PM is distressed

[BubberMiley]

The next time a hardcore pornography story shows up in the news, are these same people going to be insisting the press shouldn't appease anyone calling for them to exercise self-censorship?

[Canuck E Stan]

Where are the pictures for this "news" item

where's the media pictures?

[Wilber]

What? Are you just going to let freedom go just because some lunatics from another country wanted you to?

Are Canadian Muslims lunatics, because they don't like it?

Why can't people respect the fact that it offends Muslims.

You don't think there is anything wrong,but that's you.

It offends Muslims.

Not only Muslims around the world,but Muslims here in Canada.

How can you pass judgement on what is offensive to someone else.

Only they can make that judgement.

And I will respect their judgement because it is their judgement, not mine.

This wasn't supposedly offensive.....but fifty years later one group finally said enough is enough.

Offensive

Nobody asks me what I find offensive before they print something. I have every right to say I'm offended but I don't have any right, moral or legal to take violent action against those who offend me. By the same token those who chose to offend will have to take any consequences available under the law. You have it backward. It is the violent acts of a group of people who claim to be acting according to their religion that gives birth to cartoons like this, not the other way around. If their protests were conducted in a civilized manner their objections would be respected and I daresay would get a lot more sympathy than they do now.

[Canuck E Stan]

Nobody asks me what I find offensive before they print something. I have every right to say I'm offended but I don't have any right, moral or legal to take violent action against those who offend me. By the same token those who chose to offend will have to take any consequences available under the law. You have it backward. It is the violent acts of a group of people who claim to be acting according to their religion that gives birth to cartoons like this, not the other way around. If their protests were conducted in a civilized manner their objections would be respected and I daresay would get a lot more sympathy than they do now.

These people are angry because they are offended.

There are 1 Billion Muslims in the world.

Canadian Muslims are offended,these people are your neighbours,your friends.

They don't create violent acts,they are Canadians and they are angry.

Can you not accept these Canadians and their displeasure of these cartoons.

People around the world are angry in different ways.

The editor make the decisions to print or not.

Here is one editor's reason on why she didn't print the cartoons.

Tasteless caricature has no place here

There are several reasons why we decided not to run these cartoons.

After this controversy broke several weeks ago now, we looked at the cartoons in question and determined that we would not have run these cartoons prior to this controversy and therefore we won't now.

Why? Because they are in very poor taste. They are offensive to the religious sensitivities of Muslims, and just as we wouldn't knowingly run cartoons that are crudely disrespectful to Christians, Jews or any other religion, we will not gratuitously insult Muslims either.

Simple....offensive and in poor taste.

Respect your fellow Canadian.

[Wilber]

I accept that people are offended by these cartoons. I think they were in poor taste and am not surprised that people find them offensive. I accept that like a majority of non Muslim Canadians the same majority of Muslims don't resort to violence when they feel offended. Offensive or not, those cartoons were the result of violent acts being committed by people claiming to act in the name of God. They didn't cause those acts.

The violent reaction to the cartoons just makes them more credible to many in the world.

[Leafless]

Canuck E Stan

You wrote- " Simply offensive and in poor taste.

Respect your fellow Canadian."

Concerning the Calgary editor that finds the cartoons might endanger our troops in Afghanistan.

Our troops are already in danger in Afaghanistan and face and have faced Muzlim extremist terrorist attacks. They are there exactly for that reason to help that country towards acheiving a functionable democratic government.

I surprised you and you moderate Muzlims who protest in countries like Canada don't understand that Canadians also might have an extreme disgust concering the murderous actions of these nut case extremist Muzlims but you don't see hoards of Canadians protesting that fact, burning down building and demand our government take action one way or the other to stop these insane killings.

I wonder what the Muzlim reaction would be in Canada if this sort of counter protest against Muzlim extremists who murder and not draw cartoons would be?

Would they scream simply offensive and in poor taste??

[betsy]

The next time a hardcore pornography story shows up in the news, are these same people going to be insisting the press shouldn't appease anyone calling for them to exercise self-censorship?

We've got pornography laws. So even if the press would want to...they aren't allowed. Besides, why would a Home and Garden magazine want to print Hustler stuff? They've got their own market.

But you know what, if it's okay for Muslims to go an a rampage and violent protest over religious beliefs that they deemed is offensive, then...

It is okay to throw bombs and murder doctors in abortion clinics for they practice something which is not only offensive to some religions....but deemed as murder of helpless innocents. We can even include mothers who go to such clinics! If violent protest is okay for one...then it should be okay for the others.

One way or the other you'll do as we say....or else.

