M.Dancer Posted July 14, 2009 Report Share Posted July 14, 2009 WHAT!?!?!?!First degree murder doesn't have anything to do with the type of motivation... it has to do with the degree of planning and execution. "Malice aforethought" is not a MOTIVE. I didn't say 'type" of motivation. The fact that there it is planned and thought out makes it more serious if race why not OTHER reasons? why not make it a "hatecrime" to assault someone because of his clothes, or because he looked at you funny, or because he was ugly? That's just idiotic thinking...I've tried to lead you to culture but I can't make you think.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lictor616 Posted July 14, 2009 Report Share Posted July 14, 2009 I didn't say 'type" of motivation. The fact that there it is planned and thought out makes it more seriousThat's just idiotic thinking...I've tried to lead you to culture but I can't make you think.. to begin with comparing murder and assault is apples and oranges. Secondly a person on trial for murder is not on trial for the REASONS of the murder... but for THE MURDER ITSELF AND ALONE and The degree to which it was planned (how deliberate it was)... so killing someone by negligence (manslaughter) for instance doesn't yield in the same sentence... but again this has no relationship to assessing the REASONS why the murder was committed. There are no good and bad reasons to murder (with the notable exception of self-defense), you don't get extra time because you were consumed with hatred of the person's hairdo and voice while committing the murder... murder is murder. prosecuting the reason why a murder is committed is again: THOUGHT CRIME. real justice punishes ACTS not the THOUGHT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted July 14, 2009 Report Share Posted July 14, 2009 real justice punishes ACTS not the THOUGHT. Oh please, don't hold punches. You want to applaud these fine young lads for beating the snot out of that darkey trouble-maker. It's because we let these coloreds run around free that poor young white boys get into trouble. I mean, they probably did everyone a favor, because that black was probably itching to make it with a nice pure white girl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griz Posted July 15, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2009 It's doorknobs like Lictor and those 3 lads that are the real problem with our society Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB Globe Posted July 15, 2009 Report Share Posted July 15, 2009 No you fail to see my point (self evident as it may be). The concept of "hate crime" is ludicrous to begin with. It punishes the THOUGHT that went into a crime, which is simply not the way our justice system works... I understand that our justice system DOES recognize such a thing as a "hate crime" but it runs contrary to our entire conception of coercion. The state is justified in coercing an individual ONLY to prevent harm to OTHERS and not to condemn an individual for holding objectionable beliefs, values, or preferences... hence the state cannot punish someone for holding unfavorable opinions about certain races... You punish the ACT... assault is already a crime... there is no better or worse justification for assault, the way it works (or rather SHOULD WORK) is that punching someone in the face because of his style of clothes, because he winked at my girlfriend or because he's black ... these are all equally criminal... you don't punish the REASON WHY someone commits assault; you PUNISH THE ACT: the assault itself. Or else it amounts to a thought crime (that is what a hate crime amounts to: a thought crime)... which is simply madness and lunacy on stilts, punishing someone's thoughts is the grossest insult to freedom, the gravest attack on liberty... a person's thoughts cannot and SHOULD NEVER be subject for criminal punishment. If there is one true fundamental human right, it is the right to free thought. Now liberals who defend this nauseating concept of "hate crime" are simply insane. Its not MY PERSONAL opinion, this is a fact. punishing a person for his thoughts (no matter how ugly and abrasive) is an attempt at denial of reason and decency; it is the insane fanaticism of a mind diseased with hatred of freedom. It is the faith of a nation bent on a tyranny more terrible then any imagined, it is the death-wish of a people who are unfit to be called human. This nameless abomination of "hatecrime" is unnacceptable to any decent freethinking human (whatever the race). This is cute and everything, but I'm still waiting for you to answer the following points: 1 - How do you know more about the Courtenay incident than the police, to the point where you can claim that the black male is the instigator? What evidence do you have that is motivating you to defend those white males charged with assault? And why aren't you turning it over to police? 2 - Where is a link to a reputable English source about this "hate crime" in Montreal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lictor616 Posted July 15, 2009 Report Share Posted July 15, 2009 (edited) This is cute and everything, but I'm still waiting for you to answer the following points:1 - How do you know more about the Courtenay incident than the police, to the point where you can claim that the black male is the instigator? What evidence do you have that is motivating you to defend those white males charged with assault? And why aren't you turning it over to police? 2 - Where is a link to a reputable English source about this "hate crime" in Montreal? reputable? ITS A FREAKING VIDEO CLIP... don't you have eyes and a brain in your head to notice the black on white assault? MY POINT IS EXACTLY THAT YOU DON'T HEAR ABOUT IT.. this barely escaped the local news, and no english source that I can find reported it. lemme explain how it works: Black on white hate crime= no news, and no outrage white on black hatecrime= nationwide coverage and big outrage, human rights tribunals get involved the "experts" of the police try to sniff out racism and a huge hooplah is generated. And the Courtenay police can opine what it wants: it simply is out to prove the human rights commission that it is sensitive to minority issues, if you know anything about how a police department works you'd realize that this is a publicity stunt to ward off racism accusations (which happens almost everytime a black person gets arrested by a white cop)... this is all public relations. And the cops CAN'T determine if this was a hatecrime: because first: they don't quite have the capacity of getting into the white boys heads