Manufacturing--what is Harper doing about this?

[Topaz]

Manufacturing in this country is going down the tubes and I want to know what the PM is going to do about it. In Windsor On. alone, they now have the highest unemployment in the country cause by the rules and laws the government does or doesn't make!! 11,000 manufacturing jobs have been lost there and the province can only do so much when the rules and laws the Feds. make or don't make. The only thing the Cons are doing is holding talks with S.Korea about bring their autos in. I'm sure one of the member of the Cons, who is a car dealer, who sells this auto, would be on cloud nine about this!

[M.Dancer]

Manufacturing in this country is going down the tubes and I want to know what the PM is going to do about it. In Windsor On. alone, they now have the highest unemployment in the country cause by the rules and laws the government does or doesn't make!! 11,000 manufacturing jobs have been lost there and the province can only do so much when the rules and laws the Feds. make or don't make. The only thing the Cons are doing is holding talks with S.Korea about bring their autos in. I'm sure one of the member of the Cons, who is a car dealer, who sells this auto, would be on cloud nine about this!

Shouldn't the sector be the responsibility of those who own the sector? Like make better products at lower prices than the imports? Or at very least, make products that are in demand that aren't being made on foriegn soil?

[B. Max]

In Windsor On. alone, they now have the highest unemployment in the country cause by the rules and laws the government does or doesn't make!! 11,000 manufacturing jobs have been lost there and the province can only do so much when the rules and laws the Feds.

It's gona get a lot worse.

[Charles Anthony]

Manufacturing in this country is going down the tubes and I want to know what the PM is going to do about it.

I want the PM to do nothing about it.

What do YOU propose he does about it?

[margrace]

Manufacturing in this country is going down the tubes and I want to know what the PM is going to do about it.

I want the PM to do nothing about it.

What do YOU propose he does about it?

The obvious answer is to buy Canadian. But you can't anymore. All the talk on the environmnet sites fits in very well with this. I do believe we have to do something soon about the environment, on the other hand who is going to buy the cars to use the gas and oil if no one has a job.

[PolyNewbie]

Lyndon LaRouche has a lot to say about the manufactering capability of a country and its economy. He has MP3's on his web site about economics that can be listened to for free.

LaRouche was demonized by the corporate media and actually jailed by the Bush administration (GHW Bush) which gives him loads of credibility alone in my mind.

A countries true wealth is in its natural resources and manufactering capability. One way the globalists are destroying the nation state is to implement free trade and destroy the manufactering capability. This dissolves the nation state and its protections that it provides its citizens. This helps puts us toward a world corporate (fascist) system where individuals become units of production and have no more rights than a hammer in a tool box.

LaRouche was labeled and demonized as a fascist by the corporate media who in itself is working in concert with the corporations to implement a fascist state and implement feudalism as a world government. This transition may encounter resistance so they are building prison camps all over the country - every international banker controlled country on the earth. They are at war with the countries that will not allow the IMF come in and control their currency.

[Charles Anthony]

LaRouche was labeled and demonized as a fascist by the corporate media who in itself is working in concert with the corporations to implement a fascist state and implement feudalism as a world government. This transition may encounter resistance so they are building prison camps all over

Enough.

Lyndon LaRouche may have suffered unfair incarceration -- I will not say. However, he certainly advocates state protectionism for certain sectors of the economy but not others. Morally, he is no better than the statists he opposes.

Anti-globalists would do better to oppose state privilege or subsidization of the transportation sector if they want to be logically consistent.

[geoffrey]

Unions and years of government subsidy... that's how Ontario's manufacturing sector got where it is today. Pooring more money on it won't help the solution, just postpone the inevitable.

We can't compete anymore because the government used to reward inefficency with free bailout after free bailout. Too far behind now to ever catch up... look at how far ahead the Japanese and even the Europeans are in automaking. I'd give up and move on. Canadian manufacturing was killed by the same mindset that believes something inefficent needs to be saved.

