Harper Announces $13.8 billion Budget Surplus

[Michael Bluth]

There is only one way out for the Conservatives at this point. To announce a massive tax cut, or package of tax cuts, in some form.

The upcoming Speech from the Throne cold be called the first 'election' speech of its kind.

Harper is comfortable with a fall election and the Speech will serve as the introduction of the party's platform to the electorate.

[capricorn]

There is only one way out for the Conservatives at this point. To announce a massive tax cut, or package of tax cuts, in some form.

MB, by saying "one way out' do you mean in order to force a non-confidence vote with the Throne speech?

The $750M interest saved on debt repayment will not get him there. What he needs to do is somehow bring in program cuts to increase the funds necessary for a substantial across the board tax cut.

[Michael Bluth]

The $750M interest saved on debt repayment will not get him there. What he needs to do is somehow bring in program cuts to increase the funds necessary for a substantial across the board tax cut.

That isn't necessary at all.

The law preventing spending of surpluses doesn't handcuff the Government from implementing tax cuts going forward.

[capricorn]

That isn't necessary at all.

The law preventing spending of surpluses doesn't handcuff the Government from implementing tax cuts going forward.

Goodie! Bring it on!

I like the way Lorne Gunter put it to Flaherty.

"Broad-based tax cuts, now, Mr. Flaherty"

....

"And no more “targeted” tax cuts. Lower personal income tax, or corporate income tax, or the GST or Employment Insurance premiums. Lower those taxes nearly everyone pays and which are the biggest brakes on economic growth."

http://communities.canada.com/nationalpost...r-flaherty.aspx

[jdobbin]

The $750M interest saved on debt repayment will not get him there. What he needs to do is somehow bring in program cuts to increase the funds necessary for a substantial across the board tax cut.

Flaherty already said no to a further GST cut in the next budget.

There are people all over on the right from the Canadian Taxpayers Federations to columnists from the Globe and Post pressing hard for major income and business tax cuts.

Harper in 2005 said that budget surpluses were a sign of fiscal mismanagement. Flaherty said he would never run such huge deficits. These quotes are coming back to haunt them on CBC and CTV news clips all day long today.

Even in these forums some people were saying the government would never reach the same mark as the Liberals did for budget surpluses.

It has to be obvious to a lot of people now that we are paying too much tax when surpluses grow to this size.

[Michael Bluth]

It has to be obvious to a lot of people now that we are paying too much tax when surpluses grow to this size.

Yes, absolutely.

The size of this deficit is not coming as a shock to the Conservatives.

They have a plan for serious tax cuts in the next Throne Speech. All the more reason the opposition will want to force an election. If they don't this round of tax cuts will be noticeable for all Canadians in their take home pay.

Those cuts will offer a vision for Canada as a highly competitive actor in the global marketplace. It will be compared to the NDPs vision of scandinavia North America.

Dion and the Liberals? What are the odds they have anything resembling a platform for the next election pieced together.

Not perfect conditions for the Conservatives, but as good as they are going to get.

[trex]

Yes, absolutely.

The size of this deficit is not coming as a shock to the Conservatives.

They have a plan for serious tax cuts in the next Throne Speech. All the more reason the opposition will want to force an election. If they don't this round of tax cuts will be noticeable for all Canadians in their take home pay.

Those cuts will offer a vision for Canada as a highly competitive actor in the global marketplace. It will be compared to the NDPs vision of scandinavia North America.

Dion and the Liberals? What are the odds they have anything resembling a platform for the next election pieced together.

Not perfect conditions for the Conservatives, but as good as they are going to get.

if the taxes created this surplus, its because of cuts to social programs. we should reinstate some of those programs. some of the money can be used to reduce health care wait lines. health care is a bottomless pit, i know but we are not providing it as well as we should in some areas, and it needs much better oversight to prevent abuses.

it seems we are gradually migrating more to an american style system, with lower tax and minimal social services. i'd rather pay my taxes knowing that the money is used for important things in the society. theres no denying we have been pretty prosperous over the past few decades, regardless of the fact we're taxed at a high level. we've done well even in comparison to the united states, where the trend is to working longer hours for both partners in a household, just to maintain the bottom line. at the same time, they dont have those benefits we do. se we've done very well, and we need to protect what we have. thats why all these cuts dont make sense

this proves we can afford it. we should continue doing it, provide better services and do it fairly, with more oversight. forget the bankers, invest in the people!

[GostHacked]

August1991

WTF? $725 million on $14 billion means a (nominal) interest rate of about 5.2%. IOW, the federal government is paying back debt at 5.2% by taxing Canadians who, for the most part, have mortgages with interest rates around 6%. This is fiscal madness.

No, paying that 14 billion against our total national debt, reduced the interest owed on the total national debt. Just like a house purchase. The more you throw down on it, the less your payments will be and better off you will be in the long run. You will not be paying as much interest, so you are saving money in the long run. The more money you pay off faster, then the interest you pay on it will be dramatically reduced. Otherwise, you could end up paying 2x what the house is worth by the time everything is payed off.

http://www.canadianeconomy.gc.ca/english/economy/

Our national debt as of 2006 was $481,499,000,000. -13 billion brings it to $478,499,000,000

I say throw it on the national debt.

Also the term Surplus here means that Canada did not spend all of it's allocated budget for that period. We are still overal in much debt. So there really is no surplus here.

