pinko Posted February 1, 2011 Report Posted February 1, 2011 "Politically it is the best organized and most powerful opposition party in Egypt but its popularity has always hovered only about at 30% of the Egyptian population, without about 28% pro Mubarak and the rest really not affilited with one particular party or another but anti Mubarak." Yes. Here in Canada we have the Harperites who represent 30% of the voting public at the expense of the other 70%. Harper is an autocrat much in the same mould as Mubarak. Quote
Bonam Posted February 1, 2011 Report Posted February 1, 2011 Harper is an autocrat much in the same mould as Mubarak. Except not. Quote
pinko Posted February 1, 2011 Report Posted February 1, 2011 Harper caters to the narrow interests in his regionally based group of rednecks and bigots. He operates as if he is a monarch all the while showing contempt for Parliament. Quote
scribblet Posted February 1, 2011 Author Report Posted February 1, 2011 Yes. Here in Canada we have the Harperites who represent 30% of the voting public at the expense of the other 70%. Harper is an autocrat much in the same mould as Mubarak. Toto - I'm not in Kansas anymore sheez, get a grip man Quote Hey Ho - Ontario Liberals Have to Go - Fight Wynne - save our province
Bob Posted February 1, 2011 Report Posted February 1, 2011 (edited) Harper caters to the narrow interests in his regionally based group of rednecks and bigots. He operates as if he is a monarch all the while showing contempt for Parliament. Except he operates within the framework of a parliamentary democracy within which he has a minority and is outnumbered by leftists. Basically, he doesn't get much done as he is beholden to the system and his inability to command more support from Canadians. Seriously, what planet do you live on? Edited February 1, 2011 by Bob Quote My blog - bobinisrael.blogspot.com - I am writing on it, again!
Bob Posted February 1, 2011 Report Posted February 1, 2011 Toto - I'm not in Kansas anymore sheez, get a grip man Seriously. He needs to go read Gulag Archipelago or the Diary of Anne Frank and then cry some more about the oppressive system we all must endure under the Harper (aka Mubarak) regime in Canada. Quote My blog - bobinisrael.blogspot.com - I am writing on it, again!
bud Posted February 1, 2011 Report Posted February 1, 2011 the muslim brotherhood party and its affiliates exist in many governments throughout the arab world. they have been part of governments for decades. having them join an elected government in egypt will not make any difference. however, be prepared for egypt to refuse helping israel in keeping the gazans in a prison cell as not only the muslim brotherhood is against it, but most other parties in egypt are. Quote http://whoprofits.org/
Bob Posted February 1, 2011 Report Posted February 1, 2011 the muslim brotherhood party and its affiliates exist in many governments throughout the arab world. they have been part of governments for decades. having them join an elected government in egypt will not make any difference. however, be prepared for egypt to refuse helping israel in keeping the gazans in a prison cell as not only the muslim brotherhood is against it, but most other parties in egypt are. Why would we care if Egypt changed its border policies with Gaza, as long as they do their part to ensure that weapons don't get in in order to murder Jews? We could care less if Egypt gave all 1.5 million Gazans citizenship and took them in. All we care about is security. Quote My blog - bobinisrael.blogspot.com - I am writing on it, again!