and reading their thoughts, and second; the very concept of hate crime is absurd: because a thought isn't an act, and hate is not an act- and our justice system can only criminalize ACTS not thoughts or feelings. Edited July 15, 2009 by lictor616 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted July 15, 2009 Report Share Posted July 15, 2009 In other words no, Lictor can't back up his statements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted July 15, 2009 Report Share Posted July 15, 2009 In other words no, Lictor can't back up his statements. He doesn't feel the need to. He believes people of African descent are subhumans who inherently have criminal tendencies. All this talk about how the notion of a hate crime is simply just a red herring. He hates people of other skin colors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lictor616 Posted July 15, 2009 Report Share Posted July 15, 2009 In other words no, Lictor can't back up his statements. yeah all I have is a NEWS SEGMENT FROM A LOCAL TQS NETWORK... learn french you shut ins, not my problem if you can't speak anything but English... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted July 15, 2009 Report Share Posted July 15, 2009 yeah all I have is a NEWS SEGMENT FROM A LOCAL TQS NETWORK... learn french you shut ins, not my problem if you can't speak anything but English... I speak french fine, I also know that the Gazette would have covered it and it could be googled... The video of dimal quality you posted doesn't show squat and the reporters didn't use the langauge you would want them to.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.Dancer Posted July 15, 2009 Report Share Posted July 15, 2009 Apparently Lictor aint good a googling... How many people attacked the girl Lictor? You said what? 16? Around six or seven people attacked her, got on top of her, started kicking and punching." http://www.cjad.com/news/565/607842 A hate crime you suggest? Parents, teachers and students called last week's vicious beating of two white girls at the hands, shoes and boots of a group of girls from another school - most of them black - a rare occurrence between two institutions that have had civil relations over the years http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/news...b4-6b065ee61251 You would think if it was a hate crime, ALL OF THEM WOULD BE BLACK? Maybe it's something else? Students at Henri Bourassa, both black and white, wrote last week's incident off to a few bad apples. Racial tension is rare, most said. If anything, it would be more of a "French against English" thing. Which is what it's always been. Having grown up in Montreal North, clashes between french and english kids were not uncommon, kids from the protestan and catholic schools fighting with kids from the french catholic school.....lester pearson kids looking for excitment taunting kids from Pope Pius... Anyway, with any thing tha lictor posts, if you scratch little deeper, the facts are quite different from what he claims. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabidgoose Posted July 15, 2009 Report Share Posted July 15, 2009 Apparently Lictor aint good a googling...How many people attacked the girl Lictor? You said what? 16? http://www.cjad.com/news/565/607842 A hate crime you suggest? http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/news...b4-6b065ee61251 You would think if it was a hate crime, ALL OF THEM WOULD BE BLACK? Maybe it's something else? Which is what it's always been. Having grown up in Montreal North, clashes between french and english kids were not uncommon, kids from the protestan and catholic schools fighting with kids from the french catholic school.....lester pearson kids looking for excitment taunting kids from Pope Pius... Anyway, with any thing tha lictor posts, if you scratch little deeper, the facts are quite different from what he claims. Nice research Dancer. Many thanks for the info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tango Posted July 15, 2009 Report Share Posted July 15, 2009 (edited) Ya thanks mdancer. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/nation...article1211663/ Two years ago, at his home in Mississauga, the late Oscar Peterson - the jazz legend - was subjected to several incidents of drive-by racial taunts. The incidents hurt him deeply, and made the-then 81-year-old contemplate leaving the country. In Canada, the louts should not be allowed to drive out artists or indeed anyone else. It's racist louts and white supremacists who should have to leave the country, imo. Edited July 15, 2009 by tango Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griz Posted July 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 Ship Lictor and those three guys from Courtenay back to Europe--Deport the immigrant buggers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tango Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 Ship Lictor and those three guys from Courtenay back to Europe--Deport the immigrant buggers Thanks Griz! We can send them the long way on a slow ice floe ... their own 'white nation'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charter.rights Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 (edited) Thanks Griz! We can send them the long way on a slow ice floe ... their own 'white nation'. Maybe the white supremacists are right. They should be allowed to mingle with their "own kind". I would suggest putting them on an ice flow in the Arctic with an order of large McDonald fries. I would think that by the time the seagulls and the polar bears get done with them, they would appreciate some diversity.... Licker69? Should I get your tickets? The cruise ship leaves from Anchorage at 6:oo PM on Sunday night...... Edited July 18, 2009 by charter.rights Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tango Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 (edited) Maybe the white supremacists are right. They should be allowed to mingle with their "own kind".I would suggest putting them on an ice flow in the Arctic with an order of large McDonald fries. I would think that by the time the seagulls and the polar bears they would appreciate some diversity.... Licker69? Should I get your tickets? The cruise ship leaves from Anchorage at 6:oo PM on Sunday night...... Quote of the week 'Once they get cold, they're nasty.' Chicago fast-food connoisseur JAMIE COX, 19, agrees with McDonald's plan to do away with its Super Size fries, but he still wants the big drink NORTH POLE Russia scrambled to rescue a group of 12 scientists doing climate research near the North Pole after their