Cult Tipster is an Obama Delegate

[M.Dancer]

..... and no comment at all from you about the Tuskegee experiment and how in light of what the government did there, it might be not so 'off the wall' for blacks to not trust our government.

I wasn't aware it had been brought up...so I will comment. It was wrong. Never the less you have to be a space cadet 1st class to believe AIDS is a government conspiracy, .....

But in twenty years of sermons, there was one sermon about AIDs and the U.S. government, so speaking for myself, I can't see leaving a church I'd attended for years, a congregation that I really liked, over one sermon or one belief that I didn't share with the minister.So you're familiar with all the sermons Wright preached for 20 years?? And they were all "racist drivel?" Funny how we're only hearing about snippets from a handful of sermons when there's "20 years" of "racist drivel" to choose from.

He was there (wright ) for 37 years...how do you know it was only one sermon? What about his other racist brain fart? That the Israelis are building a bomb that only kills arabs and blacks? Was that another one timer?

Tell you what. When you can show me that Wright preached what you claim he did, I'll consider your question. Until then, I'll just dismiss your saying his church is "like Christian Identity" as more of your hyperbole.

Now the reason I posted what I did was to call attention to the Tuskegee experiment, and how in light of past government actions Wrights' claims cannot be dismissed because of the number of blacks who believe it; dismiss the man, but the claims need to be addressed.

The claims are pure unadulterated poop. They along with all who believe them can be dismissed out of hand.

[bush_cheney2004]

Actually I remember reading about that experiment quite some time ago (years), it truly was heinous thing to do. Another one that shocked me was when I read about another experiment, this time targeting mental patients. They exposed these people to varying levels of radiation in order to study the effects on the human body, of course it was done without consent of any kind. If I get time I'll see if I can dig up anything on it. As I said, it was shocking.

Right...those were the Cincinatti radiation experiments....and there were others as well....all non-consensual and government sponsored. Hell, when I was in the service, they used us to test new flu vaccines made from chicken eggs. Several people had strong adverse reactions. But it didn't mean they were trying to wipe out certain ethnicities or demographics.

Canada has its own blood products horror story, but did a member of the clergy surmise that it was a plot by the government to commit genocide?

[AngusThermopyle]

Several people had strong adverse reactions. But it didn't mean they were trying to wipe out certain ethnicities or demographics.

Canada has its own blood products horror story, but did a member of the clergy surmise that it was a plot by the government to commit genocide?

Thats true, I never meant to imply that they were deliberately trying to wipe out entire groups, just that these things are sometimes done. As for Wright, as far as I can see he's nothing more than an angry nutbar.

As a matter of fact when we deployed to Somalia they forced us to use Mefloquin, a highly dubious substance banned in many places as it can cause temporary psychosis in quite a few who use it.

I've often wondered if it played a significant role in the Somalia scandal.

[bush_cheney2004]

As a matter of fact when we deployed to Somalia they forced us to use Mefloquin, a highly dubious substance banned in many places as it can cause temporary psychosis in quite a few who use it.

Another excellent example, and more invasive than withholding penicillin treatment....the government didn't directly infect the Tuskegee subjects AFAIK, but did contribute to keeping them in play as disease vectors. The situations are different, but it is straightforward for the government to make a cost-benefit analysis decision with forward deployed troops.

Every year parents go through agonizing decisions about the risks of vaccinations....and a few otherwise healthy kids die. Is it a plot by the Govmint' ? Yes (and No).

[Guest American Woman]

Actually I remember reading about that experiment quite some time ago (years), it truly was heinous thing to do. Another one that shocked me was when I read about another experiment, this time targeting mental patients. They exposed these people to varying levels of radiation in order to study the effects on the human body, of course it was done without consent of any kind. If I get time I'll see if I can dig up anything on it. As I said, it was shocking.

That didn't take too long after all. Theres actually plenty of info about this. A note of clarification, this article states that consent was in doubt, they're still argueing about whether it was recieved or not I guess.

NY Times

I can't believe that the government actually did what it did. It is, as you said, truly heinous. That people are going on about Wright being a nutcase as they barely comment on this is pretty amazing to me. If anyone would have told me that my government did what it did before it was given full media exposure, I would definitely have dismissed them as a nutcase. It's a lot more understandable to me know why so many blacks distrust the government.

I hadn't heard of the other experiment you mentioned; the one targeting mental patients, so thank you for the information. Again, truly unbelievable and truly heinous. There's no way "children, mental patients, [or] retarded people" could have given legitimate/legal consent.

