F-35 Purchase Cancelled; CF-18 replacement process begins

[On Guard for Thee]

and let's set teh record straight. Chretien did get us involved in the original research program. It was Harper who decided we should write a blank check to LockMart.

[On Guard for Thee]

Well actually no you couldn’t………interceptions are an exercise in trigonometry.

You understand we are talking about an aircraft that first flew in 1952?

[Derek 2.0]

and let's set teh record straight. Chretien did get us involved in the original research program. It was Harper who decided we should write a blank check to LockMart.

Are you suggesting, prior to the Harper Government, Canada didn't contribute any funds to the F-35?

[Derek 2.0]

You understand we are talking about an aircraft that first flew in 1952?

Yup......do you understand basic trig?

[On Guard for Thee]

Are you suggesting, prior to the Harper Government, Canada didn't contribute any funds to the F-35?

Nope not at all. I'm only suggesting what I stated. Harper got us in this mess, then he tried to hide it all and it got him in a bit of a mess, the one called "contempt of parliament" Why was he hiding what he was planning to do I wonder?

[Derek 2.0]

Nope not at all. I'm only suggesting what I stated. Harper got us in this mess, then he tried to hide it all and it got him in a bit of a mess, the one called "contempt of parliament" Why was he hiding what he was planning to do I wonder?

Yet we were involved in the program, under Chrétien, years before the X-35 was even selected.

[On Guard for Thee]

Yup......do you understand basic trig?

I know what SOHCAHTOA is all about. Now let's go beyond basic, have you ever heard of a parsec?

[bush_cheney2004]

That’s answered simply by asking how many air forces have/had the like requirements as the Swedes.

That would be three.....the South Africans, Czechs, and Hungarians...for about 250 Gripens total (including Sweden). Meanwhile, about 4500 F-16's have been built to date...it is still in production.

[Derek 2.0]

I know what SOHCAHTOA is all about. Now let's go beyond basic, have you ever heard of a parsec?

If that's the case, why would you suggest that a TU-95 could be intercepted by a Cessna?

[Moonbox]

Now lets talk maneuverability. The small F35A ing design does not allow for quick Manoeuvres using tight turn radii whereas the Gripen excels in this area precisely what one wants from an intercepter.

From what little you've written it doesn't seem like you don't know much of anything about combat aircraft. Look up what an interceptor is and you'll see that air combat manoeuvres are not top on their list of priorities.

As for the Gripen, it excels at little other than being cheap. it might be more agile than the F-35, but it has relatively awful BVR capabilities and a low payload, so for the type of missions Canada would use it for (ground attack and interception) it would under perform.

[Derek 2.0]

That would be three.....the South Africans, Czechs, and Hungarians...for about 250 Gripens total (including Sweden). Meanwhile, about 4500 F-16's have been built to date...it is still in production.

Exactly......Sweden and Canada don't have similar requirements.

[Derek 2.0]

As for the Gripen, it excels at little other than being cheap. it might be more agile than the F-35, but it has relatively awful BVR capabilities and a low payload, so for the type of missions Canada would use it for (ground attack and interception) it would under perform.

If the Wall never came down, the Gripen would have been a suitable replacement for our old Freedom Fighters and their intended role as reinforcements to Norway/NATO’s Northern flank……..of course more Hornets (then) would have been preferred.

[On Guard for Thee]

If that's the case, why would you suggest that a TU-95 could be intercepted by a Cessna?

I'm surprised anyone who knows anything about ac wouldn't recognize that as slightly tongue in cheek, with reference that we are talking about a 60 year old bomber. A Russian one at that.

[Derek 2.0]

I'm surprised anyone who knows anything about ac wouldn't recognize that as slightly tongue in cheek, with reference that we are talking about a 60 year old bomber. A Russian one at that.

I’m surprised that someone the claims to know about aircraft would suggest that any prop driven aircraft could intercept a TU-95.….even early, non-radar equipped jets, would have faced a significant degree of difficulty.

[On Guard for Thee]

I’m surprised that someone the claims to know about aircraft would suggest that any prop driven aircraft could intercept a TU-95.….even early, non-radar equipped jets, would have faced a significant degree of difficulty.

I know the specs on the Bear bomber. perhaps you don't understand what "tongue in cheek" means.

[Derek 2.0]

I know the specs on the Bear bomber. perhaps you don't understand what "tongue in cheek" means.

Exaggeration does appear a common theme in your contributions…..So, what modern combat aircraft (outside of the F-35 of course) do you feel would best suit Canada and why?

[On Guard for Thee]

Exaggeration does appear a common theme in your contributions…..So, what modern combat aircraft (outside of the F-35 of course) do you feel would best suit Canada and why?

