Albertan Sovereignty

[August1991]

I happen to think that Jack Layton wants to turn Quebec Inc into Canada Inc.

IOW, Alberta will no longer pay for Quebec Inc. It will also pay for a new, broader Canada Inc too.

Layton and the NDP, with support from voters in Quebec, have discovered a new source of "other people's money".

Layton wants to reduce "subsidies" to oil corporations. He wants to tax them, and give the money to "clean" energy producers.

Will people in Alberta continue to accept to pay taxes/equalization to other provincial governments? Why be vilified?

----

I'm no Albertan but even I can see the hypocrisy in this.

If Layton is Official Opposition leader, and if I were Albertan, I would do as Norway did. Opt out. Immediately. Norway is not part of the European Union, and doesn't use the euro. Norway has a wonderful reputation in the world, as an independant state. Yet, Norway is still a member of NATO.

Alberta, the Norway of the New World.

Edited April 29, 2011 by August1991

[mikedavid00]

Will people in Alberta continue to accept to pay taxes/equalization to other provincial governments?

I hope not. I would love to see them leave Canada so I could move there before their borders go up lol.. they would have lower taxes, private health-care, and no sales tax as well as a functioning immigration policy which is what is most important to me as it effects my daily life and career options.

[SSD]

Over-react much? The reality is that the NDP could form the official opposition but they don't have enough resources (not for years) to form the gov't. And if the Liberals hold the balance of power, most MPs would rather die than prop up an NDP-led coalition which would essentially kill the Liberal brand.

Separation has some support in Alberta but lets face it, the reason why Alberta would never opt out is because the oil era is about to end in a couple decades. They are going to need the other provinces as much as the other provinces need Alberta right now.

[August1991]

Over-react much?

Why is Norway not part of the EU?

[kimmy]

I have little doubt that Layton envisions raising huge sums through carbon/environmental taxes in Alberta, and funneling that money into R&D in established high-tech industries in Toronto, Montreal, and Vancouver. (that these are vote-rich, left-leaning areas is purely coincidental.)

I was particularly surprised that the Liberals are promising that carbon money raised in Alberta would remain in Alberta.

-k

[CPCFTW]

Would be sad to see... Alberta would likely become one of the top countries in the world in terms of GDP per capita (already around 50k GDP per capita). Once they leave they wont be coming back. They would likely become a hotbed for investment and growth would approach that of China with the low taxes and huge oil reserves. Meanwhile Canada would become a crippled economy with no growth. Good thing that a majority of Albertans are fiercely patriotic to Canada.

Edited April 29, 2011 by CPCFTW

[TimG]

I was particularly surprised that the Liberals are promising that carbon money raised in Alberta would remain in Alberta.

The only sensible statement I have heard on this topic.

[Smallc]

Meanwhile Canada would become a crippled economy with no growth.

Sure we would....

[Topaz]

So the first sign of trouble, you bail out?? For one thing, most of the oil companies are now investing in Green energy because they know it just a matter of time before the oil runs out or tech. invents replacement for oil and gas for autos and homes.

[Tilter]

Over-react much? The reality is that the NDP could form the official opposition but they don't have enough resources (not for years) to form the gov't. And if the Liberals hold the balance of power, most MPs would rather die than prop up an NDP-led coalition which would essentially kill the Liberal brand.

Separation has some support in Alberta but lets face it, the reason why Alberta would never opt out is because the oil era is about to end in a couple decades. They are going to need the other provinces as much as the other provinces need Alberta right now.

Over-react much? The reality is that the NDP could form the official opposition but they don't have enough resources (not for years) to form the gov't. And if the Liberals hold the balance of power, most MPs would rather die than prop up an NDP-led coalition which would essentially kill the Liberal brand.

The liberals are already DEAD-- so the biggest threat to Canada is a union of the Lefties and the dying Libs would do anything (except keep Iggy on) to regain power even as a part of a coalition Or part of another party---- they could even go begging to Duceppes

Separation has some support in Alberta but lets face it,

Let's be truthful and say "Separation has A LOT of support in Alberta"

oil era is about to end in a couple decades

OK greenie--- dream on. That phrase has been hanging around for 50 years and the demise of the "OIL ERA" is always about 20 years away. remember also--- there will ALWAYS be a demand for petrolium products in industry and also remember-- Alberta is not a one trick pony. Alberta was prospering province before Leduc and will remain that way as part of Canada or out. Also remember, BC & Sask border Alta and if you hear a loud WOOOOSH--- that'll be the Western Canada Party taking those 3 out of the Dominion. I hope soon as I too would like to live there.

[nittanylionstorm07]

This is silly. Even if the whiners in Alberta tried to get Alberta to leave, the rest of Canada wouldn't let them... and there is a lot more people in the rest of Canada.

