Murderer kills 90 injures 200 more

[jbg]

i dont need to use capitals on here. to teach you need enthusiasm and i will teach social sciences to let students know what really has gone on in this country.

Nor does your other screen name, Bud?

[Jack Weber]

if you had paid attention to the direction the thread had went, you would have a hard time agreeing with DogOnGrandMufti.

many started talking about terrorist attacks including attacks by palestinians. so i sobered them up with some reality about the origins of terrorist attacks in the middle east and palestine.

Great..

I thunk we have ample access to your 2 dimensional thinking on the Israel/Palestinian issue...

[DogOnPorch]

Great..

I thunk we have ample access to your 2 dimensional thinking on the Israel/Palestinian issue...

Scotch on me.

[DogOnPorch]

if you had paid attention to the direction the thread had went, you would have a hard time agreeing with DogOnGrandMufti.

Only you have a hard time agreeing that the Mufti...founder of the Palestinian Cause you so dearly love...was knee deep in the SS and the Holocaust. I call it denial.

many started talking about terrorist attacks including attacks by palestinians. so i sobered them up with some reality about the origins of terrorist attacks in the middle east and palestine.

If you could find Guadalcanal on a map, you'd know it isn't in the Middle East.

[bud]

Great..

I thunk we have ample access to your 2 dimensional thinking on the Israel/Palestinian issue...

what is the 2 dimensional thinking you're talking about? not to say that this is a 50/50 situation, but i don't think there is 1 person on this forum who tries to justify or excuse terrorist attacks done by palestinian groups. so there is no disagreement on that. however, many here try to excuse, justify and whitewash well-documented atrocities that have been committed by jewish and israeli forces. for example, the actions committed when around 700,000 palestinians were systematically expelled from their land. the thousands who were killed and the over 500 palestinian villages depopulated and destroyed. this is pretty heavy stuff that never make it into the narrative of the israeli apologists and when there is any mention of them, we have the typical cries of anti-semitism.

Edited May 26, 2012 by bud

[DogOnPorch]

duff beer: what is the 2 dimensional thinking you're talking about? not to say that this is a 50/50 situation, but i don't think there is 1 person on this forum who tries to justify or excuse terrorist attacks done by palestinian groups.

Well, you can't even admit the origins of the Palestinian cause (cough, cough, Hashemite Jordan, cough too many Jews...cough, cough). Your ilk deny the Mufti's direct connection to the Holocaust and the FACT Yasser Arrowfart was born in Cairo...located in Egypt if I recall correctly. Not to mention he's the nephew of said Mufti SS man. So what does that say about your pet project other than you like to hide its true intentions?

I do think your boys in Iran have some pretty spiffy uniforms, though. Nice swastika.

Edited May 26, 2012 by DogOnPorch

[Signals.Cpl]

Well, you can't even admit the origins of the Palestinian cause (cough, cough, Hashemite Jordan, cough too many Jews...cough, cough). Your ilk deny the Mufti's direct connection to the Holocaust and the FACT Yasser Arrowfart was born in Cairo...located in Egypt if I recall correctly. Not to mention he's the nephew of said Mufti SS man. So what does that say about your pet project other than you like to hide its true intentions?

I do think your boys in Iran have some pretty spiffy uniforms, though. Nice swastika.

A lot of cow kicking, fancy colours, and people out of step. Not impressive at all...

[bud]

thousands of palestinians killed, the expulsion of 600,000 people and over 500 villages depopulated and destroyed.

nothing to see here folks.

[Signals.Cpl]

thousands of palestinians killed, the expulsion of 600,000 people and over 500 villages depopulated and destroyed.

nothing to see here folks.

You really will not be satisfied until jews die... Your hero, Hitler tried killing the jews, the world won't let Holocaust 2.0 happen...no matter how much you want it to.

[bud]

You really will not be satisfied until jews die...

lols

you're like a robot who can't digest criticism of israel and the truth.

i mention thousands of palestinians killed, the expulsion of 600k people and the destroying of 500+ villages and you respond with another holocaust comment.

it's over buddy. you're a dying breed. the holocaust has been milked enough. israel's actions towards the palestinians has nothing to do with the holocaust. the injustices committed by israel towards the palestinians has gone long enough and people are distancing themselves from the zionist ideology. including the jews who are living outside israel, who no longer can stomach israel's actions.

