Liberal fiscal update, has left most of us with some question.

[Army Guy]

7 minutes ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

This post goes into the heart of your credibility. 

Again i am asking you. How many millions of Canadians will you throw out in cold or let their children go hungry and which respond programs to help Canadians will you end so that to bring 381 billion deficit to zero? Remember last year's deficit was 30 -35 billion so even if you had started with zero deficit then you needed to cut programs aiding Canadians in need by 350 billions.

 

You paint a pretty grim picure, but in reality Canadians have saved 10 % more over last year, which is a good sign, but we also invest more than double into the CERB than needed. as explained below...

 

Out of $81.6 billion in spending analyzed, more than a quarter of the money went to people who might not have needed it.

For example, the study found nearly one million young people aged 15 to 24 collected the $2,000-a-month CERB benefit, even though they were still living with their parents in homes with a household income of $100,000 or more.

It was a similar story for adults collecting the CERB despite having high-income spouses. More than 480,000 spouses, who earned less than $24,000 in 2019, collected the CERB despite total family incomes of $100,000 or more.

0:47Erin O’Toole says Trudeau trying to trigger an early election during a crisis

Erin O’Toole says Trudeau trying to trigger an early election during a crisis – Aug 25, 2020

Students living with their parents in homes with family incomes greater than $100,000 pocketed more than $1 billion under the Canada Emergency Student Benefit program.

Families earning more than $100,000 last year received $503 million in one-time top-ups to the Canada Child Benefit. And seniors not eligible for the low-income-targeted Guaranteed Income Supplement, because they made too much money last year, still collected $1.4 billion in one-time emergency payments.

[CITIZEN_2015]

38 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

 

You paint a pretty grim picure, but in reality Canadians have saved 10 % more over last year, which is a good sign, but we also invest more than double into the CERB than needed. as explained below...

 

Out of $81.6 billion in spending analyzed, more than a quarter of the money went to people who might not have needed it.

For example, the study found nearly one million young people aged 15 to 24 collected the $2,000-a-month CERB benefit, even though they were still living with their parents in homes with a household income of $100,000 or more.

It was a similar story for adults collecting the CERB despite having high-income spouses. More than 480,000 spouses, who earned less than $24,000 in 2019, collected the CERB despite total family incomes of $100,000 or more.

0:47Erin O’Toole says Trudeau trying to trigger an early election during a crisis

Erin O’Toole says Trudeau trying to trigger an early election during a crisis – Aug 25, 2020

Students living with their parents in homes with family incomes greater than $100,000 pocketed more than $1 billion under the Canada Emergency Student Benefit program.

Families earning more than $100,000 last year received $503 million in one-time top-ups to the Canada Child Benefit. And seniors not eligible for the low-income-targeted Guaranteed Income Supplement, because they made too much money last year, still collected $1.4 billion in one-time emergency payments.

The government cannot oversea all singled out exceptional cases. Those obvious cases will be followed and prosecuted however, this does not apply to the majority in need.

You post reminds me of Marry Antoinette. They told her situation is grim just before French revolution as people don't have bread to eat. She responded let them eat cake. It is easy to claim situation is not grim from the comfort of your home. But i agree situation is not as grim because Trudeau government intervened and did not allow Canadians to become homeless and without income and that is why we now have 381 billion in deficit. Would you have preferred the reverse?

Edited December 2, 2020 by CITIZEN_2015

[CITIZEN_2015]

40 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

I'm not saying anything about these are figures they were released by the liberals in the update , they estimate this years deficit will be 399 bil.... That is money already borrowed and spent....And "added" to the deficit.... Now here is the tricky part the Liberals have planed to borrow and spend an additional 100 bil on kick starting the economy .... This is going to happen in 2021, plus they have predicted they will borrow and spend another 121 billion.... When we borrow money and spend it we owe it to the bank, to find out the balance we add numbers not subtract for the total balance... the balance does not go down until you pay them...which is then subtracted from the total balance......

