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Posted

What's "out there" about Miles Davis? I always thought he was one of the more conservative guys of his era.

Depends on which part of his cereer...

To me,Miles Davis is to the trumpet what Charlie Parker was to the Saxophone...

Brilliant and gifted,but a little strange...

Perhaps the fact that both were heroin addicts has something to do with it?

The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!

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Posted

Miles kicked heroin in the 50s. But, by strange, do you mean the music or the personality?

"I think it's fun watching the waldick get all excited/knickers in a knot over something." -scribblet
Posted

Miles kicked heroin in the 50s. But, by strange, do you mean the music or the personality?

Both...I find Miles Davis and Charlie Parker to be exceedingly ecclectic...

The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!

Posted

Miles was certainly eclectic in terms of his style. He went from hard bop to cool jazz to modal jazz to Hendrix-influenced fusion to that synth-pop he was playing when he died. But Charlie Parker was just Bird.

Miles' autobiography includes a great story of riding in the back of a car with Charlie Parker as Bird ate greasy fried chicken while being serviced by some "white bitch". He was certainly a character. :lol:

"I think it's fun watching the waldick get all excited/knickers in a knot over something." -scribblet
Posted (edited)

My favourite thing of all the things on the youtube machine:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZ5eGEest0g

And like Kimmy, I am also Buddy Rich when I'm flying off the handle. Who besides Gary Burghoff could top that solo?

Edited by BubberMiley
"I think it's fun watching the waldick get all excited/knickers in a knot over something." -scribblet
Posted

My Grandfather was a clarinet ans saxophone player...

That was very good because Parker played it fairly straight...

As far as the drumming goes...

I give you Mr.Moon...

The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!

Posted

That was very good because Parker played it fairly straight...

Charlie Parker never played anything straight. He was flying above the melody (like a "bird") in that solo, just like every other one.

The only difference is that was a slow song, so he doesn't seem so frenetic.

"Charlie Parker with Strings" is a great album to figure out what he was all about.

"I think it's fun watching the waldick get all excited/knickers in a knot over something." -scribblet
Posted

in the end it's all opinion, there is likely no greatest it's just the one or group we prefer...usually the music we hear in our formative puberty years into our 20's is what sticks with us...mrs wyly grew up with country music, GAWD! I hate twangy country music, long road trips are hell...

You poor man! That sort of abuse is grounds for divorce!

Won't she compromise with some folksy Willie Nelson? Or better yet, some modern country with some great guitar playing, like Keith Urban?

We should pass the hat for you and buy you an Ipod with some headphones that REALLY block out ambient sound!

"A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul."

-- George Bernard Shaw

"There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."

Posted

You poor man! That sort of abuse is grounds for divorce!

Won't she compromise with some folksy Willie Nelson? Or better yet, some modern country with some great guitar playing, like Keith Urban?

We should pass the hat for you and buy you an Ipod with some headphones that REALLY block out ambient sound!

Right! Everyone can at least stomach Willie Nelson. Or Johnny Cash. In fact, I used to have a CD of them playing together, live. I'm no country fan, but I liked it very much.

As scarce as truth is, the supply has always been in excess of the demand.

--Josh Billings

Posted

Right! Everyone can at least stomach Willie Nelson. Or Johnny Cash. In fact, I used to have a CD of them playing together, live. I'm no country fan, but I liked it very much.

Have you listened to Keith Urban, BM? He's a country star but he plays guitar like a Pat Travers or a Dominic Troiano...

"A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul."

-- George Bernard Shaw

"There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."

Posted

Have you listened to Keith Urban, BM? He's a country star but he plays guitar like a Pat Travers or a Dominic Troiano...

I'm aware of him, but no, never listened. I'll check it out.

As scarce as truth is, the supply has always been in excess of the demand.

--Josh Billings

Posted

Oh they ripped off all kinds of Blues bands...

Led Zeppelin Thievery

That's the dumbest video i've ever seen! Almost all those songs were covers that Zeppelin did. Yes its true, bands sometimes do covers. :rolleyes:

As for The Who, i love all things rock and classic rock, but The Who and Pink Floyd were 2 of the big classic rock bands i just never really got into much. They are ok, and have some decent songs, but just don't do a ton for me.

"All generalizations are false, including this one." - Mark Twain

Partisanship is a disease of the intellect.

Posted

That's the dumbest video i've ever seen! Almost all those songs were covers that Zeppelin did. Yes its true, bands sometimes do covers. :rolleyes:

As for The Who, i love all things rock and classic rock, but The Who and Pink Floyd were 2 of the big classic rock bands i just never really got into much. They are ok, and have some decent songs, but just don't do a ton for me.

