Anti-Semitism or playing with the truth?

[athos]

Being Jewish is a religious, not an ethnic or racial category. As with Christians or Muslims, there are Jews of different nationalities, ethnicities and races. No DNA test will tell you if you are Jewish, Christian, Buddhist, Atheist...but it will tell you what percentage of you are Turks (Khazars), Blacks, Slavs, Celts, and so on.  At least over 99% of today Jews are not Semites. They obviously don't look like like Semites because they are not not Semites. On the other hand, over 99% of Arabs are Semites. How then can you accuse someone of being anti-Semitic, for criticizing those who are not Semites??? Can you accuse someone who criticizes Chinese  of being Russophobic? 

Where are the real anti-Semites who indiscriminately kill Arab Palestinian Semites???

 

Are they "Semites"

 

Edited March 15 by athos

[WestCanMan]

On 3/14/2024 at 5:50 PM, athos said:

At least over 99% of today Jews are not Semites. They obviously don't look like like Semites because they are not not Semites. 

Where did you get that "stat" from?

Does it rhyme with "culled a toud ovuras"?

Quote

 

Are they "Semites"

 

 

Well, I guess that settles it 🤣

[athos]

On 3/18/2024 at 10:51 AM, WestCanMan said:

Where did you get that "stat" from?

Does it rhyme with "culled a toud ovuras"?

 

Well, I guess that settles it 🤣

And what the writer wanted to say??? Please explain and stop guessing.

[WestCanMan]

7 hours ago, athos said:

And what the writer wanted to say??? Please explain and stop guessing.

Whoever told you that "99% of Jews in Israel aren't Arabic" was lying to you. 

More than 1% of Israelis are native to that region, so the 99% number is obviously false, most of the Jews that were in Europe were either from the ME themselves or direct descendants on Arabic Jews, and almost a million more Israelis came to Israel directly from other countries in the middle east, where they had been discriminated against/slaughtered for centuries Athos. 

And when I say "discriminated against" I don't just mean "a small percentage of people in the ME were bigots, and the laws there couldn't prevent all the bigots from having some effect on them" like white people are accused of in Canada, I mean "religious bigotry was codified right into every muslim law, and Jews lived like 3rd-class citizens." Not in a few countries - the whole ottoman empire was like that. 

Furthermore, religious bigotry was 'the good part': when they weren't just being discriminated against they were being targeted in riots, driven from their homes, and even massacred. It was constant.

From your small POV the Jews were treated like humans all throughout the centuries and then when they got a homeland they were evil, but that's a completely false narrative. The Jews actually needed a homeland of their own so that they could live like normal citizens with full rights, and so that they could feel like they weren't always at risk of being driven from their homes or slaughtered en masse. 

Consider Pakistan, athos. 

After the British freed the ME from ottoman rule, and then decided to withdraw from the region themselves, the muslims of what's now Pakistan (and muslims in other parts of India as well, who moved to Pakistan later) were adamant that they couldn't live in a Hindu-majority country, so they needed their own sovereign nation. 

The British partitioned Pakistan off the exact same way that they partitioned Israel just 8 months earlier. Pakistanis ethnically cleansed that region, killing almost 1 million Sikhs and Hindus. Then they committed a second genocide in 1971, killing as many as 3M more people. 

But did Pakistanis really need sovereignty? There are 20 other countries under islamic rule where those people could have moved to if they just had to live under islamic laws. They didn't need Pakistan to be islamic. 

Not so for the Jews. There was nowhere for them to go. They were treated like dogs everywhere in the ME, and Europe was hit and miss. Great for a while, then they'd get slaughtered by the tens of thousands, sometimes millions.

1. Do you think that the Jews don't need a homeland athos? 
2. Do you think they have somewhere else to go?
3. Do you think the Gazans don't have any options? They can't go to Iran, Iraq, Syria, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Lebanon, Libya, Egypt, Turkey, Brunei, UAE, Yemen, Pakistan, etc, etc, etc?  

FYI in all of Israel's history, including all the wars in which they were attacked and this conflict, the Israelis haven't killed 1/40th as many people as Pakistan has killed. They'd have to recreate the Deir Yassin massacre 37,000 times to rival Pakistan. Thirty-Seven Thousand times. 4M divided by 108. 

