lictor616 Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 Why should I be ashamed. Are there no ukrainian film makers?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cinema_of_Ukraine HAAHHAHAAHAHAHAHA omg... that's a list of Ukrainian productions... do you dare insinuate that these compare to the massive internationally popular big budget Hollywood productions like Schindler's list?! by the way the only film on the subject of the holodomor is the long out of circulation Famine-33, directed by Oles Yanchuk in 1991. I don't suppose you saw it did you? Why? BECAUSE NOT EVEN 100 000 UKRAINIANS SAW IT! seriously though the gall of just picking up some random list of samll scale bs ukrainian productions ... UNRELATED TO the holodomor... is simply astounding... do you have some sort of beef with ukrainians? tell us about the hatreds that fester in your mind Dancer... I think this is your own personal problem... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 well the holocaust wrest 100% on eye whiteness testimonies... many contradicting themsleves.. the only reason we know about treblinka for instance is from the eye witness testinomy of 3 .. that's right 3 alleged survivors. It's hardly surprising that your a Holocaust Denier. At any rate, this claim, and all your claims, are pure crap. You're a racist and a liar. http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 HAAHHAHAAHAHAHAHAomg... that's a list of Ukrainian productions... do you dare insinuate that these compare to the massive internationally popular big budget Hollywood productions like Schindler's list?! No of certainly not. Hollywood makes good movies that people like. So why is Lic, that Ukrainians don't make Ukrainian famine movies? They make other movies.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 well the holocaust wrest 100% on eye whiteness testimonies... That, along with 99.9% of your posts, is pure unalterated bullshit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lictor616 Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 Six million people were murdered because of their ethno-racial identity. Also look what happened to the Gypsies. The real Holocaust figures, including all the people that the Nazis herded into their death machine, is somewhere on the order of 10 to 12 million. Saying this could get the ADL to call you a Holocaust denier by the way... THe holocaust is seen as ONLY what happened to the Jewish people... everything else IS NOT THE HOLOCAUST. in that number: about 200 000 gypsies, gays? about 60 000, Communists 1.3 million... how on earth do you get to the 12 million figure... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 Saying this could get the ADL to call you a Holocaust denier by the way... THe holocaust is seen as ONLY what happened to the Jewish people... everything else IS NOT THE HOLOCAUST. http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums//index....st&p=475119 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lictor616 Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 That, along with 99.9% of your posts, is pure unalterated bullshit. Well for Treblinka it certainly is... there isn't any physical evidence of an elaborate death machine... so 750 000 casualties in treblinka rely on eye witness testimonies of 3 people. That actually show many logistical problems like the ones I mentioned. Moshe Perlman, The Capture and Trial of Adolf Eichmann (New York: Simon and Schuster, 1963), pp. 300-302. R. Auerbach, "In the Fields of Treblinka," in: A. Donat, ed., Death Camp Treblinka, pp. 19, 69, 71, 72. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lictor616 Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 (edited) It's hardly surprising that your a Holocaust Denier. At any rate, this claim, and all your claims, are pure crap. You're a racist and a liar. http://www.holocaustresearchproject.org/ OH SO NOW we're all angry at denying mass murders!!! You people don't seem phased at all when Dancer downgrades the holodomor (with random non specific round rejections). But if anyone calls the holocaust to account.. all bets are off... and its mud slinging time! LOL. beautiful! yeah there really is no double standard... why don't you try addressing individual claims I made yourself instead? technically if I refuse to believe that 750 000 Jews in Treblinka were gassed with a RUSSIAN SUBMARINE DIESEL ENGINE... I'm a holocaust denier and subject to imprisonment in some European countries... Yet if someone roundly denies the Holodomor as "russian unreliable info" what are the consequences? nothing at all of course! yes that's right the double standard goes so far that DENYING in the case of the Holocaust CAN MEAN JAIL TIME! and you people don't see the gap ?! Edited October 22, 2009 by lictor616 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 I believe the reason that the Holocaust gets more air time than other atrocities is that because of hateful racists like lictor, an inordinate amount of time is spent answering their bullshit. If Lictor really wants more publicity about the Ukrainian Famine, he should probably spend time denying it....then maybe the Ukrainian film makers would make a movie to correct to set the story straight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 You people don't seem phased at all when Dancer downgrades the holodomor (with random non specific round rejections). That's because I haven't. I think I'm done playing with you today, I feel soiled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 and you people don't see the gap ?! It's the internet, I can't see between your ears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 Well for Treblinka it certainly is... there isn't any physical evidence of an elaborate death machine... so 750 000 casualties in treblinka rely on eye witness testimonies of 3 people. That actually show many logistical problems like the ones I mentioned. Moshe Perlman, The Capture and Trial of Adolf Eichmann (New York: Simon and Schuster, 1963), pp. 300-302. R. Auerbach, "In the Fields of Treblinka," in: A. Donat, ed., Death Camp Treblinka, pp. 19, 69, 71, 72. This just keeps getting better. You really are a genuine anti-Semite Holocaust Denier. Yes, there were mass gassings at Treblinka... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Hoefletelegram.jpg I pity your family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lictor616 Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 I believe the reason that the Holocaust gets more air time than other atrocities is that because of hateful racists like lictor, an inordinate amount of time is spent answering their bullshit.If Lictor really wants more publicity about the Ukrainian Famine, he should probably spend time denying it....then maybe the Ukrainian film makers would make a movie to correct to set the story straight. i'm not sure I follow... you see your statement is only correct if you (like the nazis mind you) consider Jews a race... do you? Do you Dancer, consider Jews a race? how could calling into account evidence available to everyone (in this case the use of submarine diesel engines of captured russian subs) possibly be considered "racist" ? That's the official story! Is it racist to talk about russian sub engines? oh but of course it isn't racist to minimize the suffering of Ukrainians (as not as bad) because the people who died in the holodomor were only Ukrainians... and, there were more Ukrainians... and at least the ukrainians died at the hands of communists who spoke a similar language... so it doesn't really matter.. its not HOW MANY deaths that count ... its how many relative to the total population... beauty! fantastic logic there... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lictor616 Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 (edited) This just keeps getting better.You really are a genuine anti-Semite Holocaust Denier. Yes, there were mass gassings at Treblinka... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Hoefletelegram.jpg I pity your family. ahahhahaaha what the hell is that link? what is that coupon all about?... is that what you're going with? then you should have no problem believing the nazis used a captured russian submarine engine (a diesel engine at that!) to gas 750 000 of god's own then... as the official story tells us. anti-semite? if words are not to become mere babbling to excite the glands of liberals... anti-semitism can only logically mean ANTIPATHY TOWARDS SEMITES.... Which is a deceitful term because Semites are not necessarily JEWS. In fact the most ardently "antisemetic" country in the world right now is (Israel) who is in the process of liquidating OTHER semites it could be argued! Edited October 22, 2009 by lictor616 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 i'm not sure I follow... you see your statement is only correct if you (like the nazis mind you) consider Jews a race... do you? Do you Dancer, consider Jews a race? how could calling into account evidence available to everyone (in this case the use of submarine diesel engines of captured russian subs) possibly be considered "racist" ? That's the official story! Is it racist to talk about russian sub engines? oh but of course it isn't racist to minimize the suffering of Ukrainians (as not as bad) because the people who died in the holodomor were only Ukrainians... and, there were more Ukrainians... and at least the ukrainians died at the hands of communists who spoke a similar language... so it doesn't really matter.. its not HOW MANY deaths that count ... its how many relative to the total population... beauty! fantastic logic there... Since you don't actually seem to think that a Jewish Holocaust happened, why are you feeling so bad for the Ukrainians. I suspect you, being a racist, probably think Slavs as nearly inferior as Blacks, and probably feel they were all being manipulated by Jewish-controlled Bolsheviks anyways. You seem to ascribe to every painfully moronic conspiracy theory that your fellow racist monsters do, so I'm sure this is all a smoke screen. You complain of a double standard, and you show it most clearly. You don't think the Nazis killed millions of Jews,because, fundamentally, you share the same racial views that they did. But you do accept that Stalin killed millions, because you hate Communists, just as the Nazis did, and quite happily accept death figures which are just as much estimates as the Holocaust estimates (it's not like Stalin and his minions went around advertising "We killed a few hundred thousand Ukrainians this quarter!") Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 ahahhahaaha what the hell is that link? what is that coupon all about?... is that what you're going with? then you should have no problem believing the nazis used a captured russian submarine engine (a diesel engine at that!) to gas 750 000 of god's own then... as the official story tells us. anti-semite? if words are not to become mere babbling to excite the glands of liberals... anti-semitism can only logically mean ANTIPATHY TOWARDS SEMITES.... Which is a deceitful term because Semites are not necessarily JEWS. In fact the most ardently "antisemetic" country in the world right now is (Israel) who is in the process of liquidating OTHER semites it could be argued! And even more moronic bigotry, curled into that delightful logical fallacy known as the etymological fallacy. Words mean what they mean, not what you would like them to mean. Anti-semitism refers to the hatred of Jews. It was coined thusly by an anti-Semite, and other than by racist monsters like you during debates, it is accepted by virtually everyone as meaning the hatred of Jews. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lictor616 Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 I pity your family. toadbrother... you realize that i'm using official holocaust scholarship right? If you have a problem with the fact that Treblinka is based on eye witness testimonies of 3 jews (this is in the official transcript of the Nuremberg trails incidentally- which is illegal to deny in certain countries) and that Nazi's used I REPEAT AGAIN: captured russian diesel submarine engines: to gas jews, then take it up with the ADL and Bnai Brith... don't get angry at me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 ahahhahaaha what the hell is that link? what is that coupon all about?... is that what you're going with? then you should have no problem believing the nazis used a captured russian submarine engine (a diesel engine at that!) to gas 750 000 of god's own then... as the official story tells us. I'm not going to debate your strawmen. anti-semite? if words are not to become mere babbling to excite the glands of liberals... anti-semitism can only logically mean ANTIPATHY TOWARDS SEMITES.... Which is a deceitful term because Semites are not necessarily JEWS. In fact the most ardently "antisemetic" country in the world right now is (Israel) who is in the process of liquidating OTHER semites it could be argued! We've already taken care of this, you racist monster. Anti-semite means hatred of Jews. That is what the English-speaking world defines it as. But if you like, I can call you a Jew hater, you racist piece of filth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 toadbrother... you realize that i'm using official holocaust scholarship right? If you have a problem with the fact that Treblinka is based on eye witness testimonies of 3 jews (this is in the official transcript of the Nuremberg trails incidentally- which is illegal to deny in certain countries) and that Nazi's used I REPEAT AGAIN: captured russian diesel submarine engines: to gas jews, then take it up with the ADL and Bnai Brith... My understanding is that it was gasoline, but at any rate, what I provided demonstrates the Nazis' own estimates. don't get angry at me... But I will you lying Jew hating monster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 Incidentally, anyone who wants to know the real story of the Treblenka camp can go here: http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsourc...t/reinhard.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lictor616 Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 (edited) And even more moronic bigotry, curled into that delightful logical fallacy known as the etymological fallacy.Words mean what they mean, not what you would like them to mean. Anti-semitism refers to the hatred of Jews. It was coined thusly by an anti-Semite, and other than by racist monsters like you during debates, it is accepted by virtually everyone as meaning the hatred of Jews. etymological fallacy? that's large! words are sounds that are used to communicate. Usually created to mean what one can hear them to be. anti-semetism to a newbie would unambiguously mean to any marsian observer: antipathy towards semetic people... and we all know Jews aren't the only semites right? if what the word really means is HATRED OF JEWS... then the term should be revised (quite obviously!) to "anti-jewish" or "anti-judaic" or any number of similar clear unambiguous terms. The fact that the term is considered sinful, is widely accepted and drummed into the heads of every featherless biped should tell you something about the double standard we are talking about here. We know anti-semitism because of the holocaust... and the term elicits such venomous and angry responses (just look at you hand wringing posts) that they prove that the holocaust has a very deep emotional significance to you... but .. again put the shoe on the other foot... when dancer denies the Holodmor, you come to his defense and are utterly unmoved... and you think you have the moral high ground... unfortunately your obvious hypocrisy and bias is present in every line you write. Edited October 22, 2009 by lictor616 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lictor616 Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 (edited) Incidentally, anyone who wants to know the real story of the Treblenka camp can go here:http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsourc...t/reinhard.html excellent! here they allege that Treblinka's Belzec camp used motor diesel engines... that's right DIESEL ENGINE... which emits very small amounts of carbon monoxide (which is what this website says was the preferred method of execution)... strange since it doesn't support the widely held view that the nazis used the pesticide Zyklon B to kill jews. let's delve into a key quote: "On Wirth's instructions I travel led by truck to Lvov and collected a gassing engine there, which I transported to Sobibor. In Sobibor... [we] unloaded the engine. It was a heavy Russian gasoline engine [probably a tank or train er.gine] with at least 200 h.p. [V-enginel 8 cylinders, water cooled]. We stood the engine on a concrete base and connected the exhaust to the pipe conduit. Then I tried out the engine. To begin with, it did not function. I managed to repair the ignition and the ventils so that the motor finally started. The chemist, whom I already knew from Belzec, entered the gas chamber with a measuring instrument in order to test the gas concentration. Next, an experimental gassing was carried out. I seem to recall that 30-40 women were gassed in one chamber. The Jewesses had to undress on a covered piece of wooded ground near the gas chamber and were driven into the gas chamber by... members of the SS as well as by Ukrainian volunteers. When the women were locked into the gas chamber, I, together with Bauer, operated the engine. Initially the engine idled. We both stood next to the engine and switched from free-exhaust so that the gases were conducted into the chamber. At the suggestion of the chemist, I adjusted the engine to a certain number of revs per minute so that no more gas had to be supplied. After approximately 10 minutes all the women were dead. The chemist and the SS-Fu"hrer gave the signal to switch off the motor. I packed up my tools and saw how the corpses were removed. Transport was by means of a rail-trolley which ran from the gas chamber to a distant area. (StA Dortmund AZ:45 Js 27-61 )" hmmm