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both sides use the nazis to describe the other. although the situations are not the same, there are some similarities between the jews during the holocaust and the palestinians now and for the past 60 years. to name a few similarities: - they are under occupation - many live inside enclaves and behind borders, roads and walls that are controlled by the occupier - they have no military and are fighting against a superior military with state of the art weapons - the occupation has killed thousands of innocent civilians. (although the numbers who have been killed do not come close in comparison, they still are being killed in large numbers - ie; 400 palestinian children killed in a 3 week assault) many disagree with that. the reason for that is because hamas did not fire any rockets and there were only a handful of rockets fired by other groups during the ceasefire. the hamas rockets started launching after israel attacked inside the gaza border and killed several number of palestinians. even israel agrees with that. just look at the video clip above. you mean the jews who lived in the warsaw ghettos did not want to see the nazis destroyed? i highly doubt that. this i agree with. this is not a systematic killing spree by israel. i don't think anyone is saying this. the other similarities in the way the israelis are treating the palestinians still stand. not to mention the fact that it was the jews who experienced such a treatment by the nazis and who are now violating international law. the hague is actually after the israeli military as well. they've been accused by many human rights organizations of violating many human rights laws. as mentioned above, there are many similarities and it's also a valid comparison because the very same people who experienced the holocaust are now putting another people under a similar situation.

useless post. your post has nothing to do with what i said. the danish paper that originally posted the muhammed cartoons had said that they would post the holocaust cartoons in order to show that they're not against muslims and that they champion freedom of speech. however, the paper refused to do so after the holocaust cartoons were published. if you're curious to see them, here they are: http://www.irancartoon.com/120/holocaust/

you seem to have a lot of knowledge about history. you know, with wikipedia only a few clicks away. so we agree that iran stayed neutral in world war 2 and that britain and russia attacked iran so that they could get supplies to russia?

the jews took a lot of punishment from the nazis, yet they stayed strong and resisted nazis' actions the best they could. do you think they were also dumb?

i'm not going to go through the other assistance they receive that is not on that graph. it still does not change the fact that israel receives more aid than any other country (iraq not included) for decades. i'm still a little baffled by the earlier comment in regards to arab states being welfare states when israel has received more assistance from the U.S. than all of them combined.

yes. we all have many of them. it doesn't change the fact that 70% of his riding (close to 3/4 of them) is white and you tried to suggest that he is speaking against israel in order to be re-elected by the muslims in his riding. maybe you can share more opinions about why kaufman speaks about israel's treatment of the palestinians.

what are you showing me M.Dancer? what kind of a response is that? i don't get how that counters my argument.

i usually try to read, watch and listen carefully to the information provided and i also like to look into the background and the sources; not only does he mention that he is jewish but you can also read his article on the topic: http://www.alternet.org/story/119372 Pro-Israel Rally Attended by Big-Time NY Dems Descends into Calls for 'Wiping Out' Palestinians By Max Blumenthal

sure. i will give you citations. since you like wikipedia so much, here is some information: Since the 1970s, Israel has been one of the top recipients of U.S. foreign aid.[17] While it is mostly military aid, in the past a portion was dedicated to economic assistance. In 2004, the second-largest recipient of economic foreign aid from the United States was Israel, second to Iraq.In 2007, the United States increased its military aid to Israel by over 25% to an average of $3 billion per year for the following ten year period, while ending economic aid.In 1998, Israeli, congressional, and Administration officials agreed to reduce U.S. $1.2 billion in Economic Support Funds (ESF) to zero over ten years, while increasing Foreign Military Financing (FMF) from $1.8 billion to $2.4 billion. Separate from the scheduled cuts, there was an extra $200 million in anti-terror assistance, $1.2 billion to implement the Wye agreement, and the supplemental appropriations bill assisted for another $1 billion in FMF for the 2003 fiscal year. For the 2005 fiscal year, Israel received $2.202 billion in FMF, $357 million in ESF, and migration settlement assistance of $50 million. For 2006, the Administration has requested $240 million in ESF and $2.28 billion in FMF. H.R. 3057, passed in the House on June 28, 2005, and in the Senate on July 20, approves these amounts. is that good enough for you or do you want more? now you show me that U.S. is not giving over $3billion a year to israel each year.