[Signals.Cpl]

lols

you're like a robot who can't digest criticism of israel and the truth.

i mention thousands of palestinians killed, the expulsion of 600k people and the destroying of 500+ villages and you respond with another holocaust comment.

it's over buddy. you're a dying breed. the holocaust has been milked enough. israel's actions towards the palestinians has nothing to do with the holocaust. the injustices committed by israel towards the palestinians has gone long enough and people are distancing themselves from the zionist ideology. including the jews who are living outside israel, who no longer can stomach israel's actions.

Oh man, you are a funny bunny aren't you? You are so biased that it boggles my mind. I can only picture you sitting in the basement of your parents house with all the Swastika on your walls...

[bud]

Oh man, you are a funny bunny aren't you? You are so biased that it boggles my mind. I can only picture you sitting in the basement of your parents house with all the Swastika on your walls...

thousands killed, the expulsion of 600,000 and over 500 villages destroyed is not a biased opinion. they are historical facts which have been well-documented. they are something that you refuse to discuss.

you will now join dogonporch on the ignore list because you simply cannot have a debate or discuss any topic that criticizes israel. every single one of your replies have become accusation of anti-semitism.

Edited May 27, 2012 by bud

[bleeding heart]

You really will not be satisfied until jews die... Your hero, Hitler tried killing the jews, the world won't let Holocaust 2.0 happen...no matter how much you want it to.

I don't think bud considers Hitler his "hero," and he has in fact regularly denounced Palestinian suicide bombings--expressly because they are a direct attack on civilians.

Rather, his primary focus is on the party he considers to be more criminal.

By your formulation, you are racist against the Arab people, and wish them all to be murdered. And yet somehow I sincerely doubt this is the way you feel.

Y'all got to stop throwing around the anti-semite card so promiscuously. It adds zero to the debate...and in fact, is meant specifically to avoid having an intelligent debate at all.

That's the purpose of using the term so brazenly and in such an all-encompassing way. It is an unprincipled way of appearing to take a moral high-ground.

It's wanton political correctness, in other words. Extreme political correctness, to a degree rarely seen in any other debate issue.

If you want to argue with people who are genuinely and uncontroversially anti-semites, you'll need to go head-to-head with the right-wingers at Stormfront and its sister-sites; that's where the real anti-semitism resides.

Condemning Israel is not anti-semitic, in effect or in inclination; it's a nation-state, a geopolitical entity, and this overrides its ethnic/cultural/religious and political makeup, by definition. Whether the critiques are correct or not doesn't change that.

Edited May 27, 2012 by bleeding heart

[DogOnPorch]

Now, who was that Mufti again? Give us the 21st century rewrite. He liked kids and small animals, I'm guessing? But not Himmler? Bud denies he even existed. How about you?

[bleeding heart]

Now, who was that Mufti again? Give us the 21st century rewrite. He liked kids and small animals, I'm guessing? But not Himmler? Bud denies he even existed. How about you?

As you know from our many discussions, I am not sympathetic to Nazis...much less pretending they never existed. (???)

Neither do I deny this sordid chapter for the Palestinians....none of whom now have anything to do with Nazism, but have legitimate grievances.

I'm pointing out two incontrovertible truths:

1. Criticism of Israel does not in any way connote, much less denote, anti-semitism.

That is, even though a few anti-semites are going to use the situaition for their own rhetorical bile, that doesn't paint the critics wholesale...and those who say that it does, are lying, or are ignorant in the manner of the patently servile.

Using political correctness to try to "win" a debate.

2. The lion's share of anti-semites reside, as they long have, on the political Right, and are mostly inhabited by people who think the Arabs are even worse, being subhuman, unlike the Jews who are human but "evil." They too will criticize Israel, but fall in what amounts to them as an intellectual conundrum: the Arabs are rotten to the core, too....so where to turn?

Edited May 27, 2012 by bleeding heart

[DogOnPorch]

Why do both Hamas and Hezbollah give the Nazi salute and call for the death of Jews? No more Nazis...lol. So what small animals did the Mufti like most?

[Signals.Cpl]

I don't think bud considers Hitler his "hero," and he has in fact regularly denounced Palestinian suicide bombings--expressly because they are a direct attack on civilians.

Rather, his primary focus is on the party he considers to be more criminal.

By your formulation, you are racist against the Arab people, and wish them all to be murdered. And yet somehow I sincerely doubt this is the way you feel.

Y'all got to stop throwing around the anti-semite card so promiscuously. It adds zero to the debate...and in fact, is meant specifically to avoid having an intelligent debate at all.

