Banker/Wall Street Governance

[Riverwind]

Commercial banks have the same power wrt reserves.

Prove it. Show us the legislation that gives commerical banks the power to create money from nothing.

In any case, you are once again evading the issue (I am not surprised). The tutorial I linked to explains how banks create money. If you disagree you should identify specific problems with the logic in the tutorial. I suspect you are not able to because the tutorial is basically right but you don't want to admit it.

[PolyNewbie]

Riverwind:Prove it. Show us the legislation that gives commerical banks the power to create money from nothing.

Its in lots of books about banking. I don't have any proof - I can't find where it is written that asphalt is black either.

Riverwind:In any case, you are once again evading the issue (I am not surprised). The tutorial I linked to explains how banks create money. If you disagree you should identify specific problems with the logic in the tutorial. I suspect you are not able to because the tutorial is basically right but you don't want to admit it.

I haven't gone through your tutorial because I am very busy. You should synopsise it here.

[Charles Anthony]

I haven't gone through your tutorial because I am very busy. You should synopsise it here.

So..... RivErWIND, do you have the energy to rewind the tape... and keep the ball rolling?

[margrace]

Sure banks create money, in Canada they are taking it from the poorest of their people. I never earned more than $15,000 a year but I did without to buy RRSPS, encouraged by all the banks, and now I cannot access them without a large penalty in my Canada Pensions. In order to cash $1,600 it cost me $200 right off the top and then $200 a month for two years off my pension.

[White Doors]

Are you still whining about that? Jesus. You expect to keep getting welfare when you have savings? Why?

BTW, nothing to do with banks, that is taxation law - law that I aqree with too by the way. This has been explained to you many many times in other threads. No wonder you never made any money.

[Riverwind]

I haven't gone through your tutorial because I am very busy. You should synopsise it here.

So..... RivErWIND, do you have the energy to rewind the tape... and keep the ball rolling?

Nah, I have had my fun. I know from past dealings with Poly that he will cling to his paranoid theories even if counter evidence and facts are shoved into face. Reposting is a waste of time since Geoffrey already posted a synopsis. I also did the same thing here. The tutorial is only for people that prefer concrete examples.

[Charles Anthony]

ReWind,

I say: give it 24 hours and I bet you will be back for more! Prove me wrong.

[PolyNewbie]

Riverwind. You should give your a$$ a rest and read a book then come back and use your brain. Every bank creates money all the time. Fractional reserve banking isn't just doen at the central bank level.

Of course all these people writing these books and making movies are wrong about how banks work because you are talking out off your a$$ and your a$$ says that just cannot be !!!

[Riverwind]

Fractional reserve banking isn't just doen at the central bank level.

Fractional reserve banking requires that banks keep a percentage of their total deposits as reserves. This means they can only lend a part of what they have in deposits. They can never lend more than their total deposits. This is basic economics and the exact mechanics are easy to understand if someone is willing.

Of course all these people writing these books and making movies are wrong about how banks work

Frankly, I suspect there is not one credible economist that supports your ideas about banking. Your problem is you read the books but you do not understand what is written. Your quote from Greenspan is a perfect example. Greenspan clearly said that banks cannot lend more than their total deposits. Yet you tried to use that quote to claim that banks can create money from nothing.

So you are wasting your time babbling about the books you read. If you are so convinced that banks can create money from absolutely nothing then explain why greenspan and many other sources state clearly that banks can never lend more than their total deposits.

[Charles Anthony]

So you are wasting your time babbling

It takes two to tango!

[Riverwind]

So you are wasting your time babbling

It takes two to tango!

So are you the designated poster from the peanut gallery now?

[PolyNewbie]

Riverwind:Fractional reserve banking requires that banks keep a percentage of their total deposits as reserves. This means they can only lend a part of what they have in deposits. They can never lend more than their total deposits. This is basic economics and the exact mechanics are easy to understand if someone is willing.

There are large numbers of books specifically about banking. You should read one and learn what "fractional reserve" banking actually is. Thats not what fractional reserve banking even means. How do you think deposits come into existence ?

Have governments, the banks or corporations ever done anything that you dissagree with ? Why are you so interested in defending the banks ? Why are you so disinterested in learning about banking before getting into arguements about how banking works ? Why is it so important that banking be defended ?

You have never read anything about it. You haven't taken a course in fractional reserve banking. You have no idea what you are talking about on any of this, you are just working for the police or something trying to frustrate me and prevent the truth from getting out.

