Cadman allegedly Offered Money

[jdobbin]

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=338988

An upcoming biography about the late Chuck Cadman, an Independent MP from B.C. who in 2005 became pivotal in keeping the minority Liberals alive, claims two people representing the Tories offered Mr. Cadman a $1-million life insurance policy to bring down to government.

According to an excerpt of the book Like A Rock obtained by the Vancouver Sun, author Tom Zytaruk quoted Cadman's wife, Dona, saying the Conservative Party reps visited his office two days before a confidence vote that could have triggered an election.

Mr. Cadman's was the deciding vote.

"The Tories actually walked in with a list of offers written down on a piece of paper," says an excerpt from the book. "Included in their proposal was a million-dollar life insurance policy -- no small carrot for a man with advanced cancer.

"‘That was on him, so that if he died I'd get the million dollars,' Dona Cadman said.

Harper says he investigated it. Why wasn't this referred to the RCMP?

[Wild Bill]

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=338988

Harper says he investigated it. Why wasn't this referred to the RCMP?

Someone found an insurance company willing to give a million dollar policy to a dying man? Sound, prudent financial whizzes running that company! Probably refugees from Enron or Northern Telecom.

Good gravy! This is indeed amazing!

Perhaps they also have found the plans to that 200 mile per gallon carburetor we've been searching for all these years...

[Riverwind]

Someone found an insurance company willing to give a million dollar policy to a dying man?

This story makes no sense for a number of reasons - that is one of them. The other is why is it coming out now? Seems to me that this would have been big 'news' during the last election campaign.

I suspect someone is being fast and loose with the facts and taking something way out of context.

[M.Dancer]

If the offers were on a piece of paper, i'm sure they will have no problem coming up with the paper...

[Borg]

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=338988

Harper says he investigated it. Why wasn't this referred to the RCMP?

This whole thing sounds fishy to me.

I have an aged aunt who will die of cancer - I wonder if I could get the name of that insurance company?

Think the AUTHOR of this report might be able to actually provide the name?

Likely not.

I am sure this paper with the list of "offerings" will never appear. And if it does, it will likely be completely unidentifiable - meaning literally anyone could have written it - including the author or Mrs Cadman.

Good grief - I cannot believe the schemes some folks will come up with.

Borg

[Shakeyhands]

hold on here, its not like its an unprecedented move by these same Conservatives... Jim Hart ring a bell?

And lets not forget the Grewal affair. 14 days of Editing.

Edited February 28, 2008 by Shakeyhands

[M.Dancer]

hold on here, its not like its an unprecedented move by these same Conservatives... Jim Hart ring a bell?

And lets not forget the Grewal affair. 14 days of Editing.

I would say a million dollar policy to a dying man is inprecedented....in politics and in insurance...

[Topaz]

For one thing you can now get Cancer insurance. This doesn't surprise me IF its true. It sounds like stuff that went on in the Mulroney days, cheating, corruption etc. I can see in the future were voters will get fed-up with both the Cons and the Libs and vote in the NDP just to see how honest they are compared to the other two. So who do you think the two Conservative were that offered? Reynolds? Perhaps Harper himself? Nay, he let someone else do the dirty work.

[Wild Bill]

I would say a million dollar policy to a dying man is inprecedented....in politics and in insurance...

It's interesting though how such stuff can stick so easily to Harper's present party. When Cadman was being courted for his vote the party was still Reformer/Alliance guys running the show. These people were more like Cadman himself in their character. The idea of Reformers being so sleazy was really a stretch. With so much grassroots power in that party anyone who tried would have been hooted out of the meeting hall. Cadman himself was the living personification of such standards. Even if someone had been stupid enough to try to bribe him it would have shown that first, they had no idea of his values and second, they had no idea of how easily their actions would have come out within such a party and how strong the counter-reaction would have been.

Today however, Harper's crew seems to have totally thrown all Reform/Alliance party history down the memory hole. We never even hear those names mentioned anymore. Nothing of their party principles, those Blue Book party platform planks, the ideas of grassroots input and recall - it's all never to be mentioned again!

The party today seems a carbon copy of Mulroney's party. Mulroney is venerated as an "elder statesman". Preston Manning is "The One Whose Name Must Not Be Spoken!".

