Wilber Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 I don't think most Canadians appreciate how much Fonda is hated by the majority of Viet Nam vets, regardless of their feelings about being in that war. I think it's time to move on. Fonda is ancient history. If the vets can't let go of that, I encourage them to seek counselling. Ever been to war Newbie? Neither have I but I can tell you one thing, these guys are my generation and I've had the privilege of knowing and working with more than a few of them over the years. I would never think of saying something like that to their face, or behind their back for that matter. When their buddies were getting shot out of the sky and if lucky enough to survive, got to spend years in a North Viet Nam prison, seeing Hanoi Jane sitting on a NVA anti aircraft gun for a photo op with a big shit eating grin on her face, lets just say they have a completely different take on the woman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catchme Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 Hmmm, I remember reading that there were many Vietnam Vets at the 500,000 strong protests and that Jane Fonda was wildly applauded by all! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 Hmmm, I remember reading that there were many Vietnam Vets at the 500,000 strong protests and that Jane Fonda was wildly applauded by all! I don't doubt there are many Viet Nam vets who oppose the war in Iraq but wildly applaud Fonda? In your dreams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newbie Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 Ever been to war Newbie? Neither have I but I can tell you one thing, these guys are my generation and I've had the privilege of knowing and working with more than a few of them over the years. I would never think of saying something like that to their face, or behind their back for that matter. When their buddies were getting shot out of the sky and if lucky enough to survive, got to spend years in a North Viet Nam prison, seeing Hanoi Jane sitting on a NVA anti aircraft gun for a photo op with a big shit eating grin on her face, lets just say they have a completely different take on the woman. I said that sincerely. I have a mental health background and know that any trauma, or hostility caused by such, can require counselling to move a person on. If vets don't talk about their past experiences or hatred it can overcome them. I was simply offering advice. Jane Fonda wasn't the enemy. They can't blame her for their injuries or for anything else. She did a stupid thing and apologized for it a number of times. If they still feel animosity towards her, it is their problem, but help is available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 I said that sincerely. I have a mental health background and know that any trauma, or hostility caused by such, can require counselling to move a person on. If vets don't talk about their past experiences or hatred it can overcome them. I was simply offering advice. Jane Fonda wasn't the enemy. They can't blame her for their injuries or for anything else. She did a stupid thing and apologized for it a number of times. If they still feel animosity towards her, it is their problem, but help is available In most cases hate is probably too strong a word. Intense dislike is probably more accurate. They don't blame her for their injuries but they do blame her for giving aid and comfort to the people trying to kill them and rightly so. Opposing a war is one thing, openly taking the other side is quite another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frogs Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 Your funny. Its the collective forces that count and that fight for a countries interest, nothing to do with with singular opinions where as your contribution is either to agree or disagree. Correcto! Brainless people fighting for brainless people. No wonder these wars continue! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frogs Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 "He who joyfully marches to music rank and file, has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would surely suffice. This disgrace to civilization should be done away with at once. Heroism at command, how violently I hate all this, how despicable and ignoble war is; I would rather be torn to shreds than be a part of so base an action. It is my conviction that killing under the cloak of war is nothing but an act of murder." Albert Einstein perhaps you've heard of him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Doors Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 "He who joyfully marches to music rank and file, has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would surely suffice. This disgrace to civilization should be done away with at once. Heroism at command, how violently I hate all this, how despicable and ignoble war is; I would rather be torn to shreds than be a part of so base an action. It is my conviction that killing under the cloak of war is nothing but an act of murder." Albert Einstein perhaps you've heard of him Yeah, wasn't he one of the guys that helped build the atomic bomb? LOL!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frogs Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 Yeah, wasn't he one of the guys that helped build the atomic bomb? LOL!! YUP His biggest regret. And willing to admit it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Figleaf Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 Three soldiers a day get killed for "getting in the way." Today, another helicopter got shot down. Unfortunate, but then again we have to make the terrorists take some responsibility for the violence at sometime, now don't we? Or is it all the fault of the Americans? The presence of U.S. forces in Iraq is clearly the fault of Americans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Blue Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 Hmmm, I remember reading that there were many Vietnam Vets at the 500,000 strong protests and that Jane Fonda was wildly applauded by all! Except for the ones that were tortured... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newbie Posted January 30, 2007 Report Share Posted January 30, 2007 In most cases hate is probably too strong a word. Intense dislike is probably more accurate. They don't blame her for their injuries but they do blame her for giving aid and comfort to the people trying to kill them and rightly so. Opposing a war is one thing, openly taking the other side is quite another. I'm not going to apologize for Jane Fonda, but it seems her visits there were to promote ending the war, not providing support to the N. Vietnamese army. I don't see that as taking sides. If you recall a huge majority of the U.S. population were against that war and rightly so. Again, Fonda did some stupid things to which she has apologized many times for. Holding a grudge against someone for an extended period of time can be dangerous to your mental health. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted January 31, 2007 Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 Would you have the same opinion if a Canadian celebrity went to Afghanistan and posed with a bunch of Taliban, a big grin on their face holding an RPG or suicide bombers belt? Have you never met someone you didn't like and your opinion of them has never changed? Possibly if you had close friends or family killed in that war, you might have a different opinion of the lady. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newbie Posted January 31, 2007 Report Share Posted January 31, 2007 Would you have the same opinion if a Canadian celebrity went to Afghanistan and posed with a bunch of Taliban, a big grin on their face holding an RPG or suicide bombers belt?Have you never met someone you didn't like and your opinion of them has never changed? Possibly if you had close friends or family killed in that war, you might have a different opinion of the lady. We are talking about something that happened like 30 or more years ago. I would never hold a grudge that long, regardless of the issue. Many years ago I forgave all the people who once were a thorn in my side. I had to because I don't like living with hatred. In regards to your question, I would think that if that happened it would be a very stupid thing to do. But I'm at a point in my life where such things don't bother me much, including your hypothetical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 You're quite correct blackascoal, but there are many reasons why Bush will not leave and no of them have to do with preventing the chaos that is in Iraq.And people should really stick with their first instincts they are usually correct. Here is a link to a picture from someone who was there, 500,000 is one huge amount of people and they represent even more across the USA. Finally they woke up! But oh so late for so many Iraqis and the country. Here is a link which says otherwise. http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/na...y?track=tothtml http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/01/27/iraq.protest.ap/index.html United for Peace and Justice, a coalition group sponsoring the protest, had hoped 100,000 would come. They claimed even more afterward, but police, who no longer give official estimates, said privately the crowd was smaller than 100,000. http://www.fox6.com/entertainment/story.as...A2-14D23821B47E he 69-year-old joined a 100,000-strong protest in the capital, assembled after President George W. Bush's announced plans to send more troops to Iraq." All we know is that there was faulty and apparently old intelligence, Bush went forward believing it. You have no proof that G.W. Bush lied to Congress, and if after six years and the animosity toward Bush, one would think that democrats could produce that proof - but they haven't. If they had the proof, they would have impeached him by now. I heard Charles Rangel (dem) in an interview yesterday, even he agreed they can't do it. http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5053822 Bush has admitted he relied on faulty intelligence, but if you have hared core proof that he knew there were no WMDs before going into Iraq, please provide it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 In regards to your question, I would think that if that happened it would be a very stupid thing to do. But I'm at a point in my life where such things don't bother me much, including your hypothetical A somewhat easier position to take if you were not personally effected. In Ms Fonda's case it wasn't hypothetical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catchme Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 LOLOLOL, Oh the disappearing 500k worth of protesters LOLOL just like 2005 LOLOL Nope, there is no media censorship. they think control the message control the people works LOLOLOL Protest organizers in D.C. put the numbers at 500,000 people, a number almost surely inflated somewhat. D.C. cops refused to estimate the size, but Metropolitan Police Chief Charles H. Ramsey said it was bigger than the march in October, which most people have put at around 100,000 people. "It's one of the biggest ones we've had, certainly in recent times," he said.And the Washington Post described it as "the largest anti-war demonstration here since the Vietnam era." Alas, President Bush was in Camp David this weekend and Congress was not in session, so none of the powers that be saw the protesters. As he did while at Yale, Bush seems be missing out on all the anti-war fun. "I don't remember debates. I don't think we spent a lot of time debating it. Maybe we did, but I don't remember." -- On discussions of the Vietnam War when Bush was an undergraduate at Yale, Washington Post, July 27, 1999 What's good about this protest is the major media haven't ignored it as many charged after the last major rally in October. In addition to the Associated Press, the New York Times, the Post, ABC News, CNN and MSNBC, a quick search on google revealed more than 1,000 stories. (A fair number were duplicates of AP and Reuters stories, but still...) Not surprisingly, Fox News was not prominent among the media outlets covering the protests. In fact, from my brief survey, only it and the Times didn't feature the protest prominently on the front page of their Web sites. (At least the Times had a link to it, however. Fox made me search for it. For shame.) http://www.back-to-iraq.com/archives/2003/...ts_peaceful.php Here is a slide show: http://www.alternet.org/waroniraq/47222 Rabbi Lerner reminded the over 1,400 peace and justice member groups and hundreds of thousands of individuals who had traveled from as far as Albuquerque to Vermont, Seattle to Florida and all points in between, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newbie Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 In regards to your question, I would think that if that happened it would be a very stupid thing to do. But I'm at a point in my life where such things don't bother me much, including your hypothetical A somewhat easier position to take if you were not personally effected. In Ms Fonda's case it wasn't hypothetical. You asked me a hypothetical question and I answered it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rue Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 The right wants to focus on Jane Fonda to detrect from the clear message sent by thye vast amount of other people who gathered. It's easier for them to attack Fonda than attack the American people. I don't think most Canadians appreciate how much Fonda is hated by the majority of Viet Nam vets, regardless of their feelings about being in that war. Jane needs a new movie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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