I would really like it if you would just avoid my threads. You never know your subject matter and believe your opionion on the way things should be is the way things are.

I'm going to ignore you from now on because I see that you are just a fool trying to waste peoples time.

[PolyNewbie]

"Banking was conceived in iniquity and was born in sin. The Bankers own the Earth. Take it away from them, but leave them the power to create deposits, and with the flick of the pen they will create enough deposits to buy it back again. However, take it away from them, and all the great fortunes like mine will disappear, and they ought to disappear, for this would be a happier and better world to live in. But if you wish to remain the slaves of Bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery, let them continue to create deposits." - Sir Josiah Stamp, President of the Bank of England in the 1920's, the second richest man in Britain

[PolyNewbie]

Riverwind: Stephen Zarlenga in his book "The Lost Science Of Money" explains that banks have been creating money since before the Fuggers of the 12th centrury. He is an economist and monetary historian. I guess you a$$ knows more than he does.

I think you should make an effort to learn the subject matter before throwing around what your a$$ says is logical as fact. Otherise you look foolish.

There are many quotes from economists that verfify that banks do in fact create money. They do this by creating deposits as bookeeping entries. Various financial instruments such as cheques make this possible as well. Banking is tricky, secretive and dishonest toward society. You can see this in their little tutorials that they write for government apologists. You think a depost occurs when someone drops money off at a bank. That is not what the term deposit means.

John Kenneth Galbraith also explains how banks create money in his book called "Money: Whence it came, where it went".

You should try reading a book on the subject matter instead of spouting non sense all the time.

[Riverwind]

do this by creating deposits as bookeeping entries.

What do you mean? Are you saying that electronically transferred funds are not real cash? That is false - an electronic transfer has to be followed up by an exchange of real cash, however, banks have figured out that they don't need to settle up after every transaction - they only need to figure out what the net difference is at the end of a day and only move the difference between banks.

A bank could never create a loan without cash to back it up because as soon as they loan that money it could end up in the hands of someone (i.e. another bank) who will demand real cash or interest in return. Sometimes, banks will have to borrow cash to cover the cost of loans on demand (e.g. credit cards) but this costs banks a lot more than using deposits.

If you disagree then please explain where the money goes when it is loaned. It has to go somewhere - it is either withdrawn as cash or it is deposited into a bank that must pay interest on it.

[PolyNewbie]

riverwind:If you disagree then please explain where the money goes when it is loaned. It has to go somewhere - it is either withdrawn as cash or it is deposited into a bank that must pay interest on it.

Many loans never get converted to cash. They are just numbers on a balance sheet.

[PolyNewbie]

As far as this big conspiracy I have been talking about, its been admitted by both bankers and presidents. We live in the information age and its hard to be associated with this subject matter and not realize there is a huge conspiracy occuring now - bigger than anything in history past.

Of course we know this because they tell us - or at least they tell those of us that are smart enough to get the message. Something real;ly big is happening and its not good, we know this because we are being lied to all the time in the media and not being informed about the American Union.

"...all of us here at the policy-making level have had experience with directives...from the White House.... The substance of them is that we shall use our grant-making power so as to alter our life in the United States that we can be comfortably merged with the Soviet Union."

H. Rowan Gaither, Jr., President - Ford Foundation

"They [the Soviets] intend...to induce the Americans to adopt their own 'restructuring' and convergence of the Soviet and American systems using to this end the fear of nuclear conflict.... Convergence will be accompanied by blood baths and political re-education camps in Western Europe and the United States. The Soviet strategists are counting on an economic depression in the United States and intend to introduce their reformed model of socialism with a human face as an alternative to the American system during the depression."

Anatoliy Golitsyn The Perestroika Deception 1990

"Those who hope that we shall move away from the socialist path will be greatly disappointed. Every part of our program of perestroika...is fully based on the principle of more socialism and more democracy."

Mikhail Gorbachev Perestroika - New Thinking for Our Country and the World 1988

"We are grateful to the Washington Post, The New York Times, Time Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost forty years. It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subjected to the lights of publicity during those years. But, the world is now more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto-determination practiced in past centuries."

David Rockefeller Baden-Baden, Germany 1991

"All of us will ultimately be judged on the effort we have contributed to building a NEW WORLD ORDER."--Robert Kennedy, former U.S. Attorney-General, 1967.

"The real rulers in Washington are invisible and exercise their power from behind the

scenes."-- Justice Felix Frankfurter, U.S. Supreme Court.

[Charles Anthony]

So are you the designated poster from the peanut gallery now?

