CitizenX Posted September 27, 2011 Report Posted September 27, 2011 (edited) This video might enlighten http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7VmpDADabg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpnnekLeX9U&feature=related Edited September 27, 2011 by CitizenX Quote "The rich people have their lobbyists and the poor people have their feet." The price of apathy towards public affairs is to be ruled by evil men. - Plato
bud Posted September 28, 2011 Author Report Posted September 28, 2011 This video might enlighten http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7VmpDADabg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpnnekLeX9U&feature=related very candid. Quote http://whoprofits.org/
jbg Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 Have I said anything that isn't true? I have said that Hamas and fanatic Arab groups love to fire rockets into civilian areas of Israel. They have sent suicide bombers to blow up innocents. They TARGET innocents! Is this not true?Is targeting innocents NOT the act of a rabid animal? Well it's an act with honorable Biblical precedents; the fighting tactics of the Amelkites against the Hebrews. The response should be the same. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
segnosaur Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 the 2 year old was at home. he was killed when israel targeted his father. meaning that israel doesn't care that a child was in the house when they shoot missiles. Soooo.... what you're saying is that it would be an effective tactic for the Palestinians to use "human shields", and Israel is wrong for reacting when such human shields are used? Malek Khaled Hamad Shaat, 2, of Rafah refugee camp, Gaza, killed by an IDF missile while at home in Block J of the camp. He was killed during the targeted killing of his father, a member of the Popular Resistance Committees' Nasser Saladin Brigades.Islam Motaz Basem Quraiqe, 1, of Shujaiya, east of Gaza City, Gaza, killed, along with his uncle and father, by an IDF drone while riding on a motor cycle during the targeted killing of his father, a leader in Islamic Jihad's al-Quds Brigades. Just out of curiosity... What exactly do you think that says about the quality of Palestinian parenting when someone who engages in militant activity (making themselves a target) decides to keep their children around? After all, in both cases it appears the fathers were involved in terrorist activities. Shouldn't a responsible parent, if they really cared about their children, actually make attempts to distance themselves from their children should something happen? It would be like the U.S. deciding to set up a daycare in Kabul for the children of soldiers shipped to Afghanistan.... Quote
bud Posted October 3, 2011 Author Report Posted October 3, 2011 It would be like the U.S. deciding to set up a daycare in Kabul for the children of soldiers shipped to Afghanistan.... your analogy sucks. they live and fight in gaza. the number of civilian casualty shows that israel uses its weapons indiscriminatory. it's okay for israel and its supporters if the IDF drops a bomb on a building and kills people inside it, just so they can kill a militant. Quote http://whoprofits.org/
Guest American Woman Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 your analogy sucks. they live and fight in gaza. the number of civilian casualty shows that israel uses its weapons indiscriminatory. it's okay for israel and its supporters if the IDF drops a bomb on a building and kills people inside it, just so they can kill a militant. It's difficult to understand why Israel doesn't kill them while they are in uniform, bravely fighting on the front line for what they so strongly believe in. Oh wait ................ they don't do that ................ do they? Quote
wyly Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 your analogy sucks. they live and fight in gaza. the number of civilian casualty shows that israel uses its weapons indiscriminatory. it's okay for israel and its supporters if the IDF drops a bomb on a building and kills people inside it, just so they can kill a militant. simplistic... where does he think resistance fighters should go when they've been occupied? perhaps during WW2 the french resistance should taken their war with the german occupation to spain so their french familes would not be in danger.... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
wyly Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 It's difficult to understand why Israel doesn't kill them while they are in uniform, bravely fighting on the front line for what they so strongly believe in. fighting highly technical nuclear equiped armed forces with crude rockets, ak's and rocks ya I'd say they're very brave... Oh wait ................ they don't do that ................ do they? oh wait..................they aren't allowed a standing army.............are they? Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
