Russell by-law spat sparks bilingual study

CANADIEN · June 7, 2008

Let's forget the fact that the Russell by-law, although wrong, is no more a violation of freedom of expression that the Toronto by-law mandating that cab drivers be able to speak English to their clients. (I for one, would have love to see some businesses start to post signs in French only just to witness our resident francophobe's reaction).

Let's forget the irony of seeing a known francophobe, xenophobe and homophobe use the word Nazi all the time.

Nah, let's marvel instead at the twisted logic that sees a by-law that does not violates anybody's right, passed by a democratically elected city council, and that is within the powers of the city council to pass being labelle as seditious, allegedly because some citizens may choose to defy it. Does not look like the definition of sedition in any English (or French) dictionnary I know. Must be a new definition, that reads something like "sedition = anything that runs contrary to the sacred principle that the Frenchies are inferiors".

BTW: Yes Leafless, I am back. And yes, I still don't waste my time reading any of your francophobic, xenophobic or homophobbic drivel.

CANADIEN · June 7, 2008

1. That is, at worst, better than what you traffic in: generalized hate attacks.
2. So, when you say that we should make Ontario, " Officially English, " are you saying that we should use only good, " England English, " and that our language is merely a bastardized form that cannot be called an official language without being inappropriate and deceiving? How dumb is that? The majority language of Canada is not England English, it is Canadian English.

I look forward to your pathetic attempt to defend your contradiction.

What kind of English would be the norm is Ontario was "officially English" is just one aspect of the issue. It would be interesting to see what those promoting an officially English Ontario have in mind in terms of access to education in French, signage legislation, use of languages other than English by the government. I for one does not want an English version of that pile of manure aka as Quebec language laws implemented in Ontario, but forgive me if I think that some of those who call those laws racist would not hesitate one second to bring something similar to my province in order to "protect English" against an unexistent threat.

Edited June 7, 2008 by CANADIEN

CANADIEN · June 7, 2008

Let's forget the fact that the Russell by-law, although wrong, is no more a violation of freedom of expression that the Toronto by-law mandating that cab drivers be able to speak English to their clients. (I for one, would have love to see some businesses start to post signs in French only just to witness our resident francophobe's reaction).
Let's forget the irony of seeing a known francophobe, xenophobe and homophobe use the word Nazi all the time.

Nah, let's marvel instead at the twisted logic that sees a by-law that does not violates anybody's right, passed by a democratically elected city council, and that is within the powers of the city council to pass being labelled as seditious, allegedly because some citizens may choose to defy it. Does not look like the definition of sedition in any English (or French) dictionnary I know. Must be a new definition, that reads something like "sedition = anything that runs contrary to the sacred principle that the Frenchies are inferiors".

BTW: Yes Leafless, I am back. And yes, I still don't waste my time reading any of your francophobic, xenophobic or homophobbic drivel.

Leafless · June 7, 2008

1. That is, at worst, better than what you traffic in: generalized hate attacks.

I generally post only MSM political related news events that are an interest to most people.

This of course includes groups that are the source problem in many of these MSM articles.

If you consider any MSM article I post has a being as being a hate article, then perhaps you should forward your complaints to those responsible for the initial article and retract your hate comment directed at myself.

It is also also unfortunate you fail to support the majority interest of our mainstream society and the associated rights that belong to the majority to prevent mainstream Canadian society from slipping into an unmanageable society.

The Charter of Rights and Freedoms is the evil force that will eventually destroy the functioning of a country built by the majority interest of Canadian society.

2. So, when you say that we should make Ontario, " Officially English, " are you saying that we should use only good, " England English, " and that our language is merely a bastardized form that cannot be called an official language without being inappropriate and deceiving? How dumb is that? The majority language of Canada is not England English, it is Canadian English.

No one ever said the majority English language of is (in your words) England English.

No matter how bastardized you consider English to be in U.S./Canada it is still the common majority language used for commerce and everyday communication in both our countries and in many U.S. states, their English language is the 'official language' of that state.

English is the majority native language of both countries and taught in schools with basically the same linguistic rules and therefore is not considered 'bastardized' as English in North America is NOT a regional language.

Minority French is recognized as a foreign language in Canada and that is proven by the fact that most Canadians must take special French language courses to learn it.

It is not the common language of the land.