[bush_cheney2004]

...I hadn't heard of the other experiment you mentioned; the one targeting mental patients, so thank you for the information. Again, truly unbelievable and truly heinous. There's no way "children, mental patients, [or] retarded people" could have given legitimate/legal consent.

Why is it unbelievable? The government, or at least people in positions acting on behalf or underwritten by government, have done such things for a very long time. We even embraced the data collected from heinous German and Japanese experiments on human beings, including live vivisections! You can imagine what the animals went / still go through !

Edited May 6, 2008 by bush_cheney2004

[Guest American Woman]

Why is it unbelievable? The government, or at least people in positions acting on behalf or underwritten by government, have done such things for a very long time. We even embraced the data collected from heinous German and Japanese experiments on human beings, including live vivisections! You can imagine what the animals went / still go through !

Why is it unbelievable?

That question could just as easily apply to Wright's beliefs about AIDS.

Edited May 6, 2008 by American Woman

[bush_cheney2004]

Why is it unbelievable?

That question could just as easily apply to Wright's beliefs about AIDS.

No...the difference is verifiable evidence to support the claim. Wright has offered nothing in this regard.

[Guest American Woman]

No...the difference is verifiable evidence to support the claim. Wright has offered nothing in this regard.

"Verifiable evidence" has nothing to do with the statement I made; I suggest you look up the definition of "unbelievable."

Furthermore, Wright has the past actions of the government to support the possibility of his allegations-- that's why his allegations need to be addressed. I repeat. Dismiss the man, but not the allegations; not in light of how too many blacks feel. And again, I don't blame them for not trusting the government. Furthermore, you seem to confirm it: The government, or at least people in positions acting on behalf or underwritten by government, have done such things for a very long time.

[M.Dancer]

"Verifiable evidence" has nothing to do with the statement I made; I suggest you look up the definition of "unbelievable."

Furthermore, Wright has the past actions of the government to support the possibility of his allegations-- that's why his allegations need to be addressed. I repeat. Dismiss the man, but not the allegations; not in light of how too many blacks feel. And again, I don't blame them for not trusting the government. Furthermore, you seem to confirm it: The government, or at least people in positions acting on behalf or underwritten by government, have done such things for a very long time.

Shame he doesn't have science or any semblence of tangible evidence to support his decidely divise and racist beliefs...but who having beliefs like that ever do?

Just consider....the USA creates a disease that kills more americans than black......in order qaccording to the fruitcake, to kill blacks?

[bush_cheney2004]

....Furthermore, you seem to confirm it: The government, or at least people in positions acting on behalf or underwritten by government, have done such things for a very long time.

Nonsense.....I confirmed that the government has done many things in the way of medical experiments, not purposeful genocide of "blacks" with HIV/AIDS. How many "blacks" believe this? How do you know? Why don't "whites" believe the same thing given all demographics for HIV/AIDS?

Edited May 6, 2008 by bush_cheney2004

[M.Dancer]

Nonsense.....I confirmed that the government has done many things in the way of medical experiments, not purposeful genocide of "blacks" with HIV/AIDS. How many "blacks" believe this? How do you know? Why don't "whites" believe the same thing given all demographics for HIV/AIDS?

As far as gov'tr testing goes seems like it migt be a tad more dangerous to be a serviceman than a black man...

[bush_cheney2004]

As far as gov'tr testing goes seems like it migt be a tad more dangerous to be a serviceman than a black man...

Yea...and God help a BLACK serviceman!

[sharkman]

Look, you know and I know that there are crimes being committed. That is not the point. The point is can it be proven in a court of law. The court will look at the evidence and if it was gathered lawfully. If it was gathered unlawfully, then the court has to throw it out, and the lawbreakers go free.

Since the children were seized under a fraudulent warrant, there is no case.

Court: Texas had no right to take polygamists' children

This case troubled me because the tipster caller, who lived in Colorado, lied and therefore all of the actions taken were based on someone's crusade against polygamy.

Now we find that the court has decided that there was no evidence that the children seized were in immediate danger. I'm not sure if the minors being pregnant, or young children with evidence of previous broken bones, or other testimony was thrown out, but at the end of the day, those children will go back into an environment where physical and sexual abuse of young girls is the norm. The caller from Colorado who lied about being a 16 yr old pregnant with her second child has damned the very kids she was trying to rescue.

At the end of the linked story:

The sect's leader, Warren Jeffs, is in a Utah prison after being convicted on charges of being an accomplice to rape in connection with a marriage he performed in 2001. Jeffs also faces trial in Arizona on charges stemming from arranged marriages involving FLDS teens.