Derek 2.0 Posted August 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 But it is an issue. Canada has fewer police per population than most other western democracies. The RCMP are notoriously short staffed, too. Even before the terrorist thing on parliament hill they were letting most fraud go because they didn't have the cops to investigate. Putting all those extra cops on parliament hill basically stripped much of the organized crime group and other areas bare. Who cares!!!! As linked by Waldo, all forms of crime have decreased by 23%........if this trend continues for another decade, we should be looking at cutting police officers, not hiring more!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted August 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 Sure, like, when you have nobody to investigate fraud, people stop reporting it. And guess what? Fraud rates drop really low! Well, not really. But statistically,since nobody's bothering to report it. Same goes for any number of other crimes. They're not really dropping. The statistics on 'police reported crime' are dropping because people aren't bothering to report crime to the police. Why bother if you feel they're not likely to do anything anyway? I see, so unreported crime is increasing........I don't suppose you have any statistics to prove that.....oh wait, its unreported Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 I thought many decried the Conservative approach to crime prevention............why is the NDP promising several thousand additional police officers, when crime rates, including violent crime, is decreasing across Canada? It's a ridiculous vote-buying tactic for urban centres. That's why. You should be super stoked about it. It's exactly the kind of garbage legislation that you love. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 notwithstanding there are pockets within communities all across Canada that have serious crime... increasing crime, you choose to blindly throw out national crime stats... Good point. Coupled with Harper's broken promises, maybe this legislation isn't garbage after all. It's still an urban vote-buying ploy though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 notwithstanding there are pockets within communities all across Canada that have serious crime... increasing crime, you choose to blindly throw out national crime stats...Yet, from your CBC story's link, overall, all violent crime, in all its forms, decreasedYou might want to re-read the post you're responding to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted August 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 It's a ridiculous vote-buying tactic for urban centres. That's why. You should be super stoked about it. It's exactly the kind of garbage legislation that you love. No its not, as my property taxes will go up to pay for unneeded policing......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted August 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 You might want to re-read the post you're responding to. I did, and went to the embedded link from within the link posted by Waldo, clearly showing violent crime and crime overall has dropped!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 21, 2015 Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 I did, and went to the embedded link from within the link posted by Waldo, clearly showing violent crime and crime overall has dropped!!!Then you might want to have someone else read it to you and explain it if necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted August 21, 2015 Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 You might want to re-read the post you're responding to. geezaz! No kidding... his reply is nonsense in the context of what I stated. Of course, it's D2.0, so not unexpected! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted August 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 Then you might want to have someone else read it to you and explain it if necessary. I can read just fine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 21, 2015 Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 Try again, Derek. The point continues to elude you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted August 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 Try again, Derek. The point continues to elude you. Which point? That all violent crime dropped 17% or that crime overall dropped 23%? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 21, 2015 Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 Derek, stop. You're embarrassing yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted August 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 Derek, stop. You're embarrassing yourself. By all means, explain how. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted August 21, 2015 Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 Sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted August 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 Sure. Still waiting...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted August 21, 2015 Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 I see, so unreported crime is increasing........I don't suppose you have any statistics to prove that.....oh wait, its unreported What planet have you been on the last few years? This has been discussed here repeatedly. Every five years Statistics Canada runs a major survey of victims of crime. And every time they do it shows that the percentage of crime citizens are reporting to police went down from the one before. Reporting crime to the police is a time-consuming pain in the ass, and since tons of people don't think the cops are going to find the criminal, or even if they do that the courts would do anything worthwhile, they don't bother to report the crime. This goes for all kinds of property crime as well as assaults and rapes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted August 21, 2015 Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 Derek, stop. You're embarrassing yourself. notwithstanding there are many ways to punch holes in the StatsCan methodology ala police reporting... events involving multiple crimes are not categorized individually; rather, the most 'serious' crime within the grouping is the only crime reported (and cataloged) within that grouping... I could go on... and on... but I'm already bored of this stooopid thread! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted August 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 What planet have you been on the last few years? This has been discussed here repeatedly. Every five years Statistics Canada runs a major survey of victims of crime. And every time they do it shows that the percentage of crime citizens are reporting to police went down from the one before. Reporting crime to the police is a time-consuming pain in the ass, and since tons of people don't think the cops are going to find the criminal, or even if they do that the courts would do anything worthwhile, they don't bother to report the crime. This goes for all kinds of property crime as well as assaults and rapes. Do you have one of such surveys handy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek 2.0 Posted August 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 (edited) Just a quick search of the scourge that is unreported crime in Canada, and found this from 5 years ago: The statistics, published in Statistics Canada's 2009 General Social Survey on Victimization, suggest Canadians reported 31 per cent of the crimes they experienced to police in 2009 — down from 34 per cent in the previous survey in 2004. But the same survey found: Overall, however, the statistics revealed little change in victimization from 2004 to 2009. Ninety-three per cent of the Canadians surveyed said they were either satisfied or very satisfied with their personal safety from crime, similar to 94 per cent in 2004. So the vast majority of Canadians are satisfied with their personal safety from crime.......... So if reported crime is decreasing by leap and bounds, but unreported crime is increasing (from five years ago), how are Mulcair's "boots on the ground" going to address crime not reported to police? After all, the majority of policing in Canada is either reactionary or a combination of reactionary and proactive measures........hence how are Mulcair's "boot on the ground" going to contend with this? --------- I find this report from the Star last year telling: Using Statistics Canada figures, including Police-Reported Crime Statistics, Di Matteo found that between 2001 and 2012, the number of police officers in Canada grew 21.8 per cent (from 57,076 to 69,505) while the Canadian population increased only 12.2 per cent. So police officers are increasing at a greater rate than the population, despite a decrease in crime........and Mulcair wants to add more? If this was a Harper proposal, surely there would be claims as to this being the making of a "Police State"......... Edited August 21, 2015 by Derek 2.0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted August 21, 2015 Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 (edited) Just a quick search of the scourge that is unreported crime in Canada, and found this from 5 years ago: Yes, the 2014 should be released very soon. You noted how only 31% of crimes were reported? The survey also said: In each cycle of the GSS, victims are asked whether or not the incident came to the attention of the police. Overall, nearly one-third (31%) of incidents were reported to the police in 2009, down slightly from 2004 (34%) As I pointed out when I first mentioned this survey some time ago, a fall from 34% to 31% is not a 'slight decrease' It's actually almost a 10% decrease in reporting. Further, the 2004 survey which they mention also found a decrease in the percentage of crime being reported from the previous 1999 survey. So is crime decreasing, or is the amount of crime actually being reported decreasing? So if reported crime is decreasing by leap and bounds, but unreported crime is increasing (from five years ago), how are Mulcair's "boots on the ground" going to address crime not reported to police? After all, the majority of policing in Canada is either reactionary or a combination of reactionary and proactive measures........hence how are Mulcair's "boot on the ground" going to contend with this? Derek, I think you have to step back and recognize that just because Mulcair says something that doesn't mean it's a bad idea. More police is actually something many conservatives have been calling for for many years, and something which Harper promised and failed to deliver on. If you wonder at how more police are going to help address crime what would you say to cutting back on the numbers of police? The RCMP slashed their organized crime bureaus and a number of others to the bone to find people to act as security guards on Parliament Hill. I'd kind of like those units restaffed myself. So police officers are increasing at a greater rate than the population, despite a decrease in crime........ Except that as per the Stats Can victimization survey crime isn't necessarily decreasing, and even at 200 police per 100k pop we still have a low number of police compared to most of our allies. Edited August 21, 2015 by Argus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted August 21, 2015 Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 If this was a Harper proposal, surely there would be claims as to this being the making of a "Police State"......... it's essentially the same proposal Harper did make... but failed to properly fund. Your attempt to create a wedge issue has failed - please try again with sumthin' else, hey! . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poochy Posted August 21, 2015 Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 They aren't terribly happy about Mr. Mulcair over on Rabble, for neither for his Thatcher lover nor for his law and order love, ahhh, it is fun when they start to turn against each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted August 21, 2015 Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 They aren't terribly happy about Mr. Mulcair over on Rabble, for neither for his Thatcher lover nor for his law and order love, ahhh, it is fun when they start to turn against each other. With them criticizing him it makes me like him just a bit more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kraychik Posted August 21, 2015 Report Share Posted August 21, 2015 I'm forced to laugh at all the past claims of a Harper police State, when I here this from the NDP: I would have assumed the NDP to have thought loafers or Roman sandals worn by social workers and addiction counsellors would be more fitting......but no: I thought many decried the Conservative approach to crime prevention............why is the NDP promising several thousand additional police officers, when crime rates, including violent crime, is decreasing across Canada? Why are the NDP attempting to address an issue that isn't an issue? And to think, there are those on the left that accuse the Tories of pimping fears among voters. What is behind Mulcair's pledge for more "boots on the ground" across Canada? If I recall correctly, violent crime and homicide are are 40-year-lows as of 2013 (the most recent year of available data). Pretty pathetic that we're ending 2015 and SC still can't get its act together. I'm not sure how much credit the CPC can take for it, but hey... it's moving in the right direction. Meanwhile, the hysterical left is shrieking about "violence against women", with Niki Ashton claiming that such violence is reaching "crisis levels". The Canadian left literally parrots the rhetoric of the American left and Democrats. "War on Women"! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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