F-35 Purchase Cancelled; CF-18 replacement process begins

[Signals.Cpl]

The numbers are arbitrary and not based on reality. If you accept the logical premise that attacks will always be able to get through, then you accept the idea that it makes no sense to spend billions trying to prevent the same.

You can let your family die, that is your concern and your problem. My position is that I will fight and if necessary die for my loved once and I believe that the vast majority of people in Canada agree with me on this point, they would prefer knowing that there is a small chance of an attack going through rather than a GUARANTEE that an attack WILL get through.

[Signals.Cpl]

Collective. Scary word. Stop paying for health care? As an individual? No. As a "collective"? Absolutely.

That is until you need the healthcare and are going broke getting the treatment you need right?

[bush_cheney2004]

....Taking people's hard earned money and wasting it on an inefficient and inept system of defense like buying expensive war machine toys is not defending anything.

How do you propose to transport commodities across oceans and borders if sea lanes and other communications are disrupted?

[bush_cheney2004]

Collective. Scary word. Stop paying for health care? As an individual? No. As a "collective"? Absolutely.

Well, at least you are consistent. Stop paying for collective anything. Like I said, good luck with that, and chop lots of wood for the winter.

[kward]

Why should I be taxed to provide healthcare when I have not required to use the healthcare for anything serious?

Why should I be taxed for the fire department when I have never needed them?

Why should I be taxed to support EMS when I have never needed an ambulance?

Why should I be taxed to support police forces at the municipal, provincial or federal level since they seem unable to prevent 100% of the crime?

Why should I pay for insurance for my car when I am a good driver and have never made an insurance claim?

Why invest in doctors and healthcare if it is inevitable that we will die at some point?

Why invest in fighting cancer seeing as soon as we rid ourselves of cancer another disease will replace it?

Where does it end? Why work hard to increase the lifespan of people when we are guaranteed to die at some point in time? We can't get immortality so why don't we just give in?

1. Absolutely right. You shouldn't be. Pay for your own health care and ask everyone else to do the same.

2. Right, because the government runs the fire department better, more cheaply, and efficiently than private citizens who've banded together could?

3. See number 2.

4. See number 2.

5. Is insurance in a free market, free of government requirements, regulations, and bureaucracy cheaper?

6. Why take portions of everyone's wages to pay for services not everyone will use, and some people use and abuse far more than others?

7. Are citizens capable of fighting cancer through private charities as opposed to government bureaucracy?

8. You've got it backwards...we can achieve immortality...but first we have to get government out of the way. Government is a giant body that sucks a good chunk of investment into areas that do nothing to help progress, instead money is wasted instead of going directly to the intended source.

It's not about giving up, it's about recognizing that social engineering doesn't work...the profit motive does.

[kward]

You can let your family die, that is your concern and your problem. My position is that I will fight and if necessary die for my loved once and I believe that the vast majority of people in Canada agree with me on this point, they would prefer knowing that there is a small chance of an attack going through rather than a GUARANTEE that an attack WILL get through.

There are no guarantees. Diplomacy is every bit as effective as a fighter plane, if not more. And it's way cheaper.

You seem to be stuck on this notion that a lack of military hardware makes us susceptible to attack. And that is outdated thinking. Closing diplomatic channels, and protectionist policies. Those are what make us susceptible.

On the one hand you say it is my concern and my problem. So, you accept the idea of personal responsibility? And yet you advocate spending almost everyone's tax money on military hardware?

[kward]

That is until you need the healthcare and are going broke getting the treatment you need right?

Do you know what makes treatment expensive?

Scarcity, and limits on competition.

[Wilber]

The numbers are arbitrary and not based on reality. If you accept the logical premise that attacks will always be able to get through, then you accept the idea that it makes no sense to spend billions trying to prevent the same.

Just because I accept the fact I may be robbed or assaulted doesn't mean I don't lock my doors or equip and maintain a police force.

[kward]

How do you propose to transport commodities across oceans and borders if sea lanes and other communications are disrupted?

A problem for the owners of said commodities, and for the owners of said property being traversed, and for the owners/operators of communications services.

Not a problem for a federal government. Or at least, it shouldn't be...unless we want to continue taxing...i.e. stealing from people.

[bush_cheney2004]

...Not a problem for a federal government. Or at least, it shouldn't be...unless we want to continue taxing...i.e. stealing from people.

OK.....got it. You could have saved us a lot of trouble by posting such tax protester sentiments in the first place. Chop more wood.

[Signals.Cpl]

1. Absolutely right. You shouldn't be. Pay for your own health care and ask everyone else to do the same.

And that is a good answer until its your ass on the line knowing that you cannot afford your healthcare bill of 400,000 dollars and unfortunately your child needs a transplant there go another 100,000 dollars...

2. Right, because the government runs the fire department better, more cheaply, and efficiently than private citizens who've banded together could?

