Hawk

How about a little reality check, eh? Popular Vote Analysis British Columbia Party/2000/2004/Change Lib: 27.7%, 28.6%, up 0.9% Con: 56.7%, 36.2%, down 20.5% New Dem: 11.3%, 26.6%, up 15.3% Not a good omen for you know who! You forget those polls fail to take into account the shifting of MPs immediately following the creation of the CPC, alot of MPs left the CPC and joined the Liberals and NDPs. As a result when they get re-elected (because the people who elected them think they are doing a good job) its under a new banner. Polls fail to take into account many things, one major reason I dont trust them. As soon as those renegade MPs are required to step into line with party policy I think we will see alot of: 1. Them going independant 2. Them returning to the CPC 3. Them not being re-elected in their ridings

I suppose that is why Harper failed and was defeated, eh. Yeah, because certain media outlets and Liberal propoganda out East have painted an untrue and blatantly regionalized picture of Alberta. "Lets all ignore that Alberta under the PCs has prospered GREATLY, is now debt-free, and is STILL the richest province in this country. Who on EARTH would want all the provinces to be this good eh?"

Haha I would rather spend our taxpayer dollars on a system designed to protect ourselves from Nuclear destruction than on the Gun Registry (which, surprise surprise, doesn't work when the offender *gasp* DOESN'T register his gun before a robbery) or paying for nice dinners and living quarters for in-mates ( because hey, they may have raped and/or murdered someone but they are people too =*( ) =p

roflmao I miss Reagan is my new best friend xD Awesome argument, and since I have been too busy to post for a while (you know, WORKING and all, keeping Alberta RICHER than all you poor have-not souls haha) I will try and get back into the debate One thing you can always count on is MS going and posting something COMPLETELY off the current topic and that doesn't address a single thing, by definition a rant. Such is this case, as far as I can tell MS fears to parry in debate and simply wishes to vent =o Try and answer this one MS, you may live in the West but look at who was elected and where and you will notice your supposed support against the PCs in BC simply dont exist in the force you seem to think they do. You live in the wrong part of the country, go live in Sask. and notice the 'greatness' of NDP rule, live in a territory, live anywhere but the two richest provinces in the country (where 'coincidently' the PCs rule) and tell us how terrible our ways are. Its called INVESTING in the future, the big picture, looking forward instead of backwards. You know, good business strategies. Look at Alberta today, debt free, powerful economy (when it isn't being screwed over by Liberal anti-Americanism), yeah that "crony capitalism" sure was crony =p Thats right, lets ignore the points because we can't counter them and instead 'nullify' the argument by simply picking an argument in a completely unrelated area =p Heck then all you left-wingers must be wrong in all areas of debate because you dont know the difference between the chocolate content of mars and oh henry chocolate bars. Lets stay on focus please =p Stop avoiding the issues

Black Dog: by your own words you decry yourself. Firstly, Moores did not make a documentary, a documentary is factual, what Moore made was a Fiction. Source: http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html Secondly, over 80% of the media is staunchly Left-leaning... so you can stop with the 'oppressive' right wing crap Bryan: Your 'credible' news outlets have been historically proven to favor controversy over truth, and are unashamadly anti-right wing maple syrup: You sound like a preacher, wake up and stop basing your decisions on the 'allknowing' CBC

Actually yes, ever heard of splicing? Video editing software can easily manipulate what you see, and with a skillful hand you can be very easily decieved. Check out some of these sources: http://slate.msn.com/id/2102723/ http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/ http://marccooper.typepad.com/marccooper/2...and_moore_.html The guy is a fsking moron, and anyone who blindly follows the man is also a fsking moron =p PS Most Liberals know that Moore is a sack of lies aimed to tell the story the way he wants it told

Ditto, and my post was not unsubstantial, just because you are unable to comprehend anything isn't my problem The only way to tack a computer crime on someone is to id every piece of information on it, a typical form is to use md5 encryption technologies and make a copy of their harddrive. Then when you go in and make the arrest you can prove his crimes, otherwise whose to keep the guy from simply holding a magnet next to his harddrive and destroying all the information?

