Canada will slump into deficit next year: Flaherty

[jdobbin]

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/stor...?hub=TopStories

Federal Finance Minister Jim Flaherty said Wednesday that Canada will fall into deficit during the next fiscal year as recessionary economic forces continue to slowdown the world's economy.

Three weeks ago Flaherty was saying no deficit in 2009.

And this is before one extra cent is spent on stimulus.

[Jerry J. Fortin]

Figure a 30 billion dollar tab for a 20% pie of the auto bailout plan. Add in another 10 to 15 billion in other bailouts yet unseen and you begin to see the end of the beginning of the things to come.

[scribblet]

Bailing out the auto industry won't help either, what about all the other people who won't be so lucky as to be bailed out.

[Shakeyhands]

Was any bailout factored in there? $15Billion surplus reduced to a $5Billion deficet in 2.5 years?

[Mr.Canada]

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/stor...?hub=TopStories

Three weeks ago Flaherty was saying no deficit in 2009.

And this is before one extra cent is spent on stimulus.

Canada would have to go into deficit no matter who was in power. Just a few weeks ago you were criticizing Harper for cutting spending, then you said he needed a stimulus package, now you say he's running a deficit this week. You cannot have your cake and eat it too jdobbin.

However you trumpeted the coalitions plan to go into $30B in debt. You are saying something different every day. You are wishy washy in your views like Paul Martin. Where do you stand jdobbin cause it changes daily depending on the scope of the article you've just read.

[Shakeyhands]

5...4...3...2...

[Topaz]

They paid money towards the debt but now all that is going to be wiped away from the deficit we are going to have. My one question is what is the deficit NOW and how much will it be when the Conservatives end their time in Ottawa?

[Mr.Canada]

They paid money towards the debt but now all that is going to be wiped away from the deficit we are going to have. My one question is what is the deficit NOW and how much will it be when the Conservatives end their time in Ottawa?

They have no choice but to run a deficit. IF they don't you'll say they killed the auto sector or whatever else you can think of. Any person in power would run a deficit. The coalition wants to run a $30B deficit and Layton wants to raise corporate taxes. You support these guys Topaz. Put your money where your mouth is.

[blueblood]

Was any bailout factored in there? $15Billion surplus reduced to a $5Billion deficet in 2.5 years?

Do you like paying higher taxes so the Libs can hoard it in a piggy bank?

[Mr.Canada]

Do you like paying higher taxes so the Libs can hoard it in a piggy bank?

I doubt he has a job, so it doesn't matter to people who have no money to begin with. It isn't their money so they don't care.

[White Doors]

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/stor...?hub=TopStories

Three weeks ago Flaherty was saying no deficit in 2009.

And this is before one extra cent is spent on stimulus.

ha, like he had much choise with all the opposition hand wringing over a 'stimulus package'

[Jerry J. Fortin]

If Harper had a brain he would not hand over one tax dollar to inefficient corporations that are on the brink of going belly up. This bailout is folly, supporting business is not the roll of government, their function is to support the people. Now either we go full commy and nationalize the industry, or we don't give them a dime. I am sure there are lots of folks that want to spend tax dollars on the industry, for them and their desires let them have a special corporate welfare tax applied to them and only use those funds for a bailout of failed business interests. The rest of the citizens should not be burdened with this regional concern.

[Shakeyhands]

Do you like paying higher taxes so the Libs can hoard it in a piggy bank?

Not particularily, I'm just unclear as to where $15B has gone. Most prudent families have an emergency fund, if the surplus hadn't been spent, we wouldn't find ourselves in a deficit position.

Edited December 18, 2008 by Shakeyhands

[Shakeyhands]

I doubt he has a job, so it doesn't matter to people who have no money to begin with. It isn't their money so they don't care.

Thats a good one... want to compare jobs and T4's?

[blueblood]

Not particularily, I'm just unclear as to where $15B has gone. Most prudent families have an emergency fund, if the surplus hadn't been spent, we wouldn't find ourselves in a deficit position.

Tax cuts and larger than normal debt payments, along with increased transfer to provinces. The feds do have an always emergency fund, it's called debt payments. Given that gov'ts cannot die, they can prolong debt payments indefinetely. However paying the debt reduces the taxload on Canadians. The gov't isn't a prudent family as it cannot die and is around in theory forever.

[Topaz]

They have no choice but to run a deficit. IF they don't you'll say they killed the auto sector or whatever else you can think of. Any person in power would run a deficit. The coalition wants to run a $30B deficit and Layton wants to raise corporate taxes. You support these guys Topaz. Put your money where your mouth is.

Where did you get that figure? The Libs didn't come up with that number and they can't give a number until they KNOW how far into Debt the Conservative government are and right now they aren't saying! Do you know how far into debt the government is? Please tells us if you know? Layton raising corporate taxes is old news he changed his mind. Do I support thses guys? The Libs track record has been they have paid off the debt the Conservatives seem to get the country into, so if that's only way we are going to get the job done and get out of debt, the Libs will be back in. Lets just hope that the Cons don't put us so far into debt , that we CAN get out of it.

[Moonbox]

A liquidity crisis, and the consequence of lower tax revenue for consumer purchases and business revenue, happened to the $15B surplus.

