Harper hails opening of grand Hindu temple

[guyser]

PM Harper going to the opening of a Hindu Temple is innocent. But go ahead and prove me wrong.

Canada being an 'official multicutural country, I would say makes the 'separation of church and state' all that much more serious.

He went to an opening. Did Harper say that "this" should be the religion of Canada ? No he didnt, so stop trying to make something out of nothing. He was there for political expediancy.

"Condoning and allowing" what cultures to fight out what and where? Whatever are you talking about?

How about $40-million dollar temples for starters.

Oh , so your pissed about them spending their own money? Here read this...."The temple’s construction cost $40-million, donated by “worshippers or well-wishers” of the BAPS religion. More than 400 volunteers gave their services on site. "

Look, you make mountains out of molehills, you see things no one else sees , you blame Que for everything, well if it is not the "Blame the Charter du Jour" .

Your problem is that you see no difference between the federal Liberals and the province of Quebec.

Oopsie...not quite right. The Libs are dead dude. Didnt you get the memo? As for Quebes, they do what they have always done. You just want to make everything out to be their fault. Ya know....like the bridges and who pays?

If this were a $40M Catholic/Baptist Church/Synagogue .....what would you say?

Seems it is their money. Quite bitching about how people want to spend their own money and go mind your own business. Quick someone from Ontario is buying a coka cola in Que, go lambast them for destroying this country.

I would think my God would be extremely disappointed with that sort of materialistic extravagance. This is extremely condescending, especially relating to poor people of the world, with nothing more than the soil beneath their feet to worship and pray.

So, now we are competing with high price god's, worship, are we.

Oh how pious of you. Why not rant against the beautiful Catholic Churches we have, or the amazing Synagogues we have. Are you Catholic? My my, look what they have.

Off with their heads !

Edited July 24, 2007 by guyser

[NovaScotian]

Oh how pious of you. Why not rant against the beautiful Catholic Churches we have, or the amazing Synagogues we have. Are you Catholic? My my, look what they have.

Off with their heads !

QFT.

Anyway, Who cares. He is suppose to represent all Canadians. One day at a Hindu Temple is not a government endorsement of Hinduism. And I do not expect mass conversions to Hinduism either.

Edited July 24, 2007 by NovaScotian

[jazzer]

Talk about a ridiculous exaggeration.

[Renegade]

Since when did the federal government show any political leaning towards Christianity in recent times?

Er, when Paul Martin went to Pope John-Paul's funeral, was that too an irresponsible pandering toward religion?

The point is that Christianity being the majority, powerful, religion in Canada, governments of the past had no choice but to acknowledge it's existence and even acknowledge a few religious demands, that were utilized in schools, traditions, and for example, a short public prayer relating to certain events.

To-day the power of the federal government treats Christianity with a contempt never before displayed allowing minority religions to beat down Christian beliefs and now with the PM publicly promoting expensive temples of a minority faith. And worse still, allowing immigration to continue, from Islamic countries with no idea how to prevent the so called Islamic extremist fundamentalist from entering our country or for that matter are basically clueless relating to the actual percent of potential terrorist activity.

If Christanity is still the majority, why not flex their Christian voting power? Frankly if you think about what you are saying it makes no common sense. Why would a government which is pandering for votes alienate a majority which can give them the most votes to cater to a minority?

The country does have a national (peculiar to or characteristic of a particular nation) religion common with the majority of this country, Christianity.

So what? The percentage of Christians in Canada is only going down. Even if it wasn't should the prime minster only cater to the majority? If so he would only cater to Ontario and Que.

It may be majority Christian, but thankfully only a small minority are intolarant racists.

How can you possibly make such a nonsensical claim when Canada is a capitalistic totalitarian undemocratic regime by nature with the only democratic right being the right to vote for your so called representative (MP).

We are NOT all employed by the federal government, therefore government should reflect the right of the citizens of Canada to decide important decisions that affect ALL Canadians, a right we do not have.

If Canadians did have that right, you could be disappointed relating to the rights now granted by our federal government in comparison to the rights that would be ratified by Canadian citizens.