[Argus]

But given the climate that has resulted from the printing of those cartoons, what's the point of inciting them further? It's not being cowardly; it's just common sense. It isn't necessary to better inform people, because if they were really interested enough to see them, they could find them easily online at many sites

The latest pictures of abu graihb prison in Iraq are being released by the Australian media. Why? it's not necessary to better inform people. These are taken at the same time as the other ones, and contain no new information. They will incite violence against westerners just like the cartoons will, will likely get some people killed, in fact. But I bet all the media everywhere publish them regardless. What's the point of inciting them further? Why, to sell newspapers! All those media outlets which piously refused to show the prphet picture "so as to not incite the Muslim mobs" will gleefully show these.

Levant said it was fear which kept the western media from showing those cartoons. I believe he was right - and wrong. It wasn't fear of bombs, it was fear of being accused of being insensitie to a minority group, fear of being called racists, fear of being politically incorrect. Those are the kind of terrors which keep CBC reporters and editors up at night.

The average reader of the Western Standard has Internet access so pretending it's essential that the public has a print copy to look at is preposterous.

I met a couple the other day, well-educated, who had never seen the cartoons. The hubbie had tried to find them on the internet, but failed. Not everyone is internet savvy. People who haven't seen them, no-doubt think they're really horrible, that they are designed to mock and ridicule the prophet. They're not. They're actually pretty bland. I think people should see that.

[Argus]

What? Are you just going to let freedom go just because some lunatics from another country wanted you to?

Are Canadian Muslims lunatics, because they don't like it?

Why can't people respect the fact that it offends Muslims.

You don't think there is anything wrong,but that's you.

It offends Muslims.

You are offending me. So shut up right now.

Or do I have to get violent and burn something down before you'll do as you're told and not say anything that ticks me off?

[Argus]

Canuck - that is a point well made.

No, it isn't. Drawing a cartoon which is deliberately racist is not the same as drawing an inocuous cartoon which is a political commentary on the political behaviour (and what could be more political than rioting and burning and killing and beheading?) of a huge group of people. Islam is not merely a religion, it is a political movement. We're supposed to not criticise it?

[Argus]

Where are the pictures for this "news" item

where's the media pictures?

Are you so clueless you can't tell the difference between printing a sexually explicit picture which ads nothing to a news story, and printing the basis of that news story? People don't need to see a picture of a guy having sex with a sheep to know what it's about. It's not like there's any controversy or question about the rightness or wrongness of the act.

But when you tell them cartoons are mocking and insultful to the prophet they'll believe it if they can't see them. The cartoons are not mocking the prophet, but it's amazing how many people - due to lousy journalism - believe they are.

And I told you already, you're offending me. Shut up or I'll burn something.

[Army Guy]

We in Canada are among the many countries that have more freedoms than most, those freedoms should be used as they were intended, and should be used with caution and common sense. They do not give us the right to insult, mock, make racist comments etc.

While we are here in Canada protected under the umbrella of all our rights and freedoms we must remain viligant on how we use our freedoms.

A soldiers opinon.

[betsy]

But don't you see....you're talking of "appeasement".

And the radical muslim warmongers are saying the exact same thing to the rational muslims who say "but it's just a stupid cartoon!"

But don't you see....you're talking of "appeasement".

I don't get it. Can you explain why that's "appeasement?"

[betsy]

We in Canada are among the many countries that have more freedoms than most, those freedoms should be used as they were intended, and should be used with caution and common sense. They do not give us the right to insult, mock, make racist comments etc.

While we are here in Canada protected under the umbrella of all our rights and freedoms we must remain viligant on how we use our freedoms.

A soldiers opinon.

And we have to be vigilant in protecting these freedom. Once you start dismantling these freedoms...a little bit at a time...you wake up one morning with nothing!

Countless soldiers have died for these freedom.

[betsy]

What? Are you just going to let freedom go just because some lunatics from another country wanted you to?

Are Canadian Muslims lunatics, because they don't like it?

Why can't people respect the fact that it offends Muslims.

You don't think there is anything wrong,but that's you.

It offends Muslims.

Not only Muslims around the world,but Muslims here in Canada.

How can you pass judgement on what is offensive to someone else.

Only they can make that judgement.

And I will respect their judgement because it is their judgement, not mine.

If it is that blasphemous and offensive, why did a placard depict a caricature of a man wearing a turban-bomb? Isn't it, they're forbidden to draw any image of their prophet? That's waht this hoopla is all about.

That said placard was being waved around by a protester.

So, they''ve done the very same thing they're rioting about.

It's just political! They're using their own prophet for political reasons!

[BubberMiley]

But you know what, if it's okay for Muslims to go an a rampage and violent protest over religious beliefs that they deemed is offensive, then...

No, Betsy. It's not okay to do that. But it's also not okay to provoke people to do that.

[BubberMiley]

But when you tell them cartoons are mocking and insultful to the prophet they'll believe it if they can't see them. The cartoons are not mocking the prophet, but it's amazing how many people - due to lousy journalism - believe they are.

Some of them are mocking the prophet, some of them aren't. The one with the bomb in his turban certainly is (even if that's a relevant statement for Islam today).