scribblet Posted February 1, 2011 Author Report Posted February 1, 2011 (edited) Wild Bill greetings. The Muslim Brotherhood has quite the history. It was created and was first propped and sponsored by the Nazis. Then after WW2 Britain tried to use it to prevent Israel from becoming a state, then it was put underground by Nasser in the 1950's after it tried to kill him and was resurrected again as a prop of the CIA. It had no problem getting into bed with Western intelligence agencies or the Nazis when it suited its needs. Its original leaders were pro Nazi facists sharing the same hatred of Jews and moderates make no mistake. It believes in Sharia law and one Muslim theocracy of all Muslim nations under Sharia law. It sees a world of all of Africa, Asia, Indonesia, as one Muslim Caliphate empire. It subscribes to fundamentalist Islam. This means it believes in dhimmitude, i.e., anyone who is a Muslim can not enjoy the same state rights as a Muslim. It wants Israel dismantled and all Israelis killed or expelled and believes in violence to achieve this goal and thus supports and finances Hamas, Hezbollah and hundreds of terror cells in Algeria, Tunisia, egypt, Syria, Iraq, Iran, Turkey, Yemen and Saudi Arabia to name but a few Muslim countries. The Muslim Brotherhood is first and foremost an umbrella network of fundamentalist Muslims who see reclaiming the East under the umbrella of fundamentalist Muslim theocracy and a government structure identical to the one you see in Iran. It believes Westernized Arab women should be put back into head gear and back into a subservient role and has all the anti-democractic beliefs you would expect a totalitarian facist belief system to have. Because it is essentially facist, it was seen as a stooge by the CIA to fight the communist Russians in Afghanistan and it of course turned on the CIA as it did Nasser, Britain and anyone else who tried to use it. Anyone who says it is moderate is a joker. All you have to do is go on the internet and read its statements, positions and religious beliefs and history. The Ridiculous to suggest it is anything then what it is. It is also powerful. Its network is found in all Muslim countries, and it has active cells in the US, Europe, Canada, Mexico, Argentina, Brazil, Venezuela. The Egyptian Military is no fan of it but fears its extensive power network and there is good reason to believe as it did in Turkey it has infiltrated the military. The Muslim Brotherhood in Syria and the one in Egypt while they share the common enemy of Israel are otherwise enemies. The current Syrian Muslim Brotherhood is at odds with the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood and both brotherhoods are at odds with the Syrian government and experience friction with Iran and its proxy Hezbollah. Hamas which is a Muslim Brotherhood creation and stooge is split in two factions, one controlled by Egypt the other by Syria. The Syrian one currently dominates in Gaza. The Muslim Brotherhood in Sudan runs the country. The Muslim Brotherhood make no mistake is intolerant of Christians, Hindus, Zoroastrians, Assyrians, Berbers, Kurds, Druze, homosexuals, communists, trade unionists of any kind, feminists, Westernized Arabs, liberal and progressive Muslims as well as Israelis and Jews. It sees Europe and the US and all Westerners as the enemy. .... Thanks for the clarity Rue.... ETA: If the Brotherhood should be elected in free and fair elections (LOL) then we cannot do anything of course. Look how well Hamas is doing for their people. We and the U.S. of course can withhold foreign aid which is about 1.5 billion a year from the U.S. Hopefully if the worst happens and and Islamic theocracy comes to the power, Obama won't throw Israel under a bus to appease them. Edited February 1, 2011 by scribblet Quote Hey Ho - Ontario Liberals Have to Go - Fight Wynne - save our province
bud Posted February 1, 2011 Report Posted February 1, 2011 Why would we care if Egypt changed its border policies with Gaza, as long as they do their part to ensure that weapons don't get in in order to murder Jews? We could care less if Egypt gave all 1.5 million Gazans citizenship and took them in. All we care about is security. have you ever paused and tried looking outside of your eternal victimhood perspective to consider: - who is shooting the rockets? - why are they shooting the rockets? Quote http://whoprofits.org/
bud Posted February 1, 2011 Report Posted February 1, 2011 (edited) Thanks for the clarity Rue.... ETA: If the Brotherhood should be elected in free and fair elections (LOL) then we cannot do anything of course. Look how well Hamas is doing for their people. We we? who is we? and the U.S. of course can withhold foreign aid which is about 1.5 billion a year from the U.S. Hopefully if the worst happens and and Islamic theocracy comes to the power, Obama won't throw Israel under a bus to appease them. the u.s. should withhold foreign aid of $1.5 billion to egypt and $3 billion to israel. so far, the aid has done nothing but to support a dictator and a rogue state. Edited February 1, 2011 by bud Quote http://whoprofits.org/
