Michael Bluth Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 So much for the Liberals having an easy go of it in Outremont. Link The Jewish organization says Coulon, a political scientist and former journalist, has a "well-documented anti-Israel bias," including sympathy for Hamas, that is "out of step with current Liberal policy," according to a statement released by the group. With a little over 10% of the riding being Jewish this is one riding where the Jewish vote can make a difference. So it does come down to Dion's strength as a leader after all. Will he pull the plug? Issue a strong statement of support for Coulon? Or just muddle through. Only time will tell... Quote No one has ever defeated the Liberals with a divided conservative family. - Hon. Jim Prentice
M.Dancer Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 In one opinion piece, dated Feb. 22, 2006, Coulon writes that Hamas isn't just a terrorist organization, but a social and political movement that won the Palestinian elections because of its commitment to fight corruption and help people — and the international community should not isolate it. So in other words, Hamas isn't just a political organization, but a criminal and terrorist movement that has the support of the Plaestinian people becasue of it's commitment to drive israel into the sea....... If Dion was a leader, which he ain't, he would repudiate the candidate. As it is the seat will probably go Bloc if the Allophone or Anglophone vote is withheld from the liberals. On the othehand, if Harper sends a clear and unambigous message to the voters of Outremont it could reverberate in other west end neighbourhoods like TMR, Cote St Luc and Hampstead. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Bonam Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 (edited) Seems to me that voters who care about a pro-Israeli stance in Canadian foreign policy would vote for the Conservatives regardless, as Harper has expressed strong support for Israel where the Liberals have offered only critiscism. Edited July 24, 2007 by Bonam Quote
M.Dancer Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 Seems to me that voters who care about a pro-Israeli stance in Canadian foreign policy would vote for the Conservatives regardless, as Harper has expressed strong support for Israel where the Liberals have offered only critiscism. Except in Montreal where Anglophones and Allophones tend to vote enmasse against the bloc.....the last time Montreal anglophones went conservative was for Mulroney. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Michael Bluth Posted July 24, 2007 Author Report Posted July 24, 2007 Could be the anglophones and allophones vote en masse for the NDP this go round. Quote No one has ever defeated the Liberals with a divided conservative family. - Hon. Jim Prentice
jdobbin Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 The Conservatives have chosen Gilles Duguay as their candidate. The by-election has to be called by Saturday. http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2007/07...4364668-cp.html The Conservative Party of Canada is putting its faith in a former diplomat to run in a federal byelection in the Montreal riding of Outremont.A Conservative party official says the party is set to announce Gilles Duguay, a former ambassador such countries as Morocco and Cameroon, as its candidate during a news conference on Wednesday. Quote
M.Dancer Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 Could be the anglophones and allophones vote en masse for the NDP this go round. The NDP in Quebec are a non entity. The Rhino party used to poll more votes than them. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
jdobbin Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 (edited) With a little over 10% of the riding being Jewish this is one riding where the Jewish vote can make a difference.So it does come down to Dion's strength as a leader after all. Will he pull the plug? Issue a strong statement of support for Coulon? Or just muddle through. Only time will tell... Coulon will remain as candidate unless something is actually pointed out as being wholly unacceptable. I haven't seen it in some of the commentary he's written. Of note, this was Le Devoir's reaction. http://www.ledevoir.com/2007/07/24/151236.html They said: Mais cette opinion n'est pas partagée par l'ensemble de la communauté juive. Le comité Québec-Israël trouve en effet exagérée l'interprétation du B'nai Brith et il estime que M. Coulon a tout à fait le droit d'être candidat libéral dans Outremont. Basically, B'Nai Brith doesn't speak for all the Jewish community. Edited July 24, 2007 by jdobbin Quote
jdobbin Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 On the othehand, if Harper sends a clear and unambigous message to the voters of Outremont it could reverberate in other west end neighbourhoods like TMR, Cote St Luc and Hampstead. You're assuming that a majority of Quebecers in those ridings don't share Coulon's view. We'll have to see how the former ambassador that Harper has appointed does. The Tories finished fourth place in the riding previously. Quote
