Canada "ready to go to war against syria" press reports...

[waldo]

And what was OEF's purpose & mandate?

good... finally... you now accept that, yes, Operation Apollo was in support of Operation Enduring Freedom. We're making progress here!!!

next step: what campaigns associate with Operation Enduring Freedom... more pointedly, when OEF is typically spoken of, what campaign/country is being referenced? Just say it... sure you can! Af....ghan....is....tan!!!

[Guest Derek L]

just curious - do you have a seeing disability that requires you to pad out your posts with at least 3 lines between each statement/paragraph? Are you trying to substitute white noise for your lack of being able to offer anything of substance?

good to see you're actually reading your own provided link - does this now mean you will finally accept those 2 key points being made in your own provided link: that the military received government orders not to support the illegal Iraq invasion/operation... and that the DND gave direct orders to the navy not to engage in Operation Iraqi Freedom. Will you finally accept those 2 key points from your own provided link... or do you deny them?

And the very points you reference are contrary to the report by CBC....

[bush_cheney2004]

just curious - do you have a seeing disability that requires you to pad out your posts with at least 3 lines between each statement/paragraph? Are you trying to substitute white noise for your lack of being able to offer anything of substance?

I rather like the extra "white space" as it is called....a lot easier on my old eyes.

...does this now mean you will finally accept those 2 key points being made in your own provided link: that the military received government orders not to support the illegal Iraq invasion/operation... and that the DND gave direct orders to the navy not to engage in Operation Iraqi Freedom.

Sounds like they got the memo from 1962 Cuba Missile Crisis when Canada's military ignored their government and followed President Kennedy and the USA instead.

[Guest Derek L]

no - no I did not! I said, as I was aware, they did not engage in combat during the illegal Iraq invasion. Do you actually appreciate the distinction?

And said pic, coupled with the mentioned mandate from DND counters your "points"...

[waldo]

And the very points you reference are contrary to the report by CBC....

huh! Is there a translator in the house... someone who can make sense of this gobbly-gook?

[Guest Derek L]

good... finally... you now accept that, yes, Operation Apollo was in support of Operation Enduring Freedom. We're making progress here!!!

next step: what campaigns associate with Operation Enduring Freedom... more pointedly, when OEF is typically spoken of, what campaign/country is being referenced? Just say it... sure you can! Af....ghan....is....tan!!!

OEF=WOT

[waldo]

Sounds like they got the memo from 1962 Cuba Missile Crisis when Canada's military ignored their government and followed President Kennedy and the USA instead.

hey... maybe so! That certainly fits my narrative. Not much a government or it's defense interfacing department can do... if 'rogue' military commanders are hell bent on "gettin it on"!

[waldo]

And said pic, coupled with the mentioned mandate from DND counters your "points"...

said pic? Who said it?

so... is this you denying those 2 key points from your own provided link? Just say you deny them... and if so... perhaps you'll learn a lesson for next time and actually read your linked articles before dropping them with a "ta da" pronouncement!

[Guest Derek L]

I rather like the extra "white space" as it is called....a lot easier on my old eyes.

Sounds like they got the memo from 1962 Cuba Missile Crisis when Canada's military ignored their government and followed President Kennedy and the USA instead.

Indeed…….My dear old Dad was flying Trackers off the Bonnie looking for Commie subs that happened to be on a south westerly heading …..But “we didn’t support” the naval blockade

[waldo]

OEF=WOT

again, is there a translator in the house? I mean... I think I know what WOT means, but I sure haven't a clue as to why you would tag OEF with it. Well, unless you're now wildly in free-fall and trying to distance yourself from your own accepted/acknowledged position that, yes, Operation Apollo was a part of the 'umbrella' Operation Enduring Freedom (OEF). Is that what you're trying to say here in all your cryptic best?

[Guest Derek L]

said pic? Who said it?

so... is this you denying those 2 key points from your own provided link? Just say you deny them... and if so... perhaps you'll learn a lesson for next time and actually read your linked articles before dropping them with a "ta da" pronouncement!

What, that Prime Minister Chrétien said one thing for domestic consumption well building up military forces in the region, and that years later, his then MND can’t confirm or deny what took place?

[Guest Derek L]

again, is there a translator in the house? I mean... I think I know what WOT means, but I sure haven't a clue as to why you would tag OEF with it. Well, unless you're now wildly in free-fall and trying to distance yourself from your own accepted/acknowledged position that, yes, Operation Apollo was a part of the 'umbrella' Operation Enduring Freedom (OEF). Is that what you're trying to say here in all your cryptic best?

Operation Enduring Freedom = War on Terror

Better?

