maplesyrup Posted October 25, 2004 Report Posted October 25, 2004 The New Democrats have a problem and it is the Green Party. Environmental groups actually state that NDP policies are better for our environment than the Green Party, yet some environmentalists still support the Green Party. I believe that the major factor here that is enabling the Green Party to gain this environmental support is because of labour's special voting rights in the NDP party. The NDP needs to adopt two strategies: 1 Remove labour special privileges within the party 2 Change the NDP lawn sign colours to Green, to reflect the NDP's most progressive policies, of all the political parties, on environmental issues. Failure to adapt to the new political realities in Canada will prevent the NDP from ever forming the government in Ottawa, however with Jack Layton as NDP Leader and progressive policies, the NDP has a fighting chance. Quote An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you do know and what you don't. Anatole France
stamps Posted October 25, 2004 Report Posted October 25, 2004 I thought the NDP was the working mans party... if they dropped their labour special privileges within their party would they not be just another flavor of the current liberals... if they did do as you say they should they would cease to be a party with any real substance and lose all relevance in my mind... and the working mans voice would disappear from the national stage politically... I myself have never and would never support these people but I believe the universe needs balance and the NDP's roll in that universe is to help keep that balance... Quote
August1991 Posted October 25, 2004 Report Posted October 25, 2004 2 Change the NDP lawn sign colours to Green, to reflect the NDP's most progressive policies, of all the political parties, on environmental issues.Isn't that like Air Canada changing the colours of its airplanes? In fact, to carry the analogy further, if the NDP adopts Green policies, isn't that kind of like Air Canada setting up Tango?I mean, if people don't like your product, the obvious solution is to package it in a different bottle and claim it's new and improved. The Left, once again, confuses symbol and reality. Quote
maplesyrup Posted October 25, 2004 Author Report Posted October 25, 2004 2 Change the NDP lawn sign colours to Green, to reflect the NDP's most progressive policies, of all the political parties, on environmental issues.Isn't that like Air Canada changing the colours of its airplanes? In fact, to carry the analogy further, if the NDP adopts Green policies, isn't that kind of like Air Canada setting up Tango?I mean, if people don't like your product, the obvious solution is to package it in a different bottle and claim it's new and improved. The Left, once again, confuses symbol and reality. Wrong. The NDP represents the average working person, students and pensioners in Canada, and the less privileged in our society. But I believe in democracy including democracy for political parties. Everyone' vote should carry equal weight, no special privileges for anyone or any special group. Half the people in the heirarchy of the labour movement don't support the NDP anyways. David Haggard's despicible anctics in the last federal election is an excellent example of what i am talking about. Quote An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you do know and what you don't. Anatole France
Guest eureka Posted October 25, 2004 Report Posted October 25, 2004 The Green Party is not even close to the NDP. Many "Greens" are as comfortable with Conservative policies other than on limited environmental issues. Environmentalists are, in general, a nuisance on the political scene. Too many are concerned with saving a stand of trees or a particular animal or some other limited goal. They do not campaign for the large issues that a political party should be dealing with. The world is now facing social, economic and human disaster on a scale unknown since mass extinctions of life forms on earth in the past. This is the issue for politics and it is not one that considers clear cutting or any such local matter. Think Kyoto and address all the minor issues within a party. Distractions from the overall health of the environment are not helpful. Quote
maplesyrup Posted October 25, 2004 Author Report Posted October 25, 2004 What kind of mass extinctions are you referring to? The dinasaurs I thought were eliminated by an astroid impacting on the planet earth. I agree with you about the Greens that they are all over the map but our right wing media is pulling out all the stops to ensure they take votes from the progressive parties. Basically Adianne Carr, and whatever his name is, who is leader federally, are right wing, but some of the Green supporters are not. They have no idea about what is going on in the politics at the top echelons of their party. The NDP both federally and provincially have met and tried to work with the Greens, however the Green party leaders couldn't give a tinker's damm about the lesss privileged in society, and the Greens are being led by Attila the Hun types who are seeking power for power's sake. I find it quite ironic that people who profess to give a shit about environmental issues will consciously split the vote and allow the the most anti-environmental interests back into power. Until we learn that we are an interdependent web we will continue to be doomed. Quote An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you do know and what you don't. Anatole France
caesar Posted October 26, 2004 Report Posted October 26, 2004 Who are these :less privleged" that you refer to. If you are referring to people who are unable to work(handicapped or seniors); that is one thing but sometimes you seem to believe that we should supply those who will not work or cannot work due to addictions and equal share of the pie. No thanks; that takes away the incentive and rewards for working and spending wisely. We saved money for our senior years; now it is being taken away in taxes and loss of benefits to help those who lived loved and partied hardy and spent it all. Quote
maplesyrup Posted October 26, 2004 Author Report Posted October 26, 2004 caesar........a guaranteed annual income, I am not saying a big income, would solve a lot of these problems. But the rich are mean so they will fight tooth and nail to prevent a progressive idea like that. The gap between the rich and the poor is too large. Look at Air Canada and what do they pay that dickhead Robert Milton for basically bankrupting the company. The whole world thirves on bullshit. Quote An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you do know and what you don't. Anatole France