And this presents a problem in learning it, as the French language in Canada, unlike English, IS a unofficial regional language and is NOT the same version as the official French taught by language schools in Canada.

You are the one that is pathetic for not crawling out of that French little hole in the ground you appear to live in.

Come out and discover the universal language of the world and the majority language of Canada.

Remiel · June 7, 2008

Come out and discover the universal language of the world and the majority language of Canada.

Do you have anyone astronomically stupid generalizations to make, or do you want to quit with that one?

Less than 25% on the world speaks English (and most of them not as their first language), maybe even less than 15%. Universal my ass.

CANADIEN · June 7, 2008

Do you have anyone astronomically stupid generalizations to make, or do you want to quit with that one?
Less than 25% on the world speaks English (and most of them not as their first language), maybe even less than 15%. Universal my ass.

I for one would think of English as a global language. That being said, there are not that many countries abandoning their own language for it :lol:

Edited June 7, 2008 by CANADIEN

Leafless · June 8, 2008

Do you have anyone astronomically stupid generalizations to make, or do you want to quit with that one?
Less than 25% on the world speaks English (and most of them not as their first language), maybe even less than 15%. Universal my ass.

You are still back in the dark ages with your French and Latin.

Why English is a universal language?
In: English Language

Answer

Because unlike other languages, English is taught in every country in the world and many people can understand English than other languages. There you go; hope that will help.

Umm, English is not actually taught in every country in the world. It has, however, definitely become the lingua franca (most common language, which in the West used to be French, and Latin before that) of modern commerce and communication, is currently the most widely-spoken language in terms of geography, and likely will become the most-spoken language in the world at some point. (Mandarin Chinese is still the language the most people in the world can understand.)

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Why_english_is_a...versal_language

English is without a doubt the actual universal language. It is the world's second largest native language, the official language in 70 countries, and English-speaking countries are responsible for about 40% of world's total GNP.
There are other strong languages that, due to population and economic power, could be universal languages, but they have a number of disadvantages when compared with English.

Some examples:

Japanese: has very regular verbs but also a very complicated script.

Chinese: no conjugations or declension, but a very complicated script and tones.

German has many more inflections than English.

The major Romance languages, such as French, Spanish and Portuguese, have fewer inflections than most of languages, but their verb conjugation is very complicated.

Russian has both complex verb conjugations and numerous noun declensions.

In conclusion, it is lucky for us that our universal language is the simplest and easiest, even though that simplicity and easiness weren't the reasons that lead English

http://www.omniglot.com/language/articles/engunilang.php

Remiel · June 8, 2008

Dark ages, eh?

I mean, it is not like English and French are the languages of the United Nations Secretariat. But what would they know about the prominence of languages, eh?

I have a hard time accepting definitions from a source that clearly does not understand what the implications of the word " universal " is in everyday English. Lingua franca and universal language are not synonyms.

How sad for you to hate the language and culture of your family so deeply.

CANADIEN · June 8, 2008

Dark ages, eh?
I mean, it is not like English and French are the languages of the United Nations Secretariat. But what would they know about the prominence of languages, eh?

I have a hard time accepting definitions from a source that clearly does not understand what the implications of the word " universal " is in everyday English. Lingua franca and universal language are not synonyms.

How sad for you to hate the language and culture of your family so deeply.

You got one thing right... it's about hatred. But I for one know that I am not part of leafless family... one has to be English-speaking (and francophobe0, white (and xenophobe) and heterosexual (and homophobe) to qualify as a person.

Leafless · June 8, 2008

Let's forget the fact that the Russell by-law, although wrong, is no more a violation of freedom of expression that the Toronto by-law mandating that cab drivers be able to speak English to their clients.

The Toronto bylaw ensures cab drivers speak the working language of Ontario so that they can communicate with their clients.

This has nothing to do with the situation in Russell whereas you have a minority culture dictating the language a private business owner should post a sign in.

Let's forget the irony of seeing a known francophobe, xenophobe and homophobe use the word Nazi all the time.

Lets not forget the reason Nazi was used, as it is a true comparison to what the minority Anglophobes in Russell are doing, moving step by step to obtain the upper hand, relating to language domination.

You are only expressing your hatred trying to label me a francophobe, xenophobe or homophobe and is indicative of the contempt you hold against especially, English speaking, Christian Canadians who expressive logical views via free speech.