When the parties merged who would have thought the tiny, fantastically broke and in debt rump of the old Tory party would wind up running the show.

The price proved higher than first thought. The new party has only itself to blame for courting Mulroney and then being struck by some of his mud in the Schrieber scandal. Or even this feeble attempt to build something sleazy on Chuck Cadman's memory. By erasing the disconnect of all those years of Reform there's no public sense that today's Tories are NOT the same party as Mulroney's! Considering that Mulroney might arguably be the most reviled PM in generations in the court of public opinion perhaps Harper now realizes his mistake in accepting all those old Conservative advisers into his couterie...

[jdobbin]

Someone found an insurance company willing to give a million dollar policy to a dying man? Sound, prudent financial whizzes running that company! Probably refugees from Enron or Northern Telecom.

Good gravy! This is indeed amazing!

Perhaps they also have found the plans to that 200 mile per gallon carburetor we've been searching for all these years...

Only in exchange for his vote though. It is a bit amazing.

[Riverwind]

This story is even more bizarre:

Dona Cadman, who is now running for the Conservatives in the Vancouver-area riding of Surrey North, was not in the office at the time. But she says her husband was furious when he returned to their apartment. "Chuck was really insulted," she said in a telephone interview with The Globe yesterday. "He was quite mad about it, thinking they could bribe him with that."

Why would she ever agree to run for a party that she believed engaged in those kinds of tactics? Something just does not add up.

[jdobbin]

This story makes no sense for a number of reasons - that is one of them. The other is why is it coming out now? Seems to me that this would have been big 'news' during the last election campaign.

I suspect someone is being fast and loose with the facts and taking something way out of context.

Well perhaps the Tories will toss out Dona Cadman who is running for the Tories in this next election because she says this is what happened. They wouldn't want a dishonest woman running for them.

[jdobbin]

This story is even more bizarre:

Why would she ever agree to run for a party that she believed engaged in those kinds of tactics? Something just does not add up.

And why would the Tories have her is she is being dishonest? Call in the RCMP.

[Wilber]

For one thing you can now get Cancer insurance.

Yes you can but there is a catch. No company will write a policy on someone who already has cancer. As Cadman had terminal cancer at the time and only a few weeks left, I can't imagine him getting any kind of additional life insurance. Something not right with this story.

[scribblet]

It's interesting though how such stuff can stick so easily to Harper's present party. When Cadman was being courted for his vote the party was still Reformer/Alliance guys running the show. These people were more like Cadman himself in their character. The idea of Reformers being so sleazy was really a stretch. With so much grassroots power in that party anyone who tried would have been hooted out of the meeting hall. Cadman himself was the living personification of such standards. Even if someone had been stupid enough to try to bribe him it would have shown that first, they had no idea of his values and second, they had no idea of how easily their actions would have come out within such a party and how strong the counter-reaction would have been.

..

They believe it because they want to, the CPC is doing far better than they ever imagined, and guess what - no hidden agendas and no - 'scary scary'

I will reserve judgement until I see proof or confirmation from gov't that this actually happened.

[guyser]

. As Cadman had terminal cancer at the time and only a few weeks left, I can't imagine him getting any kind of additional life insurance. Something not right with this story.

Actually this could be done quite easily.

It would depend on how much the ins co asked to be paid for this $1M policy. Maybe the ins co asked for $400G or $500G premium, after crunching the numbers and expecting Cadman to live another 4 5 or 10 years, they would not lose money.

Ok I see that "terminal" was used. Is/was that accurate?

Either way, I could see it happening, just no idea at what cost to purchase the policy.

[M.Dancer]

Actually this could be done quite easily.

It would depend on how much the ins co asked to be paid for this $1M policy. Maybe the ins co asked for $400G or $500G premium, after crunching the numbers and expecting Cadman to live another 4 5 or 10 years, they would not lose money.

Ok I see that "terminal" was used. Is/was that accurate?

Either way, I could see it happening, just no idea at what cost to purchase the policy.

I believe it was well known his days were coming to a rather quick end.

[Wilber]

Actually this could be done quite easily.

It would depend on how much the ins co asked to be paid for this $1M policy. Maybe the ins co asked for $400G or $500G premium, after crunching the numbers and expecting Cadman to live another 4 5 or 10 years, they would not lose money.