I'd never buy a product because it was made in Canada alone. Why bother? It rewards poor products. We all need to start buying foreign when it's high quality/cheaper. Then Canadian companies will be forced to become more efficent... or they'll just die off which is sad but necessary.

[M.Dancer]

Unions and years of government subsidy... that's how Ontario's manufacturing sector got where it is today. Pooring more money on it won't help the solution, just postpone the inevitable.

We can't compete anymore because the government used to reward inefficency with free bailout after free bailout. Too far behind now to ever catch up... look at how far ahead the Japanese and even the Europeans are in automaking. I'd give up and move on. Canadian manufacturing was killed by the same mindset that believes something inefficent needs to be saved.

I'd never buy a product because it was made in Canada alone. Why bother? It rewards poor products. We all need to start buying foreign when it's high quality/cheaper. Then Canadian companies will be forced to become more efficent... or they'll just die off which is sad but necessary.

On the otherhand, someof the best Japanese cars in the world are made in Cambridge and Alliston Ontario....by Ontario workers, Canadian engineers.......

[Canuck E Stan]

In Windsor On. alone, they now have the highest unemployment in the country cause by the rules and laws the government does or doesn't make!!

Toyotas are made in Ontario.They are building more plants to build more cars.The plants are in over-time mode to get the cars out faster.Ever stop to wonder why?

We laughed at the econo boxes the Japanese built while we drove our SUV's and other gas guzzling, living room on wheels vehicles.Now with a concern for gas prices we change our driving habits and don't want these gas guzzler vehicles anymore.

And it's now the fault of government? Give me a break.

If anyone should be blamed it's the auto sector itself.

Auto companies went for the big bucks for short term gain.

They thought they knew the consumer market,but they didn't,they blew it and now it's costing them big time.

Any other business that doesn't know their target market goes out of business,why not the domestic car market.

My heart bleeds for the $36 an hour auto worker, but they know this is how the industry works. Maybe another line of work would suit them better.

The auto industry goes up and down all the time.Overtime one day because of high demand,no work the next because no one buys their product.

Rules brought Toyota and Honda to Canada because they saw the demand, and with other foreign car makers it may be the same.

When you're a one industry town like Windsor,expect these ups and downs.

If you want to help Windsor,go and buy a gas guzzling vehicle made there,but don't ask the taxpayers to bail out an industry that doesn't have the right product at the right time.

FYI Read this the other day, 20%-23% of Canadians buy a new vehicle EVERY year.

[M.Dancer]

FYI Read this the other day, 20%-23% of Canadians buy a new vehicle EVERY year.

Why?

[DFCaper]

Windsor is a strong CAW town, and that's what is killing it. Nobody wants to setup a shop SW of London since a union is only months away at any time. Otherwise Canada is one of the most efficient and highest quality places to manufacture products. We just can't compete with foreign wages. And Europeans are losing there manufacturing to the 3rd world as well, protectionism is the only thing that is slowing the bleeding. I guess that is what Topaz wants.

I'm not sure if anything can save manufacturing in Canada long term. Unless transportation costs go up.

[geoffrey]

On the otherhand, someof the best Japanese cars in the world are made in Cambridge and Alliston Ontario....by Ontario workers, Canadian engineers.......

Agreed. You'll find that they use much more efficient methods. Somthing the automakers have never had to do because Ottawa bails them out.

[Canuck E Stan]

On the otherhand, someof the best Japanese cars in the world are made in Cambridge and Alliston Ontario....by Ontario workers, Canadian engineers.......

Agreed. You'll find that they use much more efficient methods. Something the automakers have never had to do because Ottawa bails them out.

And what would these much,more ,efficient methods be?

[geoffrey]

And what would these much,more ,efficient methods be?

I'm not an engineer, I don't know how their methods of production are cheaper. But if you compare financial statements for Honda versus GM, you'll notice that Honda hit an operating margin of 8% in '06, GM had a massive operating loss of over a billion.

