14th Amendment -WTF

[August1991]

As a foreigner, I admire your constitution. Written. Still exists/respected some two centuries later.

Amend the constitution? Amazing concept that your writers did at its origin.

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But the 14th Amendment is unnecessary. 

IMHO, it should be repealed.

 

 

[August1991]

Can an American explain to me the 14th Amendment?

It's gibberish.

Is it any wonder that it's the most litigated amendment.

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In common law, badly written decisions are often contested. Well written decisions are often cited.

Edited May 5, 2022 by August1991

[August1991]

Wow, it has 5 sections.

Even finding a link is difficult.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/amendmentxiv

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The US Constitution is a remarkable document.

The 14th amendment is everything wrong about a federal state. 

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We in Canada have weird things like "nonobstant" (you don't want to know) but we don't have a 14th Amendment. Amazing. 

 

Edited May 13, 2022 by August1991

[WestCanMan]

What does the 14th amendment do exactly?

I've never heard anyone talk about it before. 

I quickly looked it up on Google and it reads like a follow-up to the 13th amendment, granting American citizenship to the people who were freed. 

What's objectionable about it? I'm really not familiar with it at all. 

[Great American]

On 5/4/2022 at 11:42 PM, August1991 said:

As a foreigner, I admire your constitution. Written. Still exists/respected some two centuries later.

Amend the constitution? Amazing concept that your writers did at its origin.

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But the 14th Amendment is unnecessary. 

IMHO, it should be repealed.

 

 

 

Hey kids, lets take a trip back in time to May 7, 2015 and check out this article:

Birthright Citizenship -- A Fundamental Misunderstanding of the 14th Amendment
https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/birthright-citizenship-a-fundamental-misunderstanding-of-the-14th-amendment

What’s the citizenship status of the children of illegal aliens? That question has spurred quite a debate over the 14th Amendment lately, with the news that several states, including Pennsylvania, Arizona, Oklahoma, Georgia and South Carolina, may launch efforts to deny automatic citizenship to such children.

Critics claim that anyone born in the United States is automatically a U.S. citizen, even if their parents are here illegally. But that ignores the text and legislative history of the 14th Amendment, which was ratified in 1868 to extend citizenship to freed slaves and their children.

The 14th Amendment doesn’t say that all persons born in the U.S. are citizens. It says that “[a]ll persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof” are citizens. That second, critical, conditional phrase is conveniently ignored or misinterpreted by advocates of “birthright” citizenship . . . . 
. . . . Its original meaning refers to the political allegiance of an individual and the jurisdiction that a foreign government has over that individual. The fact that a tourist or illegal alien is subject to our laws and our courts if they violate our laws does not place them within the political “jurisdiction” of the United States as that phrase was defined by the framers of the 14th Amendment.

This amendment’s language was derived from the 1866 Civil Rights Act, which provided that “[a]ll persons born in the United States, and not subject to any foreign power” would be considered citizens. Sen. Lyman Trumbull, a key figure in the adoption of the 14th Amendment, said that “subject to the jurisdiction” of the U.S. included not owing allegiance to any other country.

As John Eastman, former Dean of the Chapman School of Law, has said, many do not seem to understand “the distinction between partial, territorial jurisdiction, which subjects all who are present within the territory of a sovereign to the jurisdiction of that sovereign’s laws, and complete political jurisdiction, which requires allegiance to the sovereign as well” . . . . . 
. . . . It is just plain wrong to claim that the children born of parents temporarily in the country as students or tourists are automatically U.S. citizens: They do not meet the 14th Amendment’s jurisdictional allegiance obligations. They are, in fact, subject to the political jurisdiction (and allegiance) of the country of their parents. The same applies to the children of illegal aliens because children born in the United States to foreign citizens are citizens of their parents’ home country . . . 

[Great American]

2 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

What does the 14th amendment do exactly?

I've never heard anyone talk about it before. 

I quickly looked it up on Google and it reads like a follow-up to the 13th amendment, granting American citizenship to the people who were freed. 

What's objectionable about it? I'm really not familiar with it at all. 

Mark Levin on 14th Amendment debate, Hillary's server saga - Aug. 20,2015

 

Edited May 13, 2022 by Great American

[Faramir]

Ah yes, you have to know Democrats want to apply the 14th to every single wetback that stumbles out of the Rio Grande.

[August1991]

Wow.

14th Amendment? It's like our notwithstanding clause. Politicians can do what they want.

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In fairness to Trudeau Snr, he wanted to imitate the people who wrote the US Constitution and create a federal state with protection of the individual.

You do what you can.

Edited May 17, 2022 by August1991

[August1991]

US Amendment 14: Section I

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

 

Canada Charter - Section 7:

Everyone has the right to life, liberty and security of the person and the right not to be deprived thereof except in accordance with the principles of fundamental justice.

Edited May 17, 2022 by August1991

[August1991]

An American in a northern state should have contested the 14th amendment.

IMHO, what makes America great is that State governors/legislatures have sovereignty.

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Our Canadian Charter version sadly refers to "Everyone has the right... "

The American version refers to "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof... " 

 

 

Edited May 17, 2022 by August1991

[August1991]

I have always admired the US Constitution for two points: its Amendments and a specific Amendment.

a) Amendments? The writers imagined that it could be changed.

b) In the 10th Amendment, they made it plain how power ("control") should work. In Canada, we don't have this.

Edited May 17, 2022 by August1991