Alberta Pleads Keystone XL Case in NYT Ad

[Shady]

Shockingly, that may not happen. Looks like we are at a tipping point!http://www.thestarphoenix.com/touch/story.html?id=8745872 Democrats and independents would like to see a rapid move towards renewables and a rapid move away from fossil fuels and Republicans would like to see a rapid move towards renewables but a much slower move away from fossil fuels," he said.

Until recently, Obama's policy has been to support both renewables and fossil fuels with equal vigour. Maibach's polling, however, may have swung the pendulum over to clean energy."I actually think that the president is catching up with public opinion," he said.

This grassroots, green revolution has given Obama the voter support to claim in stark terms - as he did this week - that projects such as the Keystone XL pipeline do not automatically fit into America's vision of a greener future and job creation. It allows him to use Keystone XL as an anvil upon which he can pound out his message that jobs and economic revival are not to be found in a pipeline designed to transport "dirty oil" from Canada's oilsands for decades to come.In other words, attacking Keystone suddenly makes political sense, Maibach said.

No, it makes little political sense. All polls show a vast majority of Americans support the project.

[Argus]

What relationship?

Yeah, there isn't even an American ambassador to Canada. From what the Ottawa Citizen reported the other day, US ambassadors are appointed based on how much of a bribe they pay to the sitting government... oh, excuse me, how much funds they raise for the sitting government, and none of the 'fundraisers' seem eager to be ambassador to Canada. Not romantic or exotic enough, I suspect.

Former president Richard Nixon testified to a grand jury in 1975 about “commitments” to sell ambassadorships to campaign donors. He claimed it was normal practice and that he always made sure that the sale was to somebody qualified enough not “to disgrace the United States.”

If they're not a 'disgrace' they're good enough to be the US ambassador. I'm starting to understand why the US makes so many odd foreign policy decisions...

http://o.canada.com/2013/07/31/at-what-price-a-u-s-ambassadorship-to-canada/

Edited August 4, 2013 by Argus

[jacee]

No, it makes little political sense. All polls show a vast majority of Americans support the project.

Link?

[Guest American Woman]

Shady, on 04 Aug 2013 - 10:03 AM, said:

No, it makes little political sense. All polls show a vast majority of Americans support the project.

Link?

Just for starters:

Americans Support the Keystone XL Pipeline by Wide Margin

Americans Favor Keystone XL Pipeline

As Obama weighs his decision, most Americans support building Keystone pipeline

Survey shows most Americans support Keystone XL pipeline

[Smallc]

I can't believe what it looks like Obama is going to do. I didn't even think it was remote possibility.

[jacee]

Just for starters:

Americans Support the Keystone XL Pipeline by Wide Margin

Americans Favor Keystone XL Pipeline

As Obama weighs his decision, most Americans support building Keystone pipeline

Survey shows most Americans support Keystone XL pipeline

1) Biased question

2) 2012

3) ok

4) " by the American Petroleum Institute."

What we have seen regarding energy policy is that almost all Americansregardless of their political orientation are decidedly for clean energy future for America," said Edward Maibach, a professor at George Mason University who tracks public opinion on climate change.

His data have given U.S. President Barack Obama and his closest advisers the renewed confidence to go bold on clean energy, and dismiss projects such as Keystone XL as old economics.

Well I guess it depends who you quote, but you can bet that Obama will go with the Dem flow.

Edited August 4, 2013 by jacee

[Smallc]

Too bad Obama and those people are wrong. Oil will be here for a very long time, no matter how fast we move towards other energy sources.

[Guest American Woman]

What we have seen regarding energy policy is that almost all Americansregardless of their political orientation are decidedly for clean energy future for America," said Edward Maibach, a professor at George Mason University who tracks public opinion on climate change.His data have given U.S. President Barack Obama and his closest advisers the renewed confidence to go bold on clean energy, and dismiss projects such as Keystone XL as old economics.

Well

Polls prove Maibach wrong regarding the pipeline and I doubt whether Obama is ignorant of the polls. Edited August 4, 2013 by American Woman

[jacee]

Polls prove Maibach wrong regarding the pipeline and I doubt whether Obama is ignorant of the polls.