wow ! so a captured russian lorry engine was the only way the germans could figure out how to produce carbon monoxide! (who were a the time at the apogee and apex of science and technology). no the germans couldnt have just used a simple wood burning furnace which produces carbon monoxide at about 10 times the rate of a gasoline engine... why design it like that? and what about the gas chambers themselves? this is the reinhard camp http://www.deathcamps.org/Reinhard/pic/bigcommand06.jpg "In place of the three old ones which together measured 48 sq.m., the area now covered was 320 sq.m. The new rooms were 2 m. high, i.e., ca. 60 cm. lower than the old ones." funny the individual chambers were 12 feet by 12 feet large and barely 6 feet high... 12X12X6... and apparently 200 to 300 people were gassed in such rooms in 10 minutes FLAT!!! I quote again: "After approximately 10 minutes all the women were dead." 10 minutes !? anyhoozle who cares right? believe the holocaust but deny the Holodomor... pffff Edited October 22, 2009 by lictor616 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Dog Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 The Holocaust and the Ukrainian Famine are two spearate and different events. Both are horrific but there are differences. One was the sytematic extermination of an entire people, and one wasn't. One was in the end fully exposed and brought to light and the other is still shrouded in mystery. The estimates of the dead vary widely and there isn't even conscensu on whether it was a deliberate policy or the result of the inept soviet system. Personaly I think it ranks with the Irish Famine. Amazinly we hear little about the irish famine, possibly because they are white.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Famine_(Ireland) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor I don't know how anyone can look at Stalin's track record overall and his attitude toward minority groups within the Soviet Union and be so quick to dismiss the famine as an byproduct of an inept bureaucracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Dog Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 excellent! here they allege that Treblinka's Belzec camp used motor diesel engines... that's right DIESEL ENGINE... which emits very small amounts of carbon monoxide (which is what this website says was the preferred method of execution)... strange since it doesn't support the widely held view that the nazis used the pesticide Zyklon B to kill jews. Zyklon B was used in some death camps, but not all. let's delve into a key quote:... hmmm wow ! so a captured russian lorry engine was the only way the germans could figure out how to produce carbon monoxide! (who were a the time at the apogee and apex of science and technology). It seems logical to conclude they were simply working with the materials they had on hand. no the germans couldnt have just used a simple wood burning furnace which produces carbon monoxide at about 10 times the rate of a gasoline engine... Evidence? Link? and what about the gas chambers themselves? "In place of the three old ones which together measured 48 sq.m., the area now covered was 320 sq.m. The new rooms were 2 m. high, i.e., ca. 60 cm. lower than the old ones." funny the individual chambers were 12 feet by 12 feet large and barely 6 feet high... 12X12X6... and apparently 200 to 300 people were gassed in such rooms in 10 minutes FLAT!!! Silly racist: 144 square meters of floor space per chamber, 6 chambers in total=864 square meters of killing space. Plenty of room to accomodate 200-300 people at a go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted October 22, 2009 Report Share Posted October 22, 2009 etymological fallacy? that's large! Yes, the etymological fallacy. words are sounds that are used to communicate. Usually created to mean what one can hear them to be. Words mean what the speakers essentially agree they mean. In the case of the word "anti-semite", it was first coined by Wilhelm Marr, a German Jew hater. anti-semetism to a newbie would unambiguously mean to any marsian observer: antipathy towards semetic people... and we all know Jews aren't the only semites right? Well, yes, if you had just arrived from Mars, it might very well mean that. But as with the meanings of all words, we arrive at them either by instruction or context, and not just by looking at word roots. if what the word really means is HATRED OF JEWS... then the term should be revised (quite obviously!) to "anti-jewish" or "anti-judaic" or any number of similar clear unambiguous terms. Take that up with the English-speaking world. It means what it means, whether or not you're too stupid or too desirous of playing semantical games. The fact that the term is considered sinful, The term isn't sinful, any more the word "bestiality" is sinful. Both words describe things that many find immoral. is widely accepted and drummed into the heads of every featherless biped should tell you something about the double standard we are talking about here. It means what it means. Ironically, as I said, it was a Jew hater like yourself who coined it. We know anti-semitism because of the holocaust... and the term elicits such venomous and angry responses (just look at you hand wringing posts) Ah yes, the ones where I call you what you are. You seem to have no problem comprehending those meanings. Clearly you are not suffering aphasia. that they prove that the holocaust has a very deep emotional significance to you... As it would to anyone who had a conscience. but .. again put the shoe on the other foot... when dancer denies the Holodmor, you come to his defense and are utterly unmoved... and you think you have the moral high ground... We've already established that you hate Jews and you don't accept the Holocaust. You're invoking the double standard yourself. unfortunately your obvious hypocrisy and bias is present in every line you write. It's your hypocrisy that's interesting. I have never defended Stalin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.