Bitsy Posted February 1, 2011 Report Posted February 1, 2011 Wild Bill greetings. The Muslim Brotherhood has quite the history. It was created and was first propped and sponsored by the Nazis. Then after WW2 Britain tried to use it to prevent Israel from becoming a state, then it was put underground by Nasser in the 1950's after it tried to kill him and was resurrected again as a prop of the CIA. Do you have a link for any of those assertions? Quote
pinko Posted February 2, 2011 Report Posted February 2, 2011 (edited) Except he operates within the framework of a parliamentary democracy within which he has a minority and is outnumbered by leftists. Basically, he doesn't get much done as he is beholden to the system and his inability to command more support from Canadians. Seriously, what planet do you live on? I live in Canada and am a resident of Manitoba. You can be assured that when the next election is called my vote won't be going to Harper and his band of trained seals. Were the Harperites ever to get a majority then those social conservatives within their ranks would show their ugly heads. Harper and his party have links to the Republican Party and employ some of the same dishonest tactics utilized down south. Edited February 2, 2011 by pinko Quote
Jack Weber Posted February 2, 2011 Report Posted February 2, 2011 It is unclear to me why you fear the aspiration of a political entity wanting to gain power. If the elections are free and fair who are you to challenge the result if the people of Egypt choose the Mulsim Brotherhood as representative of their views. That is how democracy works. Fair enough... Are you prepared to go to war with these Islamofascists? Because they want war with you.... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
Jack Weber Posted February 2, 2011 Report Posted February 2, 2011 and adolf hitler was an alter boy in the catholic church so what's your point... Equating the Catholic Church with an Islamifascist organization.... And I'm not even Catholic!!! And you should look into Herr Schickelgruber and his,shall we say,occultic influences..See the Thule Society... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
pinko Posted February 2, 2011 Report Posted February 2, 2011 Fair enough... Are you prepared to go to war with these Islamofascists? Because they want war with you.... To my knowledge I haven't met any Islamofacists. What does such a person look like? Quote
Jack Weber Posted February 2, 2011 Report Posted February 2, 2011 Wild Bill greetings. The Muslim Brotherhood has quite the history. It was created and was first propped and sponsored by the Nazis. Then after WW2 Britain tried to use it to prevent Israel from becoming a state, then it was put underground by Nasser in the 1950's after it tried to kill him and was resurrected again as a prop of the CIA. It had no problem getting into bed with Western intelligence agencies or the Nazis when it suited its needs. Its original leaders were pro Nazi facists sharing the same hatred of Jews and moderates make no mistake. It believes in Sharia law and one Muslim theocracy of all Muslim nations under Sharia law. It sees a world of all of Africa, Asia, Indonesia, as one Muslim Caliphate empire. It subscribes to fundamentalist Islam. This means it believes in dhimmitude, i.e., anyone who is a Muslim can not enjoy the same state rights as a Muslim. It wants Israel dismantled and all Israelis killed or expelled and believes in violence to achieve this goal and thus supports and finances Hamas, Hezbollah and hundreds of terror cells in Algeria, Tunisia, egypt, Syria, Iraq, Iran, Turkey, Yemen and Saudi Arabia to name but a few Muslim countries. The Muslim Brotherhood is first and foremost an umbrella network of fundamentalist Muslims who see reclaiming the East under the umbrella of fundamentalist Muslim theocracy and a government structure identical to the one you see in Iran. It believes Westernized Arab women should be put back into head gear and back into a subservient role and has all the anti-democractic beliefs you would expect a totalitarian facist belief system to have. Because it is essentially facist, it was seen as a stooge by the CIA to fight the communist Russians in Afghanistan and it of course turned on the CIA as it did Nasser, Britain and anyone else who tried to use it. Anyone who says it is moderate is a joker. All you have to do is go on the internet and read its statements, positions and religious beliefs and history. The Ridiculous to suggest it is anything then what it is. It is also powerful. Its network is found in all