I expect he's far ahead in accurately interpreting the polls:

His politicos will be looking for polls from unbiased sources that follow the trend in the evolution of public thinking, not industry PR push polls and last year's data.

[Guest American Woman]

I expect he's far ahead in accurately interpreting the polls:

His politicos will be looking for polls from unbiased sources that follow the trend in the evolution of public thinking, not industry PR push polls and last year's data.

Every poll shows strong American support for the pipeline. I haven't seen one that shows otherwise. If you can show me polls "from an unbiased source" that say differently, I would appreciate a link to them. Or even one, for that matter.

The polls consistantly show that most Americans support this pipeline. Obama may not care about the polls, but the polls do show support - and that includes the most recent. I've never seen a poll that shows otherwise. Here are some more:

Survey: Americans overwhelmingly support Keystone XL pipeline

http://newsok.com/survey-americans-overwhelmingly-support-keystone-xl-pipeline/article/3841664

Americans overwhelmingly support Keystone XL pipeline despite environmental risks, poll claims

http://business.financialpost.com/2013/07/17/keystone-xl-pipeline-support/?__lsa=a776-538b

Harris Poll: 82% of Americans Believe Keystone XL is in the National Interest.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/brighammccown/2013/06/07/keystone-approval-rate-reaches-new-high/

Bottom Line: Americans Support the Keystone XL Pipeline by Wide Margin

http://businessroundtable.org/news-center/bottom-line-americans-support-the-keystone-xl-pipeline-by-wide-margin/

Edited August 4, 2013 by American Woman

[jacee]

Every poll shows strong American support for the pipeline. I haven't seen one that shows otherwise. If you can show me polls "from an unbiased source" that say differently, I would appreciate a link to them. Or even one, for that matter.

The polls consistantly show that most Americans support this pipeline. Obama may not care about the polls, but the polls do show support - and that includes the most recent. I've never seen a poll that shows otherwise. Here are some more:

Survey: Americans overwhelmingly support Keystone XL pipeline

http://newsok.com/survey-americans-overwhelmingly-support-keystone-xl-pipeline/article/3841664

Americans overwhelmingly support Keystone XL pipeline despite environmental risks, poll claims

http://business.financialpost.com/2013/07/17/keystone-xl-pipeline-support/?__lsa=a776-538b

Harris Poll: 82% of Americans Believe Keystone XL is in the National Interest.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/brighammccown/2013/06/07/keystone-approval-rate-reaches-new-high/

Bottom Line: Americans Support the Keystone XL Pipeline by Wide Margin

http://businessroundtable.org/news-center/bottom-line-americans-support-the-keystone-xl-pipeline-by-wide-margin/

Ya the industry is really pushing the polls since Obama is signaling he may not approve Keystone.

No surprise there.

[Smallc]

Ya the industry is really pushing the polls since Obama is signaling he may not approve Keystone.

No surprise there.

And he's stupid not to approve it....I can't believe he's not going to approve it, but, that's what it looks like.

[bleeding heart]

Every poll shows strong American support for the pipeline. I haven't seen one that shows otherwise. If you can show me polls "from an unbiased source" that say differently, I would appreciate a link to them. Or even one, for that matter.

The polls consistantly show that most Americans support this pipeline. Obama may not care about the polls, but the polls do show support - and that includes the most recent. I've never seen a poll that shows otherwise. Here are some more:

Survey: Americans overwhelmingly support Keystone XL pipeline

http://newsok.com/survey-americans-overwhelmingly-support-keystone-xl-pipeline/article/3841664

Americans overwhelmingly support Keystone XL pipeline despite environmental risks, poll claims

http://business.financialpost.com/2013/07/17/keystone-xl-pipeline-support/?__lsa=a776-538b

Harris Poll: 82% of Americans Believe Keystone XL is in the National Interest.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/brighammccown/2013/06/07/keystone-approval-rate-reaches-new-high/

Bottom Line: Americans Support the Keystone XL Pipeline by Wide Margin

http://businessroundtable.org/news-center/bottom-line-americans-support-the-keystone-xl-pipeline-by-wide-margin/

AW: don't take this as disagreement--I'm inclined to think you're right on this--but just as a point of order, those "four polls" are actually two...and the support between the two polls differs by 15 percentage points, which is a large margin, poll-wise.

