Rand Paul Racist or Flip Flopper?

[Michael Hardner]

If you sample the bleating sheeple worshiping Obama as a god, in a sea of mindless emotionalism for this mediocrity of a man-

But if he inherited the crown, then you would pledge fealty to him ?

Just trying to clarify your pro-monarchy stance ?

[lictor616]

If the measure of correctness or appropriateness of an individual is linked to the degree of stupidity of the comments he makes, you too could have a shot at political greatness.

But it ain't...stupid comments like the people who make them are a dime a dozen and they are only noitable when they come from someone who has previoulsy escaped scrutiny.

what was stupid about Paul's statement again?

[Jack Weber]

If you sample the bleating sheeple worshiping Obama as a god, in a sea of mindless emotionalism for this mediocrity of a man- you don't see a contradiction with your statement...

Were'nt there a sizable group of bleating sheeple mindlessly worshiping one of your "hero's"...oh...about 70 or so years ago?

[lictor616]

Were'nt there a sizable group of bleating sheeple mindlessly worshiping one of your "hero's"...oh...about 70 or so years ago?

which sheeple and hero would that be?

[Jack Weber]

which sheeple and hero would that be?

Name a few of your "ethnic hero's" from the 20th century,and the masses that followed them,and we'll see if I'm right...

[lictor616]

Name a few of your "ethnic hero's" from the 20th century,and the masses that followed them,and we'll see if I'm right...

Hero`s hmmmm, none really, I suppose I could name Julius Evola and Yukio Mishima... People I respect greatly include: Oswald Spengler, Francis Parker Yockey, H. L. Mencken, Georges Sorel, Von Mises, Sobran, Lothrop Stoddard...

[Jack Weber]

Hero`s hmmmm, none really, I suppose I could name Julius Evola and Yukio Mishima... People I respect greatly include: Oswald Spengler, Francis Parker Yockey, H. L. Mencken, Georges Sorel, Von Mises, Sobran, Lothrop Stoddard...

How 'bout Oswald Mosely or George Rockwell?

For that matter...Malcolm X(before his enlightening voyage to Mecca),Eldridge Cleaver,W.E.B DuBois,Albert Pike,and,Aleister Crowely?

Edited May 31, 2010 by Jack Weber

[lictor616]

How 'bout Oswald Mosely or George Rockwell?

Don't know rockwell, Mosely was certainly a noble son of Europe, unfortunately he failed to save Britain... not much heroics there.

[Jack Weber]

Don't know rockwell, Mosely was certainly a noble son of Europe, unfortunately he failed to save Britain... not much heroics there.

Rockwell was the leader of the American NAZI party...

Hmmm...Mosely was a Black Shirt Fascist...A sympathizer of both Benito Mussolini and Adolph Hitler.A big fan of Franco and Oliviera...

He failed to save Britain?

Explain that because I would think Sir Winston Churchill fits that mould.Unless you feel the opposite outcome of the Battle of Britain would have been more preferable?

[lictor616]

Rockwell was the leader of the American NAZI party...

Hmmm...Mosely was a Black Shirt Fascist...A sympathizer of both Benito Mussolini and Adolph Hitler.A big fan of Franco and Oliviera...

He failed to save Britain?

Explain that because I would think Sir Winston Churchill fits that mould.Unless you feel the opposite outcome of the Battle of Britain would have been more preferable?

Moseley's position vis a vis the war that destroyed the British Empire in hindsight was indeed preferable by comparative standards.

It was Britain who for all practical purposes began that fratricidal and useless war. Under that loathsome degenerate Churchill (a war criminal in his own right).

The preferable outcome would have been (as Churchill in his last days himself conceded) an alliance with European powers to stamp out the far worst Communist threat. You have only to look at the degradation and squalor of little Britain today, and ask yourself, What would Churchill say? about the 821 mosques, the abandonment of everything british, the vast void of nothing that british culture has become...

What would other heros such as Montgomery say?

