The Yazidi still seem to be in trouble on Mt. Sinjar, contrary to clai

[marcus]

You missed the point entirely. Other conflicts with many times more killed, injured, and displaced don't seem to bother you as much. Why ?

No. You missed the point. My government is not supporting these conflicts and enabling them.

[jbg]

No. You missed the point. My government is not supporting these conflicts and enabling them.

I get it. So you'll support the Jews when they get into as extreme distress as the Yatzidis are?

[bush_cheney2004]

No. You missed the point. My government is not supporting these conflicts and enabling them.

Yes it is...and yes it has. Documented in many other MLW threads.

[GostHacked]

I agree with you. Most of those outraged by Israel's unintentional killings in what the Arabs readily admit is a war don't want Israel there at all.

Destroying hi-rise buildings and leveling entire neighborhoods seems very intentional to me.

[jbg]

Destroying hi-rise buildings and leveling entire neighborhoods seems very intentional to me.

What choice did Israel have when military facilities were placed in those buildings?

[Rue]

There's that silence again. Say now its interesting how that works. Every time someone accuses Israel of being deliberate thy get silent when one asks, so what would you have suggested they do.

Um uh um uh um uh um uh say I know they should have acted proportionally whatever the phack that means.

As for you Marcus just what government is your government, you know the one you call "my"?

[marcus]

What choice did Israel have when military facilities were placed in those buildings?

They weren't. Repeating the same propaganda over and over doesn't make it truth. Well, sort of. The Hasbara has managed to make people think that Israel has targeted and flattened buildings only because of militants. The UN confirmed several times that there were no rockets or militants in the buildings they gave their coordinates to, several times.

By the way, even if there are militants there, it is against the law to collectively punish civilians because there are militants there. It's as simple as that.

Another by the way: It turns out that the IDF has used old footage from their carnage, two wars ago and tried using it in this war to justify bombing a hospital:

Exclusive: Israel's Video Justifying Destruction of a Gaza Hospital Was From 2009

A video distributed by the Israeli military in July suggesting that Palestinian fighters had fired from the Al Wafa Rehabilitation and Geriatric Hospital in Gaza City was not shot during the recent Israeli attack on Gaza, and both audio and video clips were manipulated to cover up the fact that they were from entirely different incidents, a Truthout investigation has revealed.

The video, released by the Israel Defense Forces (IDF) on July 23, the same day Israeli airstrikes destroyed Al Wafa, was widely reported by pro-Israeli publications and websites as proving that the hospital was destroyed because Hamas had turned the hospital into a military facility. But the video clip showing apparent firing from an annex to the hospital was actually shot during Israel's 2008-09 "Operation Cast Lead," and the audio clip accompanying it was from an incident unrelated to Al Wafa.

The misleading video was only the last in a series of IDF dissimulations about Al Wafa hospital that included false claims that Hamas rockets had been launched from the hospital grounds, or very near it, and that the hospital had been damaged by an attack on the launching site.

Israelis manipulating the truth? Imagine my total lack of surprise.

Edited September 9, 2014 by marcus

[bush_cheney2004]

Israelis manipulating the truth? Imagine my total lack of surprise.

...because Hamas is always truthful and forthcoming, right ?

[marcus]

...because Hamas is always truthful and forthcoming, right ?

Hamas is easy to criticize, but one thing you can't criticize them for is how they own up to anything they do. They always proudly announce rocket attacks. They claim any attacks they have done. They don't play the slimy car salesman game that Israel plays, where they'll do whatever it takes to make a sale.

Edited September 9, 2014 by marcus

[bush_cheney2004]

Hamas is easy to criticize, but one thing you can't criticize them for is how they own up to anything they do. ....

What ? I can't criticize Hamas for proudly announcing acts of terrorism ? OK...then Israel can continue to proudly bomb them.

[Rue]

Marcus you continuing apologies for Hamas is not very Canadian of you.

[marcus]

What ? I can't criticize Hamas for proudly announcing acts of terrorism ? OK...then Israel can continue to proudly bomb them.