When you bemoan the loss of life in Israel, while pretending that what they are doing is unique to that region, you're just making as ass of yourself. 

Slaughters there are normal, but it's always muslims killing other people so it's ok for them. Muslims love it. The Jews haven't even committed 1 fifty thousandth of the murders there but "OMG THEY'RE THE WORST!"

[athos]

Very good of you to admit that the Semites are Arabs.

Most Jews today are not Semites, this can easily be determined by honest and unbiased DNA testing. Most of today's Jews are Ashkenazi who are of Turkish (Khazar) origin and spread from Russia (Not from middle East) throughout Europe. It means they are not Semites. In Israel they speak Yiddish, which is nothing more than a dialect of the German language. The original Jews in the Middle East were actually Arab tribe (Semites) who in ancient times adopted Judaism as their religion, as some of the Arabs became Christians or Muslims. Today they are less than 1% of Jewish population.

The fact is that "being Jewish is a religious, not an ethnic or racial category. As with Christians or Muslims, there are Jews of different nationalities, ethnicities and races. No DNA test will tell you whether you are Jewish, Christian, Buddhist or Atheist".
If you criticize Jews, it is appropriate to be accused of being anti-Jewish, but not anti-Semitic, because today Jews are not Semites. Anti-Semites are actually Israelis who kill Arabs (Semites).

Can you accuse someone who criticizes Chinese  of being Russophobic or Anti-Slavic??? 

Typical Semite

 

 

 

 

Edited March 20 by athos

[WestCanMan]

On 3/19/2024 at 7:22 PM, athos said:

Very good of you to admit that the Semites are Arabs.

Most Jews today are not Semites, this can easily be determined by honest and unbiased DNA testing. Most of today's Jews are Ashkenazi who are of Turkish (Khazar) origin and spread from Russia (Not from middle East) throughout Europe. It means they are not Semites. In Israel they speak Yiddish, which is nothing more than a dialect of the German language. The original Jews in the Middle East were actually Arab tribe (Semites) who in ancient times adopted Judaism as their religion, as some of the Arabs became Christians or Muslims. Today they are less than 1% of Jewish population.

The fact is that "being Jewish is a religious, not an ethnic or racial category. As with Christians or Muslims, there are Jews of different nationalities, ethnicities and races. No DNA test will tell you whether you are Jewish, Christian, Buddhist or Atheist".
If you criticize Jews, it is appropriate to be accused of being anti-Jewish, but not anti-Semitic, because today Jews are not Semites. Anti-Semites are actually Israelis who kill Arabs (Semites).

Can you accuse someone who criticizes Chinese  of being Russophobic or Anti-Slavic??? 

Typical Semite

Of course Semites are Arabs, dummy. Why would anyone dispute that?

Stop trying to be a racist about this. We all know that millions of Israelis - both jewish Israelis and muslim Israelis - are Arabs. The majority of the rest of them have at least some Arabic DNA. If there are Jews there that aren't Arabic, it's because it's a popular place to go. Maybe if the rest of the Arab states weren't shithole countries, people from other countries would want to move there too. 

Stick to your religious bigotry Athos, your racism is stupid. 

[athos]

On 3/26/2024 at 3:06 AM, WestCanMan said:

Of course Semites are Arabs, dummy. Why would anyone dispute that?

Stop trying to be a racist about this. We all know that millions of Israelis - both jewish Israelis and muslim Israelis - are Arabs. The majority of the rest of them have at least some Arabic DNA. If there are Jews there that aren't Arabic, it's because it's a popular place to go. Maybe if the rest of the Arab states weren't shithole countries, people from other countries would want to move there too. 

Stick to your religious bigotry Athos, your racism is stupid. 

Where did yo see racism in those undisputed facts???

"Most Jews today are not Semites, this can easily be determined by honest and unbiased DNA testing. Most of today's Jews are Ashkenazi who are of Turkish (Khazar) origin and spread from Russia (Not from middle East) throughout Europe. It means they are not Semites. In Israel they speak Yiddish, which is nothing more than a dialect of the German language. The original Jews in the Middle East were actually Arab tribe (Semites) who in ancient times adopted Judaism as their religion, as some of the Arabs became Christians or Muslims. Today they are less than 1% of Jewish population.

