Should Mohawk Warriors Be Accorded Respect

[AngusThermopyle]

Well, I started this thread because another one was drifting this way. I believe this is a subject worthy of discussion in its own thread.

My personal view is that no, they should not. They have not earned the title in any sense of the word. A true Military person acts with discipline and dignity, they don't strut, threaten and bully. These are the exact opposite actions of a true Military professional.

That doesn't even begin to touch upon the aspects of training, experience and knowledge required to be considered a "warrior" in the true sense of the word.

As an interesting aside, I've never heard a professional Military person refer to themselves as a warrior. I think if someone had we would have laughed them out of the room.

I stuck this in Provincial Politics because the Mohawks currently only practice their nonsense in two Provinces, Quebec and Ontario.

[scribblet]

I agree, they are nothing more than armed thugs.

[jennie]

What on earth would you two know about what it means to be a warrior?

http://sisis.nativeweb.org/mohawk/warrior1.html

Edited September 22, 2007 by jennie

[capricorn]

What on earth would you two know about what it means to be a warrior?

Jennie, so what is a "warrior"? Do you know?

[Posit]

I agree, they are nothing more than armed thugs.

Well... I suppose that at least they are participating in an action they agree with and they aren't coming home in body bags down the "Highway of (Dead) Heroes".....

However, if you want you have a ~real~ discussion about this instead of just some diaper-diving scraper then perhaps you can define what and who you think warriors are? Do you even know the people you are talking about or are you simply using media invective to yet again target Natives because you feel you are inferior?

Edited September 22, 2007 by Posit

[AngusThermopyle]

Well... I suppose that at least they are participating in an action they agree with and they aren't coming home in body bags down the "Highway of (Dead) Heroes".....

Yayyy! Posit speaks for people he doesn't know again, and makes another colossal assumption, again. Why would you assume our people in Afghanistan don't agree with what they are there for? Actually they overwhelmingly believe in what they are doing there.

perhaps you can define what and who you think warriors are?

Sure I can, thousands others can as well. I would venture to say that the majority of people who have served in established military forces could. A warrior is someone who has been extensively trained to kill, yet still retains the consciousness of self that will guide them upon the best course. A warrior has power over others by virtue of force, but does not abuse that power. A warrior sees no need to strut and bluster, why should they? They know who they are and what they can do.

A warrior has discipline, a sense of teamwork and co-ordination that enables them to achieve the objective they wish to achieve. A warrior can kill or show compassion, they do not try to intimidate and bully citizens. They perform their duties professionally. Above all they realize that by virtue of the choice they made, their life is secondary to that of others.

I hope that answers your question.

[geoffrey]

Should be respected as much as your next extortionist.

Edited September 22, 2007 by geoffrey

[jennie]

Angus I don't think you started this thread for discussion, it's just a biatchfest. yawn

[Posit]

Yayyy! Posit speaks for people he doesn't know again, and makes another colossal assumption, again. Why would you assume our people in Afghanistan don't agree with what they are there for? Actually they overwhelmingly believe in what they are doing there.

Sure I can, thousands others can as well. I would venture to say that the majority of people who have served in established military forces could. A warrior is someone who has been extensively trained to kill, yet still retains the consciousness of self that will guide them upon the best course. A warrior has power over others by virtue of force, but does not abuse that power. A warrior sees no need to strut and bluster, why should they? They know who they are and what they can do.

A warrior has discipline, a sense of teamwork and co-ordination that enables them to achieve the objective they wish to achieve. A warrior can kill or show compassion, they do not try to intimidate and bully citizens. They perform their duties professionally. Above all they realize that by virtue of the choice they made, their life is secondary to that of others.

I hope that answers your question.

