Harper vows to cut GST to 5%

[shoop]

Boy you got us bring up Stockwell Day! Is the Liberal idea well that dry they have to reach back six years for an attack?

They are releasing one policy at a time in order to stay in the news constantly. Doesn't seem that strange...

I'm trying to decide if this GST announcement is another policy-on-the-fly that Stockwell Day was so notorious of doing.

If we give Harper the benefit of the doubt, that means the Conservatives must have a whole bunch of policies they are not releasing yet.  So why this one and why now or why aren't they releasing their entire policy book?

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[Kiraly]

Almost like the Martinistas lifted part of that from Conservative speeches from May and June of last year.

A reduction in GST would be a benefit to students who have little or no income.

What about the chidren? Don't forget the children!

[BQSupporter]

Like I have said the Liberals have nothing to run for and everything to run from. So bringing up Mr. Day is no surprise, don't be surprised when they bring up the old P.C days of 20 years ago.

So far their campaign in Quebec is quite shameless. They trouted out the Spaceman to insult us and expect Quebecers to flock back to them.

[Kiraly]

Doesn't seem that strange...

It shouldn't....

...they did it last time.

[shoop]

Garneau could end up being a huge albatross around the Liberals neck.

Uhhh, sorry Marc but sponsorship is a reasonable issue for this campaign. Lecturing people that it is time to move on only hurts the Liberals chances...

So far their campaign in Quebec is quite shameless. They trouted out the Spaceman to insult us and expect Quebecers to flock back to them.

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[Kiraly]

So far their campaign in Quebec is quite shameless. They trouted out the Spaceman to insult us and expect Quebecers to flock back to them.

Some of the best lines I've seen/heard so far this campaign have come off message boards.

[daniel]

Yes, I would go six years back to remind myself of the Canadian Alliance. And I would go eight years back to remember the ...shudder... Common Sense Revolution.

And if you wouldn't go ten years back, you wouldn't be reminded of Adscam. And if you wouldn't go twelve years back, you couldn't campaign on "Change".

And to get back on topic, go back even further to remind yourself the final nail that did the PCs in, that got the Reformers really upset, and then when they formed the opposition, made an about face and accepted the GST in a policy convention.

Promises made?

[BQSupporter]

What convoluted liberal douple-speak.

The issues that face Canada are current. Liberal sleaze and corruption is corrupt.

Liberals always want to relive the past, but never the past that makes them look bad.

If you want to run against Mr. Day go to B.C, but don't trout out that foolishness and pretend that that you said something clever.

[Black Dog]

Our government is committed to cutting personal income taxes – particularly for lower and middle-income Canadians. We would rather see Canadians keep more of their pay-cheques than help the wealthiest save on luxury items.

“I believe very strongly that Canadians deserve to keep more of their paycheque,” Prime Minister Paul Martin said in a scrum today. He went on to explain that personal income tax cuts are fairer and more progressive, and as such would continue to be a focus for the Liberal government.

PM PM is full of it. Consumption taxes like the GST are harder on lower income people because they spend a much greater percentage of their income.

[shoop]

That is exactly the line the Conservatives need to take in appealing to working families.

Consumption taxes like the GST are harder on lower income people because they spend a much greater percentage of their income.

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[Black Dog]

That is exactly the line the Conservatives need to take in appealing to working families.

Of course the NDP would eliminate the GST altogether on essential family items, as well as cut income tax for low income earners...

[shoop]

If I am not mistaken the NDs are running a campaign based on the assumption they won't form government. Seriously, hasn't Layton been touting the effectiveness of ND MPs in a minority situation?

Of course the NDP would eliminate the GST altogether on essential family items, as well as cut income tax for low income earners...

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[Black Dog]

If I am not mistaken the NDs are running a campaign based on the assumption they won't form government. Seriously, hasn't Layton been touting the effectiveness of ND MPs in a minority situation?

Well, that's a strategy that makes sense, given the probability of the next government being a minority. Campaign promises are usually big "If I were in charge..." proclimations anyway (take Harper's SSM gambit: he knows he'd lose an SSM vote without a CPC majority, but he's operating on that assumption).

[shoop]

I hear you about the promises. Don't know if i agree about the SSM thing. If it was a *true* free vote there are enough socially conservative Liberals that it could carry the day. Too bad the NDs don't believe in allowing their MPs to vote their conscience. Poor Bev Desjarlais.

Well, that's a strategy that makes sense, given the probability of the next government being a minority. Campaign promises are usually big "If I were in charge..." proclimations anyway (take Harper's SSM gambit: he knows he'd lose an SSM vote without a CPC majority, but he's operating on that assumption).

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[Biblio Bibuli]

PM PM is full of it. Consumption taxes like the GST are harder on lower income people because they spend a much greater percentage of their income.

