socialist Posted November 19, 2014 Report Posted November 19, 2014 This is absolutely disgusting. Some of you who laugh and mock me about neo-liberalism need to read this to understand what is happening behind the scenes. If you read this, you should be truly disgusted as I am. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/16/koch-brothers-education_n_5587577.html?utm_hp_ref=tw Quote Thankful to have become a free thinker.
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 19, 2014 Report Posted November 19, 2014 Good for them...somebody has to grow up and pay all the taxes that fund welfare and "social justice". Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Ash74 Posted November 19, 2014 Report Posted November 19, 2014 Who am I to tell people how to spend their money. I may not agree with everything that is being taught but I have no issue with it. How is that any different than going for a union steward training course.(Course I was so hungover I could hardly hold my bladder and the instructor was still drunk) The union preaches nothing but making sure you file grievances and make the workplace a living hell. It is a political ideology. Its private money so why should you care? Quote “Show me a young Conservative and I'll show you someone with no heart. Show me an old Liberal and I'll show you someone with no brains.”― Winston S. Churchill There is no worse tyranny than to force a man to pay for what he does not want merely because you think it would be good for him. –Robert Heinlein
Mighty AC Posted November 19, 2014 Report Posted November 19, 2014 I have a problem with a political ideology being pushed in a public school system by a private source. This is no different than a church group preaching a religious ideology in public schools or the member socialist selling a 'social justice' message to students still too young to question it critically. Now, if Charlie Koch was offering start up capital and funding a class that simply stuck to teaching entrepreneurial skills, I would have no problem with it. However, like most church 'charity' I doubt he'd be interested if the opportunity to proselytize was removed. Quote "Our lives begin to end the day we stay silent about the things that matter." - Martin Luther King Jr"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities" - Voltaire
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 19, 2014 Report Posted November 19, 2014 There are plenty of publicly funded schools teaching political and religious ideology. Don't "separate schools" in some Canadian provinces and territories still receive public funding ? Public charter schools abound in the U.S. with many different "ideologies". Wiki says: ...The constitutionally provided mandate of a separate school jurisdiction and of a separate school is to provide education in a school setting that the separate school board considers reflective of Roman Catholic (or, rarely, Protestant) theology, doctrine, and practices. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Mighty AC Posted November 19, 2014 Report Posted November 19, 2014 There are plenty of publicly funded schools teaching political and religious ideology. Don't "separate schools" in some Canadian provinces and territories still receive public funding ? Public charter schools abound in the U.S. with many different "ideologies". Wiki says: ...The constitutionally provided mandate of a separate school jurisdiction and of a separate school is to provide education in a school setting that the separate school board considers reflective of Roman Catholic (or, rarely, Protestant) theology, doctrine, and practices. I am very opposed to spending public money on separate schools. It's embarrassing that we have allowed it to persist this long. Quote "Our lives begin to end the day we stay silent about the things that matter." - Martin Luther King Jr"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities" - Voltaire
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 19, 2014 Report Posted November 19, 2014 I am very opposed to spending public money on separate schools. It's embarrassing that we have allowed it to persist this long. OK, but it is part of the Constitution Act and subsequent legislation and court rulings. The Koch brothers can only wish they had it so good. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Mighty AC Posted November 19, 2014 Report Posted November 19, 2014 OK, but it is part of the Constitution Act and subsequent legislation and court rulings. The Koch brothers can only wish they had it so good.Education is a provincial responsibility and Quebec managed to easily obtain a constitutional amendment in the 90's, that allowed it to get rid of its Catholic school system. It will be done in Ontario, but politicians fear losing support by tackling it. A recent study showed that the province could save a couple billion dollars, by axing the separate system. With declining enrollment, declining Catholic population and limited resources I think it will be removed within 10 years. Quote "Our lives begin to end the day we stay silent about the things that matter." - Martin Luther King Jr"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities" - Voltaire
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 19, 2014 Report Posted November 19, 2014 That's all well and good, and may or may not happen, but in the meantime, it is quite silly to point at a much smaller scale effort by the Koch brothers (or any other private concern) when government(s) have mandated and fund exactly such circumstances for ideologies. What's next to be prevented in public schools....MADD....DARE...Anti-bullying campaigns....etc. ? Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
guyser Posted November 19, 2014 Report Posted November 19, 2014 What's next to be prevented in public schools....MADD....DARE...Anti-bullying campaigns....etc. ?Two of those three should never set foot inside schools. Anti-bullying campaigns can stay. MADD and DARE are just plain dumb let alone misguided and scammy. Quote
Ash74 Posted November 19, 2014 Report Posted November 19, 2014 Two of those three should never set foot inside schools. Anti-bullying campaigns can stay. MADD and DARE are just plain dumb let alone misguided and scammy. I thought I was the only one that has a hatred for MADD. Please don't believe I am in support of drunk driving but they have become prohibitionists. Quote “Show me a young Conservative and I'll show you someone with no heart. Show me an old Liberal and I'll show you someone with no brains.”― Winston S. Churchill There is no worse tyranny than to force a man to pay for what he does not want merely because you think it would be good for him. –Robert Heinlein