There is no Jewish gene. because the fact is that "being Jewish is a religious, not an ethnic or racial category. As with Christians or Muslims, there are Jews of different nationalities, ethnicities and races. No DNA test will tell you whether you are Jewish, Christian, Buddhist or Atheist".
If you criticize Jews, it is appropriate to be accused of being anti-Jewish, but not anti-Semitic, because today 99% Jews are not Semites. Anti-Semites are actually Israelis who kill Arabs (Semites).

Can you accuse someone who criticizes Chinese  of being Russophobic or Anti-Slavic???

Start living with indisputable facts and stop condoning nonsense.

 

 

 

[WestCanMan]

1 hour ago, athos said:

Where did yo see racism in those undisputed facts???

"Most Jews today are not Semites, this can easily be determined by honest and unbiased DNA testing. Most of today's Jews are Ashkenazi who are of Turkish (Khazar) origin and spread from Russia (Not from middle East) throughout Europe. It means they are not Semites. In Israel they speak Yiddish, which is nothing more than a dialect of the German language. The original Jews in the Middle East were actually Arab tribe (Semites) who in ancient times adopted Judaism as their religion, as some of the Arabs became Christians or Muslims. Today they are less than 1% of Jewish population.

There is no Jewish gene. because the fact is that "being Jewish is a religious, not an ethnic or racial category. As with Christians or Muslims, there are Jews of different nationalities, ethnicities and races. No DNA test will tell you whether you are Jewish, Christian, Buddhist or Atheist".
If you criticize Jews, it is appropriate to be accused of being anti-Jewish, but not anti-Semitic, because today 99% Jews are not Semites. Anti-Semites are actually Israelis who kill Arabs (Semites).

Can you accuse someone who criticizes Chinese  of being Russophobic or Anti-Slavic???

Start living with indisputable facts and stop condoning nonsense.

Athos, what you wrote there is nothing. Just your own opinions.

I could say that 1% of the people living in Saudi Arabia are Semites and provide just as much proof as you did, right?

Here, read this and tell me that you still think only 1% of Israelis are Arabs/Arabic/Semites/Middle Easterners, whatever you want to call them: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_the_Muslim_world

Short summary: 

Quote

In the 20th century, approximately 900000 Jews migrated, fled, or were expelled from Muslim-majority countries throughout Africa and Asia. Primarily a consequence of the 1948 Arab–Israeli War, the mass movement mainly transpired from 1948 to the early 1970s, with one final exodus of Iranian Jews occurring shortly after the Islamic Revolution in 1979–1980. An estimated 650000 (72%) of these Jews resettled in Israel.^[1]

Islamic bigots like to pretend that all of the jews who moved to Israel did it purely because they were zionists (the 'pull' factor), but the push factor was actually far greater. FYI people didn't leave all their belongings behind and go to Israel because it made economic sense: they did it because they weren't safe where they lived. 

To say that the jews are only in Israel because of 'Zionism' is just more evil shit coming out of your mouth. 

[athos]

22 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

Athos, what you wrote there is nothing. Just your own opinions.

I could say that 1% of the people living in Saudi Arabia are Semites and provide just as much proof as you did, right?

Here, read this and tell me that you still think only 1% of Israelis are Arabs/Arabic/Semites/Middle Easterners, whatever you want to call them: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_the_Muslim_world

Short summary: 

Islamic bigots like to pretend that all of the jews who moved to Israel did it purely because they were zionists (the 'pull' factor), but the push factor was actually far greater. FYI people didn't leave all their belongings behind and go to Israel because it made economic sense: they did it because they weren't safe where they lived. 

To say that the jews are only in Israel because of 'Zionism' is just more evil shit coming out of your mouth. 

Firstly, don't put your words in my mouth that I didn't mention. Secondly all these who are not Semites but kill Semites are real anti-Semites.

