Harper Sales Tax

[madmax]

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/windsor/story/2009/11/16/ont-hst.html

Coffee, Donuts and Newspapers are removed from the list...

Ontario's Liberal government will introduce legislation Monday to harmonize the province's eight per cent sales tax with the five per cent GST.

In addition to creating a single, 13 per cent sales tax next July, the bill also includes a series of cuts to income, small business and corporate taxes that would take effect in January.

'Job killing tax'

NDP Leader Andrea Horwath told the legislature on Monday that people "don't want a new tax that will make life more expensive during these tough economic times."

Horwath calls the HST a "job killing tax" and says the government should not be giving profitable companies a huge tax cut.

Premier Dalton McGuinty says the New Democrats are stuck in the past and view all corporations as evil.

McGuinty points to a study the government commissioned that shows moving to a single sales tax will help create almost 600,000 jobs over 10 years.

The National Citizen's Coalition estimates the HST will cost the average taxpayer an additional $800 to $1,000 annually.

[Shady]

I'm confused as to why the title of the thread is Harper Sales Tax, when it's McGuinty's idea and implementation.

Perhaps I'm missing something that wasn't in the link?

[Topaz]

I'm confused as to why the title of the thread is Harper Sales Tax, when it's McGuinty's idea and implementation.

Perhaps I'm missing something that wasn't in the link?

The Feds were the ones pushing provinces to "harmonize" their sales tax with the Feds and when Canadians started to say no way, the Feds backed off and said it was up to the provinces. Of course, the Feds are paying the provinces to do this, just another way to recirculate our tax dollars.

[Shady]

The Feds were the ones pushing provinces to "harmonize" their sales tax with the Feds and when Canadians started to say no way, the Feds backed off and said it was up to the provinces. Of course, the Feds are paying the provinces to do this, just another way to recirculate our tax dollars.

So the provinces have the final say?

[madmax]

I'm confused as to why the title of the thread is Harper Sales Tax, when it's McGuinty's idea and implementation.

Perhaps I'm missing something that wasn't in the link?

As Long as Prime Minister Harper supports giving $4.3 Billion to implement the tax, and since the Conservative government has a net benefit in increased tax revenue when the tax is implemented, Harper owns this tax.

I DARE ..... I DOUBLE DOG DARE.... The Conservatives to pull the $4.3 BILLION DOLLAR BRIBE.

[Shady]

As Long as Prime Minister Harper supports giving $4.3 Billion to implement the tax, and since the Conservative government has a net benefit in increased tax revenue when the tax is implemented, Harper owns this tax.

I DARE ..... I DOUBLE DOG DARE.... The Conservatives to pull the $4.3 BILLION DOLLAR BRIBE.

So the provinces have the final say?

[Riverwind]

As Long as Prime Minister Harper supports giving $4.3 Billion to implement the tax, and since the Conservative government has a net benefit in increased tax revenue when the tax is implemented, Harper owns this tax.

Silliness. The GST was already collected on the services affected and the change has zero effect on federal revenue. It also does not bring in that much extra revenue for the provinces because of the tax credits given to businesses and individuals. The bottom line is all taxes are bad and kill jobs but some are better than others. In the long run, a broad based value added taxed is much better than income, payroll or corporate taxes.

[madmax]

So the provinces have the final say?

Wasn't on the Provinces Radar screen until the Federal Bribe came along.

Get rid of the Conservative Bribe... Then lets see the Province go it alone without the umbilical cord.

Harper Sales Tax.

Are you for this tax? If not say so. Many Conservatives and Liberals on this forum are totally for it.

Of course I disagree with McGuintys tax grab. I also Disagree with the Conservatives pushing it down Ontarians throats.

It a Conservative and Liberal Scheme.

Edited November 16, 2009 by madmax

[Shady]

Wasn't on the Provinces Radar screen until the Federal Bribe came along.

Get rid of the Conservative Bribe... Then lets see the Province go it alone without the umbilical cord.