Ok here is my personal opinion on Western Alienation: Firstly I know it exists, to deny the fact shows you know nothing of the issue at hand. However I do know its the fault of both the east AND the west, but the Eastern provinces are the aggressors. I heard earlier in this topic a snippy little comment about Alberta being the 'poor province' and you saved us and now that we are rich we simply want to be greedy, perhaps you would like to go into more detail with this... because you seem to not know one damnable bit of Canadian history, the great depression destroyed Western Canada. We had been almost giving away our oil to the East, helping other provinces, we were the rich guys, then the depression hit us and it hit us hard. We nearly didn't survive, and did the East come to our aid after all the help we gave out when we were rich? Heck no, they sat and watched as the West died. That, I believe, was the start of Western Alienation. We recovered and through conservative reforms managed to build our province into the rich and prosperous place it now is. You Liberals cry about how Alberta is lucky and we have and you have not, guess WHY we have. Its because we reject your morally degrading principles and policies, you encouragement of laziness and political correction, your support of centralization and the destruction of individualism. We are humans, we have a right to life, and we in the West intend to live ours without losing all our hard earned cash to some bum who is too lazy to get off his couch and get a job. Basicaly it boils down to the fact the West is sick of giving so much to Canada, only to have our views and beliefs trodden on by both our Liberal government and our Liberal media. All the while Liberals everywhere condemn us for our wealth, claiming the West is full of greedy conservatives who horde all the wealth... guess what, the wealth isn't just sitting in the West, the Westerners are creating the wealth. Our policies promote SURPLUS rather than deficit, they promote personal improvement, individuality, de-centralization/privatization, lower taxes, stronger economies.. We enjoy MAKING our dreams come true, we dont like sitting around screaming for people to make them for us.

First off, I would like to wake you all up from your Moores fantasy dreams. The guy is the biggest liar to hit the film industry in all its history, it is hideous that he won the award for best documentary since his movie was NOT a documentary. Unless of course you call blatant lies and false information part of a documentary. It is nothing more than a good laugh, if you allow yourself to be drawn in and convinced of the truth of what that man tells you without researching it for yourself then you are merely a pawn of propoganda and proving your own ignorance PS and for the love of all thats good in this world stop equating Iraq with Vietnam, that is a common Liberal rant and it is so very pathetic. If you want I will go into more detail, but that might scare you (as the truth hurts) so choose carefully Also I found an excellent book on Bush Jr and this Iraqi crisis... it is called 'MisUnderEstimated - The President Battles Terrorism, John Kerry, and the Bush Haters' It reveals the ugly side of the media with cold hard facts, gives a painstakingly accurate timeline, COMPLETE quotes not parts of sentances like the Liberal media enjoys using, and shows just how twisted some people in this world are and how Saddam used the Liberal media to cover his tracks... for example the CNN admitting AFTER Iraq was conquered that it had been covering up Saddam's 'bad' side and only airing the stories that made him look half human all to keep their coveted perch in Baghdad... its a VERY good read, I highly recommend you grab it, excellent source information as well =)

That man is the most horrendous politician in Canadian history, and if I had my way I would have him locked up for as long as humanly possible =p Does the end justify the means? Careful how you answer that one Heh, and what about right and wrong? That saying lacks merit since it doesn't take into account innocence or guilt, is it a good thing for a Conservative who mugs someone to suddenly turn Liberal? What does that tell you? Hehe it seems criminals enjoy voting Liberal, that should tell you something =p If the state accused you of child molesting they wouldn't be able to press the charges without evidence, then the evidence would require processing. However keep in mind DNA testing in addition to friends/family who would be for you and its going to be bloody hard for such a case to proceed

