dub

what's your point? no one is excusing saudi. whatever information you've provided does not change the fact that, a muslim will not be able to get citizenship in israel. many have tried, especially recently, but are not able to. denying that israel is a racist religious state makes you a liar.

tell that to the hundreds of muslims who cannot bring their spouses or family members to israel. i'm sure in saudi there is nothing in their law saying "no jews" don't bullshit DoP. besides the usual simpletons, no one else will believe you that israel is not a jewish state. look up the 'Law of Return' which is set up for the jews and no one else.

if you're muslim or christian, you will not receive automatic citizenship like a jew would. in fact, a muslim cannot even immigrate to israel because he is muslim. israeli arabs who marry a muslim who is not israeli cannot sponsor or bring their spouse to israel. you're not fooling anyone with your posts.

lol

an atheist supporting a religious state such as israel is as confused as an anti-abortionist who performs abortions. if you guys have a need to cheer for a group, why don't you pick a sports team instead?

sure DoP. it sucks when a US president believes that the palestinians have a right to self-determination. didn't "your chums" kill rabin, who, sorta made a peace deal with arafat? it's interesting you brought his up, because while i would never condone the killing of of sadat i have a feeling you weren't too upset when rabin was killed by a fanatical zionist. oh and lol @ you being an atheist who supports the creation of a jewish state.

you're trying to change history. you can argue and fight against what ben gurion had to say about this fictitious palestinian people: Ben-Gurion recognized the strong attachment of Palestinian Arabs to the land but hoped that this would be overcome in time. In a conversation about "the Arab problem" in 1956, Goldman wrote that Ben-Gurion stated: "Why should the Arabs make peace? If I was an Arab leader I would never make terms with Israel. That is natural: we have taken their country ... There has been anti-Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault? They only see one thing: we have come here and stolen their country. Why should they accept that? They may perhaps forget in one or two generations' time, but for the moment there is no chance. So it is simple: we have to stay strong and maintain a powerful army" Nahum Goldman, 'The Jewish Paradox', translated by Steve Cox, 1978, p. 98, p. 100, p. http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/David_Ben-Gurion

you're still hurt after my respond to your 'alternate universe' post, eh? god. i'm still shocked how much bullshit you typed in that paragraph. i'm seriously embarrassed for you and the fact that you're not ashamed of spreading misinformation. i guess nationalism and team cheering trumps honesty in your world.

like for example, look at this guy. he is saying that there is no such thing as palestinians. what a clown.

...and lol at trying to put down carter. didn't carter broker a peace deal between israel and egypt? isn't that significant? it's more than any other president been able to do. yeah i know how you guys work. criticize israel and automatically you are an anti-semite and the worst person in the world. most of you would be laughed out of a political science class. reading what some of you have to say is like watching foxnews' retarded brother trying to debate.

those who translate criticism of israel into anti-semitism are cowards. they're cowards because they are afraid to engage in a debate and instead pull the tired and old anti-semite card. you know someone is not interested in facts and is only here to cheer for their team when they scream out anti-semitism every chance they get.

says the guy who writes a paragraph of fiction and tries to pass it up as facts. do you expect everyone to just nod and agree with your crap? you're worse than DoP in making things up.

700k jews? ben-gurion would disagree with you: http://www.palestineremembered.com/images/...on-Page-292.jpg http://www.palestineremembered.com/images/...n-FrontPage.jpg

wtf are you talking about? when did i say that? can you, for once, attempt at typing something that isn't bullshit?

ahmadinejad said he wants to wipe out the zionist regime. this is not any different than israel's daily threat to attack iran and remove the current government. i mean, there is a lot to pick on about ahmadinejad, but to continue to spread misinformation and lies is just not cool.