It's awfully subjective. I'm not a big Who fan either. I don't dislike them, but have never really felt it. Same with Zeppelin.

Love Pink Floyd, however.

As scarce as truth is, the supply has always been in excess of the demand.

--Josh Billings

Posted

It's awfully subjective. I'm not a big Who fan either. I don't dislike them, but have never really felt it. Same with Zeppelin.

Love Pink Floyd, however.

same here...I have met anyone who didn't love Floyd I'm sure there some who don't but there can't be many...

“Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill

Posted

You poor man! That sort of abuse is grounds for divorce!

Won't she compromise with some folksy Willie Nelson? Or better yet, some modern country with some great guitar playing, like Keith Urban?

We should pass the hat for you and buy you an Ipod with some headphones that REALLY block out ambient sound!

willie and johnny I can handle...I like and his rockabilly...blue rodeo, i like a lot are they country?...keith urban I have a problem with, I hear he's a great guitarist but mrs wyly has the hots for him so he's not allowed to be played when I'm around or I leave the room(that means I leave the room :( )

I suppose what I really dislike is the hard core country...

was it Buddy Rich who said "country music is stupid music for stupid people"?...

“Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill

Posted

Oh. George Benson. Good one. Hmmmm... Ok, I see your Benson and Armatrading and toss in:

1. Steve Vai and (wait for it)

2. Pat Metheny

And I raise you...

1.Stevie Ray Vaughn

2.The late Terry Kath

The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!

Posted

could you play this well when you 5 or even now? jimi hendrix only began learning at 12 so it'll be hard hard for me to believe he as good as this kid when she's an adult...

That girl is obviously amazing, but she's a robot. A trained monkey who is very technically proficient at playing somebody else's work. Like Shwa said, let's see her when she's older see if she can write.

Hendrix isn't my #1 all-time fav guitar player, but the man can rake the axe like a God. I respected him even more when i started playing. There are guitarists who can play much faster or are have surpassed him in technical skill, but he is easily one of the most creative & artistic guitar players i've ever heard. The electric guitar is an extension of his body, and every note drips soul. Listening to a song like Voodoo Child, he's just raking with that insanely high gain & distortion it sounds like lightning striking a scrap-metal yard.

I'm not a guitar player so it's hard for me to debate the issue but I always thought of the best guitar players being in classical guitar but they don't enjoy rock guitarist higher public profile... my kids guitar teacher agrees says classical is more technical...

unless hendrix played classical how can you compare, is it even correct electric and acoustic guitar the same instrument...

I would say classical is more technical, but in a way they are different instruments with different sounds and playing techniques. But you can't say who is "the best" guitar player, it's all subjective. There are so many amazing guitar players who are nobody's that never got on the radio.

My opinion is that great guitar players aren't the most technical, it's all in how they make you feel when they play. Yngwie Malmsteen may play at the lighting speed and be a technical god, but i think most of his performing/songs are self-indulgent crap. The Edge is one of my favorite guitarists, and he is nothing special technically at all, but few play with as much emotion and the man never wastes a note.

I have other favorites like Tony Iommi (the God of riffs!), Kirk Hammett, Neil Young (a mad-man on the electric), Jimmy Page etc. all different reasons.

"All generalizations are false, including this one." - Mark Twain

Partisanship is a disease of the intellect.

Posted (edited)

That girl is obviously amazing, but she's a robot. A trained monkey who is very technically proficient at playing somebody else's work. Like Shwa said, let's see her when she's older see if she can write.

a trained monkey, really...considering she's only 5 what kind of stage presence do you expect her to have, Mozart was 5 when he began performing was he a trained monkey as well?...three other guitarists who I've shown that clip to(two of them professionals)say she's phenomenal, and she feels the music...and since when is there is an issue with playing someone else's music??? are you saying no one should play Bach, Mozart or Clapton tunes...and do you seriously expect a 5 year old to write as well as play? you're a hard man to please...

so according to your theory Yngwie Malmsteen is crap because he plays music written by Bach and Mozart ...and Clapton is crap because he plays crossroads by Robert Johnson

I would say classical is more technical, but in a way they are different instruments with different sounds and playing techniques. But you can't say who is "the best" guitar player, it's all subjective. There are so many amazing guitar players who are nobody's that never got on the radio.
electric guitar is easier to play, it just is...not that those play electric aren't talented 99% of the music I listen to includes electric guitars and I enjoy it but I have no issues admitting classical is the more difficult and has the better technicians...that's not subjective, personal taste is subjective... Edited by wyly

“Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill

Posted

same here...I have met anyone who didn't love Floyd I'm sure there some who don't but there can't be many...

Well...I love their music always have, but...I wish I had known about the long-term damage that can be done to people's ears in the space of a single night.