Well said DAC, I completely agree xD

Yeah you basically got it right... I even agree that Harper's speech was far from poetic, but how poetic can you get in that kind of situation? I doubt they expected to end up so far behind, so they more than likely had to revise the speech at the last moment and had no time for spicing it up. At least Harper was honest and acted like a national leader who was there for everyone, gracious in victory and humble yet optimistic in defeat

True enough, but considering Harper had basically no support in Ontario at all the fact he managed to convince enough people to pull off the seats they did (or the close calls) is rather impressive regardless of the Liberal scare tactics... Ontario has lived too long under the scourge of Liberalism, they need to be freed from it for at least a term or two to know what it feels like and to stop fearing life without Liberals

When me and my friends were listening to the Prime Ministers speech and he went on about Quebec and how he was going to be there for them etc we were all booing and throwing stuff at the TV... but we waited, waited for the kissing up to the West.. it never came. When he said his thanks and left the podium we all jus looked at each other and were like 'omg he didn't just do that, he just publically ignored the West on his election speech' See you support a monster, you re-elect a monstrous government for 5 terms, you blindly follow someone who has proven time and time again to be a corrupt piece of trash and then you turn around and fail to vote in new blood. A new party with new policies that has a chance to make things better, you chose the old monster that everyone with half an independant mind can see is destroying this counrty over a party that isn't even a year old. Learn from your mistakes, from history, or you will be doomed to repeat those mistakes. PS takeanumber, at least Harper had the decency to address every region and encourage everyone who didn't get their candidates (including the opposition). All I heard from the Liberals was a bunch of French suckups. Harper isn't the monster you allow yourself to be propogated into thinking he is. He represents the voice of the West, and the fact that you completely disrespect him and his party shows your disrespect for us and our ways of life. If you keep it up you may find that Ontario and east are all that you will be calling Canada... not that you would really care or notice

Attack ads only work on the ignorant, hence it worked in Ontario (although a large amount of people in Ontario went Conservative... but it was just not enough) =p Quebec is too stubbornly BQ to be majorly affected by the Liberals and their smear campaigns

Yes it will fail, because chances are it wont happen. You see the West learns from the past, when we see a government that ignores us for 5 terms and never once tries to do anything to lessen the alienation of us from Ottawa what more can you expect? We aren't the deciding vote, Quebec and Ontario are. That is why you see the Liberals sucking up to Quebec and using the West as the big bad enemy of the East for their own uses.

Paul Martin is the biggest blundering idiot on the planet, the fact the Fiberals keep getting re-elected shows that Canada does NOT learn from past mistakes. Heck, 5 terms... that is terrible. In all honesty I am seriously considering joining the Western Seperatist Movement, in addition to alot of us out here in the West. We are happy the Liberal lost their majority but are sick and tired of the rest of Canada treating us like redneck trash. Martin didn't even mention us in his public speech, all he says is he will govern EVERY region... well what if we dont like the way he is governing our region? He isn't representing our views or our ways. But oh my didn't he just kiss some more French @$$ on national television (as do most Liberal candidates) It disgusts me. PS My prediction: More scandals arise, Liberals now with minority government can't do as much to cover up such things and soon their corruption will doom the party. They dont know how to function as a cohesive unit, as a government responsible (hahahaa) for the well-being of a nation. The Conservatives and the Bloq will make the Liberals look so bad that next election the Liberals will be lucky if the Conservatives dont get in on a majority... wouldn't it just be hilarious if the BQ ended up the official opposition? xD

First off I agree Lib scare tactics dont work, I was a scrutineer at my polling station and despite a massive amount of advertising by the Liberal candidate he was destroyed. Also I am sick of this unfounded fear in the right-wing, the Tories are not the Conservative Party of Canada and if you think they are you need some SERIOUS lessons in politics and history =p

um the Liberals are the big losers here: 1. They just lost almost 40 seats 2. Conservatives have almost 100 seats 3. The Fiberals are now in power with a minority government and are faced with the political mess they had setup to trap Harper The way I see it, we win, its not about this election its about next election. If the Liberals aren't careful you may be seeing a majority conservative government next election =)