Of course they do, thats why over the last few hundred years we have seen police and fire departments take over from private citizens. You seem to be a fan of "solutions" that are proven to not work and have afield anytime some nation run by fools has tried.

3. See number 2.

See answer to #2.

4. See number 2.

See answer to #2.

5. Is insurance in a free market, free of government requirements, regulations, and bureaucracy cheaper?

Not according to my bills, the free market keep giving me "more choices" which means they cut my coverage and increase my premium

6. Why take portions of everyone's wages to pay for services not everyone will use, and some people use and abuse far more than others?

If you are one of the lucky few who will never need health care good, but most people will use it and need it at some point in their lives, and some people cannot see past the next month and think that since they haven't needed it yet they will not need it in the future...

7. Are citizens capable of fighting cancer through private charities as opposed to government bureaucracy?

Apparently not.

8. You've got it backwards...we can achieve immortality...but first we have to get government out of the way. Government is a giant body that sucks a good chunk of investment into areas that do nothing to help progress, instead money is wasted instead of going directly to the intended source.

Really we can achieve immortality?

It's not about giving up, it's about recognizing that social engineering doesn't work...the profit motive does.

So your solution would be to pay off the pirates in Somalia rather than use force to stop them? Back to the 1800 I see... and then we saw how that worked out right? The "super powers" paid off the pirates and the Americans beat the pirates, in the long run who benefited more?

[Wilber]

A problem for the owners of said commodities, and for the owners of said property being traversed, and for the owners/operators of communications services.

Not a problem for a federal government. Or at least, it shouldn't be...unless we want to continue taxing...i.e. stealing from people.

So your solution is private armies with the ability to protect yourself restricted by your ability to pay.

[Signals.Cpl]

There are no guarantees. Diplomacy is every bit as effective as a fighter plane, if not more. And it's way cheaper.

Sure worked out well for the Low countries in 1940 right?

[kward]

Well, at least you are consistent. Stop paying for collective anything. Like I said, good luck with that, and chop lots of wood for the winter.

I don't have the option to fully opt out. Not yet, anyway. Canadian society is still in its "insane" socialists throes. Wood is good, but solar's better.

[bush_cheney2004]

I don't have the option to fully opt out. Not yet, anyway. Canadian society is still in its "insane" socialists throes. Wood is good, but solar's better.

OK...but wood is solar.

[Signals.Cpl]

Do you know what makes treatment expensive?

Scarcity, and limits on competition.

So why is treatment in the US so expensive? They have a good healthcare and competition yet their treatment is just as expensive... it must be the government right? Cant possibly be that all of the Research and infrastructure costs money... or that the people who spend their time,money and effort to learn expect to be compensated properly?

[kward]

Just because I accept the fact I may be robbed or assaulted doesn't mean I don't lock my doors or equip and maintain a police force.

Locking your door is a psychological thing. If someone wants in, they'll get in. Of course almost all of us do it. I do it. The difference is I didn't expect everyone on my street to pay for the lock.

Citizens and private land owners and businesses can come together and form their own policing body, and one a lot more answerable to its constituents than the top-down policing bodies forced upon us right now.

[kward]

OK.....got it. You could have saved us a lot of trouble by posting such tax protester sentiments in the first place. Chop more wood.

Yes, I'm sure it's causing you a lot of trouble to read and reply to posts on a message board to which you belong.

[bush_cheney2004]

Yes, I'm sure it's causing you a lot of trouble to read and reply to posts on a message board to which you belong.

Sorry....I sometimes forget that American idioms don't always translate well in Canada.

[kward]

And that is a good answer until its your ass on the line knowing that you cannot afford your healthcare bill of 400,000 dollars and unfortunately your child needs a transplant there go another 100,000 dollars...

Of course they do, thats why over the last few hundred years we have seen police and fire departments take over from private citizens. You seem to be a fan of "solutions" that are proven to not work and have afield anytime some nation run by fools has tried.

See answer to #2.

See answer to #2.

Not according to my bills, the free market keep giving me "more choices" which means they cut my coverage and increase my premium

If you are one of the lucky few who will never need health care good, but most people will use it and need it at some point in their lives, and some people cannot see past the next month and think that since they haven't needed it yet they will not need it in the future...

Apparently not.

Really we can achieve immortality?

So your solution would be to pay off the pirates in Somalia rather than use force to stop them? Back to the 1800 I see... and then we saw how that worked out right? The "super powers" paid off the pirates and the Americans beat the pirates, in the long run who benefited more?

1. You're quoting prices based on current government-created inflationary costs. Health care in an unfettered free market is far cheaper than the numbers you're throwing around.

2. Just because it hasn't been done, doesn't mean it can't. I'm glad the Wright Brothers didn't think the way you do.

3. There is no free market, so I don't know what you're talking about in terms of "increase my premium".

4. Everyone needs health care at some point. The cheaper, and more readily available the better, wouldn't you say?

5. Cancer can be beaten, and more money can be invested privately because there's less bureaucracy to filter that money through.

