negitive. hence the question what has our nations soldiers done to piss you off ? i think it's a fair question, when taken in context with your continous bashing.

Negative? How much positive stuff is brought up on this forum?

What have they done?

Blowing away innocent civillians regularly comes to mind.

Glorifying a non war

And yea, torturing and murdering that innocent man that you admit to.

Doesnt that piss you off?

And bashing?

Isnt a forum like this made up of continuous bashing.

Or, as I have asked before,is bringing up criminal activity by cops and soldiers frowned upon on a forum such as this.

I mean really, a cop into kiddie porn is just as news worthy as any other creep who is.

But heaven forbid, if you bring up a story about a cop into kiddie porn or any other crime, the response you get is that you are bashing cops, no comment about the crime itself

[Wilber]

And bashing?

Isnt a forum like this made up of continuous bashing.

Or, as I have asked before,is bringing up criminal activity by cops and soldiers frowned upon on a forum such as this.

I mean really, a cop into kiddie porn is just as news worthy as any other creep who is.

But heaven forbid, if you bring up a story about a cop into kiddie porn or any other crime, the response you get is that you are bashing cops, no comment about the crime itself

There is a lot of bashing on this forum. There are also some very good arguments which make you think. Unfortunately, none of them are yours. One knows where yours are going before they read them.

[Catchme]

I'm sorry to break this to you but that's the way that war is. .. my cousin just came back from Afghanistan and he won't even talk about much of what he saw. War is horrific and how do those Canadian soldiers that killed the "innocent" afghans know that the people they're shooting at aren't taliban suicide bombers? They've got a very specific order to shoot if anyone disregards orders at a checkstop and frankly that's what they do, they have to. In their mind it's either "him or me" and in a war you have to choose the former. Unfortunately sometimes that means civilian casualties...that's what war is. As far as the soldier killed while resting in his tent, who's to say that the perpetrator wasn't suffering from Post Traumatic Stress disorder? Think back to after other conflicts the number of soldiers that came back and wound up in asylums or prisons because they simply couldn't fit back into "normal" society. It's one thing to be against the war, it's quite another to bash our troops without fully understanding what they endure.

It always means civilian casualities, and BTW, we are not at war, in Afghanistan didn't you know? Although O'Connor did say we were there for retribution didn't he, the liar. One wonders how many mor civilians were killed because he made a lying, immoral, hate filled irresponsible comment like to troops just being deployed?

Did you not know, we are there for reconstruction purposes to liberate the women and children, even though the mission was to find Osama, and that was cancelled 4 long years agao. But heh, we are still spending billions for no reason. Other than to destroy civilians and their country, of course.

But hey, should we care if the military personal can never fit into "normal" society when they come back from somewhere they should not even be? Or whether they have PTSD? There should be no excuses for their behaviour. After all, they were not lied to, and they are there to Fight Fear, Fight Distress, Fight Chaos, so really should we care how they come back after all, eh, they freely chose to go and do the things they are doing, even if it is breaking the Geneva Conevention and International law?!

Of course, we care, and we should care, these are our sons, daughters, cousins, nephews, nieces, brothers sisters, etc, but there is only one way to truly care and that is to insist they come home NOW, so we can get to the bottom of things, as they are obviousluy out of control over there.

Our military has absolutely no business being there, and for those who throw up NATO obligations, forget it, that pathetic excuse is long done with when Osama was stopped looking for, and many other countries in NATO are doing nothing or pulling their military out.

Nor are we there for Afghan women and children and their freedom, another lie some perpetuate here.

[jenny]

, who's to say that the perpetrator wasn't suffering from Post Traumatic Stress disorder?

You really ought to rethink what you just typed there.

We obviously know that Canadian Blue isnt suffering from that but yet seems to show the same signs as one who does.

There are also some very good arguments which make you think. Unfortunately, none of them are yours.

Well actually, for the most part, i just bring up real life news events which are considered to be bashing by others. Any argument was someone else doing it, not me

[Charles Anthony]

I read all of this:

The extreme pressures and duress that these brave people face often boils over and causes internal disputes. Things happen, accidents happen, internal violence happens;

---SNIP---

the number of soldiers that came back and wound up in asylums or prisons because they simply couldn't fit back into "normal" society.

and I automatically think: "Gee. This is not something I support." but what can I do?? Nothing -- of course, my taxes go to pay for it all.

I read this:

It's one thing to be against the war, it's quite another to bash our troops without fully understanding what they endure.

and I wonder: "Did the troops know what they were getting into ahead of time? or were they ignorant like I am now?"

If the answer is YES, then I do not support the troops either.

If the answer is NO, then clearly the whole thing is a treacherous and deceptive dupery.

[Canadian Blue]

Jenny you've been reported. We all know your Baylee, your post just showed the obvious. Either way I'd suggest you go to a different forum since you don't want to bring anything positive to debate.

We obviously know that Canadian Blue isnt suffering from that but yet seems to show the same signs as one who does.

Great job of making light of a PTSD, that takes alot of balls.

War is one of the most futile things we have ever gone after as humans, it rarely accomplishes anything productive, and history has shown non-violence has often worked much more effectively. While saying that, it's also important to remember that each country has a right to self defense, and if necessary a country must fight back [this does not include pre-emptive strikes].

