Organic Food not better for you

[bleeding heart]

Oh god, let's not encourage the anti-vaccine crowd to advocate for explicitly irresponsible behaviours again.

[GostHacked]

Once developed, Golden Rice will be given free to subsistence farmers. It can be re-sown every year from the saved harvest. There is no benefit to industry - only poor people.

There is a patent on that rice. Why do companies put patents on their products? Hint: money.

[Guest Manny]

So Carrots do not grow well in the areas that Rice grows in.

So grow em some where else then! Or don't live there any more. Or solve the problem in some practical way, like everyone else does.

No one denies these problems exist, but there can be many solutions to these problems. Not just your blessed GMO.

[Guest Manny]

There needs to be resistance to unfettered development and use of GMO's, because GMO's have the potential to be extremely harmful. If a mistake or an accident were to occur it could release a deadly virus. DNA manipulation is such a powerful technology, it should be feared and respected, and carefully controlled. Carefully monitored. Just like the nuclear industry, reactors are a tremendous benefit but they are also dangerous, and if an accident occurred could have widespread effect.

That's why there needs to be voices who say "No!" and pressure government and industry to make sure safety is always maintained. And it needs to be a vigilant, on-going process. Not just you gushing bon-boys who are cheerleaders for the new technology, after having read Omni magazine.

[segnosaur]

Once developed, Golden Rice will be given free to subsistence farmers. It can be re-sown every year from the saved harvest. There is no benefit to industry - only poor people.

There is a patent on that rice. Why do companies put patents on their products? Hint: money.

The stupidity! It burns!!!!

You know, if you would have spent 30 seconds doing a google search, you would have seen that even though there are patents, companies have allowed royalty free distribution in developing countries.

Perhaps the companies were feeling overly generous in making their patents free. Or perhaps they felt that it would be good publicity. Either way, poor people in Africa/Asia will not have to pay..

http://whqlibdoc.who.int/bulletin/2000/Number%2010/78%2810%29news.pdf

...genetically modified rice will be grown in developing countries have been boosted with a decision that gives developing countries royalty-free licenses for technologies used to produce so-called golden rice.

This has been pointed out to you before. 30 seconds of research would have proved that. Yet for some reason you cling to some false statement about how "expensive" it will be.

Edited October 3, 2012 by segnosaur

[segnosaur]

So Carrots do not grow well in the areas that Rice grows in.

So grow em some where else then!

Yup, and keep the developing countries subject to outside food aid. Not to mention that little issue of corrupt countries not actually allowing the distribution of food aid to the people.

But hey, I'm sure you can wave your little magic wand and make all the bad people in the world go away.

Oh, and all the environmental damage caused by the vehicles spewing CO2 into the air when delivering that food aid? Who cares, right?

Or don't live there any more.

Wow, just totally wow.

Yeah, I'm sure the poor farmers living in subsharan africa or South east asia can just pick up and move on a whim. Maybe they can spend summers at their villas in the south of france, or head on over to Disney world for spring break.

Or if they need some place to stay full time, they can move in with you. You have a couch they can crash on?

Poor farmers can do that, can't they?

No one denies these problems exist...

You and Ghosthacked seem to...

...but there can be many solutions to these problems.

There are 7 billion people on the planet. There are approximately 1 billion people in Africa. Another few hundred million in places like Cambodia, India, etc. who are affected by vitamin A deficiency. With that many people around, and that many people affected, Do you think you and GhostHacked are the only people to ever come up with the idea of "grow a carrot"? Why do you think that the problem still exists if you think its that easy to fix?

Do you think Monsanto is running around with spy planes and secret ninjas, to search and destroy any carrots that farmers plant in those areas?

Or perhaps the problems are a little more complex than your overly simplistic "let them plant carrots/move/import" would suggest.

There needs to be resistance to unfettered development and use of GMO's

Pssst... here's a little secret...

Companies releasing GM foods (or new pesticides/food additives/medication/etc.) have to undergo tests. So their development is hardly "unfettered".

That's why there needs to be voices who say "No!"

On the other hand, when the products are proven safe, we need those same voices to shut the heck up.

Saying "no" is only valuable when you actually have things like science and facts behind you.

[segnosaur]

And we also have things like this that put things in a bad light.

http://toronto.mediacoop.ca/newsrelease/13169

...this morning workers from the City of Toronto were ordered by City of Toronto Parks Director Richard Ubbens to remove all live plants and food from the People's Peas Garden in Queens Park. They were ordered to take the plants and food to the dump and lay sod overtop of this most beautiful free community food garden, without warning, without a chance to remove the rare heirloom plant species or harvest the food.

I have a confession to make...

When nobody was looking, I went and peed on the plants in the garden.

I would have been fine though, since my urine would be considered 'organic'.

Seems like a crappy reason and also why would they wait 5 months before doing anything about it?

Because hippie tears make the best fertilizer.

[GostHacked]

The stupidity! It burns!!!!

You know, if you would have spent 30 seconds doing a google search, you would have seen that even though there are patents, companies have allowed royalty free distribution in developing countries.

