Bloc may prop up Toriesl

[jdobbin]

http://www.montrealgazette.com/life/Bloc%2...9772/story.html

The Bloc Québécois could support the Harper government this Friday on its Ways and Means Motion, which if defeated would provoke the fourth federal election in five years.

Asked if he could support the Conservative government’s motion, Bloc leader Gilles Duceppe said, “It depends which one.”

If Prime Minister Stephen Harper proposes a motion to adopt his government’s home renovation program, “We'll support it,” Duceppe said.

“We proposed it,” he added. “It would be incoherent to say we’re against something we asked for.”

It certainly looks like both the NDP and Bloc are climbing down from their position of taking down the government.

However, Harper might indeed really want the government to fall then.

On another note, there seems to be a flurry of activity going on in Ottawa today. Some major controversy is being suggested but I don't who or what. If anyone else has some insight, I'm all ears.

[Goat Boy©]

This appears to be excellent news.

I really admire Gilles Duceppe, with his gall to tell the truth, even when screwing the rest of the country. I think him the most fit leader of the 4, and were he to erase 'Quebec,' and pencil in 'Canada,' and run candidates in the entire country I think he would win a record landslide.

[madmax]

This appears to be excellent news.

I really admire Gilles Duceppe, with his gall to tell the truth, even when screwing the rest of the country. I think him the most fit leader of the 4, and were he to erase 'Quebec,' and pencil in 'Canada,' and run candidates in the entire country I think he would win a record landslide.

You never fail to surprise me Goat Boy.

They funny thing about your idea of the BQ running candidates across Canada is that I don't know if we'd be voting BQ, to get rid of Quebec asap, don't let the door hit you on the way," or if we Voted BQ, all of Canada would have to separate if they got a Majority.

[Goat Boy©]

Max, do I know you from another forum?

[Hydraboss]

I'm with Goat on this one.

Gilles is by far the best politician out there. If he was for Alberta, I would vote for him.

[punked]

It does not make sense for any party to vote down the home renovation tax credit they all want it. The Liberals would be dumb to give the Cons this to run on but they will.

[Goat Boy©]

It does not make sense for any party to vote down the home renovation tax credit they all want it. The Liberals would be dumb to give the Cons this to run on but they will.

The same Liberals that failed to stand for debate on the '06 budget? Nah, they'd never do anything that dumb.

[nicky10013]

It does not make sense for any party to vote down the home renovation tax credit they all want it. The Liberals would be dumb to give the Cons this to run on but they will.

It isn't something solid to run on and the Cons know that which is why they're turning to the coalition bogeyman. A ways and means motion can be reintroduced anytime after an election and the credit would pass with tons of time to spare come the april tax season.

The real question that needs to be asked is despite how long the credit has been public, why haven't the Conservatives already introduced the motion? The reason is they held off until something like this happened. It's not something to run on but it's a bat with which you can beat the opposition for a day or two and gain some traction. Again, it's been more about politics than just getting things through.

Edited September 14, 2009 by nicky10013

[punked]

It isn't something solid to run on and the Cons know that which is why they're turning to the coalition bogeyman. A ways and means motion can be reintroduced anytime after an election and the credit would pass with tons of time to spare come the april tax season.

The real question that needs to be asked is despite how long the credit has been public, why haven't the Conservatives already introduced the motion? The reason is they held off until something like this happened. It's not something to run on but it's a bat with which you can beat the opposition for a day or two and gain some traction. Again, it's been more about politics than just getting things through.

It will play into the flippy floppy Liberal waffle I expect them to bring up. Iggy was for it before he was against before he was for it again. Like it or not you vote against it you can be portrayed as being not for it.

[nicky10013]

It will play into the flippy floppy Liberal waffle I expect them to bring up. Iggy was for it before he was against before he was for it again. Like it or not you vote against it you can be portrayed as being not for it.

That made absolutely no sense. In English please?

