jdobbin Posted August 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 Of course it's achieving what he wants. Harper believes China is a crock. He's calling them on it and bringing it to everyone's attention and is doing it well and efficiently. If his actions are helping to turn the gears inside the chinese people's heads that communism is not a good thing and should be stopped, shouldn't he be praised for that? The chinese wanted to put on this show and make a splash, they even went to extreme lengths to try and make themselves look good, Harper threw a monkey wrench in that plan. You even said that the Chinese are very upset with him. It appears to everyone that Chinese mentality is that the world needs China so China can do whatever it wants; Harper is waving his middle finger at China because there are other big economies to do business with. Harper has succeeded in taking China down a peg, bravo. The Chinese people don't hear any of that. Nor is the Chinese government changing because Harper doesn't meet with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xul Posted August 17, 2008 Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 (edited) I don't think China government or Chinese people will take Mr.Harper's absence for a big deal for he doesn't politicalize his absence as a boycott in public. And in fact it was not that China government invited him or anyone, it is a Olympic Games tradition that each of IOC members can have a free ticket for only one of their national leaders to attend the opening ceremony. I remember several weeks earlier, a Chinese newspaper reported some India media accused that China government didn't invite Indian PM attending to the ceremony but had invited another India senior politican Mrs. Sonia Gandhi. The newsletter said a spokesman of China Foreign Ministry said that "we have to respect Indian Olympic Committee's decision". It seems that Indian Olympic Committee made such decision for some reason and both China and India governments have not right to intervene them. I have just seached in internet of which countries's top policital leaders were absent the ceremony. It is very funny that Sudan and Zimbabwei presidents, China was often accused for backing them, were not there but Israeli president was there . But I agree that the relationship between two CPC governments are cold though it seems both of them recently have some will to make up it. Edited August 17, 2008 by xul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xul Posted August 17, 2008 Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 (edited) Certainly 80% of trade is raw materials but we also have a lot of Canadians companies looking at selling aerospace products, engineering and architectural services, trains, banking and insurance services, nuclear products and an increasing amount of industrial products. At this point I agree with you. Political relationship is important to the other 20% high-end goods and services because the buyers of such high price goods usually are China government or state-runned projects. Though someone may think Canada imports more goods from China so Canada could take advantage in any conflicts but the fact is it is not. Most China made good buyers in Canada are common people so Canada government can not stop them to buy Chinese goods just for some silly right wing's "political-correct" reason, but another CPC did have ability and willing to buy nothing form those guys who are very unfriendly to them and these guys cannot depend on WTO to support them for China government is the buyer in the deal so there is not any intervene could be convicted just as Canada government always bought Canadian made warships and American companies can not complain such kind of unfair in WTO, and those so-call western "friends" of Canada will not interest in backing Canada in WTO because the loss of Canada companies would be the chances of their companies. I think everyone would agree with me that there are overmany airplane manufacturers in the world and the market is shrinking. And the success of the 20% high-tech companies represents the future of Canada unless people here like Canada sink into a developing country which only sells oil, ore or something. Edited August 17, 2008 by xul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted August 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 It is very funny that Sudan and Zimbabwei presidents, China was often accused for backing them, were not there but Israeli president was there . The Israeli President is not about to face a coup if he out of the country for too long whereas that is entirely possible in Sudan and Zimbabwe. But I agree that the relationship between two CPC governments are cold though it seems both of them recently have some will to make up it. On Canada's part that can only come if Harper has changed his mind about things. I've seen no indication that he has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted August 17, 2008 Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 No need to appease, no need to provoke. Canada can remain an advocate for human rights and still meet the Chinese leadership and attend things like the Olympics. Are you stating flat out that every world leader is required to attend an Olympic games opening ceremonies? Will Stephan Dion make a public promise that he and every Liberal leader who comes after him will always attend every Olympic opening ceremonies or resign? Will it be the centrepoint of your campaign? Will all Liberal leadership candidates be required to take a vow, preferably with some kind of blood oath, to never miss an Olympic opening ceremony again? Will you have it put into the constitution? Should there be some kind of prison sentence for any political leader who fails to show an appropriate worshipful stance towards the Olympics? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted August 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 Are you stating flat out that every world leader is required to attend an Olympic games opening ceremonies? Will Stephan Dion make a public promise that he and every Liberal leader who comes after him will always attend every Olympic opening ceremonies or resign? Will it be the centrepoint of your campaign? Will all Liberal leadership candidates be required to take a vow, preferably with some kind of blood oath, to never miss an Olympic opening ceremony again? Will you have it put into the constitution? Should there be some kind of prison sentence for any political leader who fails to show an appropriate worshipful stance towards the Olympics? Nope. Not every world leader has to attend Olympic games ceremonies. The Chinese, however, were observing Harper's behaviour closely to see if there was going to be a break in the perceived hostility he has towards them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted August 17, 2008 Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 Nope. Not every world leader has to attend Olympic games ceremonies. The Chinese, however, were observing Harper's behaviour closely to see if there was going to be a break in the perceived hostility he has towards them. Will Stephan Dion vow to make an immediate pilgrimage to Beijing if elected, like, the very next day after the election, to apologize to the Chinese and beg their forgiveness? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted August 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 Will Stephan Dion vow to make an immediate pilgrimage to Beijing if elected, like, the very next day after the election, to apologize to the Chinese and beg their forgiveness? Will Harper escalate hostilities with China into a full scale trade war? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jefferiah Posted August 17, 2008 Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 The Chinese, however, were observing Harper's behaviour closely to see if there was going to be a break in the perceived hostility he has towards them. Not going to a sporting event is quite an act of hostility, bordering on aggression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted August 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 Not going to a sporting event is quite an act of hostility, bordering on aggression. The Chinese were obviously looking for some indication of a change in behaviour from Harper. It looks to be from some of the reaction of Conservative supporters here that they want Harper to go much further. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jefferiah Posted August 17, 2008 Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 The Chinese were obviously looking for some indication of a change in behaviour from Harper. I guess we had all better behave the way the Chinese think we should. Harper should be sent for re-education. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted August 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 I guess we had all better behave the way the Chinese think we should. Harper should be sent for re-education. I'm sure we'll see more of the same hostility towards China from Harper unless Emerson is somehow able to convince him to open a dialogue. It seems some in the Conservative party at least in this forum want a full scale trade war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Bill Posted August 17, 2008 Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 I guess we had all better behave the way the Chinese think we should. Harper should be sent for re-education. Don't give the leftwingers here any ideas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted August 17, 2008 Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 Harper believes China is a crock. He's calling them on it and bringing it to everyone's attention and is doing it well and efficiently. If his actions are helping to turn the gears inside the chinese people's heads that communism is not a good thing and should be stopped, shouldn't he be praised for that? The chinese wanted to put on this show and make a splash, they even went to extreme lengths to try and make themselves look good, Harper threw a monkey wrench in that plan. You even said that the Chinese are very upset with him. It appears to everyone that Chinese mentality is that the world needs China so China can do whatever it wants; Harper is waving his middle finger at China because there are other big economies to do business with. Harper has succeeded in taking China down a peg, bravo. I agree with GWH Bush, referring to talk of a boycott, who for many years has realized the importance of good relations with China: "Give credit for how far they have come; that's what I do." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueblood Posted August 17, 2008 Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 The Chinese people don't hear any of that. Nor is the Chinese government changing because Harper doesn't meet with them. Pope John Paul II didn't defeat the communist regime either, he made them look like a joke. Harper is in effect doing the same thing. Come on this is Harper, we all know good and well he'll take pot shot after pot shot at people he doesn't like. And judging by the reaction from the Chinese, it's mission accomplished. A trade war with China wouldn't hurt us much, they have a large booming neighbour next door. The quicker India gets up and running, the better off the world is. The last thing China wants is a trade war, if no country buys their goods, they are up the creek without a paddle. There's lots of poor countries to pop up factories for cheap goods, there isn't a lot of Countries with Canada's resources. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted August 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 Pope John Paul II didn't defeat the communist regime either, he made them look like a joke. Harper is in effect doing the same thing. Come on this is Harper, we all know good and well he'll take pot shot after pot shot at people he doesn't like. And judging by the reaction from the Chinese, it's mission accomplished.A trade war with China wouldn't hurt us much, they have a large booming neighbour next door. The quicker India gets up and running, the better off the world is. The last thing China wants is a trade war, if no country buys their goods, they are up the creek without a paddle. There's lots of poor countries to pop up factories for cheap goods, there isn't a lot of Countries with Canada's resources. I think you have it wrong that a trade war wouldn't hurt us. Trade conflicts hurt everyone. Is that what Conservatives want? A trade war? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Bill Posted August 17, 2008 Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 I think you have it wrong that a trade war wouldn't hurt us. Trade conflicts hurt everyone.Is that what Conservatives want? A trade war? How could a trade war hurt us if we're running a HUGE trade deficit with China? That's mathematically impossible! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted August 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 How could a trade war hurt us if we're running a HUGE trade deficit with China? That's mathematically impossible! It would hurt having to pay a whole lot more for certain products or to have them unavailable altogether. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueblood Posted August 17, 2008 Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 It would hurt having to pay a whole lot more for certain products or to have them unavailable altogether. That's where India, the rest of Asia, Africa, Latin America come in. Factory workers are a dime a dozen; our oil, grain, and metals aren't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted August 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 That's where India, the rest of Asia, Africa, Latin America come in. Factory workers are a dime a dozen; our oil, grain, and metals aren't. India does not come close to the present offerings from China. Maybe one day but that day isn't now and it isn't tomorrow either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueblood Posted August 17, 2008 Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 India does not come close to the present offerings from China. Maybe one day but that day isn't now and it isn't tomorrow either. That day is however coming very quickly, how about investing there to speed up the process? When India does come to that level, then China is in deep kaka. Uncle Sam is however still our best customer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted August 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2008 That day is however coming very quickly, how about investing there to speed up the process? When India does come to that level, then China is in deep kaka. Uncle Sam is however still our best customer. So you suggest Harper get into a trade war with China because you prefer India? You're willing to pay a higher price for Indian goods until they're at China's level? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted August 18, 2008 Report Share Posted August 18, 2008 The Chinese were obviously looking for some indication of a change in behaviour from Harper. It looks to be from some of the reaction of Conservative supporters here that they want Harper to go much further. The world was hoping for some indication of a change in behaviour from the Chinese. Fat chance that's gonna happen! They set up parks where people could protest, well away from the Olympics, then everyone who applied for a permit to protest was arrested! Niiiiice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted August 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2008 The world was hoping for some indication of a change in behaviour from the Chinese. Fat chance that's gonna happen!They set up parks where people could protest, well away from the Olympics, then everyone who applied for a permit to protest was arrested! Niiiiice. Had Harper been there, he would have been able to speak out on that issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueblood Posted August 18, 2008 Report Share Posted August 18, 2008 Had Harper been there, he would have been able to speak out on that issue. Harper's actions speak louder than words. The Chinese are PO'd at him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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