Torture in Iraq

[myata]

Following "liberation", may have reached (and exceeded) Saddam's levels, according to a UN official. The Star story.

[myata]

And civilian casualties at their highest, ever: CBC story.

Shouldn't someone be held accountable for these? And sooner rather than later, before the blame is attributed to the West as whole, with predictable consequences?

[geoffrey]

Pull out the troops and the body count grows exponentially as the country is plunged into primative tribal warfare. Your call Mr. Righteous.

[jdobbin]

Pull out the troops and the body count grows exponentially as the country is plunged into primative tribal warfare. Your call Mr. Righteous.

The U.S. has already said they won't stay if there is a civil war. You think they should stay if it is civil war?

[Black Dog]

Pull out the troops and the body count grows exponentially as the country is plunged into primative tribal warfare. Your call Mr. Righteous.

Because they are doing such a bang up job now?

[GostHacked]

Pull out the troops and the body count grows exponentially as the country is plunged into primative tribal warfare. Your call Mr. Righteous.

The U.S. has already said they won't stay if there is a civil war. You think they should stay if it is civil war?

Actually yes they should stay. When you bring freedom (a product) you should be able to provide service/support for said product. It sucks for the troops who are doing the dirty work, moral would drop due to failed leadership to stabalize the country. Making it harder for them to actually carry out and do the job they were sent to do.

This proves to me that ...

- the Bush Administration had no clue of what they were getting into. (lack of planning and foresight)

OR

- The Bush Administration expected this to happen and pull out to save face and say 'Well, we tried!'

However, those new permanent US military installations in Iraq are well... permanent. Which says to me they are in it for the long run, in some way shape or form.

[jdobbin]

Actually yes they should stay. When you bring freedom (a product) you should be able to provide service/support for said product. It sucks for the troops who are doing the dirty work, moral would drop due to failed leadership to stabalize the country. Making it harder for them to actually carry out and do the job they were sent to do.

This proves to me that ...

- the Bush Administration had no clue of what they were getting into. (lack of planning and foresight)

OR

- The Bush Administration expected this to happen and pull out to save face and say 'Well, we tried!'

However, those new permanent US military installations in Iraq are well... permanent. Which says to me they are in it for the long run, in some way shape or form.

Sadly, this might mean they have to chose the Sunni side against Shias and Kurds. Or Kurd and Shia against Sunni. A civil war means a total war against one group in the country.

Meanwhile, two more soldiers killed today. And a hundreds of civilians killed by sectarian violence.

[myata]

If only it was possible to bring the instigators of this fine mess to justice, wouldn't it alone go a huge way toward resolving the conflict between civilizations? But no, not in this world.

[geoffrey]

Pull out the troops and the body count grows exponentially as the country is plunged into primative tribal warfare. Your call Mr. Righteous.

The U.S. has already said they won't stay if there is a civil war. You think they should stay if it is civil war?

Yes, for the same reasons we need to intervene in the civil war that is about to re-erupt in Sudan.

[jdobbin]

Yes, for the same reasons we need to intervene in the civil war that is about to re-erupt in Sudan.

There are a lot of civil conflicts around the world. We should intervene in all of them?

[geoffrey]

Yes, for the same reasons we need to intervene in the civil war that is about to re-erupt in Sudan.

There are a lot of civil conflicts around the world. We should intervene in all of them?

Depends on the circumstances, but yes, most. I don't view one from another country as a lesser person then myself. If I were a Rwandian or a Sudanese about to be murdered, I'd want Canada to help me. I can't morally justify turning my back on them, and not doing for them what I'd want done for myself.

For this reason, I focus charity dollars towards groups that assist such people, I'd never make a good solider, and we aren't in these places anyways.

[jdobbin]

Depends on the circumstances, but yes, most. I don't view one from another country as a lesser person then myself. If I were a Rwandian or a Sudanese about to be murdered, I'd want Canada to help me. I can't morally justify turning my back on them, and not doing for them what I'd want done for myself.

For this reason, I focus charity dollars towards groups that assist such people, I'd never make a good solider, and we aren't in these places anyways.

I think one of the reasons that the United States is in the position it is in is because they have gotten into the middle of sectarian or civil violence around the world.

I don't know that Canada's contributions could stop such violence permanently. It might only postpone it.

[jbg]

However, those new permanent US military installations in Iraq are well... permanent. Which says to me they are in it for the long run, in some way shape or form.

This is the restoration of the pre-WW II colonial era, by another name. It had to happen; these "countries" are:

1. not real countries; and
   
2. not ready for independence, financially or politically.
   

[M.Dancer]

Pull out the troops and the body count grows exponentially as the country is plunged into primative tribal warfare. Your call Mr. Righteous.

Which is the correct definaition of a military quagmire. It's a fusckered if ya do, fusckered if ya don't scenario. As much as I was against the war from day one, for those same reasons (to avoid pointless bloodshed) I think the US should pour in troops, to at least the First Gulf War levels. I can't see how less that 350,000 can resore peace. And what this country needs is breathing space to allow their tempers to cool and to root out the death squads and disarm the militias.

[jbg]

Pull out the troops and the body count grows exponentially as the country is plunged into primative tribal warfare. Your call Mr. Righteous.

Which is the correct definaition of a military quagmire. It's a fusckered if ya do, fusckered if ya don't scenario. As much as I was against the war from day one, for those same reasons (to avoid pointless bloodshed) I think the US should pour in troops, to at least the First Gulf War levels. I can't see how less that 350,000 can resore peace. And what this country needs is breathing space to allow their tempers to cool and to root out the death squads and disarm the militias.

I agree with you, surprisingly.