jdobbin Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 Seems to me that voters who care about a pro-Israeli stance in Canadian foreign policy would vote for the Conservatives regardless, as Harper has expressed strong support for Israel where the Liberals have offered only critiscism. B'nai Brith has been hostile for some time to the Liberals. This, despite Dion, reaching out to the community for the last several months. I don't think the organization speaks for all Jews on political matters. I don't see B'Nai Brith endorsing the NDP, Liberals or the Bloq for that riding. In my opinion, they went Conservative a number of years back. Quote
jdobbin Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 (edited) Could be the anglophones and allophones vote en masse for the NDP this go round. I think you are going to see a backlash against B'Nai Brith quite frankly. They may have overplayed their hand with this one. Unless they can show a real anti-Israel stance, they are going to sound like they are unwilling to hear any analysis of the situation in the middle east. The NDP has been a third place and sometimes distant second place finisher in the riding. They aren't about to gain Jewish votes because Layton faces the same problems with B'nai Brith as Dion does. If there is going to be a flow to Mulcair, it will have to because of a different dynamic. Edited July 24, 2007 by jdobbin Quote
M.Dancer Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 On the othehand, if Harper sends a clear and unambigous message to the voters of Outremont it could reverberate in other west end neighbourhoods like TMR, Cote St Luc and Hampstead. You're assuming that a majority of Quebecers in those ridings don't share Coulon's view. We'll have to see how the former ambassador that Harper has appointed does. The Tories finished fourth place in the riding previously. Most anglophones have no trouble distinguishing terrorists even when they hide under a cloak of respectability. The only reason the Tories finished fourth is because the vote was spit between the Bloc and the libs. Taking the Libs out of the equation sends the anti bloc vote to the CPC. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
jdobbin Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 Most anglophones have no trouble distinguishing terrorists even when they hide under a cloak of respectability. The only reason the Tories finished fourth is because the vote was spit between the Bloc and the libs. Taking the Libs out of the equation sends the anti bloc vote to the CPC. Which terrorists are you referring to? Given Tory support is an anemic third place in Quebec, I don't think it is miraculously going to gain a seat in Montreal. Quote
M.Dancer Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 Which terrorists are you referring to? Do you follow the threads? In one opinion piece, dated Feb. 22, 2006, Coulon writes that Hamas isn't just a terrorist organization, but a social and political movement that won the Palestinian elections because of its commitment to fight corruption and help people — and the international community should not isolate it. Given that The liberals will have a hard enough time shaking the stink of corruption off themselves, having a terrorist symp as a candidate won't attact any disaffected voters back. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
jdobbin Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 Given that The liberals will have a hard enough time shaking the stink of corruption off themselves, having a terrorist symp as a candidate won't attact any disaffected voters back. Don't think I heard Coulon saying Hamas wasn't a terrorist organization. So is Fatah but Israel eventually negotiated and still do. The Canada-Israel Committee disagrees with B'Nair Brith. Your inflammatory remarks show that you are taking B'Nai Brith's word for Coulon's stance. I really think your remarks of linking Liberals to terrorist sympathizers is over the top. Quote
M.Dancer Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 Given that The liberals will have a hard enough time shaking the stink of corruption off themselves, having a terrorist symp as a candidate won't attact any disaffected voters back. Don't think I heard Coulon saying Hamas wasn't a terrorist organization. So is Fatah but Israel eventually negotiated and still do. The Canada-Israel Committee disagrees with B'Nair Brith. Your inflammatory remarks show that you are taking B'Nai Brith's word for Coulon's stance. I really think your remarks of linking Liberals to terrorist sympathizers is over the top. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Coulon is linked to terrorist symps, I'm saying he is one. It's now a matter of record. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
