jacee

We certainly hope so. http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2011/08/19/pol-g8-ndp-clement.html

Interesting poll of Canadian Business subscribers, CEO POLL re Warren Buffett's comments that the rich should be taxed more: http://www.canadianbusiness.com/article/43656--the-ceo-poll-soaking-the-super-rich Highest scores (out of a possible 7 points): 5.6 "Taxes shouldn't be raised without closing tax loopholes - they're the real problem." "Buffett is showing wisdom, courage and leadership." So it looks like we are agreed. However, I would suggest that increased taxes should NOT apply to 'ordinarily wealthy' Canadians, but only to the superrich: $250k is FAR too low. That's just the superrich and their government servants trying to soak 'ordinarily wealthy' Canadians for the taxes that should be paid by the superrich powermongers! Didn't I tell you they would? Don't fall for that crap! Make the richEST pay! AND go after the Canadian bankers who are criminal accessories to tax fraud, helping the superrich hide their money offshore untaxed.

The 1%ers REPORTED income skews the data even without their UNREPORTED income included. Statscan source is now included in the post with the table I created from their data. My point in creating that table is to demonstrate in simple terms that the 1%ers are different from the ordinarily wealthy people of Canada. They hide 20% of Canada's total wealth UNREPORTED, OFFSHORE UNTAXED, while their REPORTED income still makes them far FAR wealthier than the next wealthiest Canadians, whom I'm calling the ordinarily wealthy. In fact, they hold the ordinarily wealthy Canadians to ransom: Since they don't pay their taxes on 1/3 of their income from Canada, the rest of us have to make up for it either through increased taxation or reductions in services and JOBS. And since the poor have no wealth to pay taxes and the middle class is fast disappearing, who's going to be on the hook for this round, to pay the taxes the megarich have avoided? It's the ordinarily wealthy Canadians, the ones who 'defend' the rights of the megarich. The "austerity" agenda that came out of the G20 in Toronto last summer and is now being implemented around the world and CAUSING RIOTS is about balancing budgets. IF the megarich were paying ALL of the taxes owing, we wouldn't have a federal debt or deficit. See the big scam now? And who do you think is making money on the interest on the federal debt and deficit? It's a Ponzi scheme for the megarich! It's not the first time around this path and it won't be the last, unless we ENFORCE OUR CURRENT LAWS and make all Canadians pay their allotted share of taxes on ALL of the wealth they suck out of Canada's resources including the hard work of 99% of Canadians. And who do you think 'owns' our government and its 'austerity' agenda? Who do you think represented Canada at the G20? The megarich ... along with their willing servants in government, whose salaries WE PAY to represent our interests ... but they don't represent 99% of us: They represent only the 1%ers. So keep in mind when the civil unrest comes ... It isn't about the ordinarily wealthy Canadians - It's about the megarich 1%ers who not only have the majority of Canada's wealth, but also wield the power to keep it that way. And it has nothing to do with who's in power, LIB-CON same story. Remember Paul Martin's 'austerity' campaign? And where do you think his wealth is hoarded? Where are his CSL ships registered? Liberia? Not in Canada, that's for sure! We of the other99% are virtually all their puppets. Eta ... http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/24679 Who are the wealthiEST people in Canada? http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Canadians_by_net_worth

No it isn't! The discussion is why don't the wealthiEST Canadians pay all their taxes owing - $550b and counting - so the rest of us aren't stuck paying the federal debt, that is 'coincidentally' about the amount they owe us in taxes?

Zachary I think you are very Young. How would the private sector build anything if there was no public infrastructure? No roads, sewers, watermains? That's what taxes are used for. That and multi-million dollar subsidies to the oil sands, and there you might have a point.

Why would anybody? The government works for us. We pay their salaries. And likewise the police. It's the wealthiest tax evaders and the bankers who help them who need a wake up call.

For people who hide vast wealth and avoid paying tax on it?Those are crimes against ALL OF US honest people who do pay their taxes. And they are criminal offences in Canada. And in Tim Hudak's vision of Torytario, there would be chain gangs. So I'm poking fun at the Ontario PC's cos wouldn't a chain gang of extremely wealthy tax evaders be ironically hilarious?

You pay your taxes so why would you have to run away, silly. I'm just after the 20% of Canada's wealth that hasn't been taxed. Fair's fair: If well-off Canadians pay their taxes, why shouldn't the wealthiEST? And if the wealthiEST did pay their fair share of taxes, no one would have to come after you for more. Unfortunately for you, they don't, leaving you the sitting ducks.

And with too much, and increasing income disparity, civil unrest disrupts functioning too, so it,s a balancing act.