[RNG]

This is silly. Even if the whiners in Alberta tried to get Alberta to leave, the rest of Canada wouldn't let them... and there is a lot more people in the rest of Canada.

So why is Quebec allowed referenda, if that's the correct plural.

[fellowtraveller]

Let's be truthful and say "Separation has A LOT of support in Alberta"

Buushit. Most of the people in Alberta are not from Alberta, and very few want to separate.

This OP is just more trolling from the TrollMeister, or should I say agent provocateur?

Why is Norway not part of the EU?

Because they don't need the financial drain of the EU and can easily afford the massive social contract they enjoy becuase they have lots of dead dinosaurs just offshore. Norway has been a soveriegn nation for a long time, and did not 'opt out', there was nothign previous to opt out from. They chose not to join, because basically it would be a majpor net loss financially for them.

Aberta is compeltely different, it has never been sovereign and never will be.

By the way, their is almost never any public whining or indeed any public discussion in Alberta about the amount paid in equalization to the feds and thus other provinces, or of the giant disparity in all federal funds spent here.

Albertans are unquestionably Canadians first, anything else second. If that makes us whiners, so be it.

Edited April 29, 2011 by fellowtraveller

[Smallc]

Albertans are unquestionably Canadians first, anything else second. If that makes us whiners, so be it.

I'm glad to hear that. From internet forums, it's sometimes hard to tell.

[Tilter]

Buushit. Most of the people in Alberta are not from Alberta, and very few want to separate.

This OP is just more trolling from the TrollMeister, or should I say agent provocateur?

Because they don't need the financial drain of the EU and can easily afford the massive social contract they enjoy becuase they have lots of dead dinosaurs just offshore. Norway has been a soveriegn nation for a long time, and did not 'opt out', there was nothign previous to opt out from. They chose not to join, because basically it would be a majpor net loss financially for them.

Aberta is compeltely different, it has never been sovereign and never will be.

By the way, their is almost never any public whining or indeed any public discussion in Alberta about the amount paid in equalization to the feds and thus other provinces, or of the giant disparity in all federal funds spent here.

Albertans are unquestionably Canadians first, anything else second. If that makes us whiners, so be it.

One could also say that

Because the Albertans don't need the financial drain of the Equalization payments and can easily afford the massive social contract they enjoy becuase they have lots of dead dinosaurs Under most of the province

[guyser]

One could also say that..Because the Albertans don't need the financial drain of the Equalization payments

Albertans pay the same federal tax as everyone else. You dont pay more, nor less.

Edited April 29, 2011 by guyser

[RNG]

Albertans pay the same federal tax as everyone else. You dont pay more, nor less.

Yes, but if he didn't have to have the Alberta government giving a whole bunch of their money to Quebec and the Maritimes, he could be paying a whole lot less.

[Smallc]

Yes, but if he didn't have to have the Alberta government giving a whole bunch of their money

You're misinformed. That doesn't happen.

[Mr.Canada]

Alberta isn't going to separate. This is silly thread. Yes, so silly I had to add my mind bending truth to it.

[guyser]

What he ^ said.

Edit to add: I mean two places above,not our resident Morton Downey Sr.

Edited April 29, 2011 by guyser

[Mr.Canada]

What he ^ said.

Edit to add: I mean two places above,not our resident Morton Downey Sr.

It was Jr. who was the right wing talk show guy.

[RNG]

You're misinformed. That doesn't happen.

In fact it does. In part, tax rates are adjusted such that the feds have money to give to the have-nots. Thus if they weren't, the tax rates would be lower.

Of course, if it were a lib or NDP government, they'd just find other places to piss it away.

[guyser]

It was Jr. who was the right wing talk show guy.

Well butter my chops.....I did not think you would get that one. (Even if I was wrong)

I stand corrected.

[guyser]

In fact it does. In part, tax rates are adjusted such that the feds have money to give to the have-nots. .

Uh....Nope

Tax rates are the same dude!

[Smallc]

In fact it does. In part, tax rates are adjusted such that the feds have money to give to the have-nots.

What? No. Provinces set their own tax rates. Alberta has a flat 10% tax above a certain tax free amount (amongst the lowest rates in Canada for earners of any income). Equalization comes only from federal taxes, and is given to provinces who do not meet a certain arithmetic average in terms of fiscal capacity. At current, those provinces are, from west to east: Manitoba, Ontario, Quebec, New Brunswick, Prince Edward Island, and Nova Scotia.

The problem some Albertans (and Ontarians) have with the current system is that they contribute more in federal taxes than they get back in federal services. As a have province, Alberta gets less from the Canada Health Transfer and no Equalization. Ontario, as a have not province, still pays out billions more than it receives.

Edited April 29, 2011 by Smallc