[betsy]

But when you tell them cartoons are mocking and insultful to the prophet they'll believe it if they can't see them. The cartoons are not mocking the prophet, but it's amazing how many people - due to lousy journalism - believe they are.

Some of them are mocking the prophet, some of them aren't. The one with the bomb in his turban certainly is (even if that's a relevant statement for Islam today).

I've seen that picture of the prophet with a turban/bomb right on the placard of a protester. Their main argument is that "it is forbidden to draw any images of the prophet!"

[betsy]

But you know what, if it's okay for Muslims to go an a rampage and violent protest over religious beliefs that they deemed is offensive, then...

No, Betsy. It's not okay to do that. But it's also not okay to provoke people to do that.

Do you see it as a "provocation" because of the reaction?

Then if those anti-abortions reacted in a violent way (bombing clinics and sniping doctors)...because they deemed they are being "provoked" by those who insist on doing abortions...doesn't that fall under the same thing?

[betsy]

What? Are you just going to let freedom go just because some lunatics from another country wanted you to?

It offends Muslims.

Not only Muslims around the world,but Muslims here in Canada.

I do hope these Canadian muslims appreciate the fact that we're fighting for rights and freedom...the very same things that had lured them to Canada...mostly to escape oppresion from their homeland.

I would bet the mainstream Canadian Muslims, which are moderates, does not even think much about those cartoons.

[betsy]

What? Are you just going to let freedom go just because some lunatics from another country wanted you to?

How can you pass judgement on what is offensive to someone else.

Only they can make that judgement.

And I will respect their judgement because it is their judgement, not mine.

My point is not a matter of passing judgement. My point is about our rights and freedom.

[Army Guy]

Betsy:

And we have to be vigilant in protecting these freedom. Once you start dismantling these freedoms...a little bit at a time...you wake up one morning with nothing!

Countless soldiers have died for these freedom

Yes we do have to be viligant in protecting these freedoms, But in using of freedoms we must use common sense, and to use those freedoms as there were intended to be used. These freedoms does not give us the right to say or print what ever we like.

Perhaps you can explain what was gained by printing these cartoons? What have most Canadian media outlets lost from not printing them ?

I'm well aware of the sacrifice that our nations soldiers have made to ensure our freedoms, as i am one. My piont is that those freedoms are not being used as they were intended to be used, and there are limitations to all our freedoms.

[HistoryBuff44]

I was glad to see that the muslim community here reacted more appropriately. I honestly thought it amazing to see the banners calling for people to be butchered and, once again, America to be destroyed... after Denmark that is.

Just my opinion but it seems that you would be taken far more seriously by acting in a calm manner and calling for the authorities to investigate as compared to declaring that people should be killed over a cartoon.

I think Harper had the only real response he could give, sorta right down the middle.

[betsy]

Perhaps you can explain what was gained by printing these cartoons? What have most Canadian media outlets lost from not printing them ?

Showing that freedom cannot be suppressed through intimidation, is what was gained IMO. I think that was the message that resounded all over Europe.

What message do you think will we give to everyone if we back down and capitulate and give up some rights just because a group decided to intimidate us through violent means? That violent intimidation works!

It wouldn't be long before other zealot fanatics...not necessarily muslims...but every other group fighting for whatever cause they're fighting for will be following this violent means!

Look at those bombing abortion clinics and killing doctors!

Look at those anti-fur people who throw paint on fur-wearing celebrities! Maybe next time around, it wouldn't just be paint!

Look at Green Peace and its anti-whaling crusade! Didn't it endanger lives of whalers at one point?

What about that crusader against seal hunting who was trying to incite others to inflict bodily harm on the hunters!

The truth is: backing down and capitulating only encourage more of this to happen.

What have most Canadian outlets lost from not printing them? Credibility.

If you're a media specializing on politics and current events....and you decided not to do your responsibility to inform your readers on what is a crucial global issue, then you can't be relied on to bring us unbiased, uncensored news.

[Chimera]

Perhaps you can explain what was gained by printing these cartoons? What have most Canadian media outlets lost from not printing them ?

Showing that freedom cannot be suppressed through intimidation, is what was gained IMO. I think that was the message that resounded all over Europe.

What message do you think will we give to everyone if we back down and capitulate and give up some rights just because a group decided to intimidate us through violent means? That violent intimidation works!

It wouldn't be long before other zealot fanatics...not necessarily muslims...but every other group fighting for whatever cause they're fighting for will be following this violent means!

The freedom of the Canadian press was never in jeopardy over this. Noone has told them that the cartoons cannot be printed. The problem is that the people printing these cartoons are in no personal danger. They are stirring up sh!t for no reason. It is our soldiers, and others overseas who will have to deal with the consequences.

Look at it from another angle. If a newspaper discovered the name of an informant against the hells angels, would you expect them to print it? NO. To do so would endanger someone's life needlessly. Reprinting these cartoons is effectively doing the same thing to all westerners in muslim countries.