Iran - The New Nazi Germany ?

[Shady]

I suspect that is because the 'axis of evil' propaganda from Bush has sunk so deeply into your psyche that you are no longer capable of looking at the facts objectively when it comes to things related to Iran

Well, unfortunately you suspect wrong. I know that to you people, everything in the world leads back to George W Bush, but my opinions about the insane leader of Iran and ignorant statements related to him, are based on three facts. His belief in the 12th Imam, his desire to destroy Israel, and his denial of the Holocaust. Apparently you tree-hugging people have no problem looking past all this and praising him as some respectable, sane, logical world leader. That's ridiculous, and so are you.

Please, get your heads out of your collective asses. Put aside your hatred of President Bush, and see the facts for what they are. I beg you, for the good of the world.

[Black Dog]

Well, unfortunately you suspect wrong. I know that to you people, everything in the world leads back to George W Bush, but my opinions about the insane leader of Iran and ignorant statements related to him, are based on three facts. His belief in the 12th Imam, his desire to destroy Israel, and his denial of the Holocaust. Apparently you tree-hugging people have no problem looking past all this and praising him as some respectable, sane, logical world leader. That's ridiculous, and so are you.

No the reason I look past those three things is that they are completely irrelevant, given all the other facts. Let me put it this way: hating Jews, beliveing in any number of hidden inmans, and denying the Holocaust doe snot make him a threat. A kook, yes, but a threat? No. Shit: in Iran the president doesn't even control the military (betcha didn't know that).

[Machinations]

The Iranians did pass a law instituting an Islamic dress code though, with a 'uniform' of sorts for Islamic followers. It would be easy to tell the Christians and Jews from this.

The original story may be false in the idea that Jews would be wearing yellow stars or what not, but the idea that Iran wants to be able to identify 'holy' muslims and 'unholy' Christians/Jews on a national level is completely true.

Iran is a major human rights abuser, I'd sure hate to be a woman over there. No freedom to even dress how you wish, let alone freedom from abusive situations. These people need our help.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4929504.stm

http://www.rferl.org/featuresarticle/2006/...d00abd4ac4.html

As a clarification, as I recall the Kazemi case highlighted Iran's repressive regime. However, let's be clear - if we're going to condemn a regime for oppressing women, let's do it to all the offenders. Saudi Arabia and some of the other Gulf states have, as you are no doubt aware, highly brutal systems of repression, particularly towards women. They are hardly alone.

I seem to remember earlier this year the case of the man, apparently mentally ill (irrelevant but interesting) in Afghanistan who decided to convert from Islam to Christianity. I believe the sentence offered was death - but international pressure (money, heh) caused the court to commute the sentence. This avoided the nasty specter of our tax money going to support a, well, brutally repressive regime. What more should we expect though? Did we not 'fight' the Taliban with a proxy army made up of ragtag opium warlords? And air support, of course - that won the campaign, since the Taliban had no air forces to speak of, nor effective air defenses. I digress.

By being selective in our outrage we appear, well, outrageous. Is the situation of a Jew or Christian in Afghanistan not equally precarious? Do the women there not wear Islamic dress - would you not know a Jew by his kippah?

The same applies in Pakistan - which, of course is nuclear armed, but no-one seems to worry as long as a US-backed military dictator is in power. Once the inevitable revolution topples Musharraf, we will be left with a nuclear armed Pakistan squaring off with India over Kashmir, at the very least. The incoming government is likely to favor confrontation if they are radicals (also likely), which the education system incubates at an alarming rate.

So, in reply to the OP and the title of this thread - the New Nazi Germany? What pompous, ridiculous blather.

Attitudes in Iran, more so that the other Gulf states, are increasingly modern and Westernized. Would this not be the time to engage in serious diplomacy? As I have stated in other threads, an intervention (or invasion - semantics) in my view is likely to have a serious negative impact on the overall situation.

[Machinations]

I suspect that is because the 'axis of evil' propaganda from Bush has sunk so deeply into your psyche that you are no longer capable of looking at the facts objectively when it comes to things related to Iran

Well, unfortunately you suspect wrong. I know that to you people, everything in the world leads back to George W Bush, but my opinions about the insane leader of Iran and ignorant statements related to him, are based on three facts. His belief in the 12th Imam, his desire to destroy Israel, and his denial of the Holocaust. Apparently you tree-hugging people have no problem looking past all this and praising him as some respectable, sane, logical world leader. That's ridiculous, and so are you.

Please, get your heads out of your collective asses. Put aside your hatred of President Bush, and see the facts for what they are. I beg you, for the good of the world.