Perhaps the companies were feeling overly generous in making their patents free. Or perhaps they felt that it would be good publicity. Either way, poor people in Africa/Asia will not have to pay..

http://whqlibdoc.who.int/bulletin/2000/Number%2010/78%2810%29news.pdf

...genetically modified rice will be grown in developing countries have been boosted with a decision that gives developing countries royalty-free licenses for technologies used to produce so-called golden rice.

This has been pointed out to you before. 30 seconds of research would have proved that. Yet for some reason you cling to some false statement about how "expensive" it will be.

I should not need a license just to grow GMO foods. It's patented for controlling purposes.

[Guest Manny]

Yup, and keep the developing countries subject to outside food aid. Not to mention that little issue of corrupt countries not actually allowing the distribution of food aid to the people.

But hey, I'm sure you can wave your little magic wand and make all the bad people in the world go away.

Oh, and all the environmental damage caused by the vehicles spewing CO2 into the air when delivering that food aid? Who cares, right?

Wow, just totally wow.

Yeah, I'm sure the poor farmers living in subsharan africa or South east asia can just pick up and move on a whim. Maybe they can spend summers at their villas in the south of france, or head on over to Disney world for spring break.

Or if they need some place to stay full time, they can move in with you. You have a couch they can crash on?

Poor farmers can do that, can't they?

You and Ghosthacked seem to...

There are 7 billion people on the planet. There are approximately 1 billion people in Africa. Another few hundred million in places like Cambodia, India, etc. who are affected by vitamin A deficiency. With that many people around, and that many people affected, Do you think you and GhostHacked are the only people to ever come up with the idea of "grow a carrot"? Why do you think that the problem still exists if you think its that easy to fix?

Do you think Monsanto is running around with spy planes and secret ninjas, to search and destroy any carrots that farmers plant in those areas?

Or perhaps the problems are a little more complex than your overly simplistic "let them plant carrots/move/import" would suggest.

Pssst... here's a little secret...

Companies releasing GM foods (or new pesticides/food additives/medication/etc.) have to undergo tests. So their development is hardly "unfettered".

On the other hand, when the products are proven safe, we need those same voices to shut the heck up.

Saying "no" is only valuable when you actually have things like science and facts behind you.

Cant read whole thing, but suffice to say that these people should solve their own problems same as we did ares. We cant grow carrots in this region but thers others nearby. We develop trade zones.

Not shipping are food from Canada or US to them, just local. We transport carrot hundreds, or even thousands of miles to serve them here. Organic carrots from California? Oh my!

Why should that be given a pass, but not acceptible for feeding starving vhonaman Afrikaners.

Edited October 4, 2012 by Manny

[segnosaur]

Cant read whole thing...

Then why are you responding?

Seriously... over and over again you've illustrated that you don't bother paying attention to what other people say. (Yet strangely you object to being treated "like an imbecile".) If you're going to respond to a post, you should read the whole thing, because the answer to your question might have actually been dealt with before.

but suffice to say that these people should solve their own problems same as we did ares.

And if they can't... just let them die. Sound about right?

Of course, the problem with letting them "solve their own problems" is that the people most affected are often subject to corrupt governments or armed conflict not of their own making. But its ok if they die, as long as the problems get sorted out.

We cant grow carrots in this region but thers others nearby. We develop trade zones.

Yup, and I'm sure the poor subsistence farmer trying to make a living has all sorts of money to go out and buy carrots. Yup. Sure.

Not shipping are food from Canada or US to them, just local. We transport carrot hundreds, or even thousands of miles to serve them here.

Yup, all the time putting out tons of CO2 and pollutants into the air when doing so. That's a really good model to follow.

Of course the difference between Canada, the U.S., and countries in Africa/Asia is that the countries here tend to be A: more stable, and B: less corrupt. Makes it a bit easier to go to ship carrots to the local super market if you don't have to worry about some local warlord or corrupt government official stealing them.

As I asked before (and as you ignored)... if you think its so simple, Why hasn't it happened yet? There's millions of people in Africa/Asia. Why do you think someone hasn't run down to the local store and bought a pack of carrot seen to cure all their country's problems?

Could it be that the problems aren't quite as easy to fix as you are imagining them?

[segnosaur]

You know, if you would have spent 30 seconds doing a google search, you would have seen that even though there are patents, companies have allowed royalty free distribution in developing countries.

I should not need a license just to grow GMO foods. It's patented for controlling purposes.

Wow, what a brain-damaged statement.

Note that the orignal statement was by Manny: It's a money maker, and that's why they want to do it.

Later on, you stated: All of that exactly applies to Golden Rice. (post 242)

Your statement (that Golden Rice is a "money maker") is false. Farmers in developing world will not have to pay to replant it, and Monsanto (and the other companies who developed it) will not see one thin dime regardless of the number of times the rice is re-sown.

The fact that you are getting caught up on the terminology and legal minutai shows how empty and vacuous your arguments are. "Oh my god, its 'licensed' to grow? Well then just let all those poor people die".

Edited October 4, 2012 by segnosaur