Pfffffttt! Useless to toughen laws until we enforce the ones we have. Nope, we want that OFFSHORE UNTAXED 20percent of Canada's total wealth back in the country. And of course my original concern with your data is that 'average income' data for Canada are too high to truly represent the bulk of Canadian people because of the influence of a few extremely high incomes. Compare: The 2008 median income 'Two parent with children' of $65,000 (my data) The 2008 average income 'Tpwc' of $85,000 (your data table) The median income is the best indicator because it isn't influenced by the few megahigh incomes, while the average income is. The $20,000 difference between them is the effect of the megahigh income families. It's pretty substantial. And it distorts peoples' perceptions of 'average' families. More telling than either median or average income is the actual distribution of income but lately it's hard to find it in detail. Here are some facts and estimates I've come up with: http://www.statcan.gc.ca/access_acces/alternative_alternatif.action?l=eng&loc=http://www.statcan.gc.ca/pub/13f0026m/13f0026m2006001-eng.pdf&t=The%20Wealth%20of%20Canadians:%20An%20Overview%20of%20the%20Results%20of%20the%20Survey%20of%20Financial%20Security%20(Pension%20and%20Wealth%20Research%20Paper%20Series) Each 1percent represents 115k Canadian households. The wealthiEST 1% (115k households) share 40% of Canada's (reported) total wealth, with median household net worth of $175m (ie, half of them more than that, half of them less). The next 19% (2.2m households) share 29% of the wealth And the next 20% (2.5m households) Share another 20% of the wealth Median net worth of these households is $450k The next 20% (2.5m households) Share 8.4% of the wealth Median net worth $175k The next 20% (2.5m) Share 2.3% of the wealth Median net worth $50k The final 20% of Canadian households (5.5m) share .1% of Canada's wealth With net worth of -$3k Point being ... Without the wealthiEST 1% the wealth distribution looks pretty reasonable. But there's a huge gap between them and the rest of us, the other99%. And then there's half again their REPORTED wealth in OFFSHORE UNTAXED criminal tax evasion accounts. Play with the taxation numbers if you like, But the real taxation problem still lies with the wealthiEST 1% who own 60% of Canada's wealth with over $550b in taxes owing, the amount of Canada's debt.

Just anti-OFFSHORE UNTAXED Canadian wealth of the top 1percent of wealth holders, Bob. And someone who would say that Canadians shouldn't be building schools for "those animals" in Afghanistan? Well someone like that would turn my stomach too. No revolution is painless, nor is it always wealth-vs-communists. And my suggestions are just about criminals with unpaid taxes.

NO tax amnesty applies. Criminal punishment applies. Everything is on the table. And ... please tell me when you find out what percentage of Canadians - all ages, all men women and children - fall below the 'average'.

So you're good with immediate return of all offshore monies, ? How? When? We are all accumulating debt due to unpaid taxes by the wealthiEST 1percent with 60percent of the wealth of Canada, 20percent the wealth of Canada with unpaid taxes owing to the other 99percent of us. Then we'll talk tax reform. And to some of the other99percent of us, it is time for action.

If everyone under $100k is then tax exempt, then we'll get back to you on that offer. That's not average. Average isn't a good measure in Canada. A few MEGAhigh incomes skew the data upwards such that the vast bulk of PEOPLE fall below the 'average'. So ... work out the numbers - find your own data. I can't load statscan tables. But let me know what percentage of Canadians would be below the 'average' and would be tax exempt in your concept of 30percent tax for every family over $100k and none for those below that. Median for two parent families with children 2008 was $65,000.. I wonder in general what people think of of the fact that In the past 10 years, amounts equal to the federal debt and deficit have been stolen from scrutiny and hoarded UNTAXED OFFSHORE.

SHE. Can't figure out how to add gender to profile. Oh well. I claim my right to hang out a shingle, open a shop, etc. and pay my fair share of taxes along with other entreprenurial Canadians. What I despise is not capitalism per se, but predatory capitalism/corporatism that controls government to its advantage, evades taxes and takes more than its share of the wealth while demonizing the poor, the unions and anyone else they choose, eg by calling them "communist". I also despise the bankers who facilitate the tax evasion of the predatory wealthy. Is that clearer?

I certainly agree. However the 'rich vs poor' discussion is irrelevant, a red herring, a ploy to distract us from the discussion we really need to be having about predatory mega-wealth: The wealth currently being increasingly transferred to the mega-rich is not coming from the "poor" (who have negative 'wealth' already). It is being funnelled from the middle and higher income households into the mega-coffers of already obscene wealth. It's estimated that the top 1percent of wealth holders with 40percent of the REPORTED wealth, stash a third of their wealth offshore, untaxed and UNREPORTED. My admittedly rough calculations suggest that in the past 10 years, that amounts to over $500b in taxes that should have been paid in Canadian taxes missing from our federal treasury. Canada's debt has ballooned in that 10 years and now stands (coincidentally?) at over $560b and rising. We are paying $35b a year to service that debt and have an estimated deficit this year of (coincidentally?) $40b. Payment of just those 10 years of evaded taxes would virtually wipe out Canada's debt. Continual payment of ALL of their taxes would wipe out the annual deficit. Forget the poorest 20percent. They are already sucked dry. The sucking noise is emanating from the middle and higher income 79percent of us and going into the offshore accounts of the wealthiest 1percent. We all believe that 'work hard and smart to get ahead' is an important value. Do we believe that "smart" includes criminal tax evasion that victimizes 99percent of Canadians? Is that to be admired, defended, aspired to? Is it to be tolerated?