One thing I find disturbing about your post is your idea that somehow, vague threats towards Israel have anything to do with us. I cannot understand the insane amounts of military and financial aid we send Israel when the average income of an Israeli is higher than that of your average Canadian.

Israel is a nation, capable of standing on it's own two (figurative) feet. If Algeria's president - having no military office, unlike the United States - were to make vague threats towards France, would we not feel it France's place to respond?

Now, the Holocaust is historical fact. That being said, I'm sure you can dig up people in many governments across the Middle East who deny it happened. Is that a reason to attack them? Clearly Iran had nothing to do with the Holocaust, right?

It is similar to how Israel denies attacking the USS Liberty in 1967. However, it is historical fact. Should we invade Israel?

There is this knee-jerk reaction to support Israel - and I have no bias against the Israeli people - it's just I do not feel any special empathy for them either. People suffer all over the world, and genocide has happened in OUR lifetimes - think Rwanda or present-day Darfur. I do not understand why the United States sends in excess of a billion dollars a year in military aid to Israel while Darfur can't get a battalion.

Please note, I am not an 'anti-Semite', and I find the practice of typically labelling critics of Israel or our foreign policy towards Israel 'anti-Semetic' truly asinine.

[KrustyKidd]

There is this knee-jerk reaction to support Israel - and I have no bias against the Israeli people - it's just I do not feel any special empathy for them either.

I don't either except I don't like to see people get killed by the thousands. And, that is what will happen if Israel is not armed and ready to protect themselves against the entire Arab world by converntional means. See, if the Israleis don't have the means to protect themselves without using nuclear weapoons, they will have to use those nukes and that means that millions of Arabs will die. I don't wish to see that so therefore, don't mind supporting Israel in their lower tier weapons systems.

On the other hand, any country n the Middle East that isn't calling for the death of the Infidel should be protected and watered and, given aid to grow. Not being from the middle east and, undenieably an Infidel, they are to me, at least not calling for mine and your collective deaths. That's also a plus in my books.

[Machinations]

There is this knee-jerk reaction to support Israel - and I have no bias against the Israeli people - it's just I do not feel any special empathy for them either.

I don't either except I don't like to see people get killed by the thousands. And, that is what will happen if Israel is not armed and ready to protect themselves against the entire Arab world by converntional means. See, if the Israleis don't have the means to protect themselves without using nuclear weapoons, they will have to use those nukes and that means that millions of Arabs will die. I don't wish to see that so therefore, don't mind supporting Israel in their lower tier weapons systems.

On the other hand, any country n the Middle East that isn't calling for the death of the Infidel should be protected and watered and, given aid to grow. Not being from the middle east and, undenieably an Infidel, they are to me, at least not calling for mine and your collective deaths. That's also a plus in my books.

The situation is exceedingly complex. Its hard to get people to bury the hatchet - especially given the current geopolitcal climate. I would'nt say Israel is unable to defend itself, though - most Israeli's would dispute that assertation, also. They have mandatory military service, a highly modernized army and a robust air and naval force. The successfully prosecuted the Six-Day War and maintain a fairly militarized border.

Israel is, without doubt, the eminent military force in the Middle East. Well, once America leaves.

[KrustyKidd]

Israel is, without doubt, the eminent military force in the Middle East. Well, once America leaves.

And, thankfully so as we all know what would happen if they were not - a blood bath. So, in order to keep them that way, we should continue to support them.

[scribblet]

I guess everyone missed this one while getting their knickers in a knot ofer the NP article.

Iran Test-Fires Long-Range Missile

May 23, 2006 Jerusalem Post

Iran conducted a test launch Tuesday night of the Shihab-3 intermediate-range ballistic missile, which is capable of reaching Israel and US targets in the region, Israel Radio reported. The test came hours before Prime Minister Ehud Olmert met with US President George W Bush in Washington to discuss the Iranian threat.

Military officials said it was not clear if this most recent test indicated an advance in the capabilities of the Shihab 3. They said the test was likely timed to coincide with the Washington summit and with comments made by Hizbullah leader Hassan Nasrallah during celebrations in Beirut marking the 6th anniversary of Israel's withdrawal from southern Lebanon.

THE IRANIAN THREAT

"What deters the enemy from launching an aggression is the resistance's continuous readiness to respond," Nasrallah told scores of supporters. "Northern Israel today is within the range of the resistance's rockets. The ports, bases, factories and everything is within that range."

The Shihab test was only "partly successful," according to news reports. The nature of the difficulties was not clear. The Iranians have been working to extend the Shihab 3's current maximum range of 1,300 kilometers. A year ago, they successfully tested a solid fuel motor for the missile.