Yet the MPs are part of the Federal government and therefore through that the Federal government controls alot of the provincial way of things simply through their policies =p Ever heard of money talks? Also you dont know if they made deals with the PM to get into office, there are too many loopholes and security issues. They aren't nearly as innocent as you seem to think they are, and the Liberals hold the majority of the judges which makes the situation all that much worse

Decentralized? WHAT? Excuse me, our poor have welfare programs up the ying yang, we have free healthcare, public education, public buildings, we have government businesses and industries, we have privatized businesses being shut down more and more all the time I dont know what you are talking about =p They can agree with it all they want, but demanding I conform to it and say it is all ok is against my rights. I dont agree with homosexuality, I never have, I dont believe they should be enroaching on our soceity and demanding 99% of Canada conform to their way of perverse thinking (yes thats right perverse, it isn't natural) Maybe I should go out and start a pro-Straight parade, lets see how many lawsuits get thrown at me in this 'equal' system of ours. Yes it does, because we are becoming more 'tolerant' of things that have traditionally been viewed as perverse and backwards. Poligamists are people too you know =p Child molesters too, what if the child consents? Child marriage happens in many cultures, does that make it right? Your problem is that your thinking exludes morality and the decision of right and wrong. Some things are right and some are wrong, justifying laws on emotions is a terribly dangerous thing to do, you can't trust emotions. 'they are people too' yeah well they are people who need help. I posted this previously and will repeat it here: Thats the problem, whatever government is in power has the last defence against corrupt legislature on their side, so they lose credibility and potency. They are merely puppets of the administration which I am ferociously against.

Yes we do need more power, we dont want the Federal government controlling and centralizing everything. Cities are municiple, and the province should not have alot of power over city bylaws etc, you want me to go into a whole political platform or something? Maybe the rest of Canada wants the powers that the Liberals keep giving Quebec? =p Then please tell your co-Liberals to not bring it up (Sweal) Thats the problem, whatever government is in power has the last defence against corrupt legislature on their side, so they lose credibility and potency. They are merely puppets of the administration which I am ferociously against. Its no surprise you vote Liberal, they dont like proportional representation either.. heck their own MPs aren't allowed to represent the people who vote them in

Federal > Provincial, so gutting the Federal stranglehold is most certainly a good thing and DOES affect provincial jurisdiction. Close your discriminatory mouth, everyone else 'discriminates' except you. You just can't seem to understand that people who dont agree with you aren't being discriminatory we are having independant and free thoughts, a debate is exactly that. Denying us the freedom of open debate on such topics is extremely unacceptable, you can't tell us we aren't being democratic when you take away our right to disagree with homosexuality =p Otherwise using your mentality you better not disagree with poligamy or child molestation. We tend to get because they were appointed by the corrupt Liberal government, that is not democratic, and it is blatantly dangerous and has been proven to not work (Fiberals pushing legislation through) its time they represented the people

Alberta is a rich province, everyone in Canada benefits by our existence. We economically defend every province in this country ESPECIALLY Quebec =p Also defence is a broad and general term, it doesn't mean a physical and militaristic enemy. It could be anything, including something like BSE. I didn't see Quebec worrying about Western ranchers who are going out of business and losing farms and ranches that have been in their families for decades. As I said, they have the upper hand, they have the special status that is supposed to be equality (that is ironic), its them who have to take the first step and I suggest the first step being stop electing a seperatist government and get rid of this ridiculous special status

DAC, some of us wouldn't be so against French-Canadians if they stopped demanding more from us and didn't get the special status they have. You claim that we should all worry about bettering each other, when was the last time you heard Quebec rallying to defend Western Canada? You want to fix the problem, start it where the problem is coming from, the problem is an unbalanced political scale over in the East in addition to extremely anti-English attitudes (we aren't trying to seperate from the French either, we stick around despite the crap that gets thrown at us)