Ok I see that "terminal" was used. Is/was that accurate?

Either way, I could see it happening, just no idea at what cost to purchase the policy.

He had malignant melanoma and died six weeks after the vote. I don't know much about how companies calculate their risk but this one would seem pretty high to me.

[M.Dancer]

He had malignant melanoma and died six weeks after the vote. I don't know much about how companies calculate their risk but this one would seem pretty high to me.

Yes....I think the premium would need be near $999,3461.54 to make any money....

[guyser]

Yes....I think the premium would need be near $999,3461.54 to make any money....

Thats the thing. They were not looking to make money. There are many ways this could have been constructed. It is politics after all.

Perhaps....the ins co was paid well, along the lines I suggested, and with that they could have also been offered....

1) to be the carrier for MP's life insurance as provided by the house

2) tax benefits carrying to the future.

3) tax reciept for the " donation"

Not saying it/they did, just saying this could have been done.

For instance...plenty of you have company benefits and you know there is normally a three month waiting period. Well, that can be easily changed to no waiting period. $$$$ is exchanged.

[capricorn]

CTV reported the Liberals have asked the RCMP to investigate the alleged bribe offered to Cadman by the Conservative Party. Nothing posted yet on the CTV site. This couldn't come at a better time for the Liberals. The focus will be shifted away from Dion's poor leadership and, the party's lack of unity and in-fighting. I'm certain they'll welcome the diversion. An added bonus is that this matter will make the soon to be released book on Cadman an instant best seller.

When Dona Cadman was asked on CTV whether she considered the offer of a million dollar policy was a bribe she paused then answered: "Well...yes...sort of."

What will the Conservatives do about Dona Cadman's Party nomination? IMO, she and the Party should part company at once. After all, she will be questioned by the RCMP and will essentially give evidence against the Conservative Party.

[jdobbin]

They believe it because they want to, the CPC is doing far better than they ever imagined, and guess what - no hidden agendas and no - 'scary scary'

I will reserve judgement until I see proof or confirmation from gov't that this actually happened.

Until then, the Tories should ask Dona Cadman to step aside because they contend that she is not telling the truth in regards to this $1 million offer to her husband.

[jdobbin]

What will the Conservatives do about Dona Cadman's Party nomination? IMO, she and the Party should part company at once. After all, she will be questioned by the RCMP and will essentially give evidence against the Conservative Party.

I totally agree. If she is lying, they shouldn't have her in the party. If she is telling the truth, she will only get this question again and again and eventually, even with Harper saying nothing is amiss, it will have to be investigated.

If it is true, it would have been illegal. A vote for life insurance for a dying man?

[scribblet]

Until then, the Tories should ask Dona Cadman to step aside because they contend that she is not telling the truth in regards to this $1 million offer to her husband.

We don't know if any of this is true, we don't know if Donna Cadman is telling the truth or not. Until names are named and this is confirmed or proven untrue, we know nothing. So far all we have is one person (the author ) making unproven allegations and drive by smears.

Edited February 28, 2008 by scriblett

[Wild Bill]

They believe it because they want to, the CPC is doing far better than they ever imagined, and guess what - no hidden agendas and no - 'scary scary'

I will reserve judgement until I see proof or confirmation from gov't that this actually happened.

I find it interesting that you only quoted the first paragraph of my post!

Time will tell if the rest of my argument bears merit. It seems to me that the present CPC is playing a similar game to that of Mulroney's crew years ago. Limiting voter choices. The Tories back then were not a strong conservative or populist party in action or philosophy but who else could you vote for?

This is why when Manning came out of the wilderness in an amazingly short span of time Reform had whittled the Conservatives down to a tiny rump of their former strength and had made strong inroads into Ontario, getting up to over a million votes.

Any marketing man understands that limiting customer choices is a dangerous game. It only works as long as the market situation stays stable. Customers know what's happening and even though they still buy your product they tend to resent it. The first time they are given an attractive alternative they are GONE!

Reform and Alliance voters tended to vote out of genuine inspiration and agreement with party philosophy. This bunch seems to have abandoned their old core in their greed for the middle. They act as if they can do this with impunity. Perhaps they're right. Time will tell. Meanwhile, I've got a bottle of good scotch up for a bet with a friend that the present CPC someday might find itself learning the same lesson as the Mulroney party.