[Jack Weber]

Moseley's position vis a vis the war that destroyed the British Empire in hindsight was indeed preferable by comparative standards.

It was Britain who for all practical purposes began that fratricidal and useless war. Under that loathsome degenerate Churchill (a war criminal in his own right).

The preferable outcome would have been (as Churchill in his last days himself conceded) an alliance with European powers to stamp out the far worst Communist threat. You have only to look at the degradation and squalor of little Britain today, and ask yourself, What would Churchill say? about the 821 mosques, the abandonment of everything british, the vast void of nothing that british culture has become...

What would other heros such as Montgomery say?

Hobsian choice,would'nt you say?

Ally with Hitler and Mussolini to defeat Stalin,and deal with the genocidal nature of the NAZI's,or follow history as it happened.

Either way,we're talking death on massive scale.

Fratricidal?

You do realize that Europe was basically in tribal(fratricidal) conflict for about 500 years(give or take a century) until 1945?

I think you've been reading too much of Pat Buchannon's book...

[lictor616]

Hobsian choice,would'nt you say?

Ally with Hitler and Mussolini to defeat Stalin,and deal with the genocidal nature of the NAZI's,or follow history as it happened.

Either way,we're talking death on massive scale.

Fratricidal?

You do realize that Europe was basically in tribal(fratricidal) conflict for about 500 years(give or take a century) until 1945?

I think you've been reading too much of Pat Buchannon's book...

Hobsian Choice ? what the hell are you on about?

The genocidal nature of the nazi's? How does 6 million compare to 7 to 10 in PEACE time for the communist BEFORE the war during the Ukraine Holodomor?

I mean if genocide and democide was REALLY what we wanted to oppose, again the question remains: WHY PICK ON THE GERMANS...

Is it because the German's persecuted the kinsman of Mayer Amschel Rotschield, Bernard Baruch, Colonel House, Roosevelt the half jew? The Warburgs, Oppenheim's, Speyers that financed the war?

Communism destroyed 119 million lives after 1945 in its blood-soaked reign, WITHOUT massive war mind you...

if you can honestly look at that AND the comparatively horrible living conditions of communist occupied countries and still pick the commie side... then you've simply lost your humanity and should stop your phony posturing and feigned concern about "genocide and human toll"... because your hypocrisy stinks

[Jack Weber]

Hobsian Choice ? what the hell are you on about?

The genocidal nature of the nazi's? How does 6 million compare to 7 to 10 in PEACE time for the communist BEFORE the war during the Ukraine Holodomor?

I mean if genocide and democide was REALLY what we wanted to oppose, again the question remains: WHY PICK ON THE GERMANS...

Is it because the German's persecuted the kinsman of Mayer Amschel Rotschield, Bernard Baruch, Colonel House, Roosevelt the half jew? The Warburgs, Oppenheim's, Speyers that financed the war?

Communism destroyed 119 million lives after 1945 in its blood-soaked reign, WITHOUT massive war mind you...

if you can honestly look at that AND the comparatively horrible living conditions of communist occupied countries and still pick the commie side... then you've simply lost your humanity and should stop your phony posturing and feigned concern about "genocide and human toll"... because your hypocrisy stinks

Hypocrisy?

You'll get no arguement from me that both Soviet communism and Maoist communism were epic failures of human misery.In fact,Mao was worse!

You'll have to explain where I'm picking the "commie side"?

But let's be clear,while the body count total of the communist world is higher than the fascist world of that era,(and based on disatrous eco/agricultural policies and ethnic cleansing),it's only higher than the fascist side of things because of the timespan involved.The NAZI's murdered 6 million Jews,but they murdered at least 8 million more who were non-Jews.Slavs,Poles,Russians,gypsies,mentally retarded,physically handicapped,etc.In fact,before killing many of those,hideous and wierd experiments were performed on many by the likes of Dr.Joseph Mengele.