Who said you can't criticize Hamas? Are you catching a bit of Rue-syndrome and interpreting fairly straight forward comments into something totally different?

You said that Hamas lies like Israel does and I corrected you by saying that Hamas has no problem admitting to doing what they do.

[Rue]

Rue Syndrome. I have had a medical phenomena named after moi.

I have of course always wanted to be considered inflammatory.

Now that I am irritating y our bowels Marcus let me spell it out-you live in a world so selectively bias in favour of Hamas you have now taken to absolute false statements about them.

Hamas has never admitted to doing what they do. In fact their entire m.o. is to never admit what they do

To start with they deny they engage in terrorism.

Secondly the very method of operations they use never admits what they have done.

I am not sure what fantasy world you live in but Hamas has never telecast what it has done, does, and will do.

The very essence of its operation is to mislead and deceive. It is a crucial tactic. Its used disinformation so much no one except you would

be so absurd as to come on any forum and state what you did.

Continue Marcus with the pr for Hamas. Its hilarious.

[marcus]

I am right and you are, as usual, wrong.

Here is a list of just a few instances where Hamas has claimed responsibility.

Select Hamas Terrorist Attacks Against Israel

August 31, 2010: Four Israelis, including a pregnant woman, were murdered when terrorists ambushed their car as they were driving near Kiryat Arba in the West Bank. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack

March 14, 2004: Ten people were killed and 16 wounded in a double suicide bombing in the area of the Ashdod Port. Hamas and Fatah claimed responsibility for the attack.

January 14, 2004: A female suicide bomber killed four people and wounded 20 at the Erez Crossing in the Gaza Strip. Hamas and the Fatah Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades claimed responsibility for the attack.

September 9, 2003: Hamas claimed responsibility for two suicide bombings, the first at an entrance to the Tzrifin army base near Rishon Lezion

August 19, 2003: Hamas and Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the suicide bombing of a bus in Jerusalem killing at least 18 people and wounding nearly 100.

Hamas claimed to have carried out the Ariel attack.

Palestinian terrorists near Ofra, north of Ramallah. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack.

The bomber was disguised as an ultra-orthodox Jew. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack.

wounding three Israeli soldiers. Hamas claimed responsibility.

The Palestinian detonated his explosives, killing only himself. Hamas claimed responsibility in both attacks.

May 17, 2003: A pregnant Israeli woman and her husband were killed when a suicide bomber detonated himself next to them in a public square in Hebron. Hamas claimed responsibility.

The Fatah Tanzim and Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack, carried out as a joint operation.

attacked during Shabbat. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack.

I hope you get the point and I hope you stop challenging the truth. And there is more instances where Hamas has claimed responsibility.

[marcus]

Moving to another thread.

Edited September 11, 2014 by marcus

[Solidarity]

Sorry to sound like a dick, but couldn't this discussion be confined to an Israel or Gaza conflict thread?

_____

For those interested in following the events regarding the Yezidi's I would recommend rudaw English news, a Kurdistan based news organization. The most extensive coverage and up to date news regarding Iraqi/Kurdish affairs that I have found.

http://rudaw.net/english

[Big Guy]

...

For those interested in following the events regarding the Yezidi's I would recommend rudaw English news, a Kurdistan based news organization. The most extensive coverage and up to date news regarding Iraqi/Kurdish affairs that I have found.

http://rudaw.net/english

Thanks for the link. An informative, timely and specific reference site.

[Rue]

I am right and you are, as usual, wrong.

Here is a list of just a few instances where Hamas has claimed responsibility.

Select Hamas Terrorist Attacks Against Israel

August 31, 2010: Four Israelis, including a pregnant woman, were murdered when terrorists ambushed their car as they were driving near Kiryat Arba in the West Bank. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack

March 14, 2004: Ten people were killed and 16 wounded in a double suicide bombing in the area of the Ashdod Port. Hamas and Fatah claimed responsibility for the attack.