That's the purpose of using the term so brazenly and in such an all-encompassing way. It is an unprincipled way of appearing to take a moral high-ground.

It's wanton political correctness, in other words. Extreme political correctness, to a degree rarely seen in any other debate issue.

If you want to argue with people who are genuinely and uncontroversially anti-semites, you'll need to go head-to-head with the right-wingers at Stormfront and its sister-sites; that's where the real anti-semitism resides.

Condemning Israel is not anti-semitic, in effect or in inclination; it's a nation-state, a geopolitical entity, and this overrides its ethnic/cultural/religious and political makeup, by definition. Whether the critiques are correct or not doesn't change that.

Over the last few weeks, all the bud has posted was how the big bad jews are abusing the little innocent arabs. Thats not how it is, its not 90/10 division of blame, and it seems to me that all those anti Israeli garbage he posts ignored the fact that there are guilty arabs, that many of them strictly believe in the destruction of Israel. Honestly, his biased one sided accusation and his refusal to see the Arabs and Palestinians as responsible as well puts me in the corner exactly opposite to him, he is anti-Semitic, there is no doubt about it, if he was balanced in any way, shape or form we would be able to see that from his "arguments".

He posts random videos of the big bad Israelis abusing the little innocent arabs but does not post the story behind. Side A does something to instigate the Israelis, surprise surprise no one is videotaping that portion and once the Israelis come knocking on your door the video is running... This guy is racist beyond measure, arguing with him forces people to take the opposite extreme position, if he could open his eyes and mind he would see that it is not oh so exclusively Israel's fault.

And you say he is not racist? He goes in to any thread and tries to direct the conversation in to how bad Israel is, wether it is related or not. You just can't go to a forum, outright attack one particular group of people who are in no way wholly responsible for the events in the ME, present them as the bad guy and ignore everything that the other side has done. He still ignores anyone bringing up Haj Mohammed Effendi Amin el-Husseini and his position on carrying out similar actions to the Holocaust.

[bleeding heart]

Over the last few weeks, all the bud has posted was how the big bad jews are abusing the little innocent arabs. Thats not how it is, its not 90/10 division of blame, and it seems to me that all those anti Israeli garbage he posts ignored the fact that there are guilty arabs, that many of them strictly believe in the destruction of Israel. Honestly, his biased one sided accusation and his refusal to see the Arabs and Palestinians as responsible as well puts me in the corner exactly opposite to him, he is anti-Semitic, there is no doubt about it, if he was balanced in any way, shape or form we would be able to see that from his "arguments".

Until you direct me to your more "balanced" approach, and show where you've posted about the brutal treatment of Palestinians by the Israelis, you are insisting, right here and now, that you are fanatically racist against the Arab people.

It's not as if it's one-sided the other way, Signals.

Why are you holding bud to such a higher standard than you are holding yourself????

Edited May 27, 2012 by bleeding heart

[Signals.Cpl]

Until you direct me to your more "balanced" approach, and show where you've posted about the brutal treatment of Palestinians by the Israelis, you are insisting, right here and now, that you are fanatically racist against the Arab people.

It's not as if it's one-sided the other way, Signals.

Why are you holding bud to such a higher standard than you are holding yourself????

Because when he comes in to the argument and presents an extreme one sided argument, it lines up everyone to take another extreme.

--------------------------------------------

1948 War of Independence

1956 Sinai War

1967 Six Day War

1973 Yom Kippur War

-------------------------------------------

More then 140 suicide attacks between 1989 and 2009 and 70 since the year 2000 not counting the attempts that Israeli forces prevented.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/1197051.stm

--------------------------------------------

The founding document of Hamas commits the organisation to the destruction of Israel.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/1654510.stm

--------------------------------------------

The UN partition plan of 1947 was rejected by all the Arab countries. Arab leadership in Israel and in the countries surrounding Israel, planned a Jihad, holy war, against Israel and encouraged the Arabs to leave Israel promising their return after they purge the land of Jews. The great majority of Arabs left without ever seeing an Israeli soldier

source: http://www.science.co.il/arab-israeli-conflict.asp#Refugees

...the Arab states refused to allow such resettlement and integration of their Palestinian brethren, preferring instead to exploit the Palestinian refugees to serve their own political agendas.

http://www.palestinefacts.org/pf_independence_refugees_arabs_what.php

Edited May 27, 2012 by Signals.Cpl

[GostHacked]

I don't think bud considers Hitler his "hero," and he has in fact regularly denounced Palestinian suicide bombings--expressly because they are a direct attack on civilians.