guyser Posted November 19, 2014 Report Posted November 19, 2014 I thought I was the only one that has a hatred for MADD. Please don't believe I am in support of drunk driving but they have become prohibitionists. Worse than that. I have no use for MADD, they collect a shiteload of money that pays their salaries and very little goes to what they say they do. Quote
Mighty AC Posted November 20, 2014 Report Posted November 20, 2014 That's all well and good, and may or may not happen, but in the meantime, it is quite silly to point at a much smaller scale effort by the Koch brothers (or any other private concern) when government(s) have mandated and fund exactly such circumstances for ideologies.Your country, quite rightly, does not publicly fund a parallel religious school system so your point here is ridiculous. Ideologies of the political, social or religious sort should not be forced on school children. Now if Charlie Koch wanted to open his own charter school, then I guess he could sell his uber right wing ideologies to his heart's content, but the public school system should not be used as a captive audience for any special interest group. Quote "Our lives begin to end the day we stay silent about the things that matter." - Martin Luther King Jr"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities" - Voltaire
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 20, 2014 Report Posted November 20, 2014 ...but the public school system should not be used as a captive audience for any special interest group. But it is and has been for a very long time. U.S. public schools have services and curriculum relationships with numerous private organizations and special interest groups. Why make an exception for the Koch brothers ? Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Shady Posted November 20, 2014 Report Posted November 20, 2014 But it is and has been for a very long time. U.S. public schools have services and curriculum relationships with numerous private organizations and special interest groups. Why make an exception for the Koch brothers ?Exactly. If anything they add some balance. Quote
Mighty AC Posted November 20, 2014 Report Posted November 20, 2014 But it is and has been for a very long time. U.S. public schools have services and curriculum relationships with numerous private organizations and special interest groups. Why make an exception for the Koch brothers ?The fact that they are not just providing funds, but also pushing an ideology. Many, many companies provide funds and equipment to schools, particularly tech programs, but do not influence the curriculum. If this Koch program removed the ultra-free market propaganda then it would be no different. Quote "Our lives begin to end the day we stay silent about the things that matter." - Martin Luther King Jr"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities" - Voltaire
Mighty AC Posted November 20, 2014 Report Posted November 20, 2014 Exactly. If anything they add some balance.LMAO! Spoken like a true Fox News personality. Quote "Our lives begin to end the day we stay silent about the things that matter." - Martin Luther King Jr"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities" - Voltaire
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 20, 2014 Report Posted November 20, 2014 The fact that they are not just providing funds, but also pushing an ideology. Many, many companies provide funds and equipment to schools, particularly tech programs, but do not influence the curriculum. If this Koch program removed the ultra-free market propaganda then it would be no different. This is patently false, as many vendors do influence curriculum (e.g. textbook authors and publishers). I should know....I presently work for the world's largest education and book publishing corporation, with BILLIONS in sales to U.S. primary and secondary education. So we get bias towards "sustainability", "climate change", "gender studies", "sexuality equality", yada, yada, yada. Further to that end, education labour unions also get their crack at that huge pot of money. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Argus Posted November 20, 2014 Report Posted November 20, 2014 (edited) This is absolutely disgusting. Some of you who laugh and mock me about neo-liberalism need to read this to understand what is happening behind the scenes. If you read this, you should be truly disgusted as I am. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/16/koch-brothers-education_n_5587577.html?utm_hp_ref=tw How is this any different from your own stated desire to force Leftist beliefs on helpless children at school? Edited November 20, 2014 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted November 20, 2014 Report Posted November 20, 2014 Who am I to tell people how to spend their money. I may not agree with everything that is being taught but I have no issue with it. How is that any different than going for a union steward training course.(Course I was so hungover I could hardly hold my bladder and the instructor was still drunk) The union preaches nothing but making sure you file grievances and make the workplace a living hell. It is a political ideology. Its private money so why should you care? It's entirely different in that we're talking about school children here. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted November 20, 2014 Report Posted November 20, 2014 I have a problem with a political ideology being pushed in a public school system by a private source. I have a problem with ideology being pushed on children from any source. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted November 20, 2014 Report Posted November 20, 2014 Two of those three should never set foot inside schools. Anti-bullying campaigns can stay. MADD and DARE are just plain dumb let alone misguided and scammy. What's wrong with MADD? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted November 20, 2014 Report Posted November 20, 2014 Exactly. If anything they add some balance. Propaganda is not balance, especially when delivered to school children. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
guyser Posted November 20, 2014 Report Posted November 20, 2014 What's wrong with MADD?They are no longer anti-drunk driving advocates, they are anti any driving after a drink. They pushed for the dumb law of 0.05BAC. They colllect a ton of money, and pay themselves half of it. Quote
socialist Posted November 20, 2014 Author Report Posted November 20, 2014 How is this any different from your own stated desire to force Leftist beliefs on helpless children at school? Because I desire to promote a fair, inclusive society where diversity is tolerated and celebrated. That's why. Quote Thankful to have become a free thinker.
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