No. I am practicing for my run at the Smart A$$ Party leadership.

OK. I will try to stop. It is one thing to formulate a reasonable counter argument but it is even more difficult to counter and un-reasonable argument. I should be commending you instead!

I am just jealous of your endurance keeping up with Poly. Sometimes I get a headache and other times my ribs hurt!

Many loans never get converted to cash. They are just numbers on a balance sheet.

That is exactly what money is. A piece of "cash" is a very small balance sheet.

Something real;ly big is happening and its not good, we know this because we are being lied to all the time in the media and not being informed about the American Union.

What do you recommend we do?

[PolyNewbie]

Charles Anthony:What do you recommend we do?

First of all to really understand what is happening you have to read a few books about the banks and how they operate here and abroad -or you can watch videos. (The Money Masters is free on google). You have to read what monetary reformists say then you have to look at history from a monetary point of view - they don't teach this in school because they don't want people to understand how the banks actually create money and what an influence on history they have.

Then you have to listen to a wide variety of historians and read quotes from bankers and presidents past. Catharine Austin Fitts was asked to be a governer for the Federal Reserve. Listen to what she has to say.

Once you have done this you can listen to Alex Jones and verify what he is saying as true. This is normally easy. Then you have to inform others.

Fundamentally, you must understand how banks influence society. Reading from the web site for the Council On Foreign Relations helps because they actually say they are going to cut population by 90 %. Its there in print. This conspiracy isn't being hidden, they understand that many people won't believe what is happening because it is so strange in their day to day experiences although it is not strange in the historical sense. Many people have trouble thinking beyond their own personal experiences. What will be happening to us has happened at least three times over the past 100 years so it is plausible.

[margrace]

Banks have always been trouble for ordinary people, even if you don't believe in the bible, the morality is good. Never a lender or a borror be" Good advice, and plainly making the point that usery is evil.

[Charles Anthony]

Banks have always been trouble for ordinary people, even if you don't believe in the bible, the morality is good. Never a lender or a borror be" Good advice, and plainly making the point that usery is evil.

Instead of borrowing a lawn-mower from my neighbor, I will just take it and not give it back.

First of all to really understand what is happening you have to read a few books about the banks and how they operate here and abroad -or you can watch videos.

Did you ever consider the possibility that I am stupid? I am sure you have.

Now, I ask: what should I do if I am not intelligent enough to understand the message of your books and videos?

[Riverwind]

riverwind:If you disagree then please explain where the money goes when it is loaned. It has to go somewhere - it is either withdrawn as cash or it is deposited into a bank that must pay interest on it.

Many loans never get converted to cash. They are just numbers on a balance sheet.

A loan is always spent on something. The people selling the goods or services that the loan was used to pay for will do one of the following:

1) Demand cash

2) Deposit the money into a bank

If they choose 2) then you are correct - loan and deposit are just numbers on a balance sheet, however, depositing the loan into a bank account means that a bank has to pay interest on it. IOW: when a bank loans money it may not need to settle the transaction with real cash every time, however, the bank will have to pay interest on the deposit as if it had received had produced the cash and then accepted a deposit in cash.

If you disagree then explain what elso could happen to money loaned? It has to go somewhere.

[PolyNewbie]

How many mortgae payements get paid in cash ?

How often do people use their credit cards to get cash then buy something ?

[PolyNewbie]

Charles Anthony:Did you ever consider the possibility that I am stupid? I am sure you have.

Now, I ask: what should I do if I am not intelligent enough to understand the message of your books and videos?

I think arrogance and fear will prevent someone from understanding the money system in its fundamental form. I'm sure that anyone who can read and write can understand how the banks operate and how they create money for nothing and how they use that to enslave us through big government and big taxes.

Charles Anthony:Did you ever consider the possibility that I am stupid? I am sure you have.

I have considered this but when reading your arguements around 911.

John Kenneth Galbraith says tat the way banks create money warps the mind and its difficult to believe. I've always known it but the implications didn't really hit home. I learned about the banks when I was young from reading a novel called "The Money Changers".

[Riverwind]

How many mortgae payements get paid in cash ?

How often do people use their credit cards to get cash then buy something ?

You don't listen. When someone gets a loan for a mortgage they do not get the physical cash but the person that is selling the house receives an electronic deposit and they are now entitled to receive interest payments as if they had deposited cash.

IOW: if a bank issues a loan for $100,000 then it must either provide $100,000 in cash it must pay interest on a $100,000 deposit. No matter what happens that loan costs the bank something.