supplies and base camp sank when the ice floe collapsed beneath them. The floating research station, re-established with much fanfare a year ago, had traversed nearly 2,800 km of Arctic waters before it unexpectedly sank. oops! http://www.macleans.ca/world/global/articl...315_77219_77219 Edited July 18, 2009 by tango Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strangles Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 Quote of the week 'Once they get cold, they're nasty.' Chicago fast-food connoisseur JAMIE COX, 19, agrees with McDonald's plan to do away with its Super Size fries, but he still wants the big drink NORTH POLE Russia scrambled to rescue a group of 12 scientists doing climate research near the North Pole after their supplies and base camp sank when the ice floe collapsed beneath them. The floating research station, re-established with much fanfare a year ago, had traversed nearly 2,800 km of Arctic waters before it unexpectedly sank. oops! http://www.macleans.ca/world/global/articl...315_77219_77219 There's no such thing as race, its a social construct. Mixing of peoples has been such an integral part of humanity its almost ridiculous we even see so many people get upset over it. The term racial purity is like saying "chocolate chip unicorn". Most race haters are social failures or financially disadvantaged, they feel their inadequacies were brought about by others. Its almost certain the perpetrators of the attack in some way fit the category. Anyone who has had the misfortune of reading through the pseudo comedy site known as Stormfront will have a laugh at the childish stupidity of tripe that grown men consider intellectual dialogue. They use analogies and examples of horse and dog breeding and compare them with human genetics, while pretending to understand the subject matter. Anyways, the Earth is growing smaller as communication and transportation continues to bring people closer together. The resistance of the globalization of people from different origins coming together is comedies like Stormfront and lictor. Today there is a cross pollination between Africa and Asia, with an Africa town in almost every major city in Eastern China. Legal and illegal immigrants, and millions of Chinese in Africa, also legal and illegal. Shall we say...the show (miscegenation) will go on? You bet. (Yeah I know a bit off topic). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tango Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 Anyone who has had the misfortune of reading through the pseudo comedy site known as Stormfront will have a laugh at the childish stupidity of tripe that grown men consider intellectual dialogue. Pseudo comedy ... right ... Right until they come recruiting your kids to go 'hunting' with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 No, pretending that long-term abuses against certain ethno-racial groups can simply be cured by declaring "You are now equal". Would you care to present any evidence of "long term abuses" against "ethno-racial" groups? Because this thread has a dearth of such examples. I am unaware of any statistics which says that visible minorities are being attacked by nasty white people at a larger rate than, say, the reverse. I'm unaware of any actual evidence which shows that "ethno-racial" minorities are suffering due to some kind of invisible wide-scale discrimination either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 Ship Lictor and those three guys from Courtenay back to Europe--Deport the immigrant buggers Do we also deport all Blacks to Africa or the Caribbean once they've been convicted of some kind of nastiness? I'm guessing that's a big uhm NOOOOOOOOO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griz Posted July 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 That's not my point though. I have been saying all along, and will continue to do so, that whites are immigrants too. Remember way back when I said that the root of the problem are whites think they built this country exclusively on their own and they've done everybody one great big favor? What were those 3 doorknobs and Vancouver Island saying to the black guy in their attack? This is a white town or something like? The reason why most whites think they've done the Indians a favor is beyond me but relates to the brainwashing they get in school Do we also deport all Blacks to Africa or the Caribbean once they've been convicted of some kind of nastiness? I'm guessing that's a big uhm NOOOOOOOOO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tango Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 Do we also deport all Blacks to Africa or the Caribbean once they've been convicted of some kind of nastiness? I'm guessing that's a big uhm NOOOOOOOOO! It's not just about doing something nasty, but about what was done: Racial taunts and attacks attempt to exclude people from society by race. Those who attempt to exclude others should themselves be excluded. Of course, the 'deport on an ice floe with some Macdonalds fries' was a joke, but serves to illustrate the point: If you don't respect multicultural Canada, bugger off! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 It's not just about doing something nasty, but about what was done: Racial taunts and attacks attempt to exclude people from society by race. Those who attempt to exclude others should themselves be excluded. Of course, the 'deport on an ice floe with some Macdonalds fries' was a joke, but serves to illustrate the point: If you don't respect multicultural Canada, bugger off! Why is refusing to respect multiculturalism any worse than refusing to respect any other of Canada's identifying traits? What about "if you can't speak one of Canada's official languages, bugger off?" What about "if you can't respect the separation of our law from religion, bugger off?" What about "if you can't accept the rights of women, bugger off?" Personally, I think that if somebody takes their daughter to East Africa to have her genitals mutilated for cultural/religious reasons, they ought to not bother coming back to Canada. If we're going to start banishing people for not buying into Canadian values, there's a lot of people I'd put on the boat along with these three. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 By the by, as much as I dislike the general tone of just about everything Lictor writes, he is right about one thing: making "hate crime" a crime in and of itself would, indeed, be a perversion of our system of justice. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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