My ears have never stopped ringing since March 1973 - Maple Leaf Gardens.

A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.

Posted

And I raise you...

1.Stevie Ray Vaughn

2.The late Terry Kath

Oh, my. The stakes are high indeed. But I'm in, I'll see your Vaughn and Kath and raise you:

1. Chet Atkins

2. Jim Heath (the Right Reverend Horton Heat)

Posted

so according to your theory Yngwie Malmsteen is crap because he plays music written by Bach and Mozart ...and Clapton is crap because he plays crossroads by Robert Johnson

Holy mackerel, relax jack! I think you missed the part where i said she was "amazing". Never did i say she's "crap". I'm saying it's one thing to play like Mozart, it's another thing to play & write like Mozart.

"All generalizations are false, including this one." - Mark Twain

Partisanship is a disease of the intellect.

Posted (edited)

Holy mackerel, relax jack! I think you missed the part where i said she was "amazing". Never did i say she's "crap". I'm saying it's one thing to play like Mozart, it's another thing to play & write like Mozart.

I'm very relaxed thanks...you posted "amazing" then followed it with a condescending

A trained monkey who is very technically proficient at playing somebody else's work.
that was the implication you brushed off her talent as robotic...and now you raise the bar expecting her to play and write like mozart while none of the other guitarists mentioned in the thread were required to write until they were adults and they were given a pass when it came to playing other artists music...was Jimi Hendrix playing guitar and writing at 5yrs? nope 12, did Clapton play at 5yrs? nope 12 again...and I'm sure both were playing "somebody else's work" a long time before they wrote their own...

what's so hard about accepting the kid is a prodigy and likely already better than most adult guitarists...

Edited by wyly

“Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill

Posted (edited)

I'm very relaxed thanks...you posted "amazing" then followed it with a condescendingthat was the implication you brushed off her talent as robotic...and now you raise the bar expecting her to play and write like mozart while none of the other guitarists mentioned in the thread were required to write until they were adults and they were given a pass when it came to playing other artists music...was Jimi Hendrix playing guitar and writing at 5yrs? nope 12, did Clapton play at 5yrs? nope 12 again...and I'm sure both were playing "somebody else's work" a long time before they wrote their own...

You're taking some things i'm saying out of context. I was originally responding to this quote of yours:

could you play this well when you 5 or even now? jimi hendrix only began learning at 12 so it'll be hard hard for me to believe he as good as this kid when she's an adult...

What you implied is that because this girl is so amazing and technically proficient at age 5 (which she is), that she will very likely be better than Jimi Hendrix when she's an adult (btw Hendrix only got his 1st guitar at age 15). What i'm arguing is that her technical skills will almost certainly be better than Hendrix's when she's his age if she keeps playing, but that won't necessarily mean she'll be a better guitarist than him. My argument is/was that being technically proficient at the guitar is only part of a what makes a great guitarist, and that creativity and being able to write excellent original compositions is also a huge part of being a great guitarist. What made Hendrix so great wasn't just his technical proficiency, but his off-the-charts creativity/imagination he put into his playing (beyond anything i've personally heard before or since).

There are a ton of great technical guitarists. But like i said before, many of them can play at the speed of light with perfect form and play scales up and down the neck like crazy, but many also cannot write their own original compositions to save their live.

Example, here's a youtube guitar star Matt Rach. Did some of these videos at 15 years old:

As you see, he can play both electric and classical guitar with incredible technical talent. His classical form is almost perfect. I was very excited when i saw these videos and watched a whole bunch more of his & followed him over the years (he's probably about 20-21 years old now). However, both of the above videos are cover songs (though he reworked the "canon rock" piece brilliantly into his own from JerryC's original "canon rock"). But when i check out his original songs, pretty much all of them are mediocre or lame, nothing as good as his cover stuff. He just doesn't have a lot of talent seemingly for writing original creative compositions. There are so many other guitarists/musicians like this. My point is that being technically amazing doesn't always translate into being creatively talented too, meaning the logic of you thinking the 5 y/o girl will likely be better than Hendrix simply because she started a lot earlier doesn't jive.

what's so hard about accepting the kid is a prodigy and likely already better than most adult guitarists...

I agree with both things you just said. However, I stand by the robot/trained-monkey comparisons. The kid obviously has natural talent, but to be that good at that age she also obviously has been pushed incredibly hard by her (North Korean) parents and has put in hundreds if not thousands of hours of practice into her playing as anyone would have to do in order to get that good. But for a 5 year old, you can't really get any better and no i don't expect a 5 y/o to write their own original songs that complex.

Edited by Moonlight Graham

"All generalizations are false, including this one." - Mark Twain

Partisanship is a disease of the intellect.

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