TimG Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 Within the law only. If it's not illegal it's nobody's business.And the law is based on what is socially acceptable. There is no rational reason to restrict public nudity but it is restricted. Quote
jbg Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 None of the women interviewed in the Star article suggested anything close to what you say. Were they interviewed on a promise of anonymity? Because I'm sure they didn't want to be beaten or worse. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
On Guard for Thee Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 Harper will appeal this and he will lose. Another swipe at the courts and another waste of time and money. The SCC has already ruled that the niqab is acceptable in courts of law, albeit on a case by case basis, so I would think allowing it at a citizenship ceremony, where the issue of cross examination has no bearing, will be a cake walk. Quote
LemonPureLeaf Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 Harper will appeal this and he will lose. Another swipe at the courts and another waste of time and money. The SCC has already ruled that the niqab is acceptable in courts of law, albeit on a case by case basis, so I would think allowing it at a citizenship ceremony, where the issue of cross examination has no bearing, will be a cake walk. You feel it's a good thing to have an army of black shrouds becoming Canadian and walking our streets? What value does this bring to Canada? Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 You feel it's a good thing to have an army of black shrouds becoming Canadian and walking our streets? What value does this bring to Canada? An army of black shrouds. Thats quite the tin hat statement, but I guess we are used to that. Have you seen any of these armies...no because they dont exist. And those immigrants who choose to do so are fine with me. Some people wear yoga pants that shouldnt, but should we fear that enough to take it to the SC... Quote
LemonPureLeaf Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 An army of black shrouds. Thats quite the tin hat statement, but I guess we are used to that. Have you seen any of these armies...no because they dont exist. And those immigrants who choose to do so are fine with me. Some people wear yoga pants that shouldnt, but should we fear that enough to take it to the SC... What value does embracing this cultural practice bring to Canada? Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 What value does embracing this cultural practice bring to Canada? What value does allowing Scots to wear a kilt bring to Canada...What is valuable is a charter of rights that protects our freedoms. Quote
LemonPureLeaf Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 An army of black shrouds. Thats quite the tin hat statement, but I guess we are used to that. Have you seen any of these armies...no because they dont exist. And those immigrants who choose to do so are fine with me. Some people wear yoga pants that shouldnt, but should we fear that enough to take it to the SC... Please explain what value embracing this custom of the niqab brings to Canada. Thank you. Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 Please explain what value embracing this custom of the niqab brings to Canada. Thank you. I will after you explain to me what the Scottish kilt brings as a value to Canada. Thank you. Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 White shrouds are already a Canadian cultural tradition...why not black ones ? London, Ontario...1925: Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
On Guard for Thee Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 Please explain what value embracing this custom of the niqab brings to Canada. Thank you. Ill give you a hint though. It has to do with the integration of, and learning respect for, various cultures other than the one you might be used to. You dont have to take up wearing a kilt, a turban, a niqab, or eagle feathers. But you need to respect the rights of others to follow their traditions. Doing so has a lot to do with what makes Canada such a respected country. And its part of why I am proud of it and so happy I live here. Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 White shrouds are already a Canadian cultural tradition...why not black ones ? London, Ontario...1925: America 2014 https://www.kkkknights.com/ Boy did you ever step in it there! Quote
LemonPureLeaf Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 I will after you explain to me what the Scottish kilt brings as a value to Canada. Thank you. I asked you first. So your answer is that it brings nothing to Canada. Women walking around shrouded brings nothing to the fabric of Canada. Thank you for being honest about it. If it brought some great things surely you would be forth coming with the praise. Your silence speaks volumes to us. Thanks again. Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 I asked you first. So your answer is that it brings nothing to Canada. Women walking around shrouded brings nothing to the fabric of Canada. Thank you for being honest about it. If it brought some great things surely you would be forth coming with the praise. Your silence speaks volumes to us. Thanks again. No I asked you first...thats about the level of your discourse. But thanks for playing. Quote
guyser Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 Of course not - that's because all 38 of them wear the niqab. Interesting that they also all say that they are just fine with lifting their veil for a variety of reasons......which makes one wonder why this one Muslim woman has used a legal team to fight raising her veil when taking the Oath. Does it not seem counter to what the article is trying to convey?So...most of these folk are cool with raising the veil , you know...choice and all that, but we spend 76 pages worrying about one. And one who has won the right to do waht she wants and no harm no foul befalls anyone else. Wow. What is the argument again? Quote
guyser Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 Were they interviewed on a promise of anonymity? Because I'm sure they didn't want to be beaten or worse.Nope She showed her face........imagine that huh? Choice ! Wow. Quote