[GostHacked]

Old Cold and Bold.

I must also ask you why you think our cities need rebuilding?

Some of the infrastructure in our oldest cities are in dire need of repair and or outright replacement. Montreal has sewers and water mains that are over 50, maybe 100 years old. Wood telephone pools last about 30 to 40 years then need replacing. When stuff is used, there is wear and tear, and sometimes, major overhauls need to be done.

Maybe I will take my statement back and say that the money needs to be poured into rebuilding old to ancient infrastucture in our larger older cities.

[jdobbin]

I say throw it on the national debt.

Also the term Surplus here means that Canada did not spend all of it's allocated budget for that period. We are still overal in much debt. So there really is no surplus here.

It will save the average Canadian $30 a year.

Debt payment is important. It should be paid for out of the budget. It shouldn't be paid from huge surpluses which indicate overtaxation.

[daniel]

Is anybody really surprised at this finding even after the same old claims of trick down economics, Free Trade, etc.

http://www.thestar.com/article/257217

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/s...e0-c6b01b0d220a

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/Art...tional/National

And a day after this finding is released, our "new" government continues to perpetrate the same old same old.

Edited September 28, 2007 by daniel

[M.Dancer]

Pay down the federal debt

Cut taxes

Increase spending

All of the above

[old_bold&cold]

The 14 billion is not all that it appears to be. Well yes it is a vast amount, but it is only 5 billion above what was predicted in the last budget. The CPC said they built in a 9 billion expected surplus into the budget so really this is only off by 5 billion. The events that have allowed it to grow could have just as easily caused other events where it could have been a shortfall. Times have been good for Canada and we have been growing higher and higher in the way we are seen by other world powers. That is because of sound economic practices. We have lead the world in many things, and yes we now probably can reduce the taxes of the people and business. It goes a long way to be able to say that we can do this and still maintan our social services and our foreign aid and still be leading the world economies. For that I am thankful. It has not all been only the recent efforts, but rather efforts over a longer time. But recent changes have given back to Canadians the things that were let go in the past. Our military was one such thing and it is now rebuilding and hopefully we will once agin be able to express our soveirgn rights in the north, and do so with pride.

[jdobbin]

The 14 billion is not all that it appears to be. Well yes it is a vast amount, but it is only 5 billion above what was predicted in the last budget. The CPC said they built in a 9 billion expected surplus into the budget so really this is only off by 5 billion. The events that have allowed it to grow could have just as easily caused other events where it could have been a shortfall.

This is all well and good but Harper said that having a surplus of around $13 billion was poor fiscal management. Flaherty said he would never have a surplus that big. Sounds like another broken election promise since these promises were made during the election.

You can watch the newsclips of Harper and Flaherty making those claims here: http://www.cbc.ca/national/latestbroadcast.html

They are 50% off in the predictions.

Edited September 28, 2007 by jdobbin

[fellowtraveller]

Not perfect conditions for the Conservatives, but as good as they are going to get.

Indeed. Dion is about half an inch away from getting backstabbed into retirement.

Duceppe is desperate to lead the Bloc into half the seats they have now, then he can quit.

Layton is strong, but the NDp will remain more or less irrelevant, mired in their traditional 4th place.

Big surplus, success in the Quebec byelections, facing another round of byelections where the Libs will win 3 out of 4......why wouldn't Harper engineer a non-confidence vote? All he has to do is something that will enrage the Libs into voting against him, and he has a few: Afghanistan, immediate Senate reform, big tax cuts.....

Tories have money, opportunity and weak opposition.

Election this fall.

[baby billy]

I voted for Harper and until now, I've been content with his fiscal philosophy.

However with this kind of surplus, I find it improper to "throw it all" towards the debt.

What I'd like to hear from our Prime Minister are the precise reasons for this............in detail. Miniscule tax cuts are hardley a good reason at this point in our time. Three or four billion could have been used to substantially reinforce our Arctic Sovereignty issues; more ice-breakers, submarines and Frigates to be exclusively deployed in our North West passage, not to mention economic development in the Arctic communities that need it most.

Use it or lose it.

Without a substancial pressence in our arctic waters..........the world powers will steal it from us. Make no mistake.......the Arctic IS OUR FUTURE AS A NATION.

---

EDIT:

This post was an opening post to a separate thread. It has now been merged with this currently active thread which deals with the same topic.

Edited October 4, 2007 by Charles Anthony
merged multiple thread

[August1991]

Without a substancial pressence in our arctic waters..........the world powers will steal it from us. Make no mistake.......the Arctic IS OUR FUTURE AS A NATION.

Oh gawd...

Let's throw a coupla billion bucks at godforsaken, frozen wasteland. Maybe we could do like the Americans and build a bridge or two:

A bridge to nowhere - Alaska's Gravina Island (population less than 50) will soon be connected to the megalopolis of Ketchikan (pop. 8,000) by a bridge nearly as long as the Golden Gate and higher than the Brooklyn Bridge. Alaska residents can thank Rep. Don Young, who just brought home $941 million worth of bacon.

Salon

And please change the thread title. We already have a thread about the surplus. You want us to blow taxpayer (meaning my) money on tilting at ice-covered windmills. If you want to spend your own money on the Arctic, I suggest you move there and hand out your cash in Tuktoyatuk.