"Israel must be wiped off the map"

[PolyNewbie]

Many people (neocon sycophant fascists and wing nuts) believe that Ahmadinejad said "Israel must be wiped off the map".

Not true, see Global Research where the actual quote is given in Persian and translated.

Ready to stop watching mainstream yet ?

[scribblet]

And some left wing moonbats should read other translations.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/10/26/ahmadinejad/

TEHRAN, Iran (CNN) -- Iran's new president has repeated a remark from a former ayatollah that Israel should be "wiped out from the map," insisting that a new series of attacks will destroy the Jewish state, and lashing out at Muslim countries and leaders that acknowledge Israel.

The remarks by Mahmoud Ahmadinejad -- reported by Islamic Republic News Agency -- coincide with a month-long protest against Israel called "World without Zionism" and with the approach of Jerusalem Day.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4384264.stm

Iran's president has defended his widely criticised call for Israel to be "wiped off the map".

Attending an anti-Israel rally in Tehran, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said his remarks were "just" - and the criticism did not "have any validity".

His initial comment provoked anger from many governments, and prompted Israel to demand Iran's expulsion from the UN.

Egypt said they showed "the weakness of the Iranian government". A Palestinian official also rejected the remarks."

Odd that IKofi Annan reads it the same way, guess he needs a new translator, as with the BBC et al. The BBC and CNN are not known to be 'neocon sycophant fascists and wing nuts.

CNN) -- U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan has expressed "dismay" over the Iranian president's comments urging the destruction of Israel.

Annan, in a statement issued Thursday, reminded "all member states that Israel is a long-standing member of the United Nations with the same rights and obligations as every other member."

It added that "under the United Nations Charter, all members have undertaken to refrain from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of any state."

[frogs]

All thieves should be wiped from the map... whether they are christian, atheist, jew, buddhist, or whatever.

A thief is someone who takes money, property, or time, from someone with the threat of violence, or kidnapping (jail). Jews (and christians) would never support something like that, would they?

[sharkman]

All thieves should be wiped from the map... whether they are christian, atheist, jew, buddhist, or whatever.

A thief is someone who takes money, property, or time, from someone with the threat of violence, or kidnapping (jail). Jews (and christians) would never support something like that, would they?

How about you stay on topic, frog.

The wacky Iranian prez has spoken publically on Israel a good half dozen times. Put all the quotes together and you get an accurate representation of what he wants you to think of him. I no longer think he's so stupid as to utter racist hate speech just because he thinks so.

[jbg]

All thieves should be wiped from the map... whether they are christian, atheist, jew, buddhist, or whatever.

A thief is someone who takes money, property, or time, from someone with the threat of violence, or kidnapping (jail). Jews (and christians) would never support something like that, would they?

How about you stay on topic, frog.

The wacky Iranian prez has spoken publically on Israel a good half dozen times. Put all the quotes together and you get an accurate representation of what he wants you to think of him. I no longer think he's so stupid as to utter racist hate speech just because he thinks so.

I think it's time to wake up to the fact that Israel is the "canary in the coal mine" here. Today Israel, tomorrow us. These people cannot and will not live in peace with neighbors they cannot dominate.

[scribblet]

IMHO he is pushing the envelope, trying to see how far he can go before someone takes it a step further, in which case he has an excuse for an all out war with Israel. I don't think he's stupid, he's doing all of this for a reason.

If 'Palestinians' laid down their arms - there would be peace

If Israel laid down its arms - there would be genocide, Israel would no longer exist.

[Figleaf]

And some left wing moonbats should read other translations.

What other translations do you suggest?

[Figleaf]

All thieves should be wiped from the map... whether they are christian, atheist, jew, buddhist, or whatever.

A thief is someone who takes money, property, or time, from someone with the threat of violence, or kidnapping (jail). Jews (and christians) would never support something like that, would they?

How about you stay on topic, frog.

The wacky Iranian prez has spoken publically on Israel a good half dozen times. Put all the quotes together and you get an accurate representation of what he wants you to think of him. I no longer think he's so stupid as to utter racist hate speech just because he thinks so.

I think it's time to wake up to the fact that Israel is the "canary in the coal mine" here. Today Israel, tomorrow us.

Today Israel what? Israel is thriving.

[jbg]

I think it's time to wake up to the fact that Israel is the "canary in the coal mine" here. Today Israel, tomorrow us.

Today Israel what? Israel is thriving.

Thriving, but embattled. My point is that the barbarians are always taking aim at countries that look soft, contented and peaceful, thinking that they're easy targets.