The fact is they are not Semites.  😀

Edited March 28 by athos

[WestCanMan]

17 minutes ago, athos said:

Firstly, don't put your words in my mouth that I didn't mention. Secondly all these who are not Semites but kill Semites are real anti-Semites.

The fact is they are not Semites.  😀

FYI the pictures of 4 people, 3 of whom don't even live in Israel, don't prove that "only 1% of Israelis are Semites". 

Here's Benjamin Netanyahu with his brother, who died a military hero:

They look pretty Semitic there. 

 

He doesn't look native to any country north of Spain or Italy.

 

So why did people from the ME emigrate to Israel Athos, "in your own words"? Did they all leave because they were Zionists or were a lot of them forced out? Were they all Europeans athos?

You're the one who breached the topic with your COMPLETELY stupid 1% comment. Answer the question... Were the hundreds of thousands of jews who moved to Israel form Iran Europeans? 

[athos]

Everything you said is irrelevant to the topic of this post.
Once again the facts are:

"Most Jews today are not Semites, this can easily be determined by honest and unbiased DNA testing. Most of today's Jews are Ashkenazi who are of Turkish (Khazar) origin and spread from Russia (Not from middle East) throughout Europe. It means they are not Semites. In Israel they speak Yiddish, which is nothing more than a dialect of the German language. The original Jews in the Middle East were actually Arab tribe (Semites) who in ancient times adopted Judaism as their religion, as some of the Arabs became Christians or Muslims. Today they are less than 1% of Jewish population. 

There is no Jewish gene. because the fact is that "being Jewish is a religious, not an ethnic or racial category. As with Christians or Muslims, there are Jews of different nationalities, ethnicities and races. No DNA test will tell you whether you are Jewish, Christian, Buddhist or Atheist".
If you criticize Jews, it is appropriate to be accused of being anti-Jewish, but not anti-Semitic, because today 99% Jews are not Semites. Anti-Semites are actually Israelis who kill Arabs (Semites)".

Please stick to facts and common sense.

Orwell: "In the world of universal deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act"

 

[August1991]

Lebanese and Jews (Semites?) have a tendency to attract attention. They wear loud rings.

Maybe it's their mother.

[WestCanMan]

On 3/28/2024 at 5:09 PM, athos said:

Everything you said is irrelevant to the topic of this post.
Once again the facts are:

"Most Jews today are not Semites, this can easily be determined by honest and unbiased DNA testing. Most of today's Jews are Ashkenazi who are of Turkish (Khazar) origin and spread from Russia (Not from middle East) throughout Europe. It means they are not Semites. In Israel they speak Yiddish, which is nothing more than a dialect of the German language. The original Jews in the Middle East were actually Arab tribe (Semites) who in ancient times adopted Judaism as their religion, as some of the Arabs became Christians or Muslims. Today they are less than 1% of Jewish population. 

There is no Jewish gene. because the fact is that "being Jewish is a religious, not an ethnic or racial category. As with Christians or Muslims, there are Jews of different nationalities, ethnicities and races. No DNA test will tell you whether you are Jewish, Christian, Buddhist or Atheist".
If you criticize Jews, it is appropriate to be accused of being anti-Jewish, but not anti-Semitic, because today 99% Jews are not Semites. Anti-Semites are actually Israelis who kill Arabs (Semites)".

Please stick to facts and common sense.

Orwell: "In the world of universal deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act"

Just in case anyone is wondering, "^THAT^ is all a big lie which has already been debunked in this thread.

Athos is just a violent bigot, and he feels like saying "All the Jews are just a bunch of crackers" makes burning their babies to death and spitting on the corpses of raped-then-tortured-and-murdered women cool. 

[athos]

7 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

Just in case anyone is wondering, "^THAT^ is all a big lie which has already been debunked in this thread.

Athos is just a violent bigot, and he feels like saying "All the Jews are just a bunch of crackers" makes burning their babies to death and spitting on the corpses of raped-then-tortured-and-murdered women cool. 

And you are saying all Gentiles (goys) are bunch of crackers...................

 

[WestCanMan]

7 hours ago, athos said:

And you are saying all Gentiles (goys) are bunch of crackers...................

 

I'm talking about religion. 

Just that. Religion. 