Jenny's a creep, she/he was sending me e-mail's if I wanted to meet up with him/her and engage in sexual intercourse.

[jenny]

Jenny you've been reported. We all know your Baylee, your post just showed the obvious. Either way I'd suggest you go to a different forum since you don't want to bring anything positive to debate.

What exactly would you call positive I wonder?

You are right though, Canadian soldiers commiting atrocities is nothing positive, or good, but it is the truth

[Canadian Blue]

Jenny we all know you hate Canadian soldiers, and police officers, and I'm guessing you hate a bunch of other people as well. Go somewhere else and spew it.

[jenny]

For one who talks about slander, you are quite good at it.

I dont hate good soldiers or good cops.

Just the soldiers who kill innocent civillians and drop bombs on them from high above.

As for cops, reporting crimes commited by cops does not make one a cop hater

You though seem to have a problem with reading truthful acts of crime done by these people

[Catchme]

Jenny's a creep, she/he was sending me e-mail's if I wanted to meet up with him/her and engage in sexual intercourse.

Look, I do not want to read stuff like this here, if she sent you pm's or emails please report her to greg or or the moderators, it is none of the board at large business, you said you reported her, that should have been the end of it.

[jbg]

I've never heard of that town before. Is that something typical of that bar?

A lot of people in bars are like that. Think they're tough but attack from behind.

As in the the lyrics of Charlie Daniels Band's "Uneasy Rider" (link)

Artist/Band: Daniels Charlie

Lyrics for Song: Uneasy Rider

Lyrics for Album: A Decade of Hits

I was takin a trip out to L.A.

Toolin along in my cheverolet

Tokin on a number and diggin on the radio

Just as I crossed the Mississippi line

I heard that highway start to whine

And I knew that left rear tire was about to blow

Well the spare was flat and I got uptight

Cause there wasn't a filling station in sight

So I just limped on down the shoulder on the rim

I went as far as I could and when I stopped the car

It was right in front of this little bar

Kind of a red-neck lookin joint called the Dew Drop Inn

I stuffed my hair up under my hat

And told the bartender that I had a flat

And ywould he be kind enough to give me change for a one

There was one thing I was sure proud to see

There wasn't a soul in the place except for him and me

He just looked disgusted and pointed toward the telephone

I called up the station down the road a ways

He said he wasn't very busy today

And he could have somone out there in just about 10 minutes or so

He said," Now, you just stay right where yer at!"

And I didn't bother to tell the darn fool

That I sure as hell didn't have anyplace else to go

So I ordered up a beer and sat down at the bar

When some guy walked in and said, "Who owns this car

With the peace sign, the mag wheels and the four on the floor?"

He looked at me and I damn near died

And I decided that I'd just wait outside

So I laid a dollar on the bar and headed for the door

Just when I wthought I'd get outta there with my skin

These 3 big dudes come strollin in

With one old drunk chick and some fella with green teeth

Now the last thing I wanted was to get into a fight

In Jackson Mississippi on a Saturday night

Especially when there was three of them and only one of me

I was almost to the door when the biggest one

Said, "You tip your hat to this lady, son!"

And when I did, all that hair fell out from underneath

They all started laughin and I felt kinda sick

And I knew I better think of something pretty quick

So I just reached out and kicked old green teeth right in the knee

Now he let out a yell that'd curl yer hair

But before he could move I grabbed me a chair

And said "Now watch him Folks cause he's a fairly dangerous man!"

"You may not know it but this man is a spy.

He's a undercover agent for the FBI

And he's been sent down here to infiltrate the Ku Klux Klan!"

He was still bent over holdin on to his knee

But everybody else was looking and listening to me

And I laid it on thicker hand heavier as I went

"He's a friend of them long haired, hippy-type, pinko fags!

I betchya he's even got a commie flag

tacked up on the wall inside of his garage."

"He's a snake in the grass, I tell ya guys.

He may look dumb but that's just a disguise,

He's a mastermind in the ways of espionage"

"Would you believe this man has gone as far

As tearing Wallace stickers off the bumpers of cars.

And he voted for George McGovern for President."

They started lookin real suspicious at him

He jumped up and said "Now just wait a minute Jim!

You know he's lying I been living here all of my life!"

"I'm a faithful follower of Brother John Birch

And I belong to the Antioch Baptist Church.

And I aint even got a garage, you can call home and ask my wife!"

Then he started saying somethin bout the way I was dressed

But I didn't wait around to hear the rest

I was too busy moving and hoping I didn't run outta luck

When I hit the door I was making tracks

And they were just taking my car down off the jacks

So I threw the man a twenty and jumped in and fired that mother up

Mario Andretti wouldda sure been proud

Of the way I was movin when I passed that crowd

Coming out the door and headed toward me at a trott

Now I guess I should of gone ahead and run

But somehow I just couldn't resist the fun

Of chasing them all just once around the parking lot

I had them all out there steppin and fetchin

Like their heads was on fire and their asses was catchin

then I figgered I had better go ahead and split before the cops got there

When I hit the road I was really wheelin

Had gravel flyin and rubber squeelin

And I didn't slow down till I was almost to Arkansas

I think I'm gonna reroute my trip

I wonder if anybody'd think I'd flipped

If I went to L.A., via Omaha