[Shady]

AW: don't take this as disagreement--I'm inclined to think you're right on this--but just as a point of order, those "four polls" are actually two...and the support between the two polls differs by 15 percentage points, which is a large margin, poll-wise.

Every single poll over the last few years as indicated the same thing. So there isn't really anything for you to disagree with. Americans, as do Canadians, support the project.

[Guest American Woman]

Ya the industry is really pushing the polls since Obama is signaling he may not approve Keystone.

No surprise there.

Surprise or not, pushing the polls or not, they all show a strong support for the pipeline among Americans. Some of the polls, if you take note, are from before Obama "signaled" any such thing, too; but again, the polls consistently say that Americans approve the pipeline by a sizable majority - and you don't have anything to dispute that.

[Guest American Woman]

AW: don't take this as disagreement--I'm inclined to think you're right on this--but just as a point of order, those "four polls" are actually two...and the support between the two polls differs by 15 percentage points, which is a large margin, poll-wise.

I've posted several other polls, also - and there are many more out there. Every poll I've seen has shown Americans agreeing with the pipeline - and I don't see anyone coming up with anything to show otherwise.

I'm not sure why anyone would argue what the polls show anyway. Obama is obviously calling the shots on this.

[bleeding heart]

I've posted several other polls, also - and there are many more out there. Every poll I've seen has shown Americans agreeing with the pipeline - and I don't see anyone coming up with anything to show otherwise.

Yeah....well, I didn't mean to be especially pedantic about it. It sure seems as if there's broad public support for it, as you say.

[jacee]

I'm not sure why anyone would argue what the polls show anyway. Obama is obviously calling the shots on this.

I agree, and I'll bet new polls will start leaning his way.

[Smallc]

I agree, and I'll bet new polls will start leaning his way.

Why would you bet that? Is the US somehow going to stop needing energy suddenly?

[dre]

Why would you bet that? Is the US somehow going to stop needing energy suddenly?

No but they can purchase Canadian oil without keystone. They already buy more than 90% of our exports. And the US is ramping up its own production and is expected to be the worlds leading producer by 2016. They were a net oil product EXPORTER in 2012, and analysts preduct this trend to continue.

US oil imports are decreasing fast... From 11 million dollars per day to about 7 over the last few years. And domestic production has increased from about 4 million barrels per day to about 7 million barrels since 2006. Pretty soon they wont need our oil. What will the multi billion dollar keystone pipeline carry then? Maple syrup? Beer? Or maybe they will selling oil to us!

Turns out that unlike Canada, the US actually has a coherent national energy strategy.

[Guest American Woman]

I agree, and I'll bet new polls will start leaning his way.

Of course they're not. Why would they?

[The_Squid]

I'd like to see a poll that gauges support for a pipeline from people who would be living close to the route. It's easy to support something like this from 5000km away...

[jacee]

jacee, on 04 Aug 2013 - 10:30 PM, said:

I agree, and I'll bet new polls will start leaning his way.

Why would you bet that?

Is the US somehow going to stop needing energy suddenly?

People tend to poll 'the way the wind blows', and Obama just changed the wind direction.

The US doesn't need Keystone to address its own energy needs.

Alberta oil wants Keystone as a route to the gulf and overseas markets.

[Guest American Woman]

People tend to poll 'the way the wind blows', and Obama just changed the wind direction.

People tend to poll the way they believe. The majority of Americans have supported the pipeline since the beginning, they still do, and there's nothing to suggest that 'what Obama thinks' is going to change that. He doesn't have that kind of power of 'what Americans think.'

[jacee]

People tend to poll the way they believe. The majority of Americans have supported the pipeline since the beginning, they still do, and there's nothing to suggest that 'what Obama thinks' is going to change that. He doesn't have that kind of power of 'what Americans think.'

In your opinion.

I differ.

Wait for it ...