August1991 Posted October 26, 2004 Report Posted October 26, 2004 What kind of mass extinctions are you referring to? The dinasaurs I thought were eliminated by an astroid impacting on the planet earth.Maple Syrup, is that our major environmental concern right now? Asteroids?The gap between the rich and the poor is too large. Look at Air Canada and what do they pay that dickhead Robert Milton for basically bankrupting the company.Of course, this is the main problem in the world now. Rich and poor.The whole world thirves on bullshit.I feel your frustration, MS. I'm with you, man. ----- The NDP needs to adopt two strategies:1 Remove labour special privileges within the party 2 Change the NDP lawn sign colours to Green, to reflect the NDP's most progressive policies, of all the political parties, on environmental issues. The NDP needs to RE-BRAND. Naomi Klein is available for consulting (and style issues). Michael Moore will shoot the video. Issue Statement: Our clientele has shifted and we need to get ahead. Counter-culture, anti-establishment, fronde, take-pride-in-being-different-for no-reason-at-all, underdogs now vote Green, not NDP. Issue Problematic: How to recapture our clientele? Solution: GREEN LITE. Quote
maplesyrup Posted October 26, 2004 Author Report Posted October 26, 2004 What kind of mass extinctions are you referring to? The dinasaurs I thought were eliminated by an astroid impacting on the planet earth.Maple Syrup, is that our major environmental concern right now? Asteroids?well I can guarantee you that whatever it is you won't be reading about it on the front page of your beloved daily newspapers The gap between the rich and the poor is too large. Look at Air Canada and what do they pay that dickhead Robert Milton for basically bankrupting the company.Of course, this is the main problem in the world now. Rich and poor.Yes actually it is - try being poor and you might clue in to the problem. The whole world thirves on bullshit.I feel your frustration, MS. I'm with you, man. You go right on believing, whatever works for you, just don't ask me to take the same trip, my road is less travelled. ----- The NDP needs to adopt two strategies:1 Remove labour special privileges within the party 2 Change the NDP lawn sign colours to Green, to reflect the NDP's most progressive policies, of all the political parties, on environmental issues. The NDP needs to RE-BRAND. Naomi Klein is available for consulting (and style issues). Michael Moore will shoot the video. Not bad suggestions, the NDP could do a lot worse. Issue Statement: Our clientele has shifted and we need to get ahead. Counter-culture, anti-establishment, fronde, take-pride-in-being-different-for no-reason-at-all, underdogs now vote Green, not NDP. Issue Problematic: How to recapture our clientele? Solution: GREEN LITE. Changes in our attitude about environmental issues won't come from either the rich or the poor, but from the middle, where most meaningful change has always come from. Quote An education isn't how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It's being able to differentiate between what you do know and what you don't. Anatole France
Guest eureka Posted October 26, 2004 Report Posted October 26, 2004 Changed will not come in time,which is what I was referring to when MS answered with his post on asteroids. Economic modelling now predicts the collapse of the world economy by 2065 due to Global Warming. Many scientists are now saying it is too late: that we cannot now reverse the coming apocalypse. Are we actually now in the "End Days" so beloved of certain fundamentalists? Is the environmental damage that is looming and is far beyond anything the environmentalists concern themselves with about to swamp us? This is what I mean when I say a plague on the environmentalists. Should we not all be putting our concerns and support into whatever political party takes the future of humanity seriously? The Green Party does not fill the policy gap. The gap betwen rich and poor is my chief interest, globally and nationally as a social matter, but it pales beside the threat to humanity posed by our single minded concern with money and growth at all costs. Quote
Stoker Posted October 27, 2004 Report Posted October 27, 2004 Economic modelling now predicts the collapse of the world economy by 2065 due to Global Warming. Many scientists are now saying it is too late: that we cannot now reverse the coming apocalypse. Do you have a source? Quote The beaver, which has come to represent Canada as the eagle does the United States and the lion Britain, is a flat-tailed, slow-witted, toothy rodent known to bite off it's own testicles or to stand under its own falling trees. -June Callwood-
Guest eureka Posted October 27, 2004 Report Posted October 27, 2004 Actually, there is a new book recently out on this and the scientific aspects. I don't know what it is titled nor do I know the authors name. I had heard of this nut I heard an interview with the author just a week or so ago on CBC radio. I believe he is an American and he is scathing about the Bush administration that leads the only nation in the world to deny the problem. Quote
Stoker Posted October 27, 2004 Report Posted October 27, 2004 O-K You heard it from a guy on the CBC, who you don't remember his name and was writing a book which you don't remember the title..... I know of a guy that wrote a book (Don't ask me any names) that thinks you are full of it! Quote The beaver, which has come to represent Canada as the eagle does the United States and the lion Britain, is a flat-tailed, slow-witted, toothy rodent known to bite off it's own testicles or to stand under its own falling trees. -June Callwood-
Big Blue Machine Posted October 27, 2004 Report Posted October 27, 2004 How about the NDP leaving altogether? Quote And as I take man's last step from the surface, for now but we believe not too far into the future. I just like to say what I believe history will record that America's challenge on today has forged man's destiny of tomorrow. And as we leave the surface of Taurus-Littrow, we leave as we came and god willing we shall return with peace and hope for all mankind. Godspeed the crew of Apollo 17. Gene Cernan, the last man on the moon, December 1972.