You're trying to justify a slaughter based on ethnicity. 

[athos]

7 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

I'm talking about religion. 

Just that. Religion. 

You're trying to justify a slaughter based on ethnicity. 

What ethnicity???

[WestCanMan]

3 minutes ago, athos said:

What ethnicity???

You feel like the slaughter of Jews in Israel is somehow made OK by the fact that some of them came from Europe (even though they're descendants of Jews who were driven out of the ME).

You seem to think that the first war in Iraq was without merit, even though they used chemical weapons against civilian populations. 

[August1991]

21 hours ago, athos said:

What ethnicity???

Ethnic? For the confused, there are two types of Jews: Ashkenazi and Sephardic.

Sorta like Christians. And Muslims. Heck, even Buddhists.

 

 

 

[athos]

3 hours ago, August1991 said:

Ethnic? For the confused, there are two types of Jews: Ashkenazi and Sephardic.

Sorta like Christians. And Muslims. Heck, even Buddhists.

 

 

 

 

Nonsense. It is not a national but a religious affiliation. Similar to, for example, Orthodox Christians, Roman Catholics or Protestants.

😀

 

[August1991]

16 minutes ago, athos said:

 

Nonsense. It is not a national but a religious affiliation. Similar to, for example, Orthodox Christians, Roman Catholics or Protestants.

😀

 

On this particular Christian day, I respect.

I am not a believer.

=====

My Protestant father once explained to me how Catholics ask foregiveness. ("With Protestants", he explained, "we speak directly to God.")

Thank God, my Catholic mother had a different opinion of life.

Edited April 1 by August1991

[Nationalist]

On 3/26/2024 at 10:46 PM, WestCanMan said:

Athos, what you wrote there is nothing. Just your own opinions.

I could say that 1% of the people living in Saudi Arabia are Semites and provide just as much proof as you did, right?

Here, read this and tell me that you still think only 1% of Israelis are Arabs/Arabic/Semites/Middle Easterners, whatever you want to call them: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_the_Muslim_world

Short summary: 

Islamic bigots like to pretend that all of the jews who moved to Israel did it purely because they were zionists (the 'pull' factor), but the push factor was actually far greater. FYI people didn't leave all their belongings behind and go to Israel because it made economic sense: they did it because they weren't safe where they lived. 

To say that the jews are only in Israel because of 'Zionism' is just more evil shit coming out of your mouth. 

Actually...he's right.

I studied the plight and flight of the "original" Jews.

1. Judaism started in north Africa, most likely by black people.

2. Jewish doctrine forces Jews to segregate. This attracts social attention to them in a negative way.

3. I think it's obvious that Jews gravitated to the collection of wealth as a means of providing safety. Unfortunately, and as a direct result of their segregation, this eventually singled them out, over and over again.

Jews happen to be their own worst enemy. As for modern day Isreal, it was the Rothchilds who bought Palestine and gave it to the Ashkenazi. That was bound to cause problems...and it has.

Question: has any Rothchild ever made a home in the land they bought?

[WestCanMan]

8 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Actually...he's right.

I studied the plight and flight of the "original" Jews.

1. Judaism started in north Africa, most likely by black people.

2. Jewish doctrine forces Jews to segregate. This attracts social attention to them in a negative way.

3. I think it's obvious that Jews gravitated to the collection of wealth as a means of providing safety. Unfortunately, and as a direct result of their segregation, this eventually singled them out, over and over again.Jews happen to be their own worst enemy.

He's not right at all.

1) North Africans are still "Arabs", and the Jews were in Israel for over 4,000 years now. There's probably no one living in that region who doesn't have some DNA in them from North Africa or further abroad. The consideration of Jews as 'non-natives' to that area is a non-starter for realistic debate.

2) Every religion is an exercise in discrimination/supremacism/segregation to some extent. Are you seriously pretending that Catholicism and Islam are and different or superior in that regard? The main difference between Judaism and others is that spreading their religion by convincing/forcing other people to join isn't a requirement or even a consideration. 