Nah, let's marvel instead at the twisted logic that sees a by-law that does not violates anybody's right, passed by a democratically elected city council, and that is within the powers of the city council to pass being labelled as seditious, allegedly because some citizens may choose to defy it. Does not look like the definition of sedition in any English (or French) dictionnary I know. Must be a new definition, that reads something like "sedition = anything that runs contrary to the sacred principle that the Frenchies are inferiors".

If you view Frenchies as inferior that is your problem.

The mayor of Russell is a corrupt hate inspired rebel rouser and 'sedition' fits its definition.

And while we are at, the same applies to Ottawa city councillors and its mayor at the time and Ontario premier Dalton Mc.Guinty who undemocratically imposed an 'official bilingualism policy' on the majority English speaking residents of the City of Ottawa, Ontario without the democratic input from the residents of Ottawa.

Edited June 8, 2008 by Leafless

Leafless · June 8, 2008

How sad for you to hate the language and culture of your family so deeply.

Our culture goes no further back to when Britain gave us our BNA Act.

Our family culture and language is Canadian, based on majority interest.

If I was truly hung up with the past culture of my ancestors, I would migrate back to that country.

Edited June 8, 2008 by Leafless

capricorn · June 10, 2008

Jean-Serge Brisson, a former councillor, said a "silent majority" of francophones opposes the bylaw, but won't speak out for fear of being branded as sell-outs.

This is not surprising. Russell is a small town of just under 14,000 inhabitants (2006 census).

Leafless · June 10, 2008

This is not surprising. Russell is a small town of just under 14,000 inhabitants (2006 census).

Your quote was part of the article and justifies nothing relating to by the decision made by Russell councillors.

M.Dancer · June 10, 2008

I did hit Dancer on his misspelled words including 'English' and threw back misspelled 'arthritic' to the little homosexual.

You haver a little homosexual? How nice for you.

Leafless · June 15, 2008

You got one thing right... it's about hatred. But I for one know that I am not part of leafless family... one has to be English-speaking (and francophobe0, white (and xenophobe) and heterosexual (and homophobe) to qualify as a person.

We have laws relating to hatred and I am wondering why they are not being applied in Russell?

Last I heard it was suggested that English speaking Ontarians boycott French businesss in Russell.

English-language rights activist Howard Galganov proposed a boycott of French-owned businesses in Russell Township last night if the local council passes a bilingual sign bylaw next month.
Mr. Galganov, a former Quebec resident known for his battles against Quebec's language laws, said he will finance a mailing campaign to all residents of the township before a public meeting on the issue June 4. The campaign is to begin today, he said.

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/s...47-c78a70888245

Leafless · June 17, 2008

The bilingual sign bylaw was passed under chaotic conditions.

Bilingual sign bylaw passes amid hostility, legal threat
Anglo, francophone rancour erupts at Russell meeting

David Gonczol, The Ottawa Citizen

Published: Tuesday, June 17, 2008

OTTAWA - Russell Township passed a bilingual sign bylaw under a cloud of anger and hostility stirred by an organized protest by anglophone residents.

The opponents of the bylaw that will see bilingual wording on new commercial signs in the largely rural municipality of 14,000, located on Ottawa's southeast doorstep, went from hostile -- with mock Nazi salutes -- to violent when an OPP officer had to intervene when a heated argument threatened to become physical.

A sizable police presence ensured some semblance of order at the meeting, held at the Embrun Recreation Centre. But, when opponents of the bylaw started hurling jeers and taunts at the mayor and francophones in the audience, an additional OPP unit was called in.

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/s...f8-e7537506397a

It appears some cities and towns in Ontario, including Ottawa, Rockland and now Russell have adopted the type of authority the federal government harbours in the way of dictating and implementing racially discriminatory divisive language/cultural policies.

Cultural interest should not be part of a councils agenda as language and culture is a matter of choice and is guaranteed as part of our fundamental freedoms.

Relating to bilingualism in Ontario, Ontario is NOT officially bilingual and council members in cities and towns in Ontario, have no business legislating ANYTHING relating to English/French cultural issues.

