When Should Harper Pull the Plug?

[Michael Hardner]

Dan:

That would depend upon the scenario in which the Conservatives form their government. If it's a minority by either election or the GG instructing to form the government from sitting MPs, opposition will keep them in line.

I agree.

Sweal:

I don't see it. Who will elect them?

The same people who elected Mike Harris.

[Guest eureka]

If the next government is a Conservative one of this stripe, you can say goodbye to Canada.

This "Conservative" Party is dedicated to the weakening of the federal power, and, since the only real power the federal government has, that means giving up federal taxing powers to the provinces.

This "Conservative" party is dedicated to the destruction of the healthcare system and turning into a provincial toy. That has been clear for quite a few years now.

This "Conservative" party is dedicated to reneging on the Kyoto accord and to the dooming of your children and grandchildren to sickness, terror, and poverty that will necessarily follow the failure of the world struggle to reverse the damage to the Planet.

This "Conservative" party does not care about these things and the fundamentalist part would probably welcome them. After all, a soundly thought opinion is that failure to address climate change now will bring that "war of all against all" that the fundamentalists expect and want since it signals their elevation to heaven.

This "Conservative" party would be the greatest disaster as a government that could befall us.

[Digby]

Well im a right of center thinking type person who respects the bible and last election I voted for the communist (ndp). I did this evil thing because I knew in my heart Brian Muroney Was crooked and some of his crowd was still around(plus local guy they ran was a friend).

So if i can do this You liberals should be able to go Right for 4 years or so . This Country is going off the road on the left side ,it needs a pull to the right . It needs some bad weeds pulled , 12 years is lots of time for bad weeds to grow big .

You guys know This Liberal Goverment Is crooks we got to get rid of them. WE NEED A CHANGE .

[I miss Reagan]

If the next government is a Conservative one of this stripe, you can say goodbye to Canada.

This "Conservative" Party is dedicated to the weakening of the federal power, and, since the only real power the federal government has, that means giving up federal taxing powers to the provinces.

This "Conservative" party is dedicated to the destruction of the healthcare system and turning into a provincial toy. That has been clear for quite a few years now.

This "Conservative" party is dedicated to reneging on the Kyoto accord and to the dooming of your children and grandchildren to sickness, terror, and poverty that will necessarily follow the failure of the world struggle to reverse the damage to the Planet.

This "Conservative" party does not care about these things and the fundamentalist part would probably welcome them. After all, a soundly thought opinion is that failure to address climate change now will bring that "war of all against all" that the fundamentalists expect and want since it signals their elevation to heaven.

This "Conservative" party would be the greatest disaster as a government that could befall us.

Holy Shit. People in Canada really buy into this apocolyptic BS.

[daniel]

Holy Shit. People in Canada really buy into this apocolyptic BS.

You haven't sat through any nail-biter referenda on separation have you?

[Guest eureka]

IMR, you reveal yourself as a true neoconservative if you can argue with any of that. Neocon as in totally ignorant of the world around and only interested is his bank account.

What part don't you believe? Nost of it is out of the mouths of the leaders. The religious part is basic to the fundamentalists and is the most dangerous trend in world affairs. That kind of fundamentalism is sweeping through the poorer regions of the world and is the fastest growing belief on earth - by a long way.

[I miss Reagan]

Holy Shit.  People in Canada really buy into this apocolyptic  BS. 

You haven't sat through any nail-biter referenda on separation have you?

No. Penny for your thoughts...

[Guest eureka]

Some may be interested to search for Corruption Perception Index. Canada has fallen from 5th. place in 2000 to 12th. for 2004. That is with Adscam already under investigation.

The US, of course, is lower still and remains failry steady with some worsening in the Bush years.

Apart from that, the position of a number of countries is interesting.

[kimmy]

What part don't you believe? Nost of it is out of the mouths of the leaders. The religious part is basic to the fundamentalists and is the most dangerous trend in world affairs. That kind of fundamentalism is sweeping through the poorer regions of the world and is the fastest growing belief on earth - by a long way.

Whoa-whoa-whaaah?

I just can't picture the Wahabbi mullahs adopting policy resolutions to not introduce any legislation on abortion or to allow full legal benefits to same-sex couples.

If the CPC is what passes for religious fundamentalism in Canada, then religious fundamentalism in Canada is an awful lot different from that in the US or anywhere else in the world.

-kimmy

[The Terrible Sweal]

Sweal:

I don't see it. Who will elect them?

The same people who elected Mike Harris.

Materialistic, short-sighted, self-involved people. Hmmm.

