Conservative MP with balls stands up to the lockdown

[gerryhatrick]

OTTAWA -- A Conservative MP, already taken to the woodshed by the prime minister for speaking out on Liberal floor-crosser David Emerson, says Stephen Harper has nothing that he wants and vows to continue speaking out for his constituents.

http://www.edmontonsun.com/News/Canada/200...508906-sun.html

Well, that's one with the balls to openly claim his right to free speach so far.

I think every Conservative MP who defends thier right to free expression deserves a vote in the next election.

[Leader Circle]

OTTAWA -- A Conservative MP, already taken to the woodshed by the prime minister for speaking out on Liberal floor-crosser David Emerson, says Stephen Harper has nothing that he wants and vows to continue speaking out for his constituents.

http://www.edmontonsun.com/News/Canada/200...508906-sun.html

Well, that's one with the balls to openly claim his right to free speach so far.

I think every Conservative MP who defends thier right to free expression deserves a vote in the next election.

This guy needs to shut his mouth for the good of the people in his constituency. Why rock the boat a second time around? He is hurting his electorate more than himself.

This is one guy who should have never got behind a mic. I guess the Conservatives need a more comprehensive background search on their candidates, because one idiot made his was through!

[gerryhatrick]

This guy needs to shut his mouth for the good of the people in his constituency. Why rock the boat a second time around? He is hurting his electorate more than himself.

This is one guy who should have never got behind a mic. I guess the Conservatives need a more comprehensive background search on their candidates, because one idiot made his was through!

Holy sour grapes batman!

All this guy did was answer a question about the floor crossing in an honest fashion. He didn't critisize Harper over it at the time. THEN Harper dragged him to the carpet...tore a strip off him. Harper is the idiot for making it into a bigger deal than it needed to be.

Harper turned this guy into a "Maverick". He laid the chips down on him, and the guy decided to openly defy him because he wasn't going to be bullied.

Now Harper is trying to Muzzle all his MP's, of course this man will again stand up for himself and his constituents.

He's guaranteed himself re-election with this accountable and honest behavior.

[idealisttotheend]

People who read my posts when I used to post alot realize I am one of those lefty unionists that everyone here these days seems to despise. This means if I speak (a.k.a. post) in favour of this maverick MP people will think I am just doing it because he seems to be weaking the Conservatives. But think again.

When I was growing up I was a lefty unionist (even then) but I used to surprise people by saying I respected Manning and Reform. I respected them because underneath the shenanigans and the cheap visual trickery they were a party of ideas with a desire to change the system. There was an integrity to them. I was horrified as the next guy by the people threatening to charge across the isle and engage in a fist fight with their Liberal counterparts and some of the things said did give them a deserved bad image. Plus I've never seen how it's adventageous to replace democratically elected governments with corporations to deliver services or make policy (the drive for smaller government).

But think of the core of the Reform, later Alliance. Think of the Chuck Strahls, the Ian McLellands, the Debroah Grays and even Manning himself. These were people with integrity, who would stand up for their constituents who would stand up for their beliefs, who would (as that stupid Conservative commercial professes) stand up for Canada. And where are they now. Strahl wanted to run for the leadership but didn't have the big Ontario money Harper had, (I liken this to McCain losing to Bush even after the former has served in a bloody POW camp for his country and the latter skipped out on his National guard posting).

Martin failed to integrate the Chretienites and the left (represented by the hapless SHelia Copps apparently) of his party. This cost him. I wonder if Harper's loss of the aforementioned group of principled Reform/Alliance people will cost him. Will there be a backlash by the old guard of the party who believe in speaking their minds and being honest with themselves and the people they serve.

Frankly I doubt it. As the article points out there are too many perks to be gained by sticking by the party line. Too many people who will toe the line. Even if that means we get an old style top down party run entirely out of the PMO for the sake of the PMO.

And if that is the case I wonder how long it will be until the next protest movement arises, shouting "The West wants In."

[newbie]

Bravo for Mr. Turner. He's one conservative that actually speaks HIS mind and works for his constituents; the true meaning of democracy.

[Nocrap]

People who read my posts when I used to post alot realize I am one of those lefty unionists that everyone here these days seems to despise. This means if I speak (a.k.a. post) in favour of this maverick MP people will think I am just doing it because he seems to be weaking the Conservatives. But think again.