Until the time comes ALL Canadians are included in the decision making process of important political issues, you have no right labelling anyone racist in an undemocratic country that excludes the wishes of the citizens of Canada.

You take issue with my statement that the majority of of Canadians Christians are not intolerant racists??????

Would you be more satisified with my statement if I had said that the majority of Christians are intolerant racists???

Edited July 24, 2007 by Renegade

[mikedavid00]

The country doesn't have a religion

I wouldnl't say that.

Depends what you consider a 'country'. If you consider the country the people, and the majority are Christian, then you could say that it's a 'Christian' country. Which is what we are.

You can nit pick the English and usage of terms, but it's viable to say that this is a 'chritian' country. Kind of like how Pakistan is a 'muslim' country.

[Renegade]

Depends what you consider a 'country'. If you consider the country the people, and the majority are Christian, then you could say that it's a 'Christian' country. Which is what we are.

I meant the intangible state not the people. IMV it is fair to say "Canada is a country with a majority of Christians", it is not accurate to say "Canada is a Christian country". See my further response below.

You can nit pick the English and usage of terms, but it's viable to say that this is a 'chritian' country. Kind of like how Pakistan is a 'muslim' country.

No it is not like Pakistan at all. Pakistan is officially Islamic Republic of Pakistan. It as a state has made an official choice to be an Islamic state. Canada has made no such choice. If you believe it has, prove it, because I maintain that it is a secular state.

[uOttawaMan]

This is one reason why I'm agnostic.

[mikedavid00]

No it is not like Pakistan at all. Pakistan is officially Islamic Republic of Pakistan. It as a state has made an official choice to be an Islamic state. Canada has made no such choice. If you believe it has, prove it, because I maintain that it is a secular state.

I agree with what your saying. But it just depends on what a person considers a 'country'. Some my follow a mandate like 'multicultural' others may look past that and see what the common person is.

Ok, if you HAD to label the country as a religion, anyone would most likely say 'Christian'...

for the next 20 years or so when we officially become stone age.

[capricorn]

I have often read that Canada was created on the basis of Judeo-Christian principles. Perhaps this premise is changing, hence, so is the country. If I'm wrong, please someone enlighten me.

[mikedavid00]

I have often read that Canada was created on the basis of Judeo-Christian principles.

Yes everyone knows this. Of course the fight is on to change this. We need stone age principles here also and we shall fund them.

[Leafless]

Er, when Paul Martin went to Pope John-Paul's funeral, was that too an irresponsible pandering toward religion?

Er, no.

Representatives of most countries often attend funerals of influential people of other countries.

It is not an unknown practise to do this.

If Christanity is still the majority, why not flex their Christian voting power?

Christians have no party to flex their muscles to.

All federal parties accept the Charter and official multiculturalism.

The makes the political system in Canada dysfunctional, since the premiers ratified Trudeau's Charter, politicians must abide by it even if it discriminates, is undemocratic and is badly flawed.

Frankly if you think about what you are saying it makes no common sense. Why would a government which is pandering for votes alienate a majority which can give them the most votes to cater to a minority?

Hoe can you alienate the majority when all national federal parties accept the Charter and official multiculturalism. The only thing that separates the Conservatives and Liberals to-day is, ??????

Both parties are clones of each other due to the lack of democratic initiatives that should allow Canadians to be part of the decision making machinery relating to important issues in this country.

Political parties in Canada are currently bogged down in their own corruptness.

So what? The percentage of Christians in Canada is only going down. Even if it wasn't should the prime minster only cater to the majority? If so he would only cater to Ontario and Que.

There is NO majority anything in this country, relating to political demands.

The country spins on cultural ideologies, thanks to the magic of the federal liberals and Quebec and besides both parties are totaliatarian by nature.

You take issue with my statement that the majority of of Canadians Christians are not intolerant racists??????

Would you be more satisified with my statement if I had said that the majority of Christians are intolerant racists???

Taking advantage of a dysfunctional political system is no excuse to label anyone racist.

[Renegade]

Representatives of most countries often attend funerals of influential people of other countries.

It is not an unknown practise to do this.

Agreed, but it is also not an unknown practice for politicians to attend the opening of a significant religious edifice or even greet its visiting leaders.