bud Posted October 3, 2011 Author Report Posted October 3, 2011 (edited) It's difficult to understand why Israel doesn't kill them while they are in uniform, bravely fighting on the front line for what they so strongly believe in. is it also difficult to understand why the nazis Oh wait ................ they don't do that ................ do they? the jewish resistance groups in the warsaw ghettos also fought against the occupier. why didn't they wear uniforms and show themselves in the open? Edited October 3, 2011 by bud Quote http://whoprofits.org/
Guest American Woman Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 oh wait..................they aren't allowed a standing army.............are they? Ummmm. Yeah. I've noticed how much fighting according to "what's allowed" means to them. Targeting civilian? Fine. Desirable. Applauded. Wearing a uniform that's not allowed? NEVER! They DO have their standards, eh? Quote
wyly Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 or the jewish resistance groups in the warsaw ghettos fighting against the occupier. why didn't they wear uniforms and show themselves in the open? what! .....are you saying the jewish resistance of the ghetto were, cowardly terrorists! say it ain't so! ...I'm shocked! they should've put on uni's and walked right up to those panzers in the open with their pistols and rocks ... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
GostHacked Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 It's difficult to understand why Israel doesn't kill them while they are in uniform, bravely fighting on the front line for what they so strongly believe in. Oh wait ................ they don't do that ................ do they? Might be due to the lack of having a nation to call their own to have their own standing army. But they should just create their own nation and tell everyone else to piss up a rope. Quote
Guest American Woman Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 Might be due to the lack of having a nation to call their own to have their own standing army. But they should just create their own nation and tell everyone else to piss up a rope. The U.S. managed to fight Britain before it was a nation. But yeah, the militants would never put together an army that's not allowed - because their standards - their morals and ethics - are too high. They simply target civilians instead.As a side note, they have their own government, their own elections, their own rockets that they launch at Israel .... But do keep making excuses for them. Can't expect them to fight out in the open where harm might come to them, eh? Quote
wyly Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 Ummmm. Yeah. I've noticed how much fighting according to "what's allowed" means to them. Targeting civilian? Fine. Desirable. Applauded. Wearing a uniform that's not allowed? NEVER! They DO have their standards, eh? with yearly compulsory service nearly everyone in israel is in the military so they're all legitimate targets...those who are not are (in US?Israeli military speak ) collateral damage...did the US give a rats ass that civilians were killed in Iraq? nooo....don't expect the other side to play by nicy nice rules when your side doesn't either... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
wyly Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 Might be due to the lack of having a nation to call their own to have their own standing army. But they should just create their own nation and tell everyone else to piss up a rope. ya I can picture Israel letting the palestinians building and air force, and assembling armored regiments so the palestinians can fight on a level playing field Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
segnosaur Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 It would be like the U.S. deciding to set up a daycare in Kabul for the children of soldiers shipped to Afghanistan.... your analogy sucks. they live and fight in gaza. Ummm... the total area of the Gaza strip is 360 km square. I'm pretty sure that a "terrorist father" who actually wanted to protect his kids could probably find somewhere in that 360 km to keep his kid safe. Heck, even if Israel decided to use a MOAB (the largest conventional explosive in the U.S. arsenal) the blast radius is 137m. That would mean that there's roughly 359.94 square kilometers in Gaza where he could have his kid live. Why do "terrorist fathers" have to keep their children by their side? (Well, ok, that was a rhetorical question... we know why terrorists keep their children around... so that they can try operating with impunity, and if Israel does try to fight back, they can get people like you claiming "Oh, Israel wants to kill Palestinian children". You do know that the Geneva convention specifically prohibits the use of human shields.) Quote