When I was growing up I was a lefty unionist (even then) but I used to surprise people by saying I respected Manning and Reform. I respected them because underneath the shenanigans and the cheap visual trickery they were a party of ideas with a desire to change the system. There was an integrity to them. I was horrified as the next guy by the people threatening to charge across the isle and engage in a fist fight with their Liberal counterparts and some of the things said did give them a deserved bad image. Plus I've never seen how it's adventageous to replace democratically elected governments with corporations to deliver services or make policy (the drive for smaller government).

But think of the core of the Reform, later Alliance. Think of the Chuck Strahls, the Ian McLellands, the Debroah Grays and even Manning himself. These were people with integrity, who would stand up for their constituents who would stand up for their beliefs, who would (as that stupid Conservative commercial professes) stand up for Canada. And where are they now. Strahl wanted to run for the leadership but didn't have the big Ontario money Harper had, (I liken this to McCain losing to Bush even after the former has served in a bloody POW camp for his country and the latter skipped out on his National guard posting).

Martin failed to integrate the Chretienites and the left (represented by the hapless SHelia Copps apparently) of his party. This cost him. I wonder if Harper's loss of the aforementioned group of principled Reform/Alliance people will cost him. Will there be a backlash by the old guard of the party who believe in speaking their minds and being honest with themselves and the people they serve.

Frankly I doubt it. As the article points out there are too many perks to be gained by sticking by the party line. Too many people who will toe the line. Even if that means we get an old style top down party run entirely out of the PMO for the sake of the PMO.

And if that is the case I wonder how long it will be until the next protest movement arises, shouting "The West wants In."

People who read my posts when I used to post alot realize I am one of those lefty unionists that everyone here these days seems to despise.

I'm a lefty too, I guess, and agree with your insight. I've read Preston Manning's bio and am currently reading Stephen Harper's. I think the initial concept of the Reform Party was very good, but the new CPC is nothing like the original Reform party; nor is it anything like the old Tory party. It actually reminds me of George Orwell's Animal Farm. Wait till you have control of the house then hit the feather bed.

I've read some of Garth's blog, and he is very funny. I respect his position and perhaps some of his colleagues may now have the courage to speak out. Just because they are backbenchers, doesn't mean they have to just be cheerleaders for the selected few. Their responsibility is to the people who put them in office, not the Prime Minister.

[Argus]

Bravo for Mr. Turner. He's one conservative that actually speaks HIS mind and works for his constituents; the true meaning of democracy.

Unsurprising how all the lefties love a conservative who speaks out against the party. It's similar to the white supremecists and Nazis who love to find Jews saying bad things about Israel and Jews.

Turner will not run again. If he tries his papers won't be signed. So by spouting over relatively innocuous things like this, but doing so in such a way as to embarrass his party and leader, all he's done is made himself irrelevent. He won't be listened to in caucus, his phone calls and letters to cabinet and the PMO will be ignored, and come next election someone else will be running for the party in his riding.

Pity, really. He might have accomplished something. Unfortunately, it looks like sour grapes over not getting a cabinet portfolio have revealed a sulkiness and selfishness the party is better off without.

[cdnazzurri]

See, this here is the problem with Canadian democracy and Canadian politics in general. The whole point of a parliament is to question the actions of the prime minister and the govenment. If a MP is repremanded, punished for speaking out against inequities, against the hypocracy that is the Stephen Harper government, that is not democracy.

I was angered by the move of Belinda Stronach, and before her Scott Brison to the Liberal party, it was underhanded, so it isn't just a criticism of the Tories.

As for Turner, he could run as an independent since his papers won't be signed.

[BubberMiley]

Unsurprising how all the lefties love a conservative who speaks out against the party. It's similar to the white supremecists and Nazis who love to find Jews saying bad things about Israel and Jews.

Saying MPs should be able to speak freely in a party that ran on a platform of free votes for MPs: what could be closer to being a nazi?

[Michael Hardner]

a party that ran on a platform of free votes for MPs

I find it very odd that they've done such an about-face on allowing their MPs a greater degree of freedom than the Liberals did. In the end, it won't make a whole lot of difference if economic and other factors work in Harper's favour.

[geoffrey]

See, this here is the problem with Canadian democracy and Canadian politics in general. The whole point of a parliament is to question the actions of the prime minister and the govenment. If a MP is repremanded, punished for speaking out against inequities, against the hypocracy that is the Stephen Harper government, that is not democracy.

I was angered by the move of Belinda Stronach, and before her Scott Brison to the Liberal party, it was underhanded, so it isn't just a criticism of the Tories.

As for Turner, he could run as an independent since his papers won't be signed.

The Parlimentary system revolves around the concept of party discipline and control. It cannot exist any other way.