 

No these figures are annual deficits not cumulative deficits. You don't have to pay them off for annual deficit to come down but not spend as much in that year.

Edited December 2, 2020 by CITIZEN_2015

[oops]

2 hours ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

No these figures are annual deficits not cumulative deficits. You don't have to pay them off for annual deficit to come down but not spend as much in that year.

The deficits are indeed annual, but when you string several of them together during times of prosperity and difficult times alike, they do become cumulative. When you say critics of Trudeau like me and other conservatives like me, you know not of which you speak. I believe in people not in political parties. I am grateful for prime ministers that were fiscally responsible and were responsible stewarts of our resources. Among the post war PMs that I respect are Louis St Laurent (liberal) , John Diefenbaker(progressive conservative), Lester Pearson (liberal), Jean Chretien (liberal) and Paul Martin (liberal).  Although he was never prime minister I also admire Tommy Douglas our last nation builder who was leader of the CCF which we now know as the NDP. 

I don't think that Justin is a bad prime minister because he is a liberal, I think it is a result of unfortunate genetics. His father Pierre was prime minister under two separate tenures for a total of 14 years. During that time he was responsible for a 738% rise in the federal debt. His mother Margaret during his formative years was a flower child noted for her fondness of recreational drugs, and partying through the night with the Rolling Stones, and other celebrities of questionable virtue.

 

You may be infatuated with Justin, but others see him as a real menace. There is often a feeling of fatality, people believing that there is nothing that they can do make needed change. This is not totally true. Most people know that a prime minister needs the confidence of parliament to remain in power. It is also true that the PM needs the confidence of the Canadian people. If anyone believes that we need a change in leadership, and is looking for a way to contribute, there is a petition for the removal of Justin Trudeau from office. This can be found at:

https://www.change.org/p/canadian-house-of-commons-at-least-1-million-signatures-to-remove-pm-justin-trudeau-and-his-liberal-government 

[CITIZEN_2015]

1 hour ago, oops said:

The deficits are indeed annual, but when you string several of them together during times of prosperity and difficult times alike, they do become cumulative. When you say critics of Trudeau like me and other conservatives like me, you know not of which you speak. I believe in people not in political parties. I am grateful for prime ministers that were fiscally responsible and were responsible stewarts of our resources. Among the post war PMs that I respect are Louis St Laurent (liberal) , John Diefenbaker(progressive conservative), Lester Pearson (liberal), Jean Chretien (liberal) and Paul Martin (liberal).  Although he was never prime minister I also admire Tommy Douglas our last nation builder who was leader of the CCF which we now know as the NDP. 

I don't think that Justin is a bad prime minister because he is a liberal, I think it is a result of unfortunate genetics. His father Pierre was prime minister under two separate tenures for a total of 14 years. During that time he was responsible for a 738% rise in the federal debt. His mother Margaret during his formative years was a flower child noted for her fondness of recreational drugs, and partying through the night with the Rolling Stones, and other celebrities of questionable virtue.

 

You may be infatuated with Justin, but others see him as a real menace. There is often a feeling of fatality, people believing that there is nothing that they can do make needed change. This is not totally true. Most people know that a prime minister needs the confidence of parliament to remain in power. It is also true that the PM needs the confidence of the Canadian people. If anyone believes that we need a change in leadership, and is looking for a way to contribute, there is a petition for the removal of Justin Trudeau from office. This can be found at:

https://www.change.org/p/canadian-house-of-commons-at-least-1-million-signatures-to-remove-pm-justin-trudeau-and-his-liberal-government 

I was responding to a  question as how deficits comes down and I think the poster may not have been aware that it was annual deficits not cumulative and I explained how annual deficits come down in a particular year when emergency expenders end.

The rest of your post is pure nonsense. It shows how much you hate Trudeau family and you even change history. You can be a great Russian historian during soviet evil empire who used to distort Russian history to show how great their murderous revolution was.