And some, in the West, are happy to throw away Israel as a bone to appease the Arabs. Granted, many such people will use the issue of "occupied territories" or "settlers" as a figleaf to hide their real animus; the existance of Israel.

[Remiel]

If 'Palestinians' laid down their arms - there would be peace

When? How long would it be before Israel believed the fighting was over? How long before the end of the " Mach Surprise " ? How long before the barriers came down? How long before Palestinians have all of their rights fully recognized by Israel?

If there is a simple truth, it is that for Israelis, peace marks the end of their problems. For Palestinians, peace just marks the beginning of theirs. Perhaps that is why some resist peace so fiercely, because they do not see the " good times " magically appearing on the other side.

Here is an article from the Independant, about another incident that proves how un-simple things are for Palestinians: http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle...icle2169225.ece

[PolyNewbie]

scribblet:And some left wing moonbats should read other translations.

Like the Jewish owned mainstream media that wants war with Iran ?

The Global Research site has a literal word by word translation. Your sources (as usual) are nothing more than hit pieces with nothing to back them up.

scribblet:The BBC and CNN are not known to be 'neocon sycophant fascists and wing nuts.

Actually the Global Research article posted compared with your links posted actual proves that they are exactly neocon sycophant fascist wingnuts. There is absolutely no substance in the CNN/BBC articles. They are just commentary and misleading commentary at that.

[PolyNewbie]

scriblett:I don't think he's stupid, he's doing all of this for a reason.

Whether Bush is stupid or not, its irrelevant, he is just a puppet like every US president since 1913.

[Riverwind]

where the actual quote is given in Persian and translated.

The actual quote is:

The Imam said this regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time

"Vanish from the page of time" is not a typical English metaphor, however, a reasonable interpretation is that it meant that the regime must "disappear" - not exactly the same as "wiped off the map" but close enough.

Ahmadinejad is a loose cannon and is impossible to defend (the holocaust denier conference was a case in point). However, Ahmadinejad does not represent all Iranians and confrontational approach is causing him to loose support within Iran. So we should not vilify Iran because of its leader. Just like we should not vilify the US because of its leader.

[Figleaf]

I think it's time to wake up to the fact that Israel is the "canary in the coal mine" here. Today Israel, tomorrow us.

Today Israel what? Israel is thriving.

Thriving, but embattled. My point is that the barbarians are always taking aim at countries that look soft, contented and peaceful, thinking that they're easy targets.

I don't know about 'barbarians', but the reason Israel has enemies is because it was imposed in a place where a large proportion of the population opposed it and since then it has involved further inroads against the self-percieved interests of people in that region. It's got nothing to do with being soft or contented, and more to do with radically opposed interests.

And some, in the West, are happy to throw away Israel as a bone to appease the Arabs. Granted, many such people will use the issue of "occupied territories" or "settlers" as a figleaf to hide their real animus; the existance of Israel.

It's fascinating to me how every conversation about this subject eventually results in an Israel apologist imputing some heinous anti-Israel bias against his interlocutors. Just FYI, jbg, you've probably forgotten this, but I've posted at least twice before that I support a two-state solution.

I can say that the foundation of Israel is a cause of the dispute without implying that I wouldsupport the removal or eradication of Israel. (In fact, I don't see how any such project could be undertaken without criminally violating the human rights of Israelis.)

[Remiel]

Even if we consider that the sentiment was essential " Israel must be wiped off the map. " it is interesting that the translation mentions the " regime " . In our terms, regime essentially means the government. So, technically, he is saying " The Israeli government must be dismantled. " Of course, I don't really doubt that he believe the Israelis must be wiped off the map, but, it is still interesting to see how the quote is twisted.

[Argus]

All thieves should be wiped from the map... whether they are christian, atheist, jew, buddhist, or whatever.

A thief is someone who takes money, property, or time, from someone with the threat of violence, or kidnapping (jail). Jews (and christians) would never support something like that, would they?

Thanks for telling us what a thief is, genius. Now are you saying Jews are thieves?

[Argus]

If 'Palestinians' laid down their arms - there would be peace

When? How long would it be before Israel believed the fighting was over? How long before the end of the " Mach Surprise " ? How long before the barriers came down?

Since the barriers cost Israel a lot of money to maintain, and since its large military costs it even more, I would imagine that it would not be very long after the Arabs stopped blowing themselves up next to Israel's children before the Israelis would ease up on the barriers, fences and road blocks.

How long before Palestinians have all of their rights fully recognized by Israel?

What rights? The same rights as Syrians have - which is to do what you're told, shut up, or be killed?