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How true.

So called "sin" taxes on cigarettes and liquor also hurt low income and seniors the most.

Sometimes I think Paul Martin hates seniors.

[August1991]

Why does every thread here degenerate into a discussion about same-sex marriage? I am beginning to think that the Canadian Left are one issue voters.

The economic argument in favour of a consumption tax (such as GST) over an income tax largely depends on the idea that it is better to tax when you spend not when you earn. (This argument has been made by Andrew Coyne, for example.) Income tax discourages saving because people save with (smaller) after-tax income. This distortion of income tax is partly corrected with RRSPs.

All true. The GST also requires fewer collection points than the income tax. The GST is also made fairer by giving out refunds for low income families and by exempting food and rent.

What these economic arguments fail to consider though is that taxes exist in a political world. Tax policy is proof of the adage: the perfect is the enemy of the good.

Harper's proposal is very good politics, and it's the best economics we can get for the moment.

1. Harper can in fact cut the GST by 1%. This is a promise he can keep, and keeping it will mean something to many people. Canadians have been lied to for too long.

2. The Liberals have no credible response to Harper's proposal. They promised themselves to eliminate the GST, fer gawdsakes.

3. The GST is highly visible, and easy to understand. All Canadians know this. This is a change they can see and trust.

The carping about this proposal, from economists to NDP apologists, from columnists to finance ministers, is just the sound of people who can't deal with something different. Central Canada simply cannot believe that a PM can come from Alberta.

----

I have argued elsewhere that a budget surplus or deficit is no measure of a government's economic competence. Types of taxes matter but the true measure is how a government spends our money.

In this, it is impossible for the Conservatives to be worse than the crew we've had over the past 12 years.

[shoop]

This is definitely a winning issue for the Conservatives. It is pretty hard for the Liberals to argue against it ... although they will try.

The GST cut shows which of the two main parties is really on the side of average working families. The Liberals tax proposals in the mini-budget will take an extra $7.5 billion out of the treasury. Unfortunately, their tax proposal is slanted towards the higher income brackets. Working families end up better off under the Conservative proposal.

1. Harper can in fact cut the GST by 1%.  This is a promise he can keep, and keeping it will mean something to many people.  Canadians have been lied to for too long.

2. The Liberals have no credible response to Harper's proposal.  They promised themselves to eliminate the GST, fer gawdsakes.

3. The GST is highly visible, and easy to understand.  All Canadians know this. This is a change they can see and trust.

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[normanchateau]

This has to be the dumbest thing that Conservatives have done yet. I had already decided that I was going not going to let my opinions on SSM affect my vote but that was based on the idea that the Conservatives had sensible economic policies. Cutting the GST and raising income taxes (or at least not lowering them) is bad economic policy and it completely undermines the Conservative credibility on the economic front.

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It definitely is surprising that the Conservatives have no interest in cutting personal or business taxes. That was certainly the policy of Preston Manning and the Reform Party. But then again, Preston Manning and Stephen Harper had a falling out which neither seems keen to discuss. Preston Manning was a populist who did remarkably well in BC. Harper has not only lost most of the former PCs but he can't even keep the BC Reform Party supporters.

[Kiraly]

It definitely is surprising that the Conservatives have no interest in cutting personal or business taxes.

I must've missed that one.

When did the Conservatives say that they have no interest in cutting personal or business taxes?

[shoop]

Never did, just another case of how desperate the Liberals are getting for something to attack the CPC on.

btw, is your handle from the old volleyball player?

I must've missed that one.

When did the Conservatives say that they have no interest in cutting personal or business taxes?

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[Kiraly]

... is your handle from the old volleyball player?

Karch Kiraly?

I didn't select it with him in mind....

....it is just a Hungarian name/word that I use to post on message boards.

[normanchateau]

It definitely is surprising that the Conservatives have no interest in cutting personal or business taxes.

When did the Conservatives say that they have no interest in cutting personal or business taxes?

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The Conservatives have said they'll reduce the GST. If they also plan to cut personal or business taxes, they've not said so. This is why numerous economists have come out today against Harper's plan to cut the GST rather than corporate and personal taxes.

[tml12]

It definitely is surprising that the Conservatives have no interest in cutting personal or business taxes.

When did the Conservatives say that they have no interest in cutting personal or business taxes?

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The Conservatives have said they'll reduce the GST. If they also plan to cut personal or business taxes, they've not said so. This is why numerous economists have come out today against Harper's plan to cut the GST rather than corporate and personal taxes.

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They have said in the past that they would.

[shoop]

Shhh, don't point out the obvious for Norman. It takes away his raison d'etre for attacking the Conservatives as sadly as he is.

They have said in the past that they would.

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[Kiraly]

If they also plan to cut personal or business taxes, they've not said so.

Not yet.