[jdobbin]

It isn't something solid to run on and the Cons know that which is why they're turning to the coalition bogeyman. A ways and means motion can be reintroduced anytime after an election and the credit would pass with tons of time to spare come the april tax season.

We might see the Tories stuff something in there if they think the NDP and Bloc are losing their nerve.

If the NDP or Bloc do let the government continue, it will give the media something else to talk about.

[Goat Boy©]

We might see the Tories stuff something in there if they think the NDP and Bloc are losing their nerve.

If the NDP or Bloc do let the government continue, it will give the media something else to talk about.

I don't see why the Bloc would, they're gaining ground in the polls are they not? The NDP, a precarious position. Prop up the government that you've been speaking out against for years, probably an internal backlash, possible loss of support, or face an election with an empty bank and low polling figures.

[Guest coelacanthes]

Imaginez pendant une seconde si Gilles Duceppe serait a la tête d'un parti politique nationale, un parti dont les racines ne prendrait pas fondement dans le colonialisme britanique. Gilles Duceppe est l'un des meilleurs hommes politiques a Ottawa sinon le meilleur. Regarder la facon qu'il gère son parti, ses dossiers, les intérêts de ceux qu'il représente.

Si les autres partis politiques pourrait avoir eux aussi des chefs de la trempe de Duceppe le canada ne serait pas noyé dans d'éternelles chincanes partisanes comme c'est le cas depuis longtemps.

Enfin,

Mon opinion.

[Thomas Kwon]

Imaginez pendant une seconde si Gilles Duceppe serait a la tête d'un parti politique nationale, un parti dont les racines ne prendrait pas fondement dans le colonialisme britanique. Gilles Duceppe est l'un des meilleurs hommes politiques a Ottawa sinon le meilleur. Regarder la facon qu'il gère son parti, ses dossiers, les intérêts de ceux qu'il représente.

Si les autres partis politiques pourrait avoir eux aussi des chefs de la trempe de Duceppe le canada ne serait pas noyé dans d'éternelles chincanes partisanes comme c'est le cas depuis longtemps.

Enfin,

Mon opinion.

Imagine for a second if Gilles Duceppe would be a head a national political party, a party whose roots can

take no basis in British colonialism. Gilles Duceppe is one of the best politicians in Ottawa if not

the best. Watch the way he manages his party, his cases, the interests of those he represents.

If other political parties could have themselves leaders that are in the caliber of the Duceppe, Canada would not be drowned in its bullshit.

My opinion.

lol

[jdobbin]

I don't see why the Bloc would, they're gaining ground in the polls are they not? The NDP, a precarious position. Prop up the government that you've been speaking out against for years, probably an internal backlash, possible loss of support, or face an election with an empty bank and low polling figures.

According the the most recent and largest sample Leger poll, there was no change for the BQ over the summer till September. They are at 35% and the Liberals are at 30%. Another large poll a few weeks before from CROP had the Liberals and BQ tied at 30%.

I'd say those numbers are a little close for Duceppe although he is likely to do well campaigning as he always does. How well? I don't know but I expect the Liberal numbers mean some urban seat will be close one way or the other.

[capricorn]

Regarder la facon qu'il gère son parti, ses dossiers, les intérêts de ceux qu'il représente.

Gérer à l'ensemble du pays ne se compare pas à gérer seulement une région. Par exemple, si l'Alberta avait son propre parti tel le Bloc, je suis certaine que son chef serait aussi efficace que Duceppe à revendiquer pour le bien exclusif de cette province.

Si les autres partis politiques pourrait avoir eux aussi des chefs de la trempe de Duceppe le canada ne serait pas noyé dans d'éternelles chincanes partisanes comme c'est le cas depuis longtemps.

Je ne crois pas que Duceppe est le politicien parfais que tu nous présente. En grande mesure, les "chicanes" dont tu parle sont une réflection de la diversité de chacune des régions du Canada.

There's the extent of my french posting on MLW.