Sperhornet. Guaranteed price, much more affordable. Proven design. Maintenance crews, flight crews already familiar with the airframe. We don't need to pay for a lot of crap that doesn't seem to work and that we don't need i.e. stealth. It can work in cold weather and it just has soooo many more engines.

[Derek 2.0]

Sperhornet. Guaranteed price, much more affordable.

And what is that per tail price when all the associated ECM and targeting pods are factored in?

Maintenance crews, flight crews already familiar with the airframe.

No they're not.....it's a different aircraft then our current fleet.

We don't need to pay for a lot of crap that doesn't seem to work and that we don't need i.e. stealth.

Is camouflage “extra crap” our military doesn’t need?

It can work in cold weather

What's it service record in "cold weather"?

and it just has soooo many more engines.

And what does that mater?

[On Guard for Thee]

And what is that per tail price when all the associated ECM and targeting pods are factored in?

No they're not.....it's a different aircraft then our current fleet.

Is camouflage “extra crap” our military doesn’t need?

What's it service record in "cold weather"?

And what does that mater?

Much more similarities between the Hornets. Everything new with the 35. Stealth that doesn't work is extra crap we don't need. The cold weather problems have been discussed along with all the other problems with this thing. And just ask any pilot what they think about single vs multi engine aircraft. Especially when this ONE seems to blow up just sitting in a stand.

[Derek 2.0]

Much more similarities between the Hornets.

Like what? The radar, engines and avionics are completely different.

Everything new with the 35. Stealth that doesn't work is extra crap we don't need.

How do you know it doesn't work? As I said, would you suggest camouflage in general is useless?

The cold weather problems have been discussed along with all the other problems with this thing.

What cold weather problems? And what is the record of the Super Hornet in "cold weather"?

And just ask any pilot what they think about single vs multi engine aircraft.

Are you suggesting the pilot's that have flown/fly the F-16 didn’t feel comfortable with it’s single engine?

Especially when this ONE seems to blow up just sitting in a stand.

The Super Hornet fleet was grounded twice (1996 and 1998) due to it's engines......as such, would that make the Super Hornet unsafe?

[On Guard for Thee]

Like what? The radar, engines and avionics are completely different.

How do you know it doesn't work? As I said, would you suggest camouflage in general is useless?

What cold weather problems? And what is the record of the Super Hornet in "cold weather"?

Are you suggesting the pilot's that have flown/fly the F-16 didn’t feel comfortable with it’s single engine?

The Super Hornet fleet was grounded twice (1996 and 1998) due to it's engines......as such, would that make the Super Hornet unsafe?

Not so much different as upgraded. Especially the engines. There have been numerous reports of late that the stealth ain't so stealthy. And again, we don't need it. The old Hornets worked just fine in Inuvik in mid winter. I've flown single engine aircraft as much as multi engine and I know for damn sure which I feel more comfortable in. Especially after having had 2 engine failures, luckily in twins. It's not hard to figure out.

[Derek 2.0]

Not so much different as upgraded. Especially the engines.

The engines are different, as like I said, the avionics and radar also.......both legacy and Super Hornets have different supply chains.

There have been numerous reports of late that the stealth ain't so stealthy.

What reports? As I asked, do you feel camouflage in general in obsolete?

And again, we don't need it.

Why don't we need it?

Using our current fleet’s operational history as a precedent going forward, clearly we will in the decades ahead.

The old Hornets worked just fine in Inuvik in mid winter.

And what of the Super Hornet's performance in cold weather? What of the F-35?

I've flown single engine aircraft as much as multi engine and I know for damn sure which I feel more comfortable in. Especially after having had 2 engine failures, luckily in twins. It's not hard to figure out.

So you feel the F-16 is unsafe?

[On Guard for Thee]

The engines are different, as like I said, the avionics and radar also.......both legacy and Super Hornets have different supply chains.

What reports? As I asked, do you feel camouflage in general in obsolete?

Why don't we need it?

Using our current fleet’s operational history as a precedent going forward, clearly we will in the decades ahead.

And what of the Super Hornet's performance in cold weather? What of the F-35?

So you feel the F-16 is unsafe?

[On Guard for Thee]

Getting redundant. Upgraded is of course different. The software for the stealth appears to have been compromised. Ands we don't need it because we ain't planning on attacking anyone that I know of. As I said, legacy F 18's have been operating in cold forever. I can't make my comment on s/e vs m/e engine any clearer than I already have 2 is better than 1, ya know, just like heads.

[Smallc]

The Super Horner is almost a completely different aircraft than the Hornet....it's been said over and over.

Edited July 1, 2014 by Smallc