[Argus]

scribblet:And some left wing moonbats should read other translations.

Like the Jewish owned mainstream media that wants war with Iran ?

You see, Newbie, your problem (one of many, I suspect) is you lack debating tactics. Now, granted, it's very hard to make all your loony conspiracy theories sound like they originate with someone sane. But when you start making noises about Jewish conspiracies and Jewish owned media, even those few who tolerate the inane ramblings you spit out tend to shake their heads and dismiss you as an ignorant anti-semitic kook.

[Argus]

I think it's time to wake up to the fact that Israel is the "canary in the coal mine" here. Today Israel, tomorrow us.

Today Israel what? Israel is thriving.

Thriving, but embattled. My point is that the barbarians are always taking aim at countries that look soft, contented and peaceful, thinking that they're easy targets.

I don't know about 'barbarians', but the reason Israel has enemies is because it was imposed in a place where a large proportion of the population opposed it and since then it has involved further inroads against the self-percieved interests of people in that region. It's got nothing to do with being soft or contented, and more to do with radically opposed interests.

I disagree. A wealthy, capitalist state in the centre of the middle east is just what the Arabs need. Without the violence, Israel would be a beacon to the rest of the middle east, producing jobs and making large purchases from all its neighbours. Hell, most of the Palestinians would be working if it weren't for the violence, as Israeli companies took advantage of the cheap, surrounding labour pool. It is ignorance and religious fanaticism on the part of the surrounding Arabs which has produced this generations long violent struggle.

[PolyNewbie]

Hell, most of the Palestinians would be working if it weren't for the violence, as Israeli companies took advantage of the cheap, surrounding labour pool.

In other words, why don't the Arabs just make peace and be slaves for the Israelis.

[PolyNewbie]

Argus:You see, Newbie, your problem (one of many, I suspect) is you lack debating tactics. Now, granted, it's very hard to make all your loony conspiracy theories sound like they originate with someone sane. But when you start making noises about Jewish conspiracies and Jewish owned media, even those few who tolerate the inane ramblings you spit out tend to shake their heads and dismiss you as an ignorant anti-semitic kook.

Read the Global Research link and you can see what the president of Iran said - word for word. Then read what CNN and the BBC say.

My point was exactly right, CNN and the BBC lied. CNN is in fact Jewish controlled and many reporters such as Anderson Cooper and Wold Blitzer work for the CIA or are members of the CFR - hardly unbiased.

You just keep saying my views are looney because you lack the fortitude to actually look into the facts.

[PolyNewbie]

"We are grateful to the Washington Post, The New York Times, Time Magazine, and other great publications whose members have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion over forty years. It would have been impossible for us to develop a plan for the world if we had been subject to the bright lights of publicity during those years. But the work now is much more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto determination practised in past centuries"- David Rockefeller, founder of the Trilateral Commission, at the Trilteral commission in June 1991.

Mainstream media is nothing more than a propoganda machine for the big banks. Read the quote - its right there in front of you. There are many more like it.

<insert sound of alarm clock here>

Wake Up !!!

[jbg]

Hell, most of the Palestinians would be working if it weren't for the violence, as Israeli companies took advantage of the cheap, surrounding labour pool.

In other words, why don't the Arabs just make peace and be slaves for the Israelis.

If they weren't ignorant they could make peace and hire each other.

[jbg]

My point was exactly right, CNN and the BBC lied. CNN is in fact Jewish controlled and many reporters such as Anderson Cooper and Wold Blitzer work for the CIA or are members of the CFR - hardly unbiased.

Are you saying that "Jewish controlled" media lies?

[jbg]

scriblett:I don't think he's stupid, he's doing all of this for a reason.

Whether Bush is stupid or not, its irrelevant, he is just a puppet like every US president since 1913.

So, does that include William Howard Taft, who served during January, February and part of March 1913, before Woodrow Wilson's inauguration. And, who were these Presidents the puppets of? (please answer for each):

1. William Howard Taft;
   
2. Woodrow Wilson;
   
3. Warren Gamaliel Harding;
   
4. Calvin Coolidge;
   
5. Herbert Hoover;
   
6. Franklin Delano Roosvelt;
   
7. Harry S. Truman;
   
8. Dwight D. Eisenhower;
   
9. John F. Kennedy;
   
10. Lyndon Baines Johnson;
    
11. Richard Milhous Nixon;
    
12. Gerald R. Ford;
    
13. Jimmy Carter (well maybe of the lust in his heart);
    
14. Ronald Reagan;
    
15. George H.W. Bush;
    
16. William Jefferson Clinton;
    
17. George W. Bush