January 14, 2004: A female suicide bomber killed four people and wounded 20 at the Erez Crossing in the Gaza Strip. Hamas and the Fatah Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades claimed responsibility for the attack.

September 9, 2003: Hamas claimed responsibility for two suicide bombings, the first at an entrance to the Tzrifin army base near Rishon Lezion

August 19, 2003: Hamas and Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the suicide bombing of a bus in Jerusalem killing at least 18 people and wounding nearly 100.

Hamas claimed to have carried out the Ariel attack.

Palestinian terrorists near Ofra, north of Ramallah. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack.

The bomber was disguised as an ultra-orthodox Jew. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack.

wounding three Israeli soldiers. Hamas claimed responsibility.

The Palestinian detonated his explosives, killing only himself. Hamas claimed responsibility in both attacks.

May 17, 2003: A pregnant Israeli woman and her husband were killed when a suicide bomber detonated himself next to them in a public square in Hebron. Hamas claimed responsibility.

The Fatah Tanzim and Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack, carried out as a joint operation.

attacked during Shabbat. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack.

I hope you get the point and I hope you stop challenging the truth. And there is more instances where Hamas has claimed responsibility.

You clearly do not understand the difference betweenadmission, culpability and responsibility. Zip over your head yet again.

First off do you really think these are the only attacks Hamas has engaged in and they disclose all their attacks?

Get real. They release admissions such as the above if they think it will instill fear and loathing. That's what terrorists do. When they fail, they remain silent.

Now let's try put it in even simpler words for you to understand because I doubt what I just said can penetrate your cognitive processing.

Admitting you did something, does not necessaruly mean you accept responsibility for the consequences of what you did. You present them as if they are one and the same. They are not.

You once again not only miss the point I made but show you are unable to see the difference between admitting you did something and taking responsibility for what you did.

Until you do, this discussion zip zam zam soars over your head.

Tell me Marcus, where in one of those admissions you have posted did Hamas take responsibility for what it did? In fact it did the exact opposite...in each and every one of those acts it blamed Israel saying Israel was responsible for them. How about you read what Hamas actually stated and states in its admissions.

When it says it does something it then completes its announcement with it did it because its Israel's fault (responsibility for it having happened).

Read the full admission Marcus. Your attempt to cut off the full response is b.s.

Edited September 11, 2014 by Rue

[Rue]

Now you want to know what Hamas says Marcus. You really want to spin that they admit what they are...Jew haters? Lol. Show me a quote from them that they claim they are terrorists and Jew haters. You won't find any. What you will find however is plenty of evidence for their beliefs such as these statements:

source: a sermon delivered by 'Atallah Abu Al-Subh, former Hamas minister of culture, which aired on Al-Aqsa TV, April 8, 2011

"Whoever is killed by a Jew receives the reward of two martyrs, because the very thing that the Jews did to the prophets was done to him.

"The Jews are the most despicable and contemptible nation to crawl upon the face of the Earth, because they have displayed hostility to Allah.

"Allah will kill the Jews in the hell of the world to come, just like they killed the believers in the hell of this world.

"The Jews kill anyone who believes in Allah. They do not want to see any peace whatsoever on Earth."

source: Hamas official Halil Al-Hayya, Al-Hayat newspaper, November 11, 2010

"The lie of the Zionist Holocaust crumbles with countless holocausts committed by the Zionists in Beit Hanoun, al-Fakhoura school and other places in Palestine."

"Palestine is Islamic, and not an Islamic emirate, from the river to the sea, that unites the Palestinians. Jews have no right in it, with the exception of those who lived on the land of Palestine before World War I."

source:Hamas leader Mahmoud Al-Zahhar, Future News TV, June 15, 2010

"We have liberated Gaza, but have we recognized Israel? Have we given up our lands occupied in 1948? We demand the liberation of the West Bank, and the establishment of a state in the West Bank and Gaza, with Jerusalem as its capital – but without recognizing [israel]. This is the key – without recognizing the Israeli enemy on a single inch of land...