The petition you have included is idiotic. It is only the Canadian people (same people who elected Justin Trudeau to the government as Prime Minister of Canada TWICE) on an official election day who can remove Trudeau out of government not a bunch of loser hate mongers, 

Edited December 3, 2020 by CITIZEN_2015

[Argus]

And what desperately important jobs does the government do with all that money? So desperately important that even if they have NO money they will borrow it in order to accomplish? Well...

Personally, I don't think they need to worry since nobody ever watches Canadian movies anyway.

OTTAWA — Some of Canada’s biggest film producers are warning against proposed changes to a key federal funding program, saying a new politically correct focus on gender and racial equality could hamper the commercial viability of Canadian cinema.

Many producers who spoke to National Post said the new mandate is at risk of overlapping with the Canada Arts Council, which has a budget twice the size of Telefilm, and has explicit mandates to funnel money to underrepresented First Nations, Black or other artists. Telefilm also pledged $100,000 to the Black Screen Office earlier this year, and provides $100,000 to the Indigenous Screen Office annually.

https://nationalpost.com/news/success-not-a-factor-in-funding-canadian-movies-as-focus-put-on-gender-and-racial-equality-producers

 

Edited December 3, 2020 by Argus

[oops]

1 hour ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

The rest of your post is pure nonsense. It shows how much you hate Trudeau family and you even change history. You can be a great Russian historian during soviet evil empire who used to distort Russian history to show how great their murderous revolution was.

The petition you have included is idiotic. It is only the Canadian people (same people who elected Justin Trudeau to the government as Prime Minister of Canada TWICE) on an official election day who can remove Trudeau out of government not a bunch of loser hate mongers, 

I do not hate the Trudeau family, only what they have done to our nation. It is not in fact the Canadian people that decide who is prime minister. Canada is a constitutional monarchy, and the prime minister is appointed by our head of state at the present time that is Queen Elizabeth II, through her representative the Governor General.

THE CROWN AND THE GOVERNOR GENERAL

In Canada, executive authority is formally vested in the Crown (the Sovereign), and it is exercised in its name by the Governor General, acting on the advice of the Prime Minister and the cabinet. The Constitution reserves certain prerogatives of government for the Crown, including the powers to:

• give royal recommendation to bills that propose to spend government revenues;

• give royal assent to bill passed by the Senate and the House of Commons so that they become law;

• appoint holders of many important offices (e.g., judicial and diplomatic);

• dissolve Parliament before elections, and to open and close parliamentary sessions (at the beginning of each parliamentary session, the Governor General reads the Speech from the Throne, prepared by the Prime Minister, outlining the Government’s objectives for the upcoming session); and

• choose the Prime Minister (by convention, the leader of the party with the most seats in the House of Commons following a general election).

https://www.ourcommons.ca/About/OurProcedure/ParliamentaryFramework/c_g_parliamentaryframework-e.htm

 

The popukace of each electoral riding elects a member of parliament to represent their interests. Parliament is known as the house of commons (commons referring to the common people) to retain power a prime minister must continue to have the confidence of the house of commons, by inference the common people. The intent of the petition is to inform the queens representative that our current prime minister no longer has the confidence of the people of Canada, and requesting her to dissolve Parliament before elections.

 

You say that I change history, but offer no examples of such, not a sign of a solid argument. You might want to be careful about throwing the term idiotic around, you never know where it might land.

[CITIZEN_2015]

1 hour ago, oops said:

Canada is a constitutional monarchy, and the prime minister is appointed by our head of state at the present time that is Queen Elizabeth II, through her representative the Governor General.

You are distorting the facts again. You know well that the Governor general acts upon the will of people and appoint the head of the party who secures most seats in the Parliament by the people of Canada. You are misrepresenting again pretending that a petition can oust the elected Prime Minister of Canada. I meant the act of misrepresentation was idiotic not the people who may have decided to sign on to it. I believe in democracy and will of free people unlike you who so openly insult the democratically elected Prime Minister of this great country.

[Nefarious Banana]

Canada and other countries borrowing huge amounts of money . . . . 

Who's the lender ?

China ?