3) I think that the phrase "correlation isn't causation" is overused and used incorrectly in a lot of cases, but this is an example of a case where it applies 100%. Jews were forced to be self-reliant and to gather resources for their own safety throughout the years. The discrimination against Jews for the last 1,000 years in the ME was codified into law: they were 3rd-class citizens by definition. Modern-day claimants of discrimination in NA can't hold a candle to what Jews actually faced for 50 generations.  

Who isn't their own worst enemy to some extent?

Quote

As for modern day Isreal, it was the Rothchilds who bought Palestine and gave it to the Ashkenazi.

FYI what happened in Israel is the exact same thing that happened in Pakistan...

A strong religious minority within a region that was being released from the British Empire wanted their sovereignty, because they didn't want to live under the rule of a different religious majority, and the map of the newly released region was drawn up the accommodate them. 

Pakistan got their sovereignty/autonomy in the exact same way at the exact same time as Israel did (8 months apart). Over a million people were slaughtered when Pakistan partitioned. They had their heads chopped off or were doused with petrol and burned to death, etc.

There were less than 1,000 people killed during the partition of Israel. 

 

I think it's great that you're putting some effort into gathering historical information about this, but you can't ignore the main parts. 

[Nationalist]

30 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

He's not right at all.

1) North Africans are still "Arabs", and the Jews were in Israel for over 4,000 years now. There's probably no one living in that region who doesn't have some DNA in them from North Africa or further abroad. The consideration of Jews as 'non-natives' to that area is a non-starter for realistic debate.

2) Every religion is an exercise in discrimination/supremacism/segregation to some extent. Are you seriously pretending that Catholicism and Islam are and different or superior in that regard? The main difference between Judaism and others is that spreading their religion by convincing/forcing other people to join isn't a requirement or even a consideration. 

3) I think that the phrase "correlation isn't causation" is overused and used incorrectly in a lot of cases, but this is an example of a case where it applies 100%. Jews were forced to be self-reliant and to gather resources for their own safety throughout the years. The discrimination against Jews for the last 1,000 years in the ME was codified into law: they were 3rd-class citizens by definition. Modern-day claimants of discrimination in NA can't hold a candle to what Jews actually faced for 50 generations.  

Who isn't their own worst enemy to some extent?

FYI what happened in Israel is the exact same thing that happened in Pakistan...

A strong religious minority within a region that was being released from the British Empire wanted their sovereignty, because they didn't want to live under the rule of a different religious majority, and the map of the newly released region was drawn up the accommodate them. 

Pakistan got their sovereignty/autonomy in the exact same way at the exact same time as Israel did (8 months apart). Over a million people were slaughtered when Pakistan partitioned. They had their heads chopped off or were doused with petrol and burned to death, etc.

There were less than 1,000 people killed during the partition of Israel. 

 

I think it's great that you're putting some effort into gathering historical information about this, but you can't ignore the main parts. 

West...I'm not completely disagreeing with you. But I have to acknowledge the history. Ya there's some Semitic DNA left in many. I'm just not a fan of the Ashkenazim. Nor do I think what Balfore and Rothchild did was...nice.

I disagree with the assimilation thing though. Had the Ashkenazim simply assimilated there would never had been a problem. The other tribes fled and managed to get along. Why did that 1 tribe stick out like a sore thumb?

[WestCanMan]

24 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

West...I'm not completely disagreeing with you. But I have to acknowledge the history. Ya there's some Semitic DNA left in many. I'm just not a fan of the Ashkenazim. Nor do I think what Balfore and Rothchild did was...nice.

I disagree with the assimilation thing though. Had the Ashkenazim simply assimilated there would never had been a problem. The other tribes fled and managed to get along. Why did that 1 tribe stick out like a sore thumb?

I don't know how or why the Ashkenazis are being singled out for criticism among the hordes of troublemakers in the ME. 

They're responsible for 0.1% of the murders and discrimination. 

[Nationalist]

1 minute ago, WestCanMan said:

I don't know how or why the Ashkenazis are being singled out for criticism among the hordes of troublemakers in the ME. 

They're responsible for 0.1% of the murders and discrimination. 

Meh...its their history. I mean...the Arab people have their own sorted history too. But throwing the Jews in the middle of the Arab lands...regardless of ancient history...was a HUGE faux pas.