GostHacked Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 (edited) The U.S. managed to fight Britain before it was a nation. But yeah, the militants would never put together an army that's not allowed - because their standards - their morals and ethics - are too high. They simply target civilians instead.As a side note, they have their own government, their own elections, their own rockets that they launch at Israel .... Well, easy solution. Let them have their nation state, with a standing army, if they attack Israel and Israel retaliates, then I don't see a problem. Until then, this is very much a one sided issue where Israel has most if not all the cards. But do keep making excuses for them. Can't expect them to fight out in the open where harm might come to them, eh? Stating facts is not making excuses for anyone. But you can continue to do yourself a disservice by doing so. I wish both sides to stop, but that will fall on deaf ears on both sides of the occupational fence. Edited October 3, 2011 by GostHacked Quote
wyly Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 The U.S. managed to fight Britain before it was a nation. But yeah, the militants would never put together an army that's not allowed - because their standards - their morals and ethics - are too high. They simply target civilians instead.As a side note, they have their own government, their own elections, their own rockets that they launch at Israel .... But do keep making excuses for them. Can't expect them to fight out in the open where harm might come to them, eh? right, and no civilians were ever targeted by american revolutionary forces ...the british had no significant technological advantage over the revolutionary army either...if you had been alive during WW2 you'd be support the germans in their battle with the resistance forces of the occupied nations...not surprisingly the germans referred to the resistance fighters as terrorists as well... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
wyly Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 Ummm... the total area of the Gaza strip is 360 km square. I'm pretty sure that a "terrorist father" who actually wanted to protect his kids could probably find somewhere in that 360 km to keep his kid safe. Heck, even if Israel decided to use a MOAB (the largest conventional explosive in the U.S. arsenal) the blast radius is 137m. That would mean that there's roughly 359.94 square kilometers in Gaza where he could have his kid live. Why do "terrorist fathers" have to keep their children by their side? (Well, ok, that was a rhetorical question... we know why terrorists keep their children around... so that they can try operating with impunity, and if Israel does try to fight back, they can get people like you claiming "Oh, Israel wants to kill Palestinian children". You do know that the Geneva convention specifically prohibits the use of human shields.) when my father was done doing what ever he was doing during the day in occupied europe he still needed to come home every day to support his family, as did resistance agent down the street who died with his family in their home...there is no national infrastructure to support resistance fighters away from their homes, they do as they do in every occupied country, blend in with the population come out when it's safe... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
segnosaur Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 the jewish resistance groups in the warsaw ghettos also fought against the occupier. why didn't they wear uniforms and show themselves in the open? Let me get this straight... You're deliberately drawing a moral equivalence between the Jews under Nazi control (who generally had no ill-will towards Germany prior to the war and were more or less fighting for survival as the Germans attempted genocide) with the Palestinians in Gaza, who are run by a party that has (as their written and publically available policy) the elimination of Israel, and who's population over the past few decades as greatly increased? Wow, just... wow. Quote
wyly Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 Let me get this straight... You're deliberately drawing a moral equivalence between the Jews under Nazi control (who generally had no ill-will towards Germany prior to the war and were more or less fighting for survival as the Germans attempted genocide) with the Palestinians in Gaza, who are run by a party that has (as their written and publically available policy) the elimination of Israel, and who's population over the past few decades as greatly increased? Wow, just... wow. let me get this straight... You're deliberately not drawing a moral equivalence between the palestinian under zionist control (who generally had no ill-will towards jews prior to the take over of palestine and were more or less fighting for survival as the Germans zionists began a program of ethnic cleansing)as with the Jews in europe, who are run by a party that has (as their written and publically available policy) the elimination of palestine, and who's population over the past few decades as greatly increased? Wow, just... wow. Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