[The Terrible Sweal]

EDITED TO ADD:  Harper should wait for the inquiry to finish, which I understand is one month.  I doubt the people will change their minds by then.

That's probably a reasonable compromise. Waiting to the end of the testimony lets people hear all the information; surely they don't need Gomery's analysis to tell them what it means.

Compromise? The vast majority of Canadians want to wait for the Report. Who should they compromise with??

[The Terrible Sweal]

If the CPC is what passes for religious fundamentalism in Canada, then religious fundamentalism in Canada is an awful lot different from that in the US or anywhere else in the world.

No, it's just less successful here. Surely the CPC represents the best shot that social conservatives have in forcing their agenda into the domain of public policy. The fact that the CPC policy convention was highlighted by its final decision that they won't, after all, enforce childbirth on women is evidence that they remained up until then at the forefront of that idea.

[August1991]

The fact that the CPC policy convention was highlighted by its final decision that they won't, after all, enforce childbirth on women is evidence that they remained up until then at the forefront of that idea.

TS,

Canada at present has no law on abortion. What the Conservatives considered at their convention, if I understand properly, was whether to have such a law. The question was not whether to forbid all abortions. As it turned out, the convention decided to accept the status quo.

As to the other major social issue, same sex marriage, the Conservatives have adopted the policy of Sweden, Norway, Denmark and other such places notable for fascist fundamentalism.

Look, TS, you pointed out above that you view this election as a choice between crooks and fascists.

Describing the Liberals as crooks is not far-fetched. Describing the Conservatives as fascists is absurd. But I guess any argument is fair in a political fight.

For example, we just saw our PM, in response to a question about whether he had lunch with a crook, answer that Harper would destroy Canada's health system.

We'll see if such hyperbole works this time around. I have a suspicion that the chicken little has said one too many times that the sky is about to fall. Or is the proper fable the one about the boy who calls wolf to divert attention from his hand in the cookie jar.

[The Terrible Sweal]

Look, TS, you pointed out above that you view this election as a choice between crooks and fascists.

Nah. Between fascist crooks and just plain crooks.

[Newfie Canadian]

Well, for the first time in a very long time, Health Care isn't the #1 item on Canadians worry list.

According to a CBC poll, it's, surprise, poor govt/Gomery.

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/20...oll-050414.html

Some of the other results are interesting as well.

Harper has to weigh it all.

[Digby]

I'm not real happy with Harper and some of the top brass of the conservative party . I will most likely Vote for them as i know they are the lesser of the 2 evils .

The liberal Party just plain is too corrupt and should be in prison not the house of parliment.

The big problem I have with the conservative party is they are shutting up MPs like John Cummins , I beleave he not only knows how corrupt the department of native affairs is he would like to expose it . I know hundreds of Millions are wasted and stolen in this department . The conserative party Has shut him up ,which I think is Wrong . Even the conservative party is holding back on exposeing just how corrupt and wastefull our goverment has been with tax money.

The public should be aloud to know whats going on , Like I say I think you will find the ad scam in Quebec is only a drop in the bucket .

We can't have health care ,a strong military , public wharfs , ect. ect . Only because of goverment corruption and goverment waste .

A check for 23,000,000 was wrote to a small native band just this week for What? FOR WHAT ? The public would be shocked , Go read some of the stuff they will not let John Cummins tell , The conservatives got him shut up .

[Newfie Canadian]

It occurs to me, it may not matter when the writ is dropped, or who the leaders are, the real enemy may be voter apathy.

According to Elections Canada, the voter turnout for the last election was 60.9%.

http://www.elections.ca/scripts/OVR2004/default.html

There was a poll recently that said:

68 per cent replied that all parties operate the same way, while 29 per cent believe that some parties are more ethical than others.

Either people will say what's the point and not bother to vote, or will be so ticked off they will vote just to punish the Liberals.

I suspect it will be the latter.

Should this be a new thread?

[Digby]

I'm not real happy with Harper and some of the top brass of the conservative party . I will most likely Vote for them as i know they are the lesser of the 2 evils .

The liberal Party just plain is too corrupt and should be in prison not the house of parliment.

The big problem I have with the conservative party is they are shutting up MPs like John Cummins , I beleave he not only knows how corrupt the department of native affairs is he would like to expose it . I know hundreds of Millions are wasted and stolen in this department . The conserative party Has shut him up ,which I think is Wrong . Even the conservative party is holding back on exposeing just how corrupt and wastefull our goverment has been with tax money.

The public should be aloud to know whats going on , Like I say I think you will find the ad scam in Quebec is only a drop in the bucket .

