bush_cheney2004 Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 .....We can afford the modern technologies that assist in diagnosis and we have a viable education system to train the professionals to work within the system. Our only real problems are administrative and delivery. Those can be overcome with a little effort to tidy up the mess we perceive to have with wait times. Overall the system works and covers all citizens. Yep....works well...Canucks are not dropping like flies. But when pinhead Americans point to the Canadian single payer system as a solution for the US, all hell breaks loose. There is no social contract in America to patiently wait one's turn in order to balance provincial resources and demand. Insurance and access to care are two very different ideas. The Americans do not have Canada as a backup resource because Canada typically lacks the excess capacity. Shona Holmes was cherry picked for a media blitz; a pawn in the domestic American health care game. Her story is compelling and a wonderful opening salvo in the struggle. It's like having another Justin Morneau on my private care team! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 Yep....works well...Canucks are not dropping like flies. But when pinhead Americans point to the Canadian single payer system as a solution for the US, all hell breaks loose. Use to happen here too. It took the NDP years to force Medicare down the federal governments throat and when they did Quebec and Ontario went crazy. Although here we are and people seem happy to defend it as truly Canadian thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TrueMetis Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 Yep....works well...Canucks are not dropping like flies. But when pinhead Americans point to the Canadian single payer system as a solution for the US, all hell breaks loose. There is no social contract in America to patiently wait one's turn in order to balance provincial resources and demand. Insurance and access to care are two very different ideas. The Americans do not have Canada as a backup resource because Canada typically lacks the excess capacity.Shona Holmes was cherry picked for a media blitz; a pawn in the domestic American health care game. Her story is compelling and a wonderful opening salvo in the struggle. It's like having another Justin Morneau on my private care team! Ya typical compelling story. Want to make a great story? Start with someone with a none life threatening illness and turn it into brain cancer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 I call complete bullshit on that. You cannot get a CAT scan or MRI the next day. Yes you can. You could get it today if you needed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 Not true. It's thanks to private clinics Since all clinics are private, I suppose you're right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Ya typical compelling story. Want to make a great story? Start with someone with a none life threatening illness and turn it into brain cancer. So you have to be near death to get a diagnosis and treatment in Canada? No wonder her story is compelling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TrueMetis Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 So you have to be near death to get a diagnosis and treatment in Canada? No wonder her story is compelling. No you have to have a life threatening illness to be put at the front of the line which is what she wanted but diddn't get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 (edited) No you have to have a life threatening illness to be put at the front of the line which is what she wanted but diddn't get. She couldn't even get a diagnosis, let alone treatment. That is unacceptable. The primary care to specialist referral game also adds weeks and months to the wait.....no thanks. Edited July 23, 2009 by bush_cheney2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 She couldn't even get a diagnosis, let alone treatment. There is much about her story that doesn't make sense though. Even when she had a diagnosis, they didn't move up her appointment. It may be that the doctors already had an idea of what they were dealing with...and I still have trouble with the six month figure. It's certainly not something that I've experienced ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicky10013 Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 She couldn't even get a diagnosis, let alone treatment. That is unacceptable. The primary care to specialist referral game also adds weeks and months to the wait.....no thanks. Says the guy who has never gone through it. Oh wait, you don't need to be told. You just know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Well, when I had a (cough) complaint, my family doctor arranged a colonoscopy. I waited less than a week. Of course most colonoscopy clinics are privately owned (and services are publickly paid) and run for profit... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Bill Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 How was it before Medicare? If you didn't need and it wasn't an emergency you were turned away if you lacked funds. Then you died waiting either for the money or to get worse. I see no difference but now the rich are hurt as much as the poor. Again, not true. The rich can easily afford to go to the States. After all, that's what Bob Rae did when it was someone in his family! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Well, when I had a (cough) complaint, my family doctor arranged a colonoscopy. I waited less than a week. Of course most colonoscopy clinics are privately owned (and services are publickly paid) and run for profit... Profit is good.....speeds things up nicely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Says the guy who has never gone through it. Oh wait, you don't need to be told. You just know. I guess all those mandated web sites for provincial wait times are a figment of my Yankee imagination? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TrueMetis Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 She keeps lying about it being a tumor so I'm not gonna trust what she says the wait time was or whether or not she already had a diagnosis in Canada. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 She keeps lying about it being a tumor so I'm not gonna trust what she says the wait time was or whether or not she already had a diagnosis in Canada. Irrelevant.....the "cyst" was affecting her quality of life to such an extent to force her and her husband to hock their home and seek true medical love at the Mayo Clinic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry J. Fortin Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Yep....works well...Canucks are not dropping like flies. But when pinhead Americans point to the Canadian single payer system as a solution for the US, all hell breaks loose. There is no social contract in America to patiently wait one's turn in order to balance provincial resources and demand. Insurance and access to care are two very different ideas. The Americans do not have Canada as a backup resource because Canada typically lacks the excess capacity.Shona Holmes was cherry picked for a media blitz; a pawn in the domestic American health care game. Her story is compelling and a wonderful opening salvo in the struggle. It's like having another Justin Morneau on my private care team! I can certainly understand your point. Our system was designed for us, not you folks. Yes Ms. Holmes was cherry picked, but she was picked for you, not us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TrueMetis Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 (edited) Irrelevant.....the "cyst" was affecting her quality of life to such an extent to force her and her husband to hock their home and seek true medical love at the Mayo Clinic. So your saying it wouldn't matter if it turned out she was lying about the 6 month timeframe and it was really gonna be 2 weeks? So it was effecting her quality of life I broke my toe once wish made it so I couldn't walk should I then be put ahead of the guy who's actually dieing. I want to know what her doctor has to say about this six month wait until then I will not believe her. Edited July 23, 2009 by TrueMetis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 How was it before Medicare? If you didn't need and it wasn't an emergency you were turned away if you lacked funds. Then you died waiting either for the money or to get worse. I see no difference but now the rich are hurt as much as the poor. Yeah that's not true. My older brother lost his eye when he was 12. We didn't have healthcare and our savings had been wiped out by an earlier health crisis (my father had a kidney removed). My brother's operation went ahead without even a credit check. My parents paid monthly installments to the Montreal General. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 So your saying it wouldn't matter if it turned out she was lying about the 6 month timeframe and it was really gonna be 2 weeks? No, I'm saying she and her husband were not lying, and felt threatened by the prospect of going blind or worse. If it was my wife, I wouldn't tell her to "chill out, it's probably a cyst or benign tumor". So it was effecting her quality of life I broke my toe once wish made it so I couldn't walk should I then be put ahead of the guy who's actually dieing. Broken toes do not cause blindness. I want to know what her doctor has to say about this six month wait until then I will not believe her. Fine.....she has already made her mark on the debate. Hope she makes some money too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Fine.....she has already made her mark on the debate. Hope she makes some money too. I agree. Part in parcel of having a right is the right to sue for damages if your right is wronged. It's been done before, recently by a Quebec woman who could not get timely treatment and went to the US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radsickle Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 (edited) I would be the last to suggest a two-tier system. From what I've learned, they ruin the ideal. But there was a good article in last Sunday's Toronto Star about alternative funding sources and co-payments for those who can afford it. U.S. has much to learn from our health care; If Obama looked at our successes and failures, he could avoid making the same mistakes http://www.thestar.com/article/668161 Edited July 23, 2009 by Radsickle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 I would be the last to suggest a two-tier system. From what I've learned, they ruin the ideal. France has a two tier system and they are ranked as the best health care provider in the World. Similarly, Holland has a means tested system and is also ranked well above the average. The Canadian system is a very good starting point, but far from "ideal". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 The Canadian system is a very good starting point, but far from "ideal". Well, it varies from province to province. There is really no such thing as an ideal system. We have a system now and we should work to improve it. If someone else is doing something better that we can work in without to much trouble, we should go for it, but we have a system that works reasonably well and in most places it only needs a few tweaks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radsickle Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 I guess the article's saying that, while Canadians love their health-care system, they also don't want to pay more taxes to keep it going and improve it. So the dreaded co-payment is discussed along with other funding sources for further improvement of our rocking Health Care ideology. The ideal might be outta reach, but at least we're trying for it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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