Muslim countries, and it has active cells in the US, Europe, Canada, Mexico, Argentina, Brazil, Venezuela. The Egyptian Military is no fan of it but fears its extensive power network and there is good reason to believe as it did in Turkey it has infiltrated the military. The Muslim Brotherhood in Syria and the one in Egypt while they share the common enemy of Israel are otherwise enemies. The current Syrian Muslim Brotherhood is at odds with the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood and both brotherhoods are at odds with the Syrian government and experience friction with Iran and its proxy Hezbollah. Hamas which is a Muslim Brotherhood creation and stooge is split in two factions, one controlled by Egypt the other by Syria. The Syrian one currently dominates in Gaza. The Muslim Brotherhood in Sudan runs the country. The Muslim Brotherhood make no mistake is intolerant of Christians, Hindus, Zoroastrians, Assyrians, Berbers, Kurds, Druze, homosexuals, communists, trade unionists of any kind, feminists, Westernized Arabs, liberal and progressive Muslims as well as Israelis and Jews. It sees Europe and the US and all Westerners as the enemy. To try portray it as otherwise is a joke. Politically it is the best organized and most powerful opposition party in Egypt but its popularity has always hovered only about at 30% of the Egyptian population, without about 28% pro Mubarak and the rest really not affilited with one particular party or another but anti Mubarak. Spot on,sir!!! Especially the part about the NAZI/Fscist influence on Islamic fundementalists...And,the NAZI/Fascistic leanings of the Pan-Arab Ba'Athists... I and DogonPorch salute you!!!! Sadly,there is no democratic option in Egypt once the Fascit thug Mubarak is gone...This is the obvious reason why El Baradei is being parachuted in as some sort of democratic "white night"... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
Jack Weber Posted February 2, 2011 Report Posted February 2, 2011 To my knowledge I haven't met any Islamofacists. What does such a person look like? Ayman El Zwahiri,for one...The Muslim cleric that speak for Hezbollah,for another...Osama Bin Laden,for another... These people learned ver well to co-opt a faith with the ideology of their Fascist taskmasters in the Ba'Athist regimes where they came from... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
pinko Posted February 2, 2011 Report Posted February 2, 2011 Ayman El Zwahiri,for one...The Muslim cleric that speak for Hezbollah,for another...Osama Bin Laden,for another... These people learned ver well to co-opt a faith with the ideology of their Fascist taskmasters in the Ba'Athist regimes where they came from... I live in Winnipeg and don't ever expect to come in contact with this person. Has it ever occurred to you that in Egypt, for example, such an individual might be rejected in favour of others? Quote
Jack Weber Posted February 2, 2011 Report Posted February 2, 2011 I live in Winnipeg and don't ever expect to come in contact with this person. Has it ever occurred to you that in Egypt, for example, such an individual might be rejected in favour of others? Sure it's occurred to me... But I have'nt seen a viable democratic option in Egypt because Mubarak crushed them all... Guess what's behing door #2? Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
pinko Posted February 2, 2011 Report Posted February 2, 2011 (edited) Sure it's occurred to me... But I have'nt seen a viable democratic option in Egypt because Mubarak crushed them all... Guess what's behing door #2? Good point and that is probably why it would be better for all concerned if Mubarak would relinquish his position today. Based on the link I have provided he and his supporters seem to wish otherwise. There may very well be a secular option that you have failed to take into account behind that door. http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/egyptian-president-mubarak-to-speak-after-massive-protest-demanding-his-ouster-115039994.html Edited February 2, 2011 by pinko Quote
Jack Weber Posted February 2, 2011 Report Posted February 2, 2011 Good point and that is probably why it would be better for all concerned if Mubarak would relinquish his position today. Based on the link I have provided he and his supporters seem to wish otherwise. There may very well be a secular option that you have failed to take into account behind that door. http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/egyptian-president-mubarak-to-speak-after-massive-protest-demanding-his-ouster-115039994.html Yes... I'm watching CNN right now and watching,essentially,a riot between the anti-Mubarak crowd and what's being called the "Pro-Stability" crowd. The fact of the matter is that in chaos like this you need organizational order.The only organization I see meeting this is the Muslim Brotherhood.This would be the worst possible option. I guess I'm a cynic,however,after the euphoria of watching despotic Fascist dictators being overthrown I ask myself the obvious question of ,"What's next?"... Sadly I don't see democracy in thse places because these places seem to be places where extremism and authoritarianism reigns supreme.And I don't hav a good feeling about the futur when I see the potential for entire states to fall into the hands of Islamofascists,who are intent on killing anyone who is either and infidel,or not "Islamic enough"... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
