Russell Brand Revolution

[Michael Hardner]

... if you do even a tiny bit of research you can watch the money supply explode after convertability ended.

What year are you referring to ?

The only thing left to argue about is how big a part this played compared to other things.

That's a pretty big thing to argue about.

Most of this trade would have been impossible on permanent money. Remember for decades the expansion of global trade consisted mostly of real goods going in one direction and only bits of paper and electronic spreadsheet entries going in the other.

'bits of paper' being money, bonds, and so on.

Think of it this way... if you suddenly had the power to print as much money as you wanted, I would imagine that you would see a rapid increase in the flow of goods to your house from neighbors, vendors etc. "Trade" would definately increase would it not?

Of course, but you're leaving out the fact that everything has to be paid back and risk has to be assessed.

Do you at least agree that it would have been hard or impossible for the US and other countries to run the kind of huge trade deficits you are talking about without monetary expansion? What would they have traded for all these goods?

I think that easy credit does cause more trade, yes. The same people who lend you the money have to factor in a record number of defaults as well.

No... trade and commerce have been around for centuries. whats new is the capacity to run large trade deficits, and THAT is what has underpinned "globalism" so far. Every single country running trade deficits is racking up a huge and corresponding debt. It might feel to you like you can suddenly get stuff for next to nothing, but all you are doing is passing on your bills to your children and grand children.

The economic landscape is complex, and when you attribute a single factor as being largely responsible for change, I get suspicious. When you post statements like this, my mind reels with questions. For example, the US largely reduced the budget deficit during the Clinton administration, yet trade with China was soaring.

the machinations and the consequences of the debt money system are supported by a significant portion of the worlds economists including entire schools of economic thought, and they are written about by bankers and people inside the reserve system as well.

...

having to switch back and forth from money backed by various commodities to money backed by nothing more than government decree and legal tender laws.

If the actions of banks are understood, and even supported by economic theory then doesn't that undercut the idea that these are 'machinations' ? ie. that somebody is manipulating the system for something other than the greater good ?

I'm also suspicious of people who use the post-2008 period as proof of anything, kind of like using 1929-1939 as foundation for some economic idea when it's a once in a lifetime event.

[GostHacked]

No its nothing like that at all. Our monetary system has well documented rules that produce direct and objectively verifiable consequences.Unlike the idea that Dick Cheney organized 911 which is believed by a few quacks, the machinations and the consequences of the debt money system are supported by a significant portion of the worlds economists including entire schools of economic thought, and they are written about by bankers and people inside the reserve system as well. And unlike 911 truthers we have a historical record of dozens of such non-permanent money systems crashing and civilizations having to switch back and forth from money backed by various commodities to money backed by nothing more than government decree and legal tender laws.

Have you been listening to Bruce McCarthy by chance??

[GostHacked]

How the Canadian education continually fails us!

Here math noob, maybe this link will help you:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exponential_function

Edit: btw, I also live in Ottawa. If you are looking for a math tutor please do not hesitate to ask.

Edit 2: Seriously, I need the employment, lol.

Exponential is where the number is multiplied by itself. 4% to the power of 1 is 4%, 4, to the power of two is 16. Are you being taught math by socialist at all?

[GostHacked]

But does capitalism need exponential growth? Doesn't it just need growth, period? Western countries with highly developed economies have growing GDP per capita around 1-2% growth per year (compared to ie: China which is somewhere around 8% growth per year in the last decade or so). As long as profit continues, isn't that enough for the system to continue?

Some of these profits are tied directly to natural resources. If oil dried up tomorrow, what happens then? Then think of any natural resource we depend on and if we see growth as good, the natural resource better grow with us. That is obviously not the case, so we will reach a tipping point soon, if it has not happened already.

[Michael Hardner]

Exponential is where the number is multiplied by itself.

Yes, but exponential growth means that the growth rate is based on the current size...

You are talking about exponents in general, not exponential growth.

[-1=e^ipi]

Yes, but exponential growth means that the growth rate is based on the current size...

Nah, it means that the growth rate is constant, while the first derivative is proportional to the zeroth derivative. But you are basically right.

@GhostHacked - we are talking about the GDP per capita growing exponentially, not the growth rate growing exponentially. I have never encountered a situation (empirical or theoretical) in economics where you have an exponential growth rate.

[Wilber]

1% growth every year, year after year, is exponential. So is 0.1% or 0.00001%.

If we were speaking of interest, the term would be compound.

[dre]

Have you been listening to Bruce McCarthy by chance??

No, Im not sure who that is, or at least I wasnt until I just googled him.

[GostHacked]

No, Im not sure who that is, or at least I wasnt until I just googled him.

Some of your words were much in line with him.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4Zp4DG_JfzT44nb82Ogna0sygc_R2jf7