For the most part you are wrong. What you described is a soldier - a trained killer - and it doesn't surprise me that you would miss the mark since the western world view is dominated by the "violence is solution" attitudes. A Mohawk Warrior is a father, a son, an uncle or a grandfather who steps up when his community is threatened. Most are without any formal training. They know what has to be done and aren't afraid to do it, even if it means they will be harmed. They are about defending their people and are not interested in attacking anyone. When the event that caused them to congeal is over, they will return home to their jobs and their families as if nothing had ever happened. A Mohawk warrior is just a man that cares enough to do something about it.

I believe this is where their tenacity comes from. (That and being raised by women with big ovaries...instead trying to prove their nuts.)

Edited September 22, 2007 by Posit

[noahbody]

They are about defending their people and are not interested in attacking anyone.

Ohhhh! They're Peacekeepers just like our military.

[bush_cheney2004]

For the most part you are wrong. What you described is a soldier - a trained killer - and it doesn't surprise me that you would miss the mark since the western world view is dominated by the "violence is solution" attitudes. A Mohawk Warrior is a father, a son, an uncle or a grandfather who steps up when his community is threatened. Most are without any formal training. They know what has to be done and aren't afraid to do it, even if it means they will be harmed. They are about defending their people and are not interested in attacking anyone. When the event that caused them to congeal is over, they will return home to their jobs and their families as if nothing had ever happened. A Mohawk warrior is just a man that cares enough to do something about it.

Guess again.....

That pact, called the Jay Treaty, formalized the long history of cross-border enlistment. Six hundred Nova Scotian Mi'kmaq fought with George Washington. A Canadian Mohawk was a cavalry lieutenant at the side of Lt. Col. George Custer at the massacre at Little Bighorn. Canadian Indians, a term they themselves still use, have fought as U.S. troops in every modern war.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...2500702_pf.html

[jennie]

I believe this is where their tenacity comes from. (That and being raised by women with big ovaries...instead trying to prove their nuts.)

[AngusThermopyle]

I believe the previous post was inspired by a lack of anything of real substance to add to the discussion.

[kengs333]

Any organization that identifies itself as some kind of "warrior society" or has any kind of para-military ethos that is meant to "protect," "defend," or do anything else on behalf of any group with sanction of the Government of Canada should be deemed a terrorist organization and dealt with accordingly.

edit:

this should read "without the sanction..."

Edited September 22, 2007 by kengs333

[Posit]

I agree. The Canadian Armed Forces, the RCMP and the OPP are all terrorist organizations.

A Mohawk Warrior is best described as a member of a community militia, raised to defend their territory but being farmers, and business people, husbands, fathers, sons and grandfathers most their lives.

[M.Dancer]

Mohawk warriors, like mafia soldiers, are due respect and 10% of the take.

[AngusThermopyle]

A Mohawk Warrior is best described as a member of a community militia, raised to defend their territory but being farmers, and business people, husbands, fathers, sons and grandfathers most their lives.

What a rosy view of reality you have. these guys are not doing what they do from a legitimate basis. Many of them travel up from New York everytime the new blockade of the week debuts.

It's an opportunity for them, they get to strut their stuff and play the aggressive warrior card, all whilst knowing they are perfectly safe and pretty much immune to prosecution. They are nothing more than thugs and as such why the hell should anyone respect them?

Mohawk Warrior Society. The name invokes and implies a Paramilitary organization, not just some Johny do goods valiantly defending their people and their sacred territory Their method is well documented by now, they are there merely to intimidate and use force against civilian residents of the town.

They are not worthy of respect. Military organizations respect each other for real reasons, not just because some bunch of guys in used combats think they are warriors and like to gang up on defenceless people. As has been stated before, they are thugs, nothing more. They have no legitimate mandate or command system.

[jennie]

What a rosy view of reality you have. these guys are not doing what they do from a legitimate basis. Many of them travel up from New York everytime the new blockade of the week debuts.

It's an opportunity for them, they get to strut their stuff and play the aggressive warrior card, all whilst knowing they are perfectly safe and pretty much immune to prosecution. They are nothing more than thugs and as such why the hell should anyone respect them?