Complaining about where the surplus went during an economic crisis is particularly funny when everyone's demanding increased government spending and corporate bailouts.

[Topaz]

On the radio news just now, they said that Conservatives will have four years of deficits, even BEFORE a dime is spent on stimulating the economy!! Go figure, Flaherty... do to Canada what you did to Ontario! So the debt will probably be higher than the Cons say because more EI payments and social payments will be going out and less corporate and income tax revenues coming in. I'm totally surprise at Harper who suppose have all these degrees behind him in economics and a IQ of 128. He should have listened to Dion's warning during the election.

[Canadian Blue]

Topaz, how do you think Canada could have become an island in this GLOBAL financial crisis?

The Libs track record has been they have paid off the debt the Conservatives seem to get the country into, so if that's only way we are going to get the job done and get out of debt, the Libs will be back in. Lets just hope that the Cons don't put us so far into debt , that we CAN get out of it.

Not necessarily, look at Ontario under Dalton McGuinty. Difference is that the Conservatives take action during such times to put in place common sense economic policies like NAFTA.

[Canadian Blue]

I'm totally surprise at Harper who suppose have all these degrees behind him in economics and a IQ of 128. He should have listened to Dion's warning during the election.

Which was to put in place a hefty tax on consumers which would cure all of our economic ills?

[Moonbox]

Where did you get that figure? The Libs didn't come up with that number and they can't give a number until they KNOW how far into Debt the Conservative government are and right now they aren't saying!

Opposition agrees to $30-billion stimulus in coalition deal

It's on the Globe and Mail as well...if you need me to find it and link it. That was the number they were looking at...

The Libs track record has been they have paid off the debt the Conservatives seem to get the country into, so if that's only way we are going to get the job done and get out of debt, the Libs will be back in. Lets just hope that the Cons don't put us so far into debt , that we CAN get out of it.

The convenient thing about this argument is you've completely ignored the Trudeau Liberal track record of recording the biggest and highest relative debt levels the country has EVER seen WITHOUT a recession to worry about.

Tax revenues are one of the biggest factors in the year end budget. When the economy is booming (which it was for the ENTIRE time the Liberals were in power 1993-2006) tax revenue is high. When commodity prices, lending, consumer spending etc all collapse in short order (such as it is now AND during both the start and end of Mulroney's terms), those revenues go down. Mulroney was a garbage PM, I won't contest that, but acting like the Liberals are somehow financial gurus is just stupid considering they're mainly responsible for the federal debt we hold right now.

[Moonbox]

On the radio news just now, they said that Conservatives will have four years of deficits, even BEFORE a dime is spent on stimulating the economy!! Go figure, Flaherty... do to Canada what you did to Ontario! So the debt will probably be higher than the Cons say because more EI payments and social payments will be going out and less corporate and income tax revenues coming in. I'm totally surprise at Harper who suppose have all these degrees behind him in economics and a IQ of 128. He should have listened to Dion's warning during the election.

okay Topaz, at the end of your ramble you said Harper should have listened to Dion's warning. What was that again? That the economy was going to the crapper? Okay...the economy is going to the crapper. Now what??? What do the Liberals have to offer, SPECIFICALLY, that the Cons haven't already? Please...

[Canadian Blue]

Moonbox in general I agree with you, however I think one point that many people miss is that it was largely initiatives taken during Mulroney's time in power that helped lead to more economic growth. He got rid of a large share of crown corporations, brought in Free Trade, and also put in place the GST, all of these would later help our economy grow and develop. While Mulroney was far from the best PM we ever had, he certainly isn't as bad as many in the Liberal camp make him out to be.

Let me say this, if John Turner had won the 1988 election our economy would still be the same mindset as that of the 1970's.

Edited December 18, 2008 by Canadian Blue

[jdobbin]

Canada would have to go into deficit no matter who was in power.

The budget officer lay the deficit coming at Harper's feet. He blamed Tory policies for where we are, not Liberal ones.

Just a few weeks ago you were criticizing Harper for cutting spending, then you said he needed a stimulus package, now you say he's running a deficit this week. You cannot have your cake and eat it too jdobbin.

I wasn't criticizing spending cuts. I was saying Harper's cuts were political and that if he wasn't serious when he cut political funding by the same amount that he increasing cabinet spending. I can't believe he has gone from 26 cabinet ministers to 37.

And Tory supporters are saying every single one of these people are of utter importance to the governing. Bullocks.

However you trumpeted the coalitions plan to go into $30B in debt.

Actually, I pointed out that this number was something made up as no one in the Liberals said anything about $30 billion.

Tory supporters keep pointing out the number but there is never a source for it.

You are saying something different every day. You are wishy washy in your views like Paul Martin. Where do you stand jdobbin cause it changes daily depending on the scope of the article you've just read.

And you seem to lie like Harper every day. The sociopathic, rabid dog response gets stronger and stronger all the time.

[jdobbin]

Do you like paying higher taxes so the Libs can hoard it in a piggy bank?

Do you like paying higher taxes to pay for Tory deficits? Mulroney increased taxes 19 times but could never get a handle on spending. And rather than get a handle on it, he tried constitutional talks twice and failed.

The Liberals decreases spending, eliminated the deficit and were paying down debt and left money in the bank to avoid a downturn as we are seeing now. They also decreased taxes.