If given the time,do you really believe that Her Schicklegruber really wanted to get along with his non-Nordic European brothers?I mean from a Mein Kampf,Arayan,Racial Hierarchical point of view?And assuming this great fascist victory occurred,and the megalomaniacal Schicklegruber got his way,how long before an attack on subSaharan Africa to rid the Arayans of those subhumanoid and inferior Negroids?Middle East?Asian subcontinent?The Chinese and other Southeast Asians?

What do you think the NAZI/fascist body count would have been if given 50 or 60 years?

Yet you think we should have collaborated with Adolph Hitler and Benito Mussolini(and Franco and Oliviera) to defeat Stalin...That's the Hobsian choice I'm speaking of...

Edited June 1, 2010 by Jack Weber

[lictor616]

But let's be clear,while the body count total of the communist world is higher than the fascist world of that era,(and based on disatrous eco/agricultural policies and ethnic cleansing),it's only higher than the fascist side of things because of the timespan involved.

loool!!?

Where's your point of reference here?? we already knew about Katyn, Vinitsya, the Holodomor, death camps (GULAG SYSTEM) purges etc. In peace time the communists were murdering MILLIONS in orgies of bestiality too sick to even describe here years BEFORE the war.

AND!... here's the scary part: They did this without the benefit of a hot war!

The nazi legacy in peace time was one of 0% unemployment, peaceful orderly cities, abundant food, a stupendously productive technological sector (it was the apogee of Europe really, perhaps for all time) and except for the t4 Aktion euthanasia program which (if we're honest here) euthanized the mentally retarded and ill, the diseased and dangerous, there was the expelling of the about 30 000 of Germany's 500 000 jews (jews were encouraged to leave ASAP).

So in retrospect: you have Germany: who,s only official extermination program in peace time was the culling of the most wretched portion of Germany: the retarded, the cripple, the degenerate (entartete und erbkrank)

while communism was high on the hog killing noble statesmen, scientists, politicians, poets, artists, financial agents, generals... in essence anyone who excelled and showed the lie of human equality... they DECAPITATED the nations they occupied (by destroying the leadership of every nation: thus weakening them irreparably)

and on the other hand you have Germany, who killed its useless in as humane a way as was possible at the time.

Oh and lets not forget (for all you liberals out there) that Nazi Germany pioneered animal rights laws, environmental protection laws, womens rights and empowerment etc.

given these two countries and their records... you still think picking the communists was a better thing to do?

i'm stumped.

[Jack Weber]

loool!!?

Where's your point of reference here?? we already knew about Katyn, Vinitsya, the Holodomor, death camps (GULAG SYSTEM) purges etc. In peace time the communists were murdering MILLIONS in orgies of bestiality too sick to even describe here years BEFORE the war.

AND!... here's the scary part: They did this without the benefit of a hot war!

The nazi legacy in peace time was one of 0% unemployment, peaceful orderly cities, abundant food, a stupendously productive technological sector (it was the apogee of Europe really, perhaps for all time) and except for the t4 Aktion euthanasia program which (if we're honest here) euthanized the mentally retarded and ill, the diseased and dangerous, there was the expelling of the about 30 000 of Germany's 500 000 jews (jews were encouraged to leave ASAP).

So in retrospect: you have Germany: who,s only official extermination program in peace time was the culling of the most wretched portion of Germany: the retarded, the cripple, the degenerate (entartete und erbkrank)

while communism was high on the hog killing noble statesmen, scientists, politicians, poets, artists, financial agents, generals... in essence anyone who excelled and showed the lie of human equality... they DECAPITATED the nations they occupied (by destroying the leadership of every nation: thus weakening them irreparably)

and on the other hand you have Germany, who killed its useless in as humane a way as was possible at the time.

Oh and lets not forget (for all you liberals out there) that Nazi Germany pioneered animal rights laws, environmental protection laws, womens rights and empowerment etc.

given these two countries and their records... you still think picking the communists was a better thing to do?

i'm stumped.