? as opposed to military weapons that kill people? i guess you got me there.

this was posted earlier, in another thread. i thought i'd re-post it: Benefits to Israel of U.S. Aid Since 1949 (As of November 1, 1997) Foreign Aid Grants and Loans $74,157,600,000 Other U.S. Aid (12.2% of Foreign Aid) $9,047,227,200 Interest to Israel from Advanced Payments $1,650,000,000 Grand Total $84,854,827,200 Total Benefits per Israeli $14,630 ---- Cost to U.S. Taxpayers of U.S. Aid to Israel Grand Total $84,854,827,200 Interest Costs Borne by U.S. $49,936,680,000 Total Cost to U.S. Taxpayers $134,791,507,200 Total Taxpayer Cost per Israeli $23,240 --- those are stats from 1997. i wonder how americans would feel if they knew about the above.

what? where is the backpedaling? my original comment still stands. i'm not the one coming in here crying and saying: "the US does what it wants! na na na poo poo". are you saying that israel is in need of aid like other poor countries? i agree with you. this is why, without US' economical and political support, israel would flop and would not be able to continue their actions against the palestinians.

how much does a US citizen pay towards taxes each year? and how much does an Israeli citizen pay towards US taxes each year?

eh? back what up? US taxpayer money goes to israel. divide $3billion a year by 6 million and you figure out the rest. and as you probably don't want to recall, they are under investigation for war crimes. an investigation that is headed by a respected jewish lawyer which they will not cooperate with. lol. are you purposely trying to make a funny? you're basically saying that israel will stop stealing palestinian land and then they will give it back to the palestinians.. blah blah. why is israel following the law have to have a pre-condition? plus, as it has been already mentioned, the PLO officially recognized israel and the 1967 border. what did that bring? as if israel would be able to get away with mass extermination. what they're doing is pushing the envelop to the max allowed by the US and they continue to get away with it. they hare systematically annexing palestinian land and are violating international law by continuing to expand the settlements. defend yourself does not include annexing land. why are the settlements in the west bank increasing? how is that defending yourself? how do you take yourself seriously with comments like that? yes. criticism of israel makes me a bigot. are you going to play the tired old anti-semitism card again? bonam's comments all had either lies or misinformation. if you see me making a mistake, by all means point them out, because just declaring that that i make things up out of thin air is not going to cut it.

huh? that's the declaration of independence. where does it say that israel accepted the borders drawn in the partition plan? seriously buddy, get real. huh? hence, they agreed? you're lying again. israel never agreed to the partition plan borders. in fact, they haven't agreed to any borders drawn up, including the 1967 border. the PLO recognized israel and the internationally recognized 1967 borders. look it up. israel doesn't. look it up. they invented the f16 and apache? oookay. israel gets $3billion a year, which is mostly used towards the military and they don't have to pay back. i don't think russia would give israel $3billion a year. so israel is going to continue to get handouts from the U.S. ahh.. persian gulf maybe? they have other bases around the mediterranean like in turkey. look it up. US has a lot of bases in the middle east. they don't need israel, israel needs the U.S. oh and don't worry about the soldier's drinking. they get their alcohol. you really should look at all the bases the US has in the middle east. including the biggest in iraq. strategically, the US does not need to be giving israel $3billion of free handout money. not to mention to fight israel's wars like the iraq war which is costing billions on its own. the only result for supporting israel is that the arab world end up also hating the US and not just israel for their treatment of the palestinians. not to mention it makes US look bad internationally for supporting a country that breaks international law.

AIPAC can make or break someone's political career. look at what happened to: Charles "Chas" Freeman, Obama’s pick to head the National Intelligence Council, has withdrawn from contention for the job. The Daily Beast’s Max Blumenthal reported that the leader of the campaign against Freeman was Steven Rosen, a former director of AIPAC awaiting trial on espionage charges, who has a long history of attacking and undermining anybody he deems hostile to Israel. all you really got to do is look at where the major donations are coming from and you'll know who has the power. can you name a few of the biggest lobby groups that are pulling in separate direction? you know how much they'll fuck you up if you don't speak in tune with israel? power is exerted in different ways. some use force and some use propaganda. some like stalin and hitler used both. at the end of it all, you always have a president who was elected between two groups. you want to argue against the facts, go for it.

the 'supreme leader' is the figurehead and mouthpiece for iran's power which is made up of clerics who have business interests in iran and abroad. rafsanjani, another former president also has a lot of power. in fact, he's the one behind mousavi and khatami. here is a short but decent analysis of khamenei: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/16/world/mi...t/16cleric.html as to name interest groups; how about AIPAC? they have much influence over U.S. foreign policy. here is some good information: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_lobby_...e_United_States then you have the oil companies and arms companies who also have major influence on U.S.'s policies.

special interest groups are also not elected either.

bonam, do you realize that majority of what you type is bullshit, as it has already been shown? there is only so much bullshit that can be corrected before you become a waste of time. much like DoP.