In December, Israel's defense against an Iranian ballistic missile strike, the Arrow 2 missile system, succeeded in intercepting an incoming rocket simulating an Iranian Shihab 3 at an altitude higher than in the previous 13 exercises.

Maj. Elyakim, commander of the Arrow missile battery at Palmahim, told The Jerusalem Post last month that the missile crews were always on high alert, but that they were recently instructed to "raise their level of awareness" because of developments on the Iranian front.

The Arrow missile, he said, could intercept and destroy any Iranian missile fired at Israel, including ones carrying non-conventional warheads. Experts believe that if Iran is attacked by Israel or the US, Teheran would respond by firing long-range ballistic missiles at Israel.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid...icle%2FShowFull

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http://atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/HE24Ak05.html

Iran deploys its war machine

By Iason Athanasiadis

TEHRAN - For Hossein Shariatzadeh, a veteran of the eight-year Iran-Iraq War in the 1980s, now navigating Tehran's traffic-choked streets as a taxi driver, the issue of whether the United States will strike Iraq is hardly a frightening prospect.

"This is Iran," he roared. "It is fire. It is a nuclear bomb. Don't look at my sitting behind the wheel of this car. I would get up in a second and head off to the front to fight."

During his 18 months of service at the front, Shariatzadeh claims to have fought in several flashpoint events. Before being evacuated to Tehran after taking a bullet in the stomach, he participated in the 18th Mah, Fath-ul Mubin and Fajrs 1, 2 and 4 offensives, some of the most horrific campaigns of a drawn-out war

[Machinations]

Israel is, without doubt, the eminent military force in the Middle East. Well, once America leaves.

And, thankfully so as we all know what would happen if they were not - a blood bath. So, in order to keep them that way, we should continue to support them.

My argument is, esentially, they no longer need our support - they are financially solvent. Their military would defeat OURS for God's sake.

Why are we sending them money for weapons we can't afford?

[KrustyKidd]

My argument is, esentially, they no longer need our support - they are financially solvent. Their military would defeat OURS for God's sake.

They wouldn't though. Our two countries are on the same path theolgically, even if they are thousands of miles apart.

BTW, how much do we send them?

[lordvishnu]

I suspect that is because the 'axis of evil' propaganda from Bush has sunk so deeply into your psyche that you are no longer capable of looking at the facts objectively when it comes to things related to Iran

Well, unfortunately you suspect wrong. I know that to you people, everything in the world leads back to George W Bush, but my opinions about the insane leader of Iran and ignorant statements related to him, are based on three facts. His belief in the 12th Imam, his desire to destroy Israel, and his denial of the Holocaust. Apparently you tree-hugging people have no problem looking past all this and praising him as some respectable, sane, logical world leader. That's ridiculous, and so are you.

Please, get your heads out of your collective asses. Put aside your hatred of President Bush, and see the facts for what they are. I beg you, for the good of the world.

for the sake of the world?? are you kidding me? President Bush is the clear and present danger to world peace. though, it's too late and we are well down the path towards inevitability.

[KrustyKidd]

President Bush is the clear and present danger to world peace. though, it's too late and we are well down the path towards inevitability.

Without going into intricacies and lengthy political discussions, he took out a guy that was responsible for the deaths of millions while causing less than ten thousand deaths in the process. Overall, saving on average a thousand lives per month. Bad guys know they will get taken out as well and hence are that much less likely to try destabilizing actions.

So, where is he a threat to world peace? Iraq - a democracy. Troubled, yet step by step and day by day becoming more peaceful. Iran - negotiating. North Korea - negotiating. So, what the hell are you talking about please?

[Machinations]

My argument is, esentially, they no longer need our support - they are financially solvent. Their military would defeat OURS for God's sake.

They wouldn't though. Our two countries are on the same path theolgically, even if they are thousands of miles apart.

BTW, how much do we send them?

Canada, I don't know and to be honest I am lazy and am not digging a source right now.

The United States, you can quote me, something like 2 billion USD$ in pure military aid a year. Once you start looking into it, you're like - why? They produce their own main battle tanks (they have over 5000) which are comparable to Challenger or Leopard models in use. They have nuclear weapons. They have mandatory military service.

On the theological thing - religion is personal, last time I checked Canada was a secular democracy. Israel is not. I see no reason to align ourselves with Israel because of belief in a particular variety of invisible superman.

[lordvishnu]

it should be clearly obvious to anyone the USA is the new Nazi Germany. if you think anything else then you are nothing but a brainwashed slave.

[gc1765]

it should be clearly obvious to anyone the USA is the new Nazi Germany. if you think anything else then you are nothing but a brainwashed slave.

Care to back that up with some facts? Or were you being sarcastic? Sometimes it's hard to tell