Your original question was a hypothetical "what if"...I'm not suggesting the Soviets were anything but barbaric,in fact Auschwitz did'nt shut down at the end of the War.It was,in fact,used well after the War to exterminate "enemies of the state".It should be noted that the words above the gates at Auschwitz said "Arbeits Macht Frei" or Work Makes Free...Variations of this were known to be seen above many forced labour camps in Siberia.

I wonder wher Stalin got that idea????Hmmm...That's a tough one!

Your points about "culling the weak" I'l let others comment on,if they so choose...

By the way,why do you suppose that the Jews were asked(I'm sure it was in a polite fashion) to leave ASAP?

You still have avoided my question on your opinion about how things would look if we had the hypothetical outcome you speak of.

Please reread my previous post to understand it fully...I'm keenly interested in your response...

Edited June 1, 2010 by Jack Weber

[lictor616]

By the way,why do you suppose that the Jews were asked(I'm sure it was in a polite fashion) to leave ASAP?

You still have avoided my question on your opinion about how things would look if we had the hypothetical outcome you speak of.

Please reread my previous post to understand it fully...I'm keenly interested in your response...

You're still dodging the obvious answer to my question: judging by the historical record: Germany Peace time vs Communist States Peace time, which were better? which was less conducive to democides, genocides and misery?

The answer unambiguously: should be GERMANY. UNDENIABLY SO!

Even in war time: in so far as looting and rape and unnecessary brutality was concerned: the best behaved army on the battlefield were again: the Germans.

Russians were INSTRUCTED as an ORDER: to rape ANY and EVERY woman on sight, Ilya Ehrenburg (who, for some reason or other managed to be jewish) the top propagandist for Russian troops instructed in one propaganda leaflet headlined "Kill," Ehrenburg incited Soviet soldiers to treat Germans as sub-human. The final paragraph concludes:

“The Germans are not human beings. From now on the word German means to use the most terrible oath. From now on the word German strikes us to the quick. We shall not speak any more. We shall not get excited. We shall kill. If you have not killed at least one German a day, you have wasted that day ... If you cannot kill your German with a bullet, kill him with your bayonet. If there is calm on your part of the front, or if you are waiting for the fighting, kill a German in the meantime. If you leave a German alive, the German will hang a Russian and rape a Russian woman. If you kill one German, kill another -- there is nothing more amusing for us than a heap of German corpses. Do not count days, do not count kilometers. Count only the number of Germans killed by you. Kill the German -- that is your grandmother's request. Kill the German -- that is your child's prayer. Kill the German -- that is your motherland's loud request. Do not miss. Do not let through. Kill.” (Alfred de Zayas, Nemesis at Potsdam (London: Roudedge & Kegan Paul, 2nd edition, 1979), pp. 6546, 201; Erich Kern (ed.), Verheimlichte Dokumente (Munich: FZ- Verlag, 1988), pp. 260-61, 353-55.)

again... i don't understand how one could see the Communists as being the "lesser evil"... the proof is obviously overwhelming that the Germans were far better behaved, far more rational, far more humane.

OH! And by the way: German antipathy towards jews was not (as the history channel loves to tell us) completely nutty and not based in blind hatred. I know TV likes to portray jews as blameless victims who were despised not because of their own actions: but because of insane random unrelated hatred.

The fact was that Germans understood that Bernard Baruch and many other jews in the Wilson administration during WW1 were able to influence the US into entering a war with Germany, thus having a hand in their horrible defeat. There were other insults as well, the Balfour declaration is duly noted.

There was also the fact that Jews were notorious inciters of revolution and disruptive: the biggest proponents of communism were often Jews, Karl Marx, Lenin, Trotsky, et al. Many high ranking operatives such as the infamous monster: Lazar Moiseyevitch Kaganovich (the butcher of Ukraine: who's policies killed 7 to 10 million ukrainians during the holodomor of 32-33, including 3 million children) were Jews,

Then there were niggles; the quite hateful religion who teaches that only jews are humans, the blood libel that Germans suffered in earlier times, the fact that prostitution and drug trafficking was for all practical purposes a Jewish industry:

Hitler in Mein Kampf noted for instance that: (while on the subject of social vices including prostitution and white-slave traffic in Vienna):

"I recognized the Jew as the cold-hearted, shameless and calculating director of this revolting vice traffic in the scum of the big city, a cold shudder ran down my back..."