Canada A May 2008 study by Léo-Paul Lauzon of the Université du Québec à Montréal (UQAM) estimated, conservatively, that Canadian banks avoided $16 billion in taxes between 1993 and 2007. . - Banque Royale du Canada, Banque Toronto Dominion – Groupe Financier Banque TD, Banque Scotia – La Banque de Nouvelle-Écosse, Banque de Montréal – BMO Groupe financier, Banque Canadienne Impériale de Commerce – CIBC http://www.taxjustice.net/cms/front_content.php?idcat=103

" Raging Inequality May Cause Unrest and Violence in America and the Rest of the Western World" http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2011/07/raging-inequality-may-cause-unrest-and-violence-in-america-and-the-rest-of-western-world.html "Moreover, the austerity measures which governments are imposing to try to plug their gaping deficits (created by throwing trillions at their banks) are causing people world-wide to push.back. "

I'm not accusing you. I'm accusing the top 1percent holders of 40percent of the wealth, and increasing their share at the expense of the other 99percent of us (including you). As the incomes of the 'middle class' become increasingly too low to support their families, to low to pay much in taxes to support infrastructure, and too low to consume the products of business and industry ... where do you think the 1percent predators are looking to next? They're looking at you. And don't kid yourself that if you defend them, they'll defend you. Sociopathic predators don't work that way. The increasing income gap between the wealthiEST and the rest of us is a clear sign of decadence and immorality in economic systems, the kind of sign that should set alarm bells ringing among the ordinarily wealthy like you: Something is dreadfully amiss, and while you are not the target of the unrest, by defending the obscene wealth of the unethical predators with more than their share of the wealth, you place yourself in the crossfire. I am sure you are aware that among the obscenely wealthy there are those who, unlike you, DO NOT pay their fair share in taxes but hide their wealth OFFSHORE.They are the targets. They are the bloodsucking leeches. You are just one of the misguided pawns who defend them. Why, I'm not sure. Shouldn't all Canadians be protesting those who leach money out of our country and undermine our economy? Eta: http://mobile.forbes.com/device/article.php?CALL_URL=http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2010/0719/opinions-taxation-tax-havens-banking-on-my-mind.html? Thus the rationale for "occupy wall street" ... and Bay Street and other centres of financial piracy globally. It is NOT about people who work hard and smart and pay their taxes: It's about the CRIMINALS who DON'T, and the CRIMINAL banking institutions that facilitate these CRIMES against the rest of the Canadian people.

I apologize for making that comment in this thread. It was said in the context of another thread re revolutions happening when income and power gaps are extreme. My service went down and I couldn't erase it. Though it may be relevant to the income and power gaps experienced by Aboriginal people in Canada, I am in no way suggesting that they would or should engage in violent revolution.

You disgust me Bob. Does Israel know that you represent it in this offensive manner? You do nothing to improve Israel's fast declining reputation.

I'm ok with stats but like most people (I think) economics baffles me. I think that's a large part of the problem: Our eyes glaze over and we leave it all up to politicians and the business interests they toady to and we let them take advantage of us. So ... Just researching some things of possible relevance to the question ... Why is the income gap growing in Canada? IE, HOW are the wealthiEST accumulating more and more of the wealth? http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_revenue_as_percentage_of_GDP How taxpayers with money offshore can come clean http://www.lawyersweekly.ca/index.php?section=article&articleid=1123 http://www.offshorelegal.org/offshore-banking/panama-offshore-banking/divorce-protect-your-money-offshore-from-your-cheating-ex-wife-or-ex-husband.html Protect your Money Panama Foundation and Bank Account How can I Access the Money in Panama Your account comes with a Visa Debit Card, which allows you to use the your onshore bank account. If you are worried about anyone noticing the money trail from Panama read the next section How can I send the Money to Panama without leaving a money trail

Or shut your stupid mouth. You are over the line. Now there is a truly anti-Jew remark on this board. Twit.

A "hobo" on the street doesn't have Trump's connections. I'm sure he had a few things left to pawn. (What an a$$,He really has no clue.) Ahhhh ... so you're not the 1percenters ... you're just the suckers they're coming after next.

I nominate this as understatement of the year!