so you accept hamas as the elected government of the palestinian people or are they a militia group?

oh sorry. i didn't know it's okay for you to speak for Greg and Charles. then carry on. the question that the interviewer, who is jewish, asked several times was that how long should israel continue its assault? should they continue to kill people? most of the people were for wiping the palestinians. some even spelled it out. it's kind of like the bush_cheney guy who posts in here who called the latest conflict a "happy ending" even after i asked him if he thinks the 400+ palestinian children killed was a happy ending. do you think it's okay for people to yell for the wiping out of another people? how low can these people sink? israel receives $3billion (plus other incentives) a year from the U.S. government. most of that goes towards buying weapons back from the U.S. are you trying to dispute this too? israel receives more money from the U.S. than any other country in the world.... so i'm not sure why you're calling the arab states welfare countries when israel receive more money than other country. money that they never pay back.

it's funny how one of the quotes you posted from wikipedia says: [citation needed] it doesn't matter what you post from wikipedia, it doesn't change the fact that iran declared itself neutral in the conflict. iran was also doing business with britain which was fighting against germany. stop trying to change history. "At the outbreak of World War II, Iran declared its neutrality, but the country was soon invaded by both Britain and the Soviet Union. Britain had been annoyed when Iran refused Allied demands that it expel all German nationals from the country. When Hitler invaded the Soviet Union in 1941, the Allies urgently needed to transport war matériel across Iran to the Soviet Union, an operation that would have violated Iranian neutrality. As a result, Britain and the Soviet Union simultaneously invaded Iran on August 26, 1941, the Soviets from the northwest and the British across the Iraqi frontier from the west and at the head of the Persian Gulf in the south.

in the movie schindler's list, there is a scene that i will never forget. it's a scene where a group of jews were walking through the street, being displaced from their homes. there were german residence standing and watching them. a few of these germans were yelling at the jews to leave or to die. in one instance, a german child ran up to a jewish woman and pulled on her clothes and then kicked her. the reason this scene stood out is because i've seen similar acts done by jewish settlers to the palestinians in the west bank. not just the children, but the adult settlers frequently do these things. they kick and throw rocks at palestinians who are walking too close to the settlements. there is one footage i remember seeing where a group of north american activist escorted 4 palestinian children who had to walk by a jewish settlement in order to get to their school. these children had rocks thrown at them and threatened every day. even with the escorts and a video camera filming, they were still threatened by these zealots. why aren't you speaking against these things?

so only if israel exterminates the palestinians will you stand up and say, "hey! maybe this is wrong"? this is more than about the number of people being killed. there are a lot of similarities between the jews in the warsaw ghettos and the palestinians, especially the gazans living where they are. just like the jews in the warsaw ghettos, a palestinian cannot leave or enter gaza without israel's permission. the main roads are controlled by israelis just like the main roads were controlled by the nazis in warsaw. the air space, the waters and the economy is controlled mostly the israelis. there are frequent assaults on the palestinians which leaves people dead and homes demolished. much like the condition the jews lived in under the nazi rule. the military weapons used by the nazis as compared to what the jewish militants had is comparable to what the israelis have now and what the palestinians have. there were many jewish militant groups in warsaw which were formed to resist the occupier, the nazis. same thing has happened in the palestinian territories.

i stand corrected about the number i gave. 80% was what i found on the Manchester site and 70% is what is the correct number. regardless, the 10% difference does not change the fact that close to 3/4 of his riding are white. that's a huge difference between the 18% of muslims. do you think, that maybe, there are many whites who also agree with gerald kaufman's stance on numerous topics, including the israeli/palestinian issue and that's why he is elected every single year? kaufman has written books and has been a leading jewish critic of israel for a long time. he's been quite active and vocal and to me and many others, he seems quite genuine about what he believes. i think it's wrong and disingenuous of you or anyone else to suggest that kaufman is doing and saying what he is because he wants to win support from his riding.