[oops]

12 hours ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

You are distorting the facts again. You know well that the Governor general acts upon the will of people and appoint the head of the party who secures most seats in the Parliament by the people of Canada. You are misrepresenting again pretending that a petition can oust the elected Prime Minister of Canada. I meant the act of misrepresentation was idiotic not the people who may have decided to sign on to it. I believe in democracy and will of free people unlike you who so openly insult the democratically elected Prime Minister of this great country.

Of course the petition will not bring down the government, it is at best a wake up call. The hope is that it will make our leaders recognize the problem, so they will see the need to address it. No luck so far. You think that our government is giving money to help people through a crisis that the virus has created. I believe the government lock downs created the problem, and their solution was to borrow more money, return it to the people who will need to repay it and then expect them to be grateful. That way everyone can keep enjoying their pleasant dreams.

 

During the pre crisis years did Justin use this time to reduce the debt, and prepare us for leaner times? No he did not do that, his solution to rising debt was to borrow money to pay it. Is this what is referred to as fiscal responsibility? No it is not.

 

The government has borrowed 300 billion dollars, to address the problem, at the same time gdp (our resources that enable us to fund government spending) was reduced by 38%. Do some people see this as a problem? Yes they do. Is Justin one of them? No he is not. At a time when we were running a $19 billion deficit we have added 30% to our debt and reduced our resources to 62% of pre crisis levels. In the latest quarter with some easing of restrictions gdp rose by 9%. One would assume that this would mean that it is now 71% of our pre crisis level. Of course the 9% increase is on 62% of our remaining gdp. This means that we are now now operating at 67% of the former gdp. While some see this as progress, we are in fact adding more to a debt that was increasing under much better times. This is of course added to, not subtracted from government deficits.

 

My hope is that people will recognize the problem, and demand change, perhaps I am aiming too high.

 

 

[CITIZEN_2015]

1 hour ago, oops said:

 I believe the government lock downs created the problem, and their solution was to borrow more money, return it to the people who will need to repay it and then expect them to be grateful. That way everyone can keep enjoying their pleasant dreams.

Yes you also likely believe aliens from other planets are among us trying to take over our planet. It is all government conspiracy. Elvis is still alive hiding somewhere.

[oops]

13 minutes ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

Yes you also likely believe aliens from other planets are among us trying to take over our planet. It is all government conspiracy. Elvis is still alive hiding somewhere.

Wrong again. I do admire your consistency though. I do not believe in government conspiracies, I don't believe our governments are clever enough to pull them off. Don't give up hope of finding Elvis, and when you do, say Hi for me.

[Army Guy]

On 12/2/2020 at 4:19 PM, CITIZEN_2015 said:

The government cannot oversea all singled out exceptional cases. Those obvious cases will be followed and prosecuted however, this does not apply to the majority in need.

You post reminds me of Marry Antoinette. They told her situation is grim just before French revolution as people don't have bread to eat. She responded let them eat cake. It is easy to claim situation is not grim from the comfort of your home. But i agree situation is not as grim because Trudeau government intervened and did not allow Canadians to become homeless and without income and that is why we now have 381 billion in deficit. Would you have preferred the reverse?

they spent over 50% more than they needed to, for example over 450,000 cases are from kids from 15 to 21 that live at home with parents that earn more than 100,000 dollars ... the entire CERB was costed to take 26 bil, they spent 52 billion thats not a few cases and if it happened on this scale for one benefit can we imagine what all the other benefits  have cost us.

I'm not sure why that does not concern you...

[Army Guy]

On 12/2/2020 at 4:34 PM, CITIZEN_2015 said:

No these figures are annual deficits not cumulative deficits. You don't have to pay them off for annual deficit to come down but not spend as much in that year.

please provide a source that explains this in detail...

each year The government collects taxes/ other revenue for what it thinks it is going to cost Canada to cover running the country for that year ....If the government spends more than that which it collects "where does that money come from" from an IOU, from a bank , bonds, where ? 

If they borrow that money  it is added to the our total deficit, Canada does not have a rich uncle or Graney.