With respect coelacanthes, I would suggest that if you want to engage posters here, you should post in english.

[Molly]

Put me on that list of folks who'd find a vote for Duceppe pretty easy, too.

He was a particular breath of fresh air during the English language debate last time.

[Moonbox]

Gérer à l'ensemble du pays ne se compare pas à gérer seulement une région. Par exemple, si l'Alberta avait son propre parti tel le Bloc, je suis certaine que son chef serait aussi efficace que Duceppe à revendiquer pour le bien exclusif de cette province.

Running a national party is a lot different than one focused on one province alone. If Alberta had its own Bloc-style party, I'm certain it's leader would do equally well focusing exclusively on the province.

I totally agree.

Je ne crois pas que Duceppe est le politicien parfais que tu nous présente. En grande mesure, les "chicanes" dont tu parle sont une réflection de la diversité de chacune des régions du Canada.

I don't believe Duceppe to be the perfect politician that you present him as. The shit going down in parliament right now is more a reflection of regional diversity in Canada than anything else.

Again, I think this is exactly our problem these days. Too many of the parties today are focusing on appeasing specific groups and nobody is focused on the country as a whole. The Bloc, more than anyone, is responsible for Canada's political instability. Turning roughly 1/5 of Canada's seats away from national interests and towards Quebec exclusively makes it almost impossible for anyone to get a majority. If that's the way politics are going to work now, we're better off having no national parties and having province-only parties for every different region. At least then if Quebec wants something done they have to negotiate in good faith with the other parties rather than seeing how much they can get for Quebec alone.

[Dave_ON]

It will play into the flippy floppy Liberal waffle I expect them to bring up. Iggy was for it before he was against before he was for it again. Like it or not you vote against it you can be portrayed as being not for it.

So then you agree that the NDP who voted against it, and are likely to vote for it now that there vote actually matters, are also flip flopping?

[punked]

So then you agree that the NDP who voted against it, and are likely to vote for it now that there vote actually matters, are also flip flopping?

I agree the NDP who voted against it saying it needed more EI funds may vote for it now they got their way. Don't see how that is flippy flopping like the Liberals who had no problem with it until they got a lead in the polls.

[Smallc]

Punked, this isn't even close to what the NDP wanted and you know it. It seems they're simply scared of an election.

[waldo]

Punked, this isn't even close to what the NDP wanted and you know it. It seems they're simply scared of an election.

[jdobbin]

Punked, this isn't even close to what the NDP wanted and you know it.

They certainly have climbed down from their position of not supporting the government.

[Topaz]

It does not make sense for any party to vote down the home renovation tax credit they all want it. The Liberals would be dumb to give the Cons this to run on but they will.

The minister was asked about this and asked why would the Tories push this reno when he it actually hasn't been passed into law. Flaherty said is usually is in the fall. So I guess the Tories were taking for granted it would passed but what if it DOESN"T? A lot of people are going to out money.

[Topaz]

Running a national party is a lot different than one focused on one province alone. If Alberta had its own Bloc-style party, I'm certain it's leader would do equally well focusing exclusively on the province.

I totally agree.

I don't believe Duceppe to be the perfect politician that you present him as. The shit going down in parliament right now is more a reflection of regional diversity in Canada than anything else.

Again, I think this is exactly our problem these days. Too many of the parties today are focusing on appeasing specific groups and nobody is focused on the country as a whole. The Bloc, more than anyone, is responsible for Canada's political instability. Turning roughly 1/5 of Canada's seats away from national interests and towards Quebec exclusively makes it almost impossible for anyone to get a majority. If that's the way politics are going to work now, we're better off having no national parties and having province-only parties for every different region. At least then if Quebec wants something done they have to negotiate in good faith with the other parties rather than seeing how much they can get for Quebec alone.

So why hasn't Harper done anything to get rid of the Bloc. Why did he make Quebec a nation within a nation? Harper wants to reform the senate, why doesn't he start with the House of Commons and get rid of the Bloc?