If you want a government that can question its executive, then look south for a great model of that.

You won't find any in the parlimentary countries.

[Montgomery Burns]

Argus:

Unsurprising how all the lefties love a conservative who speaks out against the party.

That sounds familiar. Hmmm...

MSM host (with big smile on face): "Today's guest is Republican maverick Sen. John McCain."

[gerryhatrick]

Turner will not run again. If he tries his papers won't be signed. So by spouting over relatively innocuous things like this, but doing so in such a way as to embarrass his party and leader, all he's done is made himself irrelevent.

Hardly.

You think he's embarrassing Harper, so you are angry at him. That's fair. But don't pretend he's irrelevent.

He's made a name for himself and won the respect of a lot of people.

Just because Harper won't return his phone calls hardly makes him irrelevent.

[John_McLean]

The Parlimentary system revolves around the concept of party discipline and control. It cannot exist any other way.

If you want a government that can question its executive, then look south for a great model of that.

You won't find any in the parlimentary countries.

http://www.conservative.ca/EN/2692/41607

A Conservative Government will restore democratic accountability in the House of Commons by allowing free votes. A Conservative Government will make all votes free, except for the budget and main estimates. On issues of moral conscience, such as abortion, the definition of marriage and euthanasia, the Conservative Party acknowledges the diversity of deeply held personal convictions among individual Party members and the right of Members of Parliament to adopt positions in consultation with their constituents and to vote freely.

[Guest Warwick Green]

The Parlimentary system revolves around the concept of party discipline and control. It cannot exist any other way.

If you want a government that can question its executive, then look south for a great model of that.

You won't find any in the parlimentary countries.

http://www.conservative.ca/EN/2692/41607

A Conservative Government will restore democratic accountability in the House of Commons by allowing free votes. A Conservative Government will make all votes free, except for the budget and main estimates. On issues of moral conscience, such as abortion, the definition of marriage and euthanasia, the Conservative Party acknowledges the diversity of deeply held personal convictions among individual Party members and the right of Members of Parliament to adopt positions in consultation with their constituents and to vote freely.

Approaching a Liberal MP the day after the election and bribing him with a Cabinet post, IMO, falls into the realm of "moral conscience". However, unlike simply voting in favor of SSM on a resolution, questioning the whole Emerson deal makes the PM look bad. And that is a real no-no in politics.

[August1991]

Am I missing something here?

The only evidence I've seen of anything is the quote from the Edmonton Sun link above:

A Conservative MP, already taken to the woodshed by the prime minister for speaking out on Liberal floor-crosser David Emerson, says Stephen Harper has nothing that he wants and vows to continue speaking out for his constituents.

Did Stephen Harper really take Garth Turner out to a woodshed? What happened there?

Garth Turner was elected in Halton Ontario to defend the interests of his constituents. Turner then went to Quebec and gave a speech. In the speech, he said:

(Turner) recalled talking to a man whose house "was worth maybe half a million -- modest for this neighbourhood. He told me it felt like his life was being squeezed now from all sides. Property taxes, income taxes, GST . . . 'All I've got is this.' He kicked the bricks at his front door."

Then there was the woman who decided to stay at home and raise her kids. Her husband makes six figures, but "our friends who have two incomes make a lot less, and always have more to throw around. The system is killing my family."

G & M

Garth Turner seems to have a big ego, and a lot of energy. He wants to change completely Canada's tax system. Turner is not the leader of the party and is not free to design the tax system as he sees fit. If he wants to influence changes, this approach doesn't seem the right way. IOW, Turner's not very smart. Which even he seems to have understood.

Tonight – this morning, now – I have received the clarity I wrote about yesterday morning as the sun rose on my yard back home. I listened to the people. I was true to myself. I have not lied or compromised. But that’s a fair distance from being smart.

Turner's Weblog

I have no idea what happened between Turner and Harper but the real problem seems to be between Turner and the caucus. An MP is an MP is an MP. But a member of a caucus is another thing.

My guess is that this is much ado about nothing.

[newbie]

Bravo for Mr. Turner. He's one conservative that actually speaks HIS mind and works for his constituents; the true meaning of democracy.

Unsurprising how all the lefties love a conservative who speaks out against the party. It's similar to the white supremecists and Nazis who love to find Jews saying bad things about Israel and Jews.

Poor misguided Monty. If you've read any of my past posts you would know that I applauded the Liberal MP who quit Martin's cabinet for voting against same sex marriage based on what his constituents wanted. I also was against floor crossing from any side. Comparing me to a white supremecist and a nazi is typical of your low regard for anyone who disagrees with you.