daniel Posted October 27, 2004 Report Posted October 27, 2004 How about the NDP leaving altogether? There goes any hope of your pet project: Pay Equity. Quote
Guest eureka Posted October 27, 2004 Report Posted October 27, 2004 If anyone is full of anything, it is you. What you are not full of, though, is information or reasonong ability. Quote
Guest eureka Posted October 27, 2004 Report Posted October 27, 2004 If anyone is full of anything, it is you. What you are not full of, though, is information or reasoning ability. Quote
Cartman Posted October 27, 2004 Report Posted October 27, 2004 Though I believe that the average voter spends little time worrying about politics, I think that the NDP is perceived as interventionist in the wrong ways and too liberal in the wrong ways. Too interventionist. I suspect that many Canadians believe a vote for the NDP is a vote for greater taxation and greater bureaucracy with little value attached. This scares people. The NDP also scares people because of minority group support (i.e. affirmative action, pay equity, union support etc). Too liberal. The NDP is perceived as too liberal in terms of criminals, moral crusaders getting ready for the next riot against corporate Canada, hippies and homosexuals (gay marriage) etc. Conclusion? IMO, Joe/Joanne Canadian believes that a vote for the NDP is a vote for a really nice person ignorant of economics who wants to force you to spend your money on lazy whiners, overt homosexuals and tree huggers. As "they" say, the road to hell is paved with good intentions and led by New Democrats. Quote You will respect my authoritah!!
Big Blue Machine Posted October 28, 2004 Report Posted October 28, 2004 The NDP is simple communist. Quote And as I take man's last step from the surface, for now but we believe not too far into the future. I just like to say what I believe history will record that America's challenge on today has forged man's destiny of tomorrow. And as we leave the surface of Taurus-Littrow, we leave as we came and god willing we shall return with peace and hope for all mankind. Godspeed the crew of Apollo 17. Gene Cernan, the last man on the moon, December 1972.
Stoker Posted October 28, 2004 Report Posted October 28, 2004 If anyone is full of anything, it is you. What you are not full of, though, is information or reasoning ability. You claim that we are in the "end of days" and that the apocalypse is near, but yet you provide no proof. If I stated that Jack Layton was form Mars and came here to eat are children, I'm sure most would like to see some proof to such a wild and crazy claim. Wouldn't you? Quote The beaver, which has come to represent Canada as the eagle does the United States and the lion Britain, is a flat-tailed, slow-witted, toothy rodent known to bite off it's own testicles or to stand under its own falling trees. -June Callwood-
Guest eureka Posted October 28, 2004 Report Posted October 28, 2004 Why do you not learn to read before you enter debates? When you read and comprehend what I did say, let me know. Quote
daniel Posted October 28, 2004 Report Posted October 28, 2004 The NDP is simple communist. And the Common Sense Revolution is.... Quote
caesar Posted October 28, 2004 Report Posted October 28, 2004 How about the NDP leaving altogether? Why don't the conservatives????? Makes as much sense as your statement. Why should they; they do have significant support and many good ideas. Quote
Stoker Posted October 28, 2004 Report Posted October 28, 2004 I know how to read.........Infact, I'd very much like to read your source, thats why I asked for one. Quote The beaver, which has come to represent Canada as the eagle does the United States and the lion Britain, is a flat-tailed, slow-witted, toothy rodent known to bite off it's own testicles or to stand under its own falling trees. -June Callwood-
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.