bud Posted October 3, 2011 Author Report Posted October 3, 2011 Let me get this straight... i'm comparing two groups, the people of gaza and the jews who lived in the warsaw ghettos. their similarities are striking: - both resisting an occupying force - superior weapons by the occupier vs inferior weaponry by the resistance forces - both are quarantined in an area with no freedom of movement - heavy blockades with an intense control over the limited goods going in - practice of assassination by the occupying force run by a party that has (as their written and publically available policy) the elimination of Israel, and who's population over the past few decades as greatly increased?Wow, just... wow. hamas' charter is pretty shitty. kind of like likud's platform to never allow a palestinian state. Quote http://whoprofits.org/
wyly Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 i'm comparing two groups, the people of gaza and the jews who lived in the warsaw ghettos. their similarities are striking: - both resisting an occupying force - superior weapons by the occupier vs inferior weaponry by the resistance forces - both are quarantined in an area with no freedom of movement - heavy blockades with an intense control over the limited goods going in - practice of assassination by the occupying force hamas' charter is pretty shitty. kind of like likud's platform to never allow a palestinian state. and the oblivious behaviour of the public in both situations in that they were doing nothing wrong, oppression/ethnic cleansing/ occupation was acceptable... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
segnosaur Posted October 3, 2011 Report Posted October 3, 2011 i'm comparing two groups, the people of gaza and the jews who lived in the warsaw ghettos. their similarities are striking: The only thing 'striking' is the way Palestian terrorist fans misuse the case of WW2-era jewish populations. - both resisting an occupying force Yet the Palestinians have elected a party that has, as its rule, the elimination of Israel. The Jews in Warsaw held no such desires for WW2-era Germany. - superior weapons by the occupier vs inferior weaponry by the resistance forces But then the Paelestinans have shown a willingness to use human sheids, something that I doubt the warsaw jews were doing. - practice of assassination by the occupying force Despite the assasinations, the population of Gaza has increased. The Jewish population in Poland? Errr... not so much. hamas' charter is pretty shitty. Ummmm... so? Despite their charter being well publicized, Palestinians still voted for them. Once again, let me stress that: Palestinians in Gaza voted for a party that openly declared that they were going to eliminate Israel. Not "live in peace". Not "End the occupation". But: eliminate another country. Reminds me of the Simpsons episode where Homer is deciding who to vote for mayor... Should I vote for Sideshow Bob? "Well, I disagree with his Bart killing policy. On the other hand..." You know, in the "civilized" world, if one party had such a blatant demonstration of racism they wouldn't get a million miles from power. Here's the thing... I certainly don't think Israel is blameless. But as long as people foolishly try to defend each and every action that the Palestinians do (regardless of how barbaric), it certainly makes it difficult to show any sympathy for their cause. I for example, certainly don't want to be associated with people who somehow thing a group that underwent the holocaust is somehow morally equivalent to a group who chooses to fire missles and mortars into Israeli territory. Quote
bud Posted October 3, 2011 Author Report Posted October 3, 2011 Yet the Palestinians have elected a party that has, as its rule, the elimination of Israel. The Jews in Warsaw held no such desires for WW2-era Germany. hamas wasn't around 20 years ago when the PLO (arafat) accepted the state of israel. what has happened since then is that israel has continued to drag its feet and continue to occupy and annex more arab land. hamas is a cause of the occupation and israel's unwillingness to allow a palestinian state. But then the Paelestinans have shown a willingness to use human sheids, something that I doubt the warsaw jews were doing. actually, the IDF has been shown to have used palestinians as human shields. this by numerous expert organizations and by the israeli court. The Israeli Defence Ministry will appeal against a supreme court ruling banning the use of Palestinian human shields in raids, officials said. Defence Minister Shaul Mofaz is prepared to make a personal appearance in court to defend the practice, ministry officials added. Human rights groups have frequently condemned the use of human shields. link Despite the assasinations, the population of Gaza has increased. The Jewish population in Poland? Errr... not so much. i never said they're the same but i did point out the similarities. israel uses many of the same tactics the nazis used against the jews in the ghettos. the militants in gaza, just like the warsaw ghetto militants are resisting the occupier. Ummmm... so? oops. did i get a blank stare about the israeli government vowing to never allow a palestinian state? where is your condemnation of the israeli government? hamas doesn't accept the state of israel and israel has vowed to never allow a plastinian state. it's in their platform. you need to acknowledge this. Quote http://whoprofits.org/
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