M.Dancer Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 The Canada-Israel Committee disagrees with B'Nair Brith. "He's written extensively about the Middle East, especially over the last year, and not infrequently his opinions are pretty hostile to Israel," said Shimon Fogel, chief executive officer of the Canada-Israel Committee. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/sto...ional/Politics/ *chortle* Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Michael Bluth Posted July 24, 2007 Author Report Posted July 24, 2007 Your inflammatory remarks show that you are taking B'Nai Brith's word for Coulon's stance. I really think your remarks of linking Liberals to terrorist sympathizers is over the top. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Coulon is linked to terrorist symps, I'm saying he is one. It's now a matter of record. Mo, seems to me you are taking B'Nai Brith's word and the word of the Canada - Israel Committee. The groups appear to be inline with one another. I would take the *inflammatory* line as an attempt at intimidation. Probably empty... Quote No one has ever defeated the Liberals with a divided conservative family. - Hon. Jim Prentice
M.Dancer Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 Your inflammatory remarks show that you are taking B'Nai Brith's word for Coulon's stance. I really think your remarks of linking Liberals to terrorist sympathizers is over the top. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Coulon is linked to terrorist symps, I'm saying he is one. It's now a matter of record. Mo, seems to me you are taking B'Nai Brith's word and the word of the Canada - Israel Committee. The groups appear to be inline with one another. I would take the *inflammatory* line as an attempt at intimidation. Probably empty... Gee...I thought the Canada Israel Commitee disagreed with the B'nai Brith...... Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Michael Bluth Posted July 24, 2007 Author Report Posted July 24, 2007 Gee...I thought the Canada Israel Commitee disagreed with the B'nai Brith...... Most people, when faced with evidence of being so massively wrong would own up to their error. Guess we ain't talking about most people, though... Quote No one has ever defeated the Liberals with a divided conservative family. - Hon. Jim Prentice
M.Dancer Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 Gee...I thought the Canada Israel Commitee disagreed with the B'nai Brith...... Most people, when faced with evidence of being so massively wrong would own up to their error. Guess we ain't talking about most people, though... I'm slow...you talking about me or Dobbin....if me, how? Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
jdobbin Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 (edited) http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/sto...ional/Politics/*chortle* And Le Devoir said that in the link I gave that Coulon should stand as a candidate because B'nai Brith doesn't speak for all Jews. http://www.ledevoir.com/2007/07/24/151236.html Mais cette opinion n'est pas partagée par l'ensemble de la communauté juive. Le comité Québec-Israël trouve en effet exagérée l'interprétation du B'nai Brith et il estime que M. Coulon a tout à fait le droit d'être candidat libéral dans Outremont. You need help with the translation? Edited July 24, 2007 by jdobbin Quote
jdobbin Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 Most people, when faced with evidence of being so massively wrong would own up to their error.Guess we ain't talking about most people, though... One paragraph below the one that was highlighted in the Globe and Mail: However, he said that his group is comfortable with the stands the federal Liberals have taken in the past eight months, and expects that Mr. Coulon will have to adjust his views to match party policy. When do I get my apology? The Canada-Israel Committee disagrees with B'nai Brith that Coulon should go. My link was back there from Le Devoir. You didn't read it, did you. Quote
jdobbin Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 (edited) Mo, seems to me you are taking B'Nai Brith's word and the word of the Canada - Israel Committee. The groups appear to be inline with one another.I would take the *inflammatory* line as an attempt at intimidation. Probably empty... Neither of you read the the link I gave. The Canada-Israel Committee is fine with Coulon remaining as a candidate. They disagree with the B'nai Brith and made a pointed remark that they don't speak for all Jews. Or do you disagree? Or is it that you can't read the French? Or do you need some interpretation to the Globe and Mail quote that Canada-Israel Committee is fine with Coulon as a candidate? Just what is it? Do you think that the Canada-Israel Committee is not fine with Coulon as Liberal candidate? Is that your contention? Edited July 24, 2007 by jdobbin Quote
jdobbin Posted July 24, 2007 Report Posted July 24, 2007 Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Coulon is linked to terrorist symps, I'm saying he is one. It's now a matter of record. If that is terrorist sympathizing then what is Conservative government resumption of aid to Palestinians? Isn't Fatah a terrorist organization still? Or did that change? http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/reuters/070723/...east_canada_col Quote
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