Harper Sales Tax.

Are you for this tax? If not say so. Many Conservatives and Liberals on this forum are totally for it.

Of course I disagree with McGuintys tax grab. I also Disagree with the Conservatives pushing it down Ontarians throats.

It a Conservative and Liberal Scheme.

So do the provinces have the final say?

[Wild Bill]

Wasn't on the Provinces Radar screen until the Federal Bribe came along.

Get rid of the Conservative Bribe... Then lets see the Province go it alone without the umbilical cord.

Harper Sales Tax.

Are you for this tax? If not say so. Many Conservatives and Liberals on this forum are totally for it.

Of course I disagree with McGuintys tax grab. I also Disagree with the Conservatives pushing it down Ontarians throats.

It a Conservative and Liberal Scheme.

Has it also struck you as interesting Max, that it was Mulroney who instituted the GST, intending from the start to have it harmonized with the provinces and now the present CPC is continuing his legacy?

It's plain as the nose on your face, we've gone back to the mid 80's!

Once again, why did Manning ever bother?!

[madmax]

Silliness. The GST was already collected on the services affected and the change has zero effect on federal revenue. It also does not bring in that much extra revenue for the provinces because of the tax credits given to businesses and individuals. The bottom line is all taxes are bad and kill jobs but some are better than others. In the long run, a broad based value added taxed is much better than income, payroll or corporate taxes.

How many used Cars in Ontario are sold? A new 5% tax grab for the Feds

[Hydraboss]

Wasn't on the Provinces Radar screen until the Federal Bribe came along.

Get rid of the Conservative Bribe... Then lets see the Province go it alone without the umbilical cord.

Harper Sales Tax.

Are you for this tax? If not say so. Many Conservatives and Liberals on this forum are totally for it.

Of course I disagree with McGuintys tax grab. I also Disagree with the Conservatives pushing it down Ontarians throats.

It a Conservative and Liberal Scheme.

I agree that this should be worn by Harper. The provinces wouldn't dare without federal (what did you call it?)...oh yeah...BRIBE MONEY.

Maybe Iggy should stand on a pedestal and say "I will get rid of the HST!!!". It's worked for the Liberals before......

[Riverwind]

How many used Cars in Ontario are sold? A new 5% tax grab for the Feds

GST already applied the everything that HST is going to apply to.

[Riverwind]

The provinces wouldn't dare without federal (what did you call it?)...oh yeah...BRIBE MONEY.

One person's bribe is another person's incentive to develop a rational tax policy. The opposition to this tax is getting quite rediculous. Given a choice between HST and a income tax I would take the HST. Income taxes have come down in this country over the last 20 years because of the GST and that is a really good thing.

[Oleg Bach]

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/windsor/story/2009/11/16/ont-hst.html

Coffee, Donuts and Newspapers are removed from the list...

Why don't we just take all of the money from everybody? Then create sytem that if you are cool you get a never ending line of credit..To many people with to much money are not cool - that way with the new system..we could get rid of the power held by dangerous and uncool people... Cool you get it - un-cool - to the back of the line with you...kind of do what we did to Conrad Black - he was un-cool and now he has no buying power..get the picture?

[Shady]

Why don't we just take all of the money from everybody? Then create sytem that if you are cool you get a never ending line of credit..To many people with to much money are not cool - that way with the new system..we could get rid of the power held by dangerous and uncool people... Cool you get it - un-cool - to the back of the line with you...kind of do what we did to Conrad Black - he was un-cool and now he has no buying power..get the picture?

That's quite possibly THE dumbest thing I've ever seen written in this forum during the 5 or so years I've been reading and posting here. Please tell me this is satire. Please, I beg you.

[Wild Bill]

One person's bribe is another person's incentive to develop a rational tax policy. The opposition to this tax is getting quite rediculous. Given a choice between HST and a income tax I would take the HST. Income taxes have come down in this country over the last 20 years because of the GST and that is a really good thing.