And looking at our current circumstances, how the porn industry is dominated by Jews, (just as any media) as well as the current sex slave trade that goes son in Israel in complete impunity, we have first hand experience with just what he was on about.

I'm not here trying to defend Hitler on all accounts. Nor am I saying that the Germans were angels- of course not, the Germans were at times brutal and were guilty of crimes time and time again.

But to be fair, we must be able to compare them to others who we chose as our allies. I think its a legitimate point.

Edited June 1, 2010 by lictor616

[Jack Weber]

You're still dodging the obvious answer to my question: judging by the historical record: Germany Peace time vs Communist States Peace time, which were better? which was less conducive to democides, genocides and misery?

The answer unambiguously: should be GERMANY. UNDENIABLY SO!

Even in war time: in so far as looting and rape and unnecessary brutality was concerned: the best behaved army on the battlefield were again: the Germans.

Russians were INSTRUCTED as an ORDER: to rape ANY and EVERY woman on sight, Ilya Ehrenburg (who, for some reason or other managed to be jewish) the top propagandist for Russian troops instructed in one propaganda leaflet headlined "Kill," Ehrenburg incited Soviet soldiers to treat Germans as sub-human. The final paragraph concludes:

“The Germans are not human beings. From now on the word German means to use the most terrible oath. From now on the word German strikes us to the quick. We shall not speak any more. We shall not get excited. We shall kill. If you have not killed at least one German a day, you have wasted that day ... If you cannot kill your German with a bullet, kill him with your bayonet. If there is calm on your part of the front, or if you are waiting for the fighting, kill a German in the meantime. If you leave a German alive, the German will hang a Russian and rape a Russian woman. If you kill one German, kill another -- there is nothing more amusing for us than a heap of German corpses. Do not count days, do not count kilometers. Count only the number of Germans killed by you. Kill the German -- that is your grandmother's request. Kill the German -- that is your child's prayer. Kill the German -- that is your motherland's loud request. Do not miss. Do not let through. Kill.” (Alfred de Zayas, Nemesis at Potsdam (London: Roudedge & Kegan Paul, 2nd edition, 1979), pp. 6546, 201; Erich Kern (ed.), Verheimlichte Dokumente (Munich: FZ- Verlag, 1988), pp. 260-61, 353-55.)

again... i don't understand how one could see the Communists as being the "lesser evil"... the proof is obviously overwhelming that the Germans were far better behaved, far more rational, far more humane.

OH! And by the way: German antipathy towards jews was not (as the history channel loves to tell us) completely nutty and not based in blind hatred. I know TV likes to portray jews as blameless victims who were despised not because of their own actions: but because of insane random unrelated hatred.

The fact was that Germans understood that Bernard Baruch and many other jews in the Wilson administration during WW1 were able to influence the US into entering a war with Germany, thus having a hand in their horrible defeat. There were other insults as well, the Balfour declaration is duly noted.

There was also the fact that Jews were notorious inciters of revolution and disruptive: the biggest proponents of communism were often Jews, Karl Marx, Lenin, Trotsky, et al. Many high ranking operatives such as the infamous monster: Lazar Moiseyevitch Kaganovich (the butcher of Ukraine: who's policies killed 7 to 10 million ukrainians during the holodomor of 32-33, including 3 million children) were Jews,

Then there were niggles; the quite hateful religion who teaches that only jews are humans, the blood libel that Germans suffered in earlier times, the fact that prostitution and drug trafficking was for all practical purposes a Jewish industry:

Hitler in Mein Kampf noted for instance that: (while on the subject of social vices including prostitution and white-slave traffic in Vienna):

"I recognized the Jew as the cold-hearted, shameless and calculating director of this revolting vice traffic in the scum of the big city, a cold shudder ran down my back..."