Keepitsimple Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 So...most of these folk are cool with raising the veil , you know...choice and all that, but we spend 76 pages worrying about one. And one who has won the right to do waht she wants and no harm no foul befalls anyone else. Wow. What is the argument again? Same as its always been - and enforced by The Star's article. If all 38 women in the survey indicated that lifting their veil for various reasons was OK - and taking the Oath of Citizenship certainly qualifies as an important moment - why did this one woman kick up such a fuss? They all have a right to wear the niqab - just be reasonable in circumstances where showing your face is important - as all 38 ot these women seem to be. Why just this one woman? Quote Back to Basics
poochy Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 (edited) http://news.nationalpost.com/2015/03/24/woman-fighting-citizenship-oath-niqab-ban-favours-gender-segregation-but-not-in-canada/ "During cross-examination, Negar Hashemi, the government’s lawyer, asked Ms. Ishaq why she preferred to live in Canada, rather than Pakistan, “a country with Islamic laws that includes your religious views.” The woman replied she considered Pakistan a Muslim country, but not an Islamic one, because it was “not obeying the laws in, like, whatever Islam has told us to do.” Males and females, for instance, are not educated in separate classrooms, she said. “They are not following this rule back home … it’s been co-education.” She added there are “a lot of … fields” in the workplace where there could be a separation of genders, “but there is no separation.” Asked by Ms. Hashemi whether she would like to see men and women separate during Canada’s citizenship ceremonies, Ms. Ishaq said such a move would “definitely give me something more than I asked” and her main objective was being allowed to keep her face covered while saying the oath. “But if after that they can do for me some separation, it’s more than — yes, I do appreciate for this, too.” On Tuesday, she said if the niqab ban were lifted, there would be no need for such an accommodation." So Pakistan isn't Islamic enough for her, and if given the option she would like Canada to become more Islamic, which isn't likely to happen, but, if this woman and the niqab represents this sort of attitude we don't need it or her in this country. Lamenting co-education? Or as we call it, normal? Being blind to her own oppression is not an excuse or a good reason for us to import more of it into a place where we find it unacceptable. As many of us have been saying and now reinforced by her own words. Edited March 25, 2015 by poochy Quote
guyser Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 So Pakistan isn't Islamic enough for her, and if given the option she would like Canada to become more Islamic, which isn't likely to happen,Where did this come from? But, if this woman and the niqab represents this sort of attitude we don't need it or her in this country. Being blind to her own oppression is not an excuse or a good reason for us to import more of it into a place where we find it unacceptable. As many of us have been saying and now reinforced by her own words.YOu should see some of the opinions that exist among your fellow canadians. Quote
guyser Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 Same as its always been - and enforced by The Star's article. If all 38 women in the survey indicated that lifting their veil for various reasons was OK - and taking the Oath of Citizenship certainly qualifies as an important moment - why did this one woman kick up such a fuss? They all have a right to wear the niqab - just be reasonable in circumstances where showing your face is important - as all 38 ot these women seem to be. Why just this one woman?She explained why. And she won. Quote
Argus Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 So...most of these folk are cool with raising the veil , you know...choice and all that, but we spend 76 pages worrying about one. And one who has won the right to do waht she wants and no harm no foul befalls anyone else. Wow. What is the argument again? The argument is that bringing radical extremists into Canada is not a wise idea. Not sure why those on the Left embrace the idea given these people spit on everything you believe in. This woman has been quoted in the paper today basically saying Pakistan is not Islamic enough for her because it doesn't separate the genders enough. She wants Canadian citizenship so she can vote. Do you think bringing in more and more religious extremists to vote is going to have a positive impact on Canadian politics? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 Same as its always been - and enforced by The Star's article. If all 38 women in the survey indicated that lifting their veil for various reasons was OK - and taking the Oath of Citizenship certainly qualifies as an important moment - why did this one woman kick up such a fuss? T Well, as Tarek Fatah has said, the niquab is not merely an instrument of modesty or religion but a political statement, an upright middle finger to society at large, if you will ,and a statement of the wearer's devotion to her religious ideals in the face of the secular society around her she despises. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 Where did this come from? YOu should see some of the opinions that exist among your fellow canadians. Would you be in favour of bringing in more immigrants who had those same opinions? Say, a lot of white supremacists? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
guyser Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 (edited) The argument is that bringing radical extremists into Canada is not a wise idea.Good thing is we pretty much dont, and defintely not any that sefl identify as such. Not sure why those on the Left embrace the idea given these people spit on everything you believe in. ut they dont Argus, that is merely a construct of yours. This woman has been quoted in the paper today basically saying Pakistan is not Islamic enough for her because it doesn't separate the genders enough. And she followed that with........ (insert the important part here) She wants Canadian citizenship so she can vote. Good for her, exercising something as valuable as that. Something she probably could not have done earlier. Do you think bringing in more and more religious extremists to vote is going to have a positive impact on Canadian politics? Since we dont, I guess the answer is stay the course Canada (notweithstanding the dummies in Ott) Edited March 25, 2015 by Guyser2 Quote
Michael Hardner Posted March 25, 2015 Report Posted March 25, 2015 Would you be in favour of bringing in more immigrants who had those same opinions? Say, a lot of white supremacists? "Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled strawmen yearning to breathe free" Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
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