6. Absolutely we can achieve immortality. Do yourself a favour and learn about Ray Kurzweil. Medical science can get there, and it will, but government's got to get out of the way to help it along faster, and more cheaply.

7. I do enjoy your over-simplification of history. And the Somali pirates...you're talking about a flea on a dog's arse. But sure, talk to them, figure out a business model. Maybe there's a way to make money together. Who knows? Or you figure out how they operate? Where their money comes from, and you tackle that source or root cause. A better solution than just arming yourself to the teeth just because.

[kward]

So your solution is private armies with the ability to protect yourself restricted by your ability to pay.

Not a lot different than now, except in the scenario you've laid out we're not collectively going broke paying for it.

[kward]

Sure worked out well for the Low countries in 1940 right?

It worked well for the High countries in 1941.

[kward]

OK...but wood is solar.

As in, trees need sun? Great, and when they grow, I chop them down to make room for more panels.

[kward]

So why is treatment in the US so expensive? They have a good healthcare and competition yet their treatment is just as expensive... it must be the government right? Cant possibly be that all of the Research and infrastructure costs money... or that the people who spend their time,money and effort to learn expect to be compensated properly?

Oh, that old chestnut...the US health care system...that bastion of free market economics.

The US system is every bit as managed and controlled by governments at all levels, and insurance companies regulated and controlled by government at all levels. Pointing at the US health care system as an example of free market health care is crazy.

Yes, research and infrastructure costs money, especially when every step of it is gummed up with government regulation and red tape.

Health care delivery, research, infrastructure...all of it gets cheaper and more readily fixed, and improved when you get government out of the way entirely.

And practitioners can earn boatloads in a private free market system, especially when they're not being taxed on their income. And you'd be paid commensurate with your skills. Your talents would earn you what the market determined your skills were worth. And even better you'd get out of med school without piles of student loans to pay back because school tuition subject to the same market forces would also be affordable, and of better quality.

[Signals.Cpl]

1. You're quoting prices based on current government-created inflationary costs. Health care in an unfettered free market is far cheaper than the numbers you're throwing around.

Because in the free market people don't want to make a profit and will therefore keep healthcare costs artificially low...

2. Just because it hasn't been done, doesn't mean it can't. I'm glad the Wright Brothers didn't think the way you do.

Oh it has been done before, many times... precisely why people moved away from that and to government organized and led organizations. You might be more suited to live in Afghanistan where the people band together and form their own militia's and pay for their own healthcare... you know where an ambulance is a wheelbarrow.

3. There is no free market, so I don't know what you're talking about in terms of "increase my premium".

And what do you mean by free market? Someone charging you whatever they want for the service?

4. Everyone needs health care at some point. The cheaper, and more readily available the better, wouldn't you say?

And in Canada I have no worry that if I need healthcare for myself or my children I will be able to get it... If I had to pay out of pocket for the healthcare I might not be able to afford it and will be forced to watch my children die, which might be acceptable for you but to me not so much.

5. Cancer can be beaten, and more money can be invested privately because there's less bureaucracy to filter that money through.

Less bureaucracy? What happened to all the charities that spend three quarters of every dollar on on expenses related to their bureaucracy and only spend one quarter or less on the intended project?

6. Absolutely we can achieve immortality. Do yourself a favour and learn about Ray Kurzweil. Medical science can get there, and it will, but government's got to get out of the way to help it along faster, and more cheaply.

Doubt that we can achieve impartiality much less if it was in the hands of a few corporations.

7. I do enjoy your over-simplification of history.

So do you Dispute that the British, French and Spanish were paying essentially bribes to the pirates to leave them alone while the US fought what was it two relatively small wars and ended up paying no bribes for protection of their ships? The Americans used force and the British used "diplomacy" the result was the British were found to be a much easier target even though they had a navy many times stronger than the US navy of the timeframe.

And the Somali pirates...you're talking about a flea on a dog's arse.

For the moment until others realize that to use the seaplanes we need to bribe them and they will join in the practice, you pay off one group of people to leave you alone and others will see you as an easy target, why should we bother ourselves with work when we can capture a few of your ships and get you to pay us millions of dollars to leave you alone...after all with no military power you can't do much anyway and if you want to use the sea lanes you have to pay us to leave you alone.

But sure, talk to them, figure out a business model.

Be sure to explain how paying Pirates in Somalia will not give ideas to criminals in all busy shipping areas to start their own little operation because you will pay if you want to run your business... you don't pay they take your cargo you eventually go broke...

Maybe there's a way to make money together.

That is exactly what will happen when idiots disarm and let themselves be pushed around by mere criminals.

Who knows? Or you figure out how they operate? Where their money comes from, and you tackle that source or root cause. A better solution than just arming yourself to the teeth just because.

Money comes from you, if they have weapons and target your ships you will either pay up or it becomes their ships and their cargo... thats the business plan good luck running a business when you have to pay bribes to everyone and anyone with a rifle and a boat.