And looking at our current circumstances, how the porn industry is dominated by Jews, (just as any media) as well as the current sex slave trade that goes son in Israel in complete impunity, we have first hand experience with just what he was on about.

I'm not here trying to defend Hitler on all accounts. Nor am I saying that the Germans were angels- of course not, the Germans were at times brutal and were guilty of crimes time and time again.

But to be fair, we must be able to compare them to others who we chose as our allies. I think its a legitimate point.

First of all,your description and treatise of the ending of the First World War is'nt entirely correct.

The Treaty of Versailles was not a peace treaty,but a punishment treaty.It was this way at the behest of the French,namely Georges Clemenceau and General Foche(mostly Clemenceau).This was based on payback for the humiliation Germany caused,not only in the invasion of France in 1914,but the previous French invasion of Germany,counter attack,and occupation of France during the Franco-Prussian War of 1870-71.The French always felt Germans were inferior to the them and the French were always insulted at Germany's colonial aspirations after 1871.Plus,Germany took the Alsace-Lorraine region,and the city of Strasbourg,from the French for their ill concieved invasion.Lloyd George warned Clemenceau that the treaty,as it was worded,was an extremely bad idea.But history shows us that it went ahead anyway,basically at the insistance of th French.

The famous quote was that the Treaty of Versailles was not a peace treaty,but an armistice for 20 years.Well,the fella that said that missed it by 1 year because it was only 19 years.

The fact of the matter is,that the punishing nature of the Treaty of Versailles was the reason for Imperial Germany's downfall.It had very little,to absolutely nothing,to do with some Jewish/Zionist conspiracy.The clauses in the treaty caused economic depression,in fact,the Great Depression started in Germany on Nov. 11,1918.It foisted the failed Weimar Republic(and democracy) on a country that never knew that form a government,or was remotely prepared for it.The resulting economic and political chaos caused a vacuum that was ripe for the picking.Adolph Hitler,and his NAZI fascist thugs took full advantage of that chaos.In essence,they were nothing more than bloodthirsty opportunists playing on the fragile psyche on a downtrodden nation.

Once in power,after the Reichstag fire incident and the resulting thuggery and murder around the final vote,Hitler showed his true colours.Namely his totalitarian murderous ideology,and began his attack on Jews(and everyone else he deemed inferior) as laid out in Mein Kampf.

But lets say,for the sake of arguement,that your version of history came true...

What would planet earth look like with a fascist victory?Please refer to post 63.It's a simple question and you must have thought about that hypothetical outcome...How did it turn out?

Please be specific...

Edited June 1, 2010 by Jack Weber

[M.Dancer]

Why are you arguing with a historical revisionist fascist?

Arguing with one of those is like arguing with a tr00ther or any other garden variety fruitcake...unless you have background in abnormal psychology, the effort is wasted.

[Michael Hardner]

Why are you arguing with a historical revisionist fascist?

Arguing with one of those is like arguing with a tr00ther or any other garden variety fruitcake...unless you have background in abnormal psychology, the effort is wasted.

Agreed.

Just wait for the poster in question to become feverishly excited by his own doctrine. He inevitably breaks forum rules, at which point you can report him and hopefully the moderator will send him off.

[Jack Weber]

Guys...

I enjoy delving into the minds of the,shall we say....Different?

And I'm keenly interested in his version of history if we did...say...side with the NAZI's(as incredulous as that seems)

It should be fairly obvious that I don't agree with him,but I'm prepared to agree to disagre with someone,who's views are...different.

Edited June 1, 2010 by Jack Weber

[lictor616]

First of all,your description and treatise of the ending of the First World War is'nt entirely correct.

The Treaty of Versailles was not a peace treaty,but a punishment treaty.

Nowhere did I mention the fraudulently contrived treaty of Versailles, nowhere at all.