[waldo]

What, that Prime Minister Chrétien said one thing for domestic consumption well building up military forces in the region, and that years later, his then MND can’t confirm or deny what took place?

any forces built up were clearly there years prior to the illegal invasion - you know, Operation Apollo - you yourself provided the dates for the operation! ... again, any supplements done between the March invasion date and the end of the operation were done under the auspices of the same Operation Apollo.

Chretien most certainly would have gone... he's stated as much - all he wanted/needed was the missing UN Security Council resolution... the resolution the U.S./UK could not secure. Accordingly, there was no political will... no political support. Why, your own linked article speaks directly to that in terms of the statement from the U.S. Ambassador to Canada (at the time).

[waldo]

Operation Enduring Freedom = War on Terror

Better?

almost! Now that you've finally accepted/acknowledged that Operation Apollo was in support of Operation Enduring Freedom, just answer the following question you chose to ignore:

next step: what campaigns associate with Operation Enduring Freedom... more pointedly, when OEF is typically spoken of, what campaign/country is being referenced? Just say it... sure you can! Af....ghan....is....tan!!!

[Guest Derek L]

any forces built up were clearly there years prior to the illegal invasion - you know, Operation Apollo - you yourself provided the dates for the operation! ... again, any supplements done between the March invasion date and the end of the operation were done under the auspices of the same Operation Apollo.

Chretien most certainly would have gone... he's stated as much - all he wanted/needed was the missing UN Security Council resolution... the resolution the U.S./UK could not secure. Accordingly, there was no political will... no political support. Why, your own linked article speaks directly to that in terms of the statement from the U.S. Ambassador to Canada (at the time).

And what were said forces doing in the region? Remember Operation Apollo---->Operation Enduring Freedom---->War on terror?

Now what countries in the Persian Gulf, at the time, were deemed State Sponsors of Terror?

Here's a hint.......There's two, now Vanna will spot you some letters:

Ir** & Ir**

Now buy an "A"

[Guest Derek L]

almost! Now that you've finally accepted/acknowledged that Operation Apollo was in support of Operation Enduring Freedom, just answer the following question you chose to ignore:

And what was the purpose of OEF? Why did they need a neato name for some operation.......What was it's purpose?

[waldo]

And what were said forces doing in the region?

said forces? Who said? Look we can clear this up... we can move forward... just answer the following - now asked for the 4th time. Is there a problem in why you can't answer these simple questions? Are you going to cling to your silly-buggar nonsense concerning 'Afghanistan beaches and the Afghanistan shore'?

again... just answer this question, now for the 3rd time: "are you categorically stating Operation Apollo was not in support of the war in Afghanistan... that ship boardings were not, were never, intended to attempt to ensure weapons did not reach Afghanistan via interim passage through the Gulf? Is that what you're stating? Is that your position?"

[waldo]

good to see you're actually reading your own provided link - does this now mean you will finally accept those 2 key points being made in your own provided link: that the military received government orders not to support the illegal Iraq invasion/operation... and that the DND gave direct orders to the navy not to engage in Operation Iraqi Freedom. Will you finally accept those 2 key points from your own provided link... or do you deny them?

do we have your denial yet... your denial of the two key points from your own provided link? Do you deny them?

[Guest Derek L]

said forces? Who said? Look we can clear this up... we can move forward... just answer the following - now asked for the 4th time. Is there a problem in why you can't answer these simple questions? Are you going to cling to your silly-buggar nonsense concerning 'Afghanistan beaches and the Afghanistan shore'?

I already did, Operation Apollo was Canada's Multi element contribution to the “War on Terror”, which was conducted on the United Status’s Operation Enduring Freedom, which included the war in Afghanistan, operations against terror cells in the Philippines, Somalia, Yemen and enforcing sanctions against known sponsor of terror Iraq…….Said actions against Iraq were further compounded by UNSC resolution 1441, at which point the Canadian contribution to the Persian Gulf was further expanded in terms of warships, maritime surveillance aircraft and logistical support…….As I said:

Oh, I know the thread, that’s the one where you refused to counter the fact that during the opening stages of the Iraq war, 1/3rd of the Canadian Navy (amongst RCAF Patrol and transport aircraft, coupled with logistic support provided from Camp Mirage) was in the region, conducting a similar role as that of our (acknowledged) involvement during the first Persian Excursion……….

Or Operation Friction.....our contribution to the US lead Operation Desert Shield/Storm

Yet PM Chrétien publicly opposed the war, sans a UN resolution, three days prior to it’s start, yet left our contribution in theatre, conducting it’s stated (in the DND link) mission of Force Protection of allied military and civilian vessels in the Persian Gulf, providing logistical support to allied members and conducting maritime interdiction operations against vessels inbound and outbound for Iraq, a known State Sponsor of Terror……….wraps in nicely to the Global war on Terror I think……..Unless you’re a ashamed Liberal….

[Guest Derek L]

do we have your denial yet... your denial of the two key points from your own provided link? Do you deny them?