"Our plan for this stage is to liberate any inch of Palestinian land, and to establish a state on it. Our ultimate plan is [to have] Palestine in its entirety. I say this loud and clear so that nobody will accuse me of employing political tactics. We will not recognize the Israeli enemy. "

Now please Marcus by all means. Show me one comment by one member of Hamas where they state-we are Jew haters, we are terrorists and we accept the fact we are terrorists. Right.

How about this one Marcus-here's an admission by a former Hamas member:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KakxXN5Z-XI

You really think he would admit to this if he was still in Hamas?

Let's really put it on the line Marcus.

When Hamas leader, Saleh al-Arouri, oannounced that the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades kidnapped three youths in the West Bank. at a a conference organized by the World Association of Muslim Scholars in Turkey he stated and I quote:

“It was a heroic act of the Izz al-Din al-Qassam,” said Al-Arui “that kidnapped three Israeli settlers in Hebron.”

You call that taking responsibility? You call kidnapping and killing 3 youth heroic accepting responsibility?

Save your propaganda Marcus. Hamas admits to being terrorists yes, but restates it as being heroic.

Save the crap for someone else.

Now since Big Guy is so concerned about the Yazadi how about you go back to the Yazadi and explain why ISIS is wiping them out.

How about you also explain how ISIS is heroic and how they are affiliated with the heroic Hamas. Does your script allow for that or do you

need to get the "information desk" to prepare a new script for you?

[bush_cheney2004]

Who said you can't criticize Hamas? Are you catching a bit of Rue-syndrome and interpreting fairly straight forward comments into something totally different?

I don't think so.....Hamas is a terrorist organization....bomb them...often. It's not complicated.

[jbg]

Sorry to sound like a dick, but couldn't this discussion be confined to an Israel or Gaza conflict thread?

For once I agree with Marcus. The presence of the discussion shows the world's hypocrisy. Very little concern for the Yatzidis. Lots of concerns for the "Palestinians."

[Rue]

According to the Egyptian newspaper Al-Masry Al-Youm, (which is basically the mouthpiece for its government) Egyptian security forces arrested fifteen ISIS terrorists who tried to enter Sinai from the Gaza Strip.

In fact it is believed Hamas facilitated the infiltration of the ISIS terrorists into Egypt so that they could carry out a terrorist attack against Egyptians.

The report also said that the terrorists had been entrusted with establishing terror cells and branches of ISIS in Egypt.

Hamas was receiving virtually all its funding and military equipment from Iran and Hezbollah. When both found out Hamas was making contact with ISIS. they apparently cut their aid and this was one major reason Hamas stopped its latest jihad with Israel.

Hamas is an offshoot of the Sunni Muslim Brotherhood that backs ISIS now. The cell that controls Hamas was pro Assad and funded by Assad of Syria, Hezbollah and Iran so Hamas is facing an internal dilemma. Although it is a Sunni terrorist group, it relied 100% on Assad, Iran and Hezbollah the enemy of the Muslim Brotherhood and ISIS.

The Middle East is now in a Sunni v.s. Shiite civil war.

ISIS in fact believes Hamas is “too moderate” and is not doing enough to destroy Israel.

In June of 2014, Hamas sent in its armed men to disperse a rally organized by ISIS followers in the Gaza Strip celebrating “military victories of the terrorist group in Iraq.

Hamas prevented local journalists from covering the event because it officially denies the existence of ISIS in the Gaza Strip but videos got out.

One of several videos coming out of Gaza since January of 2014 on You Tube shows masked armed men declaring their allegiance to ISIS.

At the funeral of two Islamists killed by the IDF at the end of June, 2014 in Gaza, funeral-goers carried flags and banners of ISIS.

One of the reasons Morsi was removed and arrested was because of his Muslim Brotherhood's attempt to embrace ISIS not Hamas and bring them into the Gaza to replace the Assad-Iran-Hezbollah controlled Hamas.