Christians have no party to flex their muscles to.

Sure they do. Christian Heritage Party of Canada. Could it be that very few of the Christian majority actually supprt them?

Hoe can you alienate the majority when all national federal parties accept the Charter and official multiculturalism. The only thing that separates the Conservatives and Liberals to-day is, ??????

Both parties are clones of each other due to the lack of democratic initiatives that should allow Canadians to be part of the decision making machinery relating to important issues in this country.

You've got it backwards. The reason the Cons and Libs are so close on the political spectrum is because they adopt policies supported by the majority of voters. If they didn't then voters would abandon them just like they have abandoned other parties in the past. The popularity of the Cons and Libs over the CHP is proof that the majority has a choice and has chosen.

Taking advantage of a dysfunctional political system is no excuse to label anyone racist.

I beleive I distinctly said that most people aren't racist. Some people are. To deny it would show how blind you truly are.

It is interesting to me that you don't deny holding racist and intolarant views. Your repeated defense is to state that nobody has a right to accuse anyone else of racism.

I would submit that if you created a poll on this site and asked other posters their opinion on the views you have expressed, the overwhelming majority would judge your views as racist and intolerant. The question would be a simple Yes/No, "Do you believe the views expessed by Leafless in the various posts to be racist and intolerant?. I challenge you to do it and you will get an honest view of your positions which you yourself seem incapable of seeing.

Edited July 24, 2007 by Renegade

[Leafless]

Agreed, but it is also not an unknown practice for politicians to attend the opening of a significant religious edifice or even greet its visiting leaders.

Maybe you could provide a list of Canadian PM,s who officially attended the opening of significant religious buildings here in Canada?

Sure they do. Christian Heritage Party of Canada. Could it be that very few of the Christian majority actually supprt them?

Let's get our terminology straight.

When you speak of the Christian majority in Canada, you are talking about the majority 'White English speaking Canadian', who are not a fanatical group and with most who do not associate themselves with a non-mainstream party of this sort.

Face facts, the Federal Liberals and Quebec spun cultural webs around Canada's political working much in the same way as a fanatical religion but pertaining to culture.

So to-day what we basically have in Canada is French and foreign cultural fanaticism, controlled by the Federal Government, Quebec, and ethnic minorities who have basically obliterated White English Canada and its history and culture.

You've got it backwards. The reason the Cons and Libs are so close on the political spectrum is because they adopt policies supported by the majority of voters.

You know the Conservatives and Liberals are totalitarian political parties and do not allow referendums relating to majority support.

What majority support are you talking about, corrupt telephone polls.

Just because Canadian voters HAVE NO CHOICE but to vote for either of the mainstream federal political parties does not mean they support their policies.

It is interesting to me that you don't deny holding racist and intolarant views. Your repeated defense is to state that nobody has a right to accuse anyone else of racism.

I do not deny holding REASONABLE intolerant views.

And why shouldn't I, as this could simply be because of our current politcal parties being totally intolerant to the will of Canadians'.

Your racist accusations are nonsense.

[Renegade]

Maybe you could provide a list of Canadian PM,s who officially attended the opening of significant religious buildings here in Canada?

Sure. Please provide the list of buildings you consider "significant religious buildings".

When you speak of the Christian majority in Canada, you are talking about the majority 'White English speaking Canadian', who are not a fanatical group and with most who do not associate themselves with a non-mainstream party of this sort.

So you in your roundthebout way are saying that the CHP is radical? Funny they seem to have positions on issues pretty similar to yours CHP Platform

You know the Conservatives and Liberals are totalitarian political parties and do not allow referendums relating to majority support.

What majority support are you talking about, corrupt telephone polls.

There is only one poll that matters and that is the one that takes place on election day. The fact that the Cons or Libs have been in voted in for EVERY election in memory is sufficient backup for my statement.

Just because Canadian voters HAVE NO CHOICE but to vote for either of the mainstream federal political parties does not mean they support their policies.

BS. Canadians always have a choice. No party exactly fits the views of any individual voter. As individuals we are forced t make a choice of whichever is the best fit. The Great Christian Majority is no different than the rest of the voters in that regard.