pinko Posted February 2, 2011 Report Posted February 2, 2011 (edited) Yes... I'm watching CNN right now and watching,essentially,a riot between the anti-Mubarak crowd and what's being called the "Pro-Stability" crowd. The fact of the matter is that in chaos like this you need organizational order.The only organization I see meeting this is the Muslim Brotherhood.This would be the worst possible option. I guess I'm a cynic,however,after the euphoria of watching despotic Fascist dictators being overthrown I ask myself the obvious question of ,"What's next?"... Sadly I don't see democracy in thse places because these places seem to be places where extremism and authoritarianism reigns supreme.And I don't hav a good feeling about the futur when I see the potential for entire states to fall into the hands of Islamofascists,who are intent on killing anyone who is either and infidel,or not "Islamic enough"... The tactics employed by Mubarak's supporters are to be expected and perhaps were predictable. It is quite obvious when you watch Mubarak speak and observe his body language that he takes unkindly to a challenge to his authority. As I see it the problem is created through the oppression created over the decades and in particular during the reign of terror under Mubarak's watch. Unless I am misunderstanding you the fear you have is that a caliphate is in the making. There may be some merit to what you say but only time will tell. It may very well be this is a new beginning which may lead, in the long run, to a free and democratic Egypt. Edited February 2, 2011 by pinko Quote
scribblet Posted February 2, 2011 Author Report Posted February 2, 2011 There's a decent piece today from Warren Kinsella, maybe it's better the devil you know than the devil you don't know - be careful what you wish for http://www.torontosun.com/comment/columnists/warren_kinsella/2011/01/31/17105661.html The answer desired by the West and Israel is not, unfortunately, the answer we are now likely to get. According to Egypt-watchers, the most potent opposition force to the Mubarak dictatorship is (and always has been) the banned Muslim Brotherhood. And rule by the Brotherhood — or, as it is sometimes known, MB or al-Ikhwan — may leave many modern Egyptians wondering whether they have traded one devil for a more fearsome one.Formed nearly a century ago in Egypt, the Muslim Brotherhood is considered the most influential Islamist movement on the planet. It officially disavows violence, and condemned the 9/11 attacks. But a youthful Osama bin Laden, among others, was greatly influenced by Muslim Brotherhood scholars. And one of the Brotherhood's most powerful voices, still, favours a return of sharia law — and a bloody war of jihad to dominate the Muslim world. Ominously, the Brotherhood established links with Adolf Hitler's Nazi regime in the 1930s, and supported acts of terror against British forces in Palestine. The group energetically circulated Arab-language copies of Mein Kampf, as well as the notorious anti-Semitic forgery, The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion. Much more recently, Brotherhood-supported candidates won enough votes to form the largest opposition bloc in Egypt's legislature. Not all those linked to the Brotherhood are dangerous, however. The moderate Muslim Association of Canada (some of whose leadership I know, and consider modern and pluralist) freely admits its association with the Brotherhood. And Public Safety Canada does not list the Brotherhood as one of the extremist "entities" banned in this country. ------ Thus, The Arafat Principle: The current guy is indeed no good. But, soon enough, we all may find that his successors may be much, much worse. Quote Hey Ho - Ontario Liberals Have to Go - Fight Wynne - save our province
pinko Posted February 2, 2011 Report Posted February 2, 2011 There's a decent piece today from Warren Kinsella, maybe it's better the devil you know than the devil you don't know - be careful what you wish for http://www.torontosun.com/comment/columnists/warren_kinsella/2011/01/31/17105661.html You mean this devil http://www.truth-out.org/jeff-cohen-fear-extreme-islamists-arab-world-blame-washington67267 Quote
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