let him speak for himself. because in response to israeli jews dancing on the streets and calling for wiping out palestinians, he gave links to death by stoning.

i don't know where you get your information, but a lot of weapons are bought by israel from the U.S. by money given to them by U.S. from the Jerusalem Post and CNN and Raw Story: Just last September, Congress approved a $77 million dollar deal to sell a thousand Boeing GBU-39 bunker-buster "smart bombs" to Israel. The Jerusalem Post reported on Monday that these small, GPS-guided missiles have now been used on underground tunnels and launchers in Gaza. "Precision guided bombs are only precision in that they hit the target they are aimed at," Starr explained. "We're getting these civilian casualties. These weapons are supposed to be used for a country's self-defense. Israel, obviously, believes this is its self-defense against Hamas, but you see these civilian casualties. That's not why the US sells weapons abroad -- for the killing of innocent civilians." "The world community only is going to stand for this for so long," continued Starr. "It's this reason that you're seeing people look for a political settlement." She added that Israel now intends to launch a ground campaign in Gaza to "get rid of Hamas once and for all," but -- as the US has learned in Iraq and Afghanistan -- it is impossible to wipe out an insurgency by military force along without first getting the civilian population on your side.

you're changing the subject so that you don't have to deal with zionists' views of the israeli/palestinian situation. you try to change the topic by giving us links to stoning deaths? how does that even make sense? i don't think anyone here accepts or supports stoning so why even bother? are you saying because there have been a few cases of death by stoning, then it's okay for people to dance on the streets of NY and call for the killing of palestinians? the israeli supporters in NYC were calling for israel to wipe the palestinians out. they were okay with the children dying. are you one of those people niagara?

where would you suggest that the hamas fighters should go and hide? in their base? maybe they can hide in their tanks? maybe they can fly away in their helicopters or planes? why do some people treat this situation like it's 2 armies fighting against each other? the hamas military wing is nothing more than a group of young men fighting the occupation and the treatment of the occupier. i see them like the jewish militias in warsaw's ghettos during their resistance against the nazis. the jewish militias only had guns and homemade bombs while the nazis had state of the art guns, tanks and planes.

what's important is that iran declared itself neutral in the conflict. they also did business with britain and other nations. it's like saying the U.S. supported and were allied with the nazis because they did business with them during their rise to power. yeah, it sounds ridiculous.

not sure what you're babbling about. the link from manchester city that was provided earlier shows at exactly 81.5% of the people living in the region are "white". and furthermore, did you even READ what this is about and WHERE this is about or did you go into one of your zion fury mode and try to twist and turn things and start babbling about issues that do not matter? not only that, but you're talking about canada when we're talking about an MP in the UK. the important factor is that sir gerald kaufman, a jewish MP, and who has lived in israel and who was a zionist has said the following: "My grandmother did not die to provide cover for Israeli soldiers murdering Palestinian grandmothers in Gaza. The present Israeli government ruthlessly and cynically exploits the continuing guilt from gentiles over the slaughter of Jews in the Holocaust as justification for their murder of Palestinians." He said the claim that many of the Palestinian victims were militants "was the reply of the Nazi" and added: "I suppose the Jews fighting for their lives in the Warsaw ghetto could have been dismissed as militants."

no dogonporch. you're now just trying to cover. could it be that this jewish man actually believes what he says and he's not pandering?

i was actually born in manchester, but that coincidence does not change anything and it's not relevant. over 80% of kaufman's riding is white and what you said earlier is a crock of shit.

i doubt they'd be as happy as some israelis/jews who celebrated where over 400 palestinian children have been killed. look at these crazy people who only want destruction. it's odd seeing jews acting like nazis did: http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=FABqq_jjRRo

i'm talking about the danish paper who posted the original muhammed cartoons. i'm still waiting for someone who is against wheeler in holland being charged but is okay with the laws in austria where a person is sent to prison for denying the holocaust to explain to me their stance.