I do not deny holding REASONABLE intolerant views.

I see, so you admit intolerance but defend it by saying intolerance is warranted.

And why shouldn't I, as this could simply be because of our current politcal parties being totally intolerant to the will of Canadians'.

You do not show EVER any evidence of what the "will of Canadians" is, you simply assume the will of Canadians is he same as your own, and somehow they have been bamboozled into voting aginst their will.

Your racist accusations are nonsense.

Ignored my challenge, didnt you? I don't blame you. If I were you I wouldn't like the answer either.

[Leafless]

Sure. Please provide the list of buildings you consider "significant religious buildings".

I don't have a list nor consider any Christian religious buildings any more significant from a religious point of view.

All are simply places of worship.

Relating to this topic it is the Hindu's placing great dollar value on their religious building with Harper officiating the opening.

Anyways it is you who said: "Agreed, but it is also not an unknown practice for politicians to attend the opening of a significant religious edifice or even greet its visiting leaders."

So, where is your list of religious buildings officiated by Canadian PM's?

So you in your roundthebout way are saying that the CHP is radical? Funny they seem to have positions on issues pretty similar to yours CHP Platform

Positions and issues are the task of the the government of the day, but they are excluding the 'will of Canadians' and you can transform that to the will of the White English speaking Canadian who just happens to be the majority,

Is that not why we have MP representation to obtain majority concerns and issues from Canadians at large and do something about these concerns and issues?

There is only one poll that matters and that is the one that takes place on election day. The fact that the Cons or Libs have been in voted in for EVERY election in memory is sufficient backup for my statement.

Both the Liberal and Conservatives are in collusion with each other by default.

Canadian voters are trapped by the totalitarian aspect of Canadian politics, they have no real choice in a corrupt system.

You do not show EVER any evidence of what the "will of Canadians" is, you simply assume the will of Canadians is he same as your own, and somehow they have been bamboozled into voting aginst their will.

How can I have evidence in a dictatorship.

Who knows what the 'will of Canadians is', they have NEVER had the chance to express their views in referendums and have been undemocratically oppressed politically, by totaltitarian practices.

Ignored my challenge, didnt you? I don't blame you. If I were you I wouldn't like the answer either.

The results would be tainted, as I believe minorities who dominate this site with faulty minority logic, would not be compatible with majority views and concerns, of which we lack on this site.

This is the problem when reverse discrimination is discounted, minorities become the actual bigots and racist.

[guyser]

I don't have a list nor consider any Christian religious buildings any more significant from a religious point of view.

All are simply places of worship.

As is the Hindu Temple.

Relating to this topic it is the Hindu's placing great dollar value on their religious building with Harper officiating the opening.

The famous goal post mover strikes again. Go read your original post that started this thread. You will see no mention of the money except in passing. Yours was a question pertaining to "should this be right" .

Ahh, but now it is all about the money because, well, because you are sinking like a stone on this one. The muck is up to your neck , so a prudent man would stop.

But keep on trucking on should you wish.

Anyways it is you who said: "Agreed, but it is also not an unknown practice for politicians to attend the opening of a significant religious edifice or even greet its visiting leaders."

So, where is your list of religious buildings officiated by Canadian PM's?

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/special/att..._0922_A9_1.html

For one.....

Actually I realize it is not an opening. But the horror of a PM in a Mosque must put you off no end.

The results would be tainted, as I believe minorities who dominate this site with faulty minority logic, would not be compatible with majority views and concerns, of which we lack on this site.

Here , let me re-post this for you without the doublespeak. "Minorities are not as smart as me, they are faulty in their thinking because they are minorities . I know this as I have direct access to all the posters on this site and can check what ethnicity they are."

Hey naked tree , you pegged me so far wrong the last time as to my ethnicity it was pretty funny.Now you can comment on all the people on this site.

Delusions of grandeur , or highly intolerant. I will go with saying you are highly intolerant bordering on paranoia.

This is the problem when reverse discrimination is discounted, minorities become the actual bigots and racist.

....speaking of bigots and racist..........