Who am I to detract from the facts as reported by the CBC and wikileaks

[waldo]

I already did, Operation Apollo was Canada's Multi element contribution to the “War on Terror”, which was conducted on the United Status’s Operation Enduring Freedom, which included the war in Afghanistan, operations against terror cells in the Philippines, Somalia, Yemen and enforcing sanctions against known sponsor of terror Iraq…….

no - no you didn't... not until now have you even acknowledged OEF/Apollo included Afghanistan... notwithstanding, as I emphasized, Afghanistan is/was the principal component of OEF. Don't you remember your double-dose of snark with your comments deriding me over 'Afghanistan beaches & the Afghanistan shoreline'? Why your snark if you're now, finally, going to acknowledge Afghanistan within OEF, as supported by Apollo? But even now, you refuse to answer the question, bold highlighted below; again:

...what umbrella operation was Apollo supporting? That's right - the so-called "Operation Enduring Freedom (OEF)"... it had several minor plays (Philippines, Central Africa, the 'Horn of Africa', etc.)... but, of course, the principal focus of OEF was Afghanistan. But let's be clear here: are you categorically stating Operation Apollo was not in support of the war in Afghanistan... that ship boardings were not, were never, intended to attempt to ensure weapons did not reach Afghanistan via interim passage through the Gulf? Is that what you're stating? Is that your position?

Yet PM Chrétien publicly opposed the war, sans a UN resolution, three days prior to it’s start, yet left our contribution in theatre...wraps in nicely to the Global war on Terror I think……..Unless you’re a ashamed Liberal….

what was, as you say, "left in theatre", was there under the auspices of Apollo. Your own provided link has confirmed my statements that both the government and DND issued direct orders to the military not to provide support for the illegal invasion/war in Iraq. There's certainly no, as you say, "shame from any Liberal" concerning the role of the Liberal government in not providing political support for the U.S./UK Iraq war fiasco.

.

[waldo]

Who am I to detract from the facts as reported by the CBC and wikileaks

excellent! As your own provided reference was a CBC link, I acknowledge that you finally accept that both the government and DND issued direct orders to the military not to provide support to... and not to engage within... "Operation Iraqi Freedom". We went a long, long way for you to finally admit this - well done! As for you continuing to trumpet a single memo from wikileaks, I've already responded to the, "minimum level, the measly degree of qualification that suits you and your agenda":

going after wikileaks??? Again, how weak is your argument/position that you need to fabricate? I simply pointed out the claimed memo (can you find it... cause I can't), comes from an American source... an unnamed source without any suggestion of the position that supposed source held. The memo doesn't reflect upon a formal meeting; rather, the claim is the memo represents nothing more than a personal one-on-one conversation between this unknown, unnamed American source and a lower-level political staffer. Apparently, this is the minimum level, the measly degree of qualification that suits you and your agenda. I'm making a mental note the next time you go off the deep end when someone else references wikileaks... someone other than you, that is!

[bush_cheney2004]

....There's certainly no, as you say, "shame from any Liberal" concerning the role of the Liberal government in not providing political support for the U.S./UK Iraq war fiasco.

.

...and that's fine for the U.S/U.K., which really didn't give a damn how Canada's complicity was spun for the naive home audience. Overflight rights and fueling stops for military cargo were most welcomed in support of the Iraq War, as were direct C-17 "training flights", military personnel, and naval assets.

[waldo]

it's a shame you feel the need to spread your shame around... you really should take pride in your (claimed) country's Iraq war fiasco... shout it loud & proud! Be all you can be!!!

[Guest Derek L]

no - no you didn't... not until now have you even acknowledged OEF/Apollo included Afghanistan... notwithstanding, as I emphasized, Afghanistan is/was the principal component of OEF. Don't you remember your double-dose of snark with your comments deriding me over 'Afghanistan beaches & the Afghanistan shoreline'? Why your snark if you're now, finally, going to acknowledge Afghanistan within OEF, as supported by Apollo? But even now, you refuse to answer the question, bold highlighted below; again:

.

Principle component? Says you……..Clearly the “War on Terror” was/is a global effort.

what was, as you say, "left in theatre", was there under the auspices of Apollo. Your own provided link has confirmed my statements that both the government and DND issued direct orders to the military not to provide support for the illegal invasion/war in Iraq. There's certainly no, as you say, "shame from any Liberal" concerning the role of the Liberal government in not providing political support for the U.S./UK Iraq war fiasco.

Yet Canadian Forces took part, under the auspices of Operation Apollo, in boarding maritime traffic in & outbound to Iraq, escorted allied vessels into and inside the Persian gulf in perpetration & during the war, well also providing logistic support to forces involved in the conflict…………

Edited June 17, 2013 by Derek L