Leafless · June 18, 2008

Francophones hail bilingual sign bylaw
Ontario language commissioner's report urges province to tailor French services to 'new reality'

Jean-François Bertrand, The Ottawa Citizen

Published: Wednesday, June 18, 2008

English-speaking residents of Russell have nothing to fear from the township's decision to adopt a bilingual commercial sign bylaw, says the president of L'Assemblée de la francophonie de l'Ontario.

"They (anglophones) are not losing anything," said Mariette Carrier-Fraser, who added that the strong reaction was the same one she saw 10 years ago, when French-language school boards were created in Ontario.

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/c...6b-875286c105e3

I think having Nazi type racist cultural policies shoved down the throats of the English speaking residents is having a LOT to fear and has NO place in the province of Ontario.

Where is SIR DALTON MC.GUINTY in all of this and why is he not protecting the English majority cultural interest from racist abuse?

Ontario Premier Dalton Mc.Guinty has a direct obligation in all of this and that is to make the English language the official language of Ontario to stop this type of linguistic abuse and to help ensure residents of the province can communicate in the common language of the workplace.

guyser · June 18, 2008

I think having Nazi type racist ...

Oops, Godwins law ..............again.

Where is SIR DALTON MC.GUINTY in all of this and why is he not protecting the English majority cultural interest from racist abuse?

When was he knighted by the Queen?

As for the rest, he is at Queens Park and has no need to protect any English majority since there is no evidence of racism nor abuse.

Apparently the sun rose in the east this morning. Phew, I was worried.

Ontario Premier Dalton Mc.Guinty has a direct obligation in all of this and that is to make the English language the official language of Ontario to stop this type of linguistic abuse and to help ensure residents of the province can communicate in the common language of the workplace.

And if he doesnt will we all wake up one morning and start speaking French? That would be cool kind of, but my American clients might want me to stick to English.

By the way, the common language of the workplace where I work is Italian . In another section of this office its Russian since we have a large Russian clientele.

Reality must drive you nuts. Its a nice day outside , go for a walk and enjoy it. Too much disdain for the founding half of this country will give you a stroke.

Frankie says Relax.

Leafless · June 18, 2008

Oops, Godwins law ..............again.

Trying to distract the serious issue of this thread by abusing and misusing Godwin's law again are you.

However, Godwin's Law itself can be abused, as a distraction or diversion, that fallaciously miscasts an opponent's argument as hyperbole, especially if the comparisons made by the argument are actually appropriate.

And the comparisons are VERY appropriate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

As for the rest, he is at Queens Park and has no need to protect any English majority since there is no evidence of racism nor abuse.

Racism and hate language is an extremely serious issue.

Mc.Guinty is to gutless to intervene just like the way he handled Caledonia:

" Dalton Mc.Guinty's Lawless Ontario"

http://caledoniawakeupcall.wordpress.com/2...awless-ontario/

And if he doesnt will we all wake up one morning and start speaking French?

You are getting warm.

That would be cool kind of, but my American clients might want me to stick to English.
By the way, the common language of the workplace where I work is Italian . In another section of this office its Russian since we have a large Russian clientele.

Being an insurance salesman is one up from driving taxi and not many Canadians would tolerate the working conditions you describe.

Sounds like the company you work for is 100% evidence Mc.Guinty must make English the official language of Ontario.

Reality must drive you nuts. Its a nice day outside , go for a walk and enjoy it. Too much disdain for the founding half of this country will give you a stroke.

Founding half is is a total lie and is actually 23.3% of the total population of Canada and they are NOT all Quebecois.

This is also a misrepresentation of facts as Quebec founded nothing as they were defeated by the British who gave us our constitution.

If the feds want to play on semantics so be it, but facts speak for themselves.

BTW- It is the 4.3% French population of Ontario, that have disdain for the English speaking Ontarians and is proven in Russell, Rockland and Ottawa.

This sort of racist discrimination by 4.3% of the population must be curtailed and Mc.Guinty has a direct obligation to the majority culture of Ontario to stop racial discrimination to prevent social unrest.

Edited June 18, 2008 by Leafless

capricorn · June 19, 2008

This sort of racist discrimination by 4.3% of the population must be curtailed and Mc.Guinty has a direct obligation to the majority culture of Ontario to stop racial discrimination to prevent social unrest.