Actually, I am pretty sure you are up to just below your chin.Time to think about getting out.

Edited July 24, 2007 by guyser

[canadoattitude]

we should probably burnt he temple down just to show our dissaproval of harper showing up. he's a race traitor and he should burn in hell.

sounds stupid now doesn't it?

[Leafless]

As is the Hindu Temple.

You are mocking my previous post smart ass. That discussion was between myself and Renegade. Your ad-libbing is unwelcome.

The famous goal post mover strikes again. Go read your original post that started this thread. You will see no mention of the money except in passing. Yours was a question pertaining to "should this be right" .

The goal post were never moved, but the topic changed direction. Maybe if you read through you would have noticed.

Stop ruining threads with your assholic comments.

Ahh, but now it is all about the money because, well, because you are sinking like a stone on this one. The muck is up to your neck , so a prudent man would stop.

But keep on trucking on should you wish.

Here come dah judge, here come dah judge, order in the courtroom, here come dah judge, in his own twisted mind.

Actually I realize it is not an opening. But the horror of a PM in a Mosque must put you off no end.

No, it was the PM pandering for votes in a holy temple that is the killer.

Here , let me re-post this for you without the doublespeak. "Minorities are not as smart as me, they are faulty in their thinking because they are minorities . I know this as I have direct access to all the posters on this site and can check what ethnicity they are."

You sound like a racist instigator. Your the type I am talking about.

....speaking of bigots and racist..........

Actually, I am pretty sure you are up to just below your chin.Time to think about getting out.

Say what is on your mind, you nobody coward.

[Leafless]

we should probably burnt he temple down just to show our dissaproval of harper showing up. he's a race traitor and he should burn in hell.

sounds stupid now doesn't it?

Your the one who said it, instigator.

[guyser]

You are mocking my previous post smart ass. That discussion was between myself and Renegade. Your ad-libbing is unwelcome.

Mocking ? Nah, just showing the folly of your arguement.

The goal post were never moved, but the topic changed direction. Maybe if you read through you would have noticed.

Stop ruining threads with your assholic comments.

Actually I did read through the thread.

Whats become apparent is that your inability to make sense of your "outrage" , mostly because it is unwarranted and without merit.

The PM goes to a Temple opening, cuts a ribbon, presumably has a slice of cake and leaves after the photo ops. Hmm , I am guessing most see that as....well going for an opening, having a slice of cake and photos, but nope, some....can you believ this..?....some want to see outrage that the PM is trying to change this country to Hindu.

Guess my ---------- comments hitting to close to the truth? Yup, guess so.

Actually I realize it is not an opening. But the horror of a PM in a Mosque must put you off no end.

No, it was the PM pandering for votes in a holy temple that is the killer.

Oh yeah as if you believe that. Nice try. What bothers you is the PM being in a Hindu Temple, but your outrage would not be voiced if he were in a Synagogue or Mosque and you know it.

Was your outrage expressed when the PM went to these? A lighting of a mennorah? Oh my , advocating we all become Jewish, using your logic leap ?

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/stor...s_name=&no_ads=

http://www.canada.com/national/features/as...af-5ce2a9e8e4f8

The point is that the PM and the PMO is one huge PR machine. Be it a Mosque, Temple, a new McDonalds , a new business opening .

Afterall Leafless , they did spend $40M and the spin off from that is enormous and benefits our tax base. If anyone short of a terrorist has $40M to spend , you can bet the PM will try to be there.

You sound like a racist instigator. Your the type I am talking about.

Not at all Leafless. I goad no one . Some just get tripped up. So......

....speaking of bigots and racist..........

Actually, I am pretty sure you are up to just below your chin.Time to think about getting out.

Say what is on your mind, you nobody coward.

Your feigned outrage at the most ridiculous things says it all.

Up to the nose now.....

But really, wheres the love?

Edited July 25, 2007 by guyser

[Renegade]

Relating to this topic it is the Hindu's placing great dollar value on their religious building with Harper officiating the opening.

No, nothing in the stories indicate it is the Hindus bragging about the dollar value of the building. It is simply the media who have reported it. I suspect the dollar value is low and has been kept low due to the uncompensated work of volunteers.