At one basic level today's Hamas and ISIS are not connected. Hamas is controlled by Iran the dead enemy of ISIS.

On another level however, both groups equally hate the West and see it necessessary to create a one world Mulsim state starting with the eradication of the world's Jews. Their informal mutual presence now in Gaza might blow into a civil war between the two or more likely what is probably going to happen is ISIS will swallow up Hamas, rid it of any Shiite connection and would expand its war not just in Iraq and Syria, but to Israel, Lebanon and Jordan and even Egypt.

ISIS is at war with anyone that is not considered a true believer, i.e., its version of a Sunni Muslim and this brings us back to the Kurds, Zoroastreans, Bahaiis, Druze, Assyrians, Berbers, Alawite, Shiite, Christians and the Yazadi not just Jews they are at war with.

Some argue Hamas is only a nationalist group. It's not. Its a radical Muslim religious group as well. However it tempered down its Sunni beliefs to accommodate Iranian and Hezbollah backing.

Hezbollah make no mistake is a religious entity not just a terrorist entity and so is ISIS. Their beliefs are fueled by their interpretations of Muslim beliefs which they do not seperate from their political and national beliefs. .

The Yazadi are about .5 million people. They are most likely to speak Kurdish because they live in the Mosul region of Northern Iraq which is the area where the Kurds live. They also could be found in Syria, Georgia and Armenia but a lot migrated to Germany and because they are secretive as to who they are no one would think they were anything but maybe Kurds or Arabs.

They probably come from India and are related to the Zoroastreans who it is believed is where Judaism finds its roots, and of course if you trace Zoroastreanism back to India, its ancestors are probably the same ancestors as those who started Hinduism/Jainism.

They worship one God through 7 angels of whom the no.1 angel is Melek Taus also called Shaytan and he is symbolized with a snake and Peacock and so the Muslims think he is their Satan.

The Arch Angel Melek Taus is supposed to be God's caretaker of the world allowing BOTH good and bad to happen.

Their religion has strong similiarities to Sufism and their belief in the angel Iblis.

ISIS and their radical Sunni followers as well as Hezbollah and their radical Shiite followers consider Yazadi or Yezidii as heretics condemned to hell for worshipping Satan.

Turkey Iran, Hezbollah and ISIS dislike them the same way they dislike Kurds. In that sense they are considered no different than the Kurds-non Muslims who are infidel.

What this thread did not properly discuss is that because extremist Muslim fundamentalism whether its Shiite or Sunni in origin are both equally as violent and intolerant in their treatment of non Muslims, the extermination of Yazidi was inevitable.

If you subscribe to a religion that tells you non Muslims (and by that I mean the particular kind of Muslim of the particular terror group) are infidel and not worthy, you demonize them. In the case of the Yazidi they were literally demonized. They are thought of by Muslims as they do Jews, evil demons destined to hell and they are considered similiar to the shape shifting demon Jews of Mel Gibson's movie The Passion.

The ISIS war is not just against Shiites, but anyone and everyone who does not subscribe to their kind of Sunnism and that may result in a juggernaut of attacks on not just Syria and inside Iraq, but cause a spill over into Lebanon, Egypt, Israel, Jordan, Yemen, Oman.

Saudi Arbia and Oman right now finance ISIS with Turkey and Barry Hussein Obama is doing a Michael Jackson back dance from ISIS trying to distance himself from it. Good luck to Hilary Clinton as well because the two of them sat while their ally ISIS in Libya slowly tortured and killed their ambassador and then covered it up. I guarantee you the tapes will surface during the next election if Hilary tries to run.

Obama got into bed with Morsi, Erdogan a dthe origins of ISIS to dispose of Ghaddafi and when Morsi was in power in Egypt, Obama pushed his alliance with the Muslim Brotherhood (Morsi-Erdogan) who he hoped would curry him favour with ISIS and believing ISIS was now his friend-he and his buddy Erdogan trained and financed them in Turkey to attack Assad not realizing they would also attack Hezbollah and Iran. Oopsy Barry do you not know what a back-draft is when you set a fire. Clearly not and Obama was burned.