As a Franco-Ontarian and member of the 4.3% population which you categorize as globally racist, I take offense to this. Perhaps you should preview your posts before hitting "add reply".

guyser · June 19, 2008

Trying to distract the serious issue of this thread by abusing and misusing Godwin's law again are you.
And the comparisons are VERY appropriate.

No surprise there . Your comparisons are inappropriate as we have nothing even closely resembling nazism in this country.

For on, Russell held a vote to make this change. Thus, democracy in action.

Are the disenters dead? Nope, thus no nazism.

Go ahead though, keep making my case for me.

Racism and hate language is an extremely serious issue.

I agree 100%. When it rears its ugly head be sure to alert me will you please? Because so far I havent seen it.

Being an insurance salesman is one up from driving taxi and not many Canadians would tolerate the working conditions you describe.

Oww....those words hurt so bad.

If you had any idea what you are talking about you wouldnt say that. But as one who had a geriatric grasp....oh sorry, athritic grasp on most issues, I understand your feeble attempts to slag my industry.

Sounds like the company you work for is 100% evidence Mc.Guinty must make English the official language of Ontario.

Again, no idea what you are talking about. We speak, Italian, Russian, French, Hebrew,Guyanese and Trinidadian (but you wont get that-others will) Finnish,Japanese and Chinese (Mandarin).

Slap your noodle there buttercup, we are a service industry. As such, if we attract people using our language abilities, it means more money for my company. Care to thumb your way through our resumes that arrive weekly? They are all written in English, and I can change the font to super large for those eyes of yours. Let me know.

Actually, you are make dumb statements all the time, including making English the official language. It would not change this office one bit, but it would make this province worse off.

Founding half is is a total lie and is actually 23.3% of the total population of Canada and they are NOT all Quebecois.

Lets see, English and French founding nation. So one of two is 50%. Hmm.....math seems to work for me. Oh I see what you did, you changed it to founding population. How cute you are....silly boy.

This sort of racist discrimination by 4.3% of the population must be curtailed and Mc.Guinty has a direct obligation to the majority culture of Ontario to stop racial discrimination to prevent social unrest.

Naw, lets just leave it alone and have more Russell's. It will drive you nuts and provide more fodder for amusement.

Say what happened to your thesaurus? You are using normal words now.

M.Dancer · June 19, 2008

Are you Finnish.....?

CANADIEN · June 19, 2008

As a Franco-Ontarian and member of the 4.3% population which you categorize as globally racist, I take offense to this. Perhaps you should preview your posts before hitting "add reply".

He does review his posts... all good stand-up comics do. That being said,for one would think that looking in his mirror eveery morning would give him an idea of what a racist looks like.

CANADIEN · June 19, 2008

No surprise there . Your comparisons are inappropriate as we have nothing even closely resembling nazism in this country.
For on, Russell held a vote to make this change. Thus, democracy in action.

Are the disenters dead? Nope, thus no nazism.

Go ahead though, keep making my case for me.

I agree 100%. When it rears its ugly head be sure to alert me will you please? Because so far I havent seen it.

Oww....those words hurt so bad.

If you had any idea what you are talking about you wouldnt say that. But as one who had a geriatric grasp....oh sorry, athritic grasp on most issues, I understand your feeble attempts to slag my industry.

Again, no idea what you are talking about. We speak, Italian, Russian, French, Hebrew,Guyanese and Trinidadian (but you wont get that-others will) Finnish,Japanese and Chinese (Mandarin).

Slap your noodle there buttercup, we are a service industry. As such, if we attract people using our language abilities, it means more money for my company. Care to thumb your way through our resumes that arrive weekly? They are all written in English, and I can change the font to super large for those eyes of yours. Let me know.

Actually, you are make dumb statements all the time, including making English the official language. It would not change this office one bit, but it would make this province worse off.

Lets see, English and French founding nation. So one of two is 50%. Hmm.....math seems to work for me. Oh I see what you did, you changed it to founding population. How cute you are....silly boy.

Naw, lets just leave it alone and have more Russell's. It will drive you nuts and provide more fodder for amusement.

Say what happened to your thesaurus? You are using normal words now.

You haven't seen racism? You just responded to it :lol:

Interesting though, to see someone say that Quebec's language laws are racist, then try to do with English in Ontario the same that is being done with French in Quebec.

Edited June 19, 2008 by CANADIEN