Rather, his primary focus is on the party he considers to be more criminal.

By your formulation, you are racist against the Arab people, and wish them all to be murdered. And yet somehow I sincerely doubt this is the way you feel.

Y'all got to stop throwing around the anti-semite card so promiscuously. It adds zero to the debate...and in fact, is meant specifically to avoid having an intelligent debate at all.

That's the purpose of using the term so brazenly and in such an all-encompassing way. It is an unprincipled way of appearing to take a moral high-ground.

It's wanton political correctness, in other words. Extreme political correctness, to a degree rarely seen in any other debate issue.

If you want to argue with people who are genuinely and uncontroversially anti-semites, you'll need to go head-to-head with the right-wingers at Stormfront and its sister-sites; that's where the real anti-semitism resides.

Condemning Israel is not anti-semitic, in effect or in inclination; it's a nation-state, a geopolitical entity, and this overrides its ethnic/cultural/religious and political makeup, by definition. Whether the critiques are correct or not doesn't change that.

I agree. I don't see bud as anti-semite (although it is convenient for the other sides argument to say that), I am not sure that bud is anti-Israel. He does criticize Israel extensively, and the usual replies he gets are the same old from the same old.

[bleeding heart]

Because when he comes in to the argument and presents an extreme one sided argument, it lines up everyone to take another extreme.

Please. Anyone could say that about the (so-called) "pro-Israel" folks, who use the term "anti-semite" every time they blink.

At any rate, that's a bad answer for poor behaviour...especially the "extreme one sided argumnent" that you are now defending.

("It's ok for me, but not for thee.....")

It's not like this in Israel, apparently, which is an interesting fact. When Israeli lefties and critics travel to N. America, they say that there is simply no room for any debate here, as any remarks about Israel's treatment of the Palestinians is shouted down.

The Israelis are not so mired in the rhetorically defensive posture of mindless political correctness.

[Signals.Cpl]

Please. Anyone could say that about the (so-called) "pro-Israel" folks, who use the term "anti-semite" every time they blink.

At any rate, that's a bad answer for poor behaviour...especially the "extreme one sided argumnent" that you are now defending.

("It's ok for me, but not for thee.....")

It's not like this in Israel, apparently, which is an interesting fact. When Israeli lefties and critics travel to N. America, they say that there is simply no room for any debate here, as any remarks about Israel's treatment of the Palestinians is shouted down.

The Israelis are not so mired in the rhetorically defensive posture of mindless political correctness.

his views are pretty clear. the arabs are victims, without question and without causing their own hardships. Each side is to blame, what he fails to mention is that the ME is cyclic, you launch a suicide attack on me, I launch a conventional attack to remove you as a threat, you take that attack as justification and launch rocket attacks and further suicide attacks, where I launch further military action to get you out of range of my civilian population. When one side is determined to destroy the other, and is using the refugee problem that they themselves caused as an excuse it seems to me that they are not all that innocent.

I believe that Israel has the right to exist and jews have the right to live, until such a time as the Arabs decide to recognize that fact, Israel is more then justified in using force as a means of protecting themselves.

Hamas launches rocket attacks against Israel and when IDF comes knocking they cry abuse.

[Canuckistani]

Of course Israel has the right to exist. It would be nice if extended that same right to the Palestinians instead of continually grabbing more land until he Palestinians are pushed into Jordan and beyond by some Israeli leaders. I don't blame the IDF for occupying Palestinian areas while Israel is under attack, but when you sen it settlers, that shows you have no intention of giving that land back. So don't the Palestinians have the right to self defense for their land as well?

[Signals.Cpl]

Of course Israel has the right to exist. It would be nice if extended that same right to the Palestinians instead of continually grabbing more land until he Palestinians are pushed into Jordan and beyond by some Israeli leaders. I don't blame the IDF for occupying Palestinian areas while Israel is under attack, but when you sen it settlers, that shows you have no intention of giving that land back. So don't the Palestinians have the right to self defense for their land as well?

You send in settlers to make sure they don't come back once you leave and set up shop once again.

[DogOnPorch]

Of course Israel has the right to exist. It would be nice if extended that same right to the Palestinians instead of continually grabbing more land until he Palestinians are pushed into Jordan and beyond by some Israeli leaders. I don't blame the IDF for occupying Palestinian areas while Israel is under attack, but when you sen it settlers, that shows you have no intention of giving that land back. So don't the Palestinians have the right to self defense for their land as well?

Like Gaza and Sinai?