Mohawk Warrior Society. The name invokes and implies a Paramilitary organization, not just some Johny do goods valiantly defending their people and their sacred territory Their method is well documented by now, they are there merely to intimidate and use force against civilian residents of the town.

They are not worthy of respect. Military organizations respect each other for real reasons, not just because some bunch of guys in used combats think they are warriors and like to gang up on defenceless people. As has been stated before, they are thugs, nothing more. They have no legitimate mandate or command system.

And you are qualified to make these judgments ... how?

Because what you have described here bears no resemblance to what I see, and I do see regularly.

I really don't think you have any knowledge at all about these things you spout off about.

[ScottSA]

And you are qualified to make these judgments ... how?

Because what you have described here bears no resemblance to what I see, and I do see regularly.

I really don't think you have any knowledge at all about these things you spout off about.

We've all seen it. We all know what this is about. Trying to dress up a bunch of occasionaly sober thugs in discarded camous and paint them as heroic "warriors" is just plain funny. They'd last about 5 minutes of hot firefight with a platoon of disciplined infantry before they turned tail and hid behind their girlfriends' skirts. They are nothing more than idiots who now have what they see as a viable excuse not to have a job.

[kengs333]

I agree. The Canadian Armed Forces, the RCMP and the OPP are all terrorist organizations.

Huh?

[jennie]

We've all seen it. We all know what this is about. Trying to dress up a bunch of occasionaly sober thugs in discarded camous and paint them as heroic "warriors" is just plain funny. They'd last about 5 minutes of hot firefight with a platoon of disciplined infantry before they turned tail and hid behind their girlfriends' skirts. They are nothing more than idiots who now have what they see as a viable excuse not to have a job.

Well you haven't "seen" much if you haven't noticed that many of the warriors are women.

The Clan Mothers and the women have responsibility for the land.

[kengs333]

We've all seen it. We all know what this is about. Trying to dress up a bunch of occasionaly sober thugs in discarded camous and paint them as heroic "warriors" is just plain funny. They'd last about 5 minutes of hot firefight with a platoon of disciplined infantry before they turned tail and hid behind their girlfriends' skirts. They are nothing more than idiots who now have what they see as a viable excuse not to have a job.

I think if we had access to the police records of the three youths being sought by the OPP and the nine arrested the other day, we'd probably have a lot of reading to do. One of the nine I believe is still being held on an outstanding gun charge.

And then there's that turkey last year who was arrested for assault and turned into a "warrior" upon his release when his supporters planted some sort of feather hat on his head. He claimed not to have had any interest in SN issues up until then and apparently had a lengthy criminal record, the most recent charge being dv for beating the crap out of his partner.

[kengs333]

Well you haven't "seen" much if you haven't noticed that many of the warriors are women.

The Clan Mothers and the women have responsibility for the land.

No wonder this situation is so screwed up.

Edited January 26, 2008 by kengs333

[ScottSA]

Well you haven't "seen" much if you haven't noticed that many of the warriors are women.

The Clan Mothers and the women have responsibility for the land.

I suppose next you'll claim that the feminist movement was started by precolumbian Alt-Amazonian squaws and Steinem learned it from them? Did the Indians invent cars too? Just wondering, you know, since they supposedly invented the US Constitution.

Anyway, back at the ranch, the presence of women warriors would cut the time from first bullet to "run away! run away!" down to seconds.

[Posit]

We've all seen it. We all know what this is about. Trying to dress up a bunch of occasionaly sober thugs in discarded camous and paint them as heroic "warriors" is just plain funny. They'd last about 5 minutes of hot firefight with a platoon of disciplined infantry before they turned tail and hid behind their girlfriends' skirts. They are nothing more than idiots who now have what they see as a viable excuse not to have a job.

Oh...and you mean like this soldier who pissed his pants?

Lasagna and Soldier

Little boy misfits.