We can't have health care ,a strong military , public wharfs , ect. ect . Only because of goverment corruption and goverment waste .

A check for 23,000,000 was wrote to a small native band just this week for What? FOR WHAT ? The public would be shocked , Go read some of the stuff they will not let John Cummins tell , The conservatives got him shut up .

Cummins chosen as Canadian Alliance fisheries critic

Portfolio is no mystery to former commercial fisherman

By Jessica Holmes ([email protected])

Delta-South Richmond MP John Cummins is returning to his old post as fisheries critic for the Canadian Alliance’s shadow cabinet.

"I’ve been dealing with fishing issues one way or another over time and have gained knowledge of the issues at hand," he said.

Cummins, a former commercial fisherman, has worked on and off as the party’s fisheries critic since the 1993 federal election, his last stint in 1997 for two years.

He said the first issues he plans to deal with have to do with the First Nations treaty negotiations presently being dealt with, including the Tsawwassen band.

"The Tsawwassen band is demanding a chunk of the fisheries for commercial purposes and they want a say in management," he said.

Cummins thinks involving the First Nations in fisheries management will overcrowd the decision-making process.

"If everyone claims to have a constitutional right to manage the fisheries, it will be impossible to manage the resource."

A federal issue he is presently criticizing is the way Minister of Fisheries and Oceans Herb Dhaliwal is dealing with the 1999 Supreme Court of Canada Marshall decision, in which Donald Marshall established his right to fish for eels as a small-scale commercial activity to support himself and his common-law spouse.

Dhaliwal, Cummings said, is now entering into agreements which allow native bands to fish non-traditional species outside of their traditional areas.

Cummins plans to raise public awareness of these issues to curb possible problematic decisions made by Dhaliwal.

Cummins handily won re-election in last November’s federal election.

They now have him shut up , I think they should let him talk . The public would never beleave where Dhaliwal's stupidity has lead this Country , Id say it has cost hundreds of millions , And in the future hundreds of millions in lost tax revenue . Cummins seen where it was leading , the stupid corrupt liberals did it any way

[willy]

Cummins, has not been shut up.

He is a thoughtful MP who is passionate about the fishing issues on both coasts. Right now he has been working hard to get a commission to look into the fish that died in the salmon run up the Fraser last year. He is still rocking the apple cart and charging that we don't put enough resources into enforcement.

Mr. Cummins is still a member of the fisheries committee and plays an important roll.

Here is a link to John's website so you can see the work he has been up to.

http://www.johncummins.ca/

[Digby]

Maybe he is still speaking some ,But im sure he's Been shut up about the results of the Donald Marshall decission and liberal goverment .

If the public was ever aloud to see it , it would be too hard to beleave . I guess maybe this is why they will not allow it to be told even in the conservative camp .

[Shakeyhands]

Well, for the first time in a very long time, Health Care isn't the #1 item on Canadians worry list.

According to a CBC poll, it's, surprise, poor govt/Gomery.

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/20...oll-050414.html

Some of the other results are interesting as well.

Harper has to weigh it all.

Boy that really exposes the CBC as the media tool of the right wing Conservative party... d'oh...

I guess I should post this in the Is the CBC bias'd thread.... sorry

[I Miss Trudeau]

I just can't picture the Wahabbi mullahs adopting policy resolutions to not introduce any legislation on abortion or to allow full legal benefits to same-sex couples.

Given Harper's adamant stance on free votes for issues of conscience, the official CPC position on issues such as abortion is misleading at best and outright deceitful at worst.

Furthermore, "full legal benefits to same-sex couples" may be in the platform, but the party violates that position on an almost daily basis.

All it takes is one "rogue" conservative mp to introduce such legislation, and you can bet a very large portion of conservative MP's will back it. The "official position" of the CPC is a misleading farce.

[willy]

All it takes is one "rogue" conservative mp to introduce such legislation, and you can bet a very large portion of conservative MP's will back it. The "official position" of the CPC is a misleading farce.

What scares me is what the Liberal stated policy is on a number of issues.

i.e. legalizing drugs and prostitution

[daniel]

What scares me is now Health Care is only the number two issue and the Conservatives will take it literally.

[Guest eureka]

What scares me is the ignorance of some who will be able to vote.

The Mullahs have no bearing on my statement. It is certain Protestant fundamental (and evangeliicals) who believe in a "war of all agaonst all" in the last days when they, the elct, will be taken up to heaven. They want it and they are the fastest growing belief - far greater growth than Islam. They are growing in Canada too.