[Leader Circle]

The Parlimentary system revolves around the concept of party discipline and control. It cannot exist any other way.

If you want a government that can question its executive, then look south for a great model of that.

You won't find any in the parlimentary countries.

http://www.conservative.ca/EN/2692/41607

A Conservative Government will restore democratic accountability in the House of Commons by allowing free votes. A Conservative Government will make all votes free, except for the budget and main estimates. On issues of moral conscience, such as abortion, the definition of marriage and euthanasia, the Conservative Party acknowledges the diversity of deeply held personal convictions among individual Party members and the right of Members of Parliament to adopt positions in consultation with their constituents and to vote freely.

I don't think anyone is wanting to take away his free vote but, a blatant attempt to insult your party and leader is pure assinine. This guy is looking for his 15 minutes of fame & every lefty media outlet will give it to him. When they are done with him, he will be nothing more than a toilet bug. Nobody is saying, shut your mouth on things you believe, use a little tact is all!

[fellowtraveller]

Sounds like Garth got bypassed for a Cabinet post and is determined to be as miserable and cranky as possible........

As I recall, he was in Mulroneys Cabinet at one point.

[newbie]

The Parlimentary system revolves around the concept of party discipline and control. It cannot exist any other way.

If you want a government that can question its executive, then look south for a great model of that.

You won't find any in the parlimentary countries.

http://www.conservative.ca/EN/2692/41607

A Conservative Government will restore democratic accountability in the House of Commons by allowing free votes. A Conservative Government will make all votes free, except for the budget and main estimates. On issues of moral conscience, such as abortion, the definition of marriage and euthanasia, the Conservative Party acknowledges the diversity of deeply held personal convictions among individual Party members and the right of Members of Parliament to adopt positions in consultation with their constituents and to vote freely.

I don't think anyone is wanting to take away his free vote but, a blatant attempt to insult your party and leader is pure assinine. This guy is looking for his 15 minutes of fame & every lefty media outlet will give it to him. When they are done with him, he will be nothing more than a toilet bug. Nobody is saying, shut your mouth on things you believe, use a little tact is all!

What about Myron Thomspon? Another loose cannon?

[Argus]

Turner will not run again. If he tries his papers won't be signed. So by spouting over relatively innocuous things like this, but doing so in such a way as to embarrass his party and leader, all he's done is made himself irrelevent.

Hardly.

You think he's embarrassing Harper, so you are angry at him. That's fair. But don't pretend he's irrelevent.

He's made a name for himself and won the respect of a lot of people.

Just because Harper won't return his phone calls hardly makes him irrelevent.

He will be a nobody backbench MP for the limitied duration of this parliament and then unemployed.

[gerryhatrick]

He will be a nobody backbench MP for the limitied duration of this parliament and then unemployed.

I would bet two paychecks he'll be in Parliament after the next election. And if he's not, he's dead (in which case the bet's off).

[BubberMiley]

How much are your paycheques?

[gerryhatrick]

How much are your paycheques?

Net about $1200/2 weeks.

[Leader Circle]

The Parlimentary system revolves around the concept of party discipline and control. It cannot exist any other way.

If you want a government that can question its executive, then look south for a great model of that.

You won't find any in the parlimentary countries.

http://www.conservative.ca/EN/2692/41607

A Conservative Government will restore democratic accountability in the House of Commons by allowing free votes. A Conservative Government will make all votes free, except for the budget and main estimates. On issues of moral conscience, such as abortion, the definition of marriage and euthanasia, the Conservative Party acknowledges the diversity of deeply held personal convictions among individual Party members and the right of Members of Parliament to adopt positions in consultation with their constituents and to vote freely.

I don't think anyone is wanting to take away his free vote but, a blatant attempt to insult your party and leader is pure assinine. This guy is looking for his 15 minutes of fame & every lefty media outlet will give it to him. When they are done with him, he will be nothing more than a toilet bug. Nobody is saying, shut your mouth on things you believe, use a little tact is all!

What about Myron Thomspon? Another loose cannon?

Nah, he's a good old fashion redneck. People don't get offended with rednecks, because the often don't understand them.

Myron has had a few choice words, but usually tows the party line, Turner does not. I think he truly became the Conservative candidate as a farce(I wonder who ran against him for the Conservative candidacy in his riding?) and was never really a new age Conservative. He is stuck in Kim Campbell mode! Basically a defected Liberal with a blue tie!