Anyways it is you who said: "Agreed, but it is also not an unknown practice for politicians to attend the opening of a significant religious edifice or even greet its visiting leaders."

So, where is your list of religious buildings officiated by Canadian PM's?

First, I didn't restrict the behaviour to Canadian PMs. I said politicians.

Second, I'll do even better. I will show you that politicians much more powerful than Harper routinely participate in religious ceremonies and even seem to endorse religious scripture. All of this without much fuss from the public at large.

President Bush Hosts Iftaar Dinner

"Ramadan commemorates the revelation of God's word in the Holy Koran to the prophet Mohammad" - President Bush

President Commemorates Eid al-Fitr

Even PM Chretien welcomed Pope John-Paul when he came to Toronto in 2002.

Positions and issues are the task of the the government of the day, but they are excluding the 'will of Canadians' and you can transform that to the will of the White English speaking Canadian who just happens to be the majority,

How do you know they are excluding the "will of Canadians" when below you admit that you don't even know what the "will of Canadians" is (" Who knows what the 'will of Canadians is',")

Is that not why we have MP representation to obtain majority concerns and issues from Canadians at large and do something about these concerns and issues?

Of course, and you are free to call your MP and feed them your views, as intolerant as they may be, and if you are not satisified with your MP's response or actions you are free not to support them on election day. If enough of your majority friends agree with you, your riding can have a new MP. Like it or not, that's how it works.

Both the Liberal and Conservatives are in collusion with each other by default.

Canadian voters are trapped by the totalitarian aspect of Canadian politics, they have no real choice in a corrupt system.

You have stated this over and over at nausem but offer zero proof.

How can I have evidence in a dictatorship.

No, of course you can't have any such evidence. Did it occur to you that the reason you don't have any evidience is because none exist.

Who knows what the 'will of Canadians is', they have NEVER had the chance to express their views in referendums and have been undemocratically oppressed politically, by totaltitarian practices.

At least you have admitted that you do not know what the "will of Canadians" is. It seems to me hollow that you complain that the will of the majority is not being followed when you don't even know what it is.

The results would be tainted, as I believe minorities who dominate this site with faulty minority logic, would not be compatible with majority views and concerns, of which we lack on this site.

This is the problem when reverse discrimination is discounted, minorities become the actual bigots and racist.

Ah yes, the conspiracy theories abound. So if I understand your position, all government parties are colluding to keep white Christian Canadians down, and you have no evidence to prove this because their dictatorship is holding you down, and you can't even ask if you position is reasonable because the forum to ask has been taken over by racist and bigoted minorities with faulty logic. Yep, makes perfect sense to me now.

[mikedavid00]

Who knows what the 'will of Canadians is', they have NEVER had the chance to express their views in referendums and have been undemocratically oppressed politically, by totaltitarian practices.

I've read some good lines on the forum, but this one describes the greater situation in one sentance.

This is the greatest sentance ever written on this forum IMO.

[xul]

I think Mr.Harper just did his job. Every politician whichever the political party he is at his position will do this, or his just followed others.

Let's assume that there were not any minorities and immigrants in Canada but only a majority, most of them are Christian. Then some members of the majority separated form the mainstream and created their own religion and set up a new temple. Now they invites their own nation's PM to their ceremony. Will PM refuse them?

These Indian are Canadian citizens. So they invited their PM to their ceremony and their PM accepted the invite are reasonable, unless Canada PM really refuses to attend any christian ceremony.

Of course, I guess Mr. Harper was fully awared that he will benefit from these Indian voters with attending the ceremony. But this seems his job too.

Edited July 25, 2007 by xul

[mikedavid00]

I think Mr.Harper just did his job.

Is it the job of the PM to attend these events and provide funding to religious churches? Is that what a PM is supposed to do? No. That is what the PM has become to benefit his party votes which he does not have the right to do.

Goverment governs and passes legislation. Giving money to minority groups in order to get votes was never part of any deal and was certainly something that was never done a long time ago.

[guyser]

Is it the job of the PM to attend these events and provide funding to religious churches?

When, and where, did this occur? Did it happen at the Hindu Temple?