[lictor616]

Once in power,after the Reichstag fire incident and the resulting thuggery and murder around the final vote,Hitler showed his true colours.Namely his totalitarian murderous ideology,and began his attack on Jews(and everyone else he deemed inferior) as laid out in Mein Kampf.

This again in comparative standards to the methods of the communists, which included far worst methods of coercion doesn't validate the disproportionate and negative attention given to the nazis.

Matter of fact, the nazis used these tactics to compete with the guerrilla party politics of the communists in Germany in the weimar republic

Read anything about the german red guards and their tactics? summary executions, kidnapping state officials, raping their wives... these where the methods of the commies in their heyday...

And the ones who were most hostile to democracy were the communists... they were the first to try to overtake the country:

"Inspired by the general strikes, a communist uprising began in the Ruhr region when 50,000 people formed a "Red Army" and took control of the province. The regular army and the Freikorps ended the uprising on their own authority. Other communist rebellions were put down in March 1921 in Saxony and Hamburg."

Again, the communist record is in comparative standards WORSE then the nazi one... The real thugs were the commies in Germany. And from all accounts the nazis were determined as a practical matter to pacify the country by using similar methods as the communists (against the communists)... Neglecting to mention that is the height of dishonesty.

"The first challenge to the Weimar Republic came when a group of communists and anarchists took over the Bavarian government in Munich and declared the creation of the Bavarian Soviet Republic. The communist rebel state was put down one month later when Freikorps units were brought in to fight the leftist rebels." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weimar_Republic

yes i'm quoting wikipedia, because anything else you guys automatically denounce as insane hatespeech literature.

Edited June 1, 2010 by lictor616

[lictor616]

But lets say,for the sake of arguement,that your version of history came true...

What would planet earth look like with a fascist victory?Please refer to post 63.It's a simple question and you must have thought about that hypothetical outcome...How did it turn out?

Please be specific...

I believe that a fascist victory would have meant more of peace time Germany, i.e: peaceable intentions with Britain (Hitler believed it was essential for the English to maintain and strengthen their Empire) and America, it would have meant that the Western ideals of science and rationality would have taken precedence over Christianity, Marxism and political correctness... the German view on such things as animal rights, environmental protection and women's rights would have translated easily into modern times.

Its also quite reasonable to believe that the third world would have known no population explosion, since the Nazis, would not have committed the liberal folly of sending aid and knowhow to third worlders thus showing them how to maintain much larger populations (which very reasonably would have lead to a great alleviation of environmental destruction).

There would, furthermore, not have been the squandering of wealth and general retardation of eastern europe (and Russia too mind you)- there would have been no communist lag. And the world would be Bi-polar with a germano-british and american hegemony, there is no reason to believe that relations would have been amicable (yet competitive) between the two. Cities in Europe and America would have never been occupied by cultural marxists, and so a homogeneity similar to Japan (with a similar orderly and functioning) could have been achieved, so places like detroit, or new orleans, or any other third world jungle- would have been almost unfeasible... there would be no third world immigration problem, no occupational hazard, no prospects for racial tensions.

Culturally, rock and rap would doubtless not have emerged...

The technological and scientific prowess of Greater Germany would not have been aborted, and with proper funding... who knows what marvels we'd be enjoying right now...

As in prewar Germany, unemployment would be drastically reduced, and the economy would doubtless be middle class driven.

No cold war, no weapons buildup, no nagasaki, no hiroshima, no EU... the difference would have been profound and I think for the most part: preferable to the outcome that occurred

[Jack Weber]

Nowhere did I mention the fraudulently contrived treaty of Versailles, nowhere at all.

You should have!

It's major demarkation point hat started Germany's dowmward spiral into NAZIsm.

That was a historical ommission error on your part....

Edited June 2, 2010 by Jack Weber

[Guest TrueMetis]

Whoa is lictor argueing that the Nazis winning would be a good thing. I think his absence has left him even more unhinged.