.

Obama did not gave a damn about the Sudanese or the moderate Sunnis and Christians in Syria or the Coptic Christians in Egypt or when the Kurds were being wiped out by an Iran-Turkey-Russian coalition, but the massacre of Yazadi finally struck someone's fancy.

Do I think its out of concern for the Yazadi? No. I think what has happened is ISIS who Obama was only too happy to have sex with to get rid of Ghaddafi had by then turned on him badly and forced him to do something to save face before Putin ridiculing him in Europe.

The problem is if he wipesISIS out now he wil create a power vacuum that will enable Iran and Hezbollah as well as Russia to come out even more powerful than before in the Middle Easty.

Obama is too tainted to undo the mess he made, so he has barked like a horny chiuaua dog last night. Its his last gasp.

Hopefully it placates Democrats who want to get re-elected. I doubt it will. The thing about Obama is he is no warrior who can lead a warrior nation. He's a skinny effiminate man who does not inspire toughness or assertive leadership.

So I think we will have a Reoublican back lash coming into congress and then a Republican President. I think the US craves a man not a transvestite in office, I think they want someone who fills up his pant legs and looks like he can fart without having to say excuse me ten times to everyone and anyone.

I then predict that this new President will resurrect an alliance now abandon, between Egypt, Israel, Jordan, the UAE and Saudi Arabia and th will try focus on trying to regain influence over Syria and Iraq.

I do believe Iran is ripe for an internal civil war and so is Turkey by pro Western progressives fed up with fundamentalist Islam and looking for a strong US leader who will not kiss Muslim Brotherhood ass and help them.

I also think in the next two to three years Russia faces severe food shortages and Putin may find the mob deposing of him to prevent a genuine revolution of the poor masses he is paying lip service to with his Hitler Stalinist routine.

As for Iraq, its a travesty. The US spent over 3 trillion. For what? It exposed brave men and women to hardship and death for what?

To put in Maliki an anti-Sunni, Shiite in power no different then that rat they placed in Afghanistan?

China and Russia are now the biggest extractors of oil from Iraq thanks to Maliki.

Why?

What the hell was Obama thinking putting an Iranian proxy in Iraq and turning his back on moderate Sunnis in Iraq and Syria in favour of the Muslim Brotherhood and Erdogan and Morsi? He alienated the moderate Sunni world thereby empowering its extremisrts like Al Quaeda and the Muslim Brotherhood. His out and out siding with Hamas in the last fiasco sending Kerry to sabotage a peace treaty did nothing but prolong the war another month and the exact same treaty Kerry tried to undo was agreed to.

The very people craving change in Egypt warned they did not want Morsi and he ignored them. He sucked up to Morsi when the majority of Egyptians did not want him or a military regime but were craving a non corupt non religious civilian leader.

Well Egypt is now a military state and if not, ISIS and Hamas would have caused a catastrophe. That same military regime has neutralized Erdogan's extremist attempt to lead the Middle East showing once again, Egypt, not Turkey is the leader of the Muslim Middle East.

Egypt and Jordan and Israel are sitting it out as the rest of the region shoots at itself and isn't it ironic these three nations are the only ones with a peace treaty.

Edited September 11, 2014 by Rue

[bush_cheney2004]

.....As for Iraq, its a travesty. The US spent over 3 billion. It exposed brave men and women to hardship and death for what? To put in Maliki an anti-Sunni, Shiite? To allow now China and Russia to be the biggest extractors of oil from Iraq? Why?

VP Cheney answered that question many years ago: The world can have terrorism with access to MidEast oil resources, or the world can have terrorism without access to those same resources. Over 80,000,000 barrels are consumed per day, and more production out of Iraq is part of growing global production for a global market.

Blood is renewable.....petroleum is not.

[On Guard for Thee]

Yeah we all heard Bush talking about how the Iraq war would be "self financing" thru the oil. That was about as ridiculous as the "Mission Accomplished" banner.