Perhaps. Yet our living standard has also dropped, a lot! It takes two incomes today for a family to have what one income provided in the 60's and 70's. I know, I lived it and paid attention!

Whenever we discuss such topics it always seems to me like the mitigating effects on the average citizen may be real but the amount of benefit in the real world seems trivial. Meanwhile, there are other much more significant factors sliding us farther down the list for living standards that are being ignored.

The GST may have reduced income taxes a mite but meanwhile our version of Free Trade resulted in huge losses in higher paying manufacturing jobs, replacing them with lower paying warehouse and service positions. While it may be true that without Free Trade or the GST the change would have been more painful it still doesn't change the fact that as far as the average citizen is concerned his disposable income is lower. He has experienced negatives greater than the promised positives.

This is perhaps what has made the populace more jaded. The HST might have been a much easier sell back in more affluent times. When you're hurting you tend to be more suspicious.

[madmax]

Silliness. The GST was already collected on the services affected and the change has zero effect on federal revenue.

The Conservative Government are going to GOUGE 5% on Content Insurance. The Conservative government has a vested interest in this tax grab.

[Shady]

The Conservative Government are going to GOUGE 5% on Content Insurance. The Conservative government has a vested interest in this tax grab.

But you wanted it at 7%, remember?

[msj]

The Conservative Government are going to GOUGE 5% on Content Insurance. The Conservative government has a vested interest in this tax grab.

I would like to see a link to support this claim.

My understanding is that content insurance is exempt under Part VII of Schedule V of the Excise Tax Act.

[ToadBrother]

Perhaps. Yet our living standard has also dropped, a lot! It takes two incomes today for a family to have what one income provided in the 60's and 70's. I know, I lived it and paid attention!

Whenever we discuss such topics it always seems to me like the mitigating effects on the average citizen may be real but the amount of benefit in the real world seems trivial. Meanwhile, there are other much more significant factors sliding us farther down the list for living standards that are being ignored.

The GST may have reduced income taxes a mite but meanwhile our version of Free Trade resulted in huge losses in higher paying manufacturing jobs, replacing them with lower paying warehouse and service positions. While it may be true that without Free Trade or the GST the change would have been more painful it still doesn't change the fact that as far as the average citizen is concerned his disposable income is lower. He has experienced negatives greater than the promised positives.

This is perhaps what has made the populace more jaded. The HST might have been a much easier sell back in more affluent times. When you're hurting you tend to be more suspicious.

This, class, is an example of one big long non sequitur.

[madmax]

But you wanted it at 7%, remember?

Don't know to what you are referring? I never wanted the 7% since 1989.

So why the hell do I want 13% vs the current 8%?

You must be a Conservative Apologist.

Mulroney Conservatives had those two.

Then the Conservatives had TWO seats.

Edited November 18, 2009 by madmax

[Wild Bill]

This, class, is an example of one big long non sequitur.

So Riverwind posits that the HST is good for us. I respond that if it is the effect is trivial. I cite some historical examples of how this has been a common diversionary tactic of some governments.

Now you call this a non sequitur? I can understand that you might disagree but I'm afraid I don't see how my post was not related to the discussion. Or is it your position that anything you don't agree with is therefore a non sequitur, by definition?

[msj]

The Conservative Government are going to GOUGE 5% on Content Insurance. The Conservative government has a vested interest in this tax grab.

Once again I ask for a link supporting the claim that content insurance will be taxable.

Anyone? Anyone?

[Nat]

Perhaps. Yet our living standard has also dropped, a lot! It takes two incomes today for a family to have what one income provided in the 60's and 70's. I know, I lived it and paid attention!

I lived it too the main difference is in the 60's & 70's you didn't live on credit. In fact I didn't know of anyone with a credit card. Even your house you had a downpayment of 20- 25% which kept prices lower.

Edited November 19, 2009 by Nat