Honda's operations are clearly more efficient. They also obviously hit a much higher return on assets, and on equity (considering GM's and Fords were both negative).

Alot of this may be labour, but that's one key element. GM may need to shut down the union controlled business model they have if they wish to be successul. Honda employees are just as happy, they've been named a top employer, and they don't have a union. Unions are proving themselves to be an inefficient way of doing business now, much of that unionized labour is going to be gone when they have effectively shut down the company.

Interesting hey.

[M.Dancer]

And what would these much,more ,efficient methods be?

I'm not an engineer, I don't know how their methods of production are cheaper. But if you compare financial statements for Honda versus GM, you'll notice that Honda hit an operating margin of 8% in '06, GM had a massive operating loss of over a billion.

Honda's operations are clearly more efficient. They also obviously hit a much higher return on assets, and on equity (considering GM's and Fords were both negative).

Alot of this may be labour, but that's one key element. GM may need to shut down the union controlled business model they have if they wish to be successul. Honda employees are just as happy, they've been named a top employer, and they don't have a union. Unions are proving themselves to be an inefficient way of doing business now, much of that unionized labour is going to be gone when they have effectively shut down the company.

Interesting hey.

The pay difference between a toyota worker and a ford worker is insignificant. The big differenes are the advanced use of robotics, employee morale and corporate human resource philosophy.

[Canuck E Stan]

The pay difference between a toyota worker and a ford worker is insignificant. The big differenes are the advanced use of robotics, employee morale and corporate human resource philosophy.

How insignificant is the pay?

I always thought all the companies had advanced robotics, why is Toyota's better?

Employee morale?,do you know of anyone working at Toyota.Why is it better?

What is Toyota's human resources philosophy? How is it different than the Big Three and why better?

I'm not looking for an arguement,I'm just interested.

I can't seem to find any of this stuff on the 'Net.

[M.Dancer]

The pay difference between a toyota worker and a ford worker is insignificant. The big differenes are the advanced use of robotics, employee morale and corporate human resource philosophy.

How insignificant is the pay?

I always thought all the companies had advanced robotics, why is Toyota's better?

Employee morale?,do you know of anyone working at Toyota.Why is it better?

What is Toyota's human resources philosophy? How is it different than the Big Three and why better?

I'm not looking for an arguement,I'm just interested.

I can't seem to find any of this stuff on the 'Net.

Toyota pays slightly more.....

My sister in law is an engineer at the cambridge plant.

Japanese manufacturerers pioneered robotics....

The Japanese philosophy is that workers are valued assets, and they have a paternal attitude which you either hate or love...they will go so far as to send a relationship therapist to see an employee who is having marital problems.........

http://www.leftlanenews.com/report-uaw-los...-advantage.html

[blueblood]

The pay difference between a toyota worker and a ford worker is insignificant. The big differenes are the advanced use of robotics, employee morale and corporate human resource philosophy.

How insignificant is the pay?

I always thought all the companies had advanced robotics, why is Toyota's better?

Employee morale?,do you know of anyone working at Toyota.Why is it better?

What is Toyota's human resources philosophy? How is it different than the Big Three and why better?

I'm not looking for an arguement,I'm just interested.

I can't seem to find any of this stuff on the 'Net.

Toyota pays slightly more.....

My sister in law is an engineer at the cambridge plant.

Japanese manufacturerers pioneered robotics....

The Japanese philosophy is that workers are valued assets, and they have a paternal attitude which you either hate or love...they will go so far as to send a relationship therapist to see an employee who is having marital problems.........

http://www.leftlanenews.com/report-uaw-los...-advantage.html

Boy it's hard to say a unionized outfit is better when stuff like that is going on...

[guyser]

The big three (domestic) are and have been saddled with expensive mistakes from the past that Honda Toyota et al do not.

Something like $2300 of every car made by Detroit is for healthcare, retirement funds and other uneccesary perks.

[M.Dancer]

The big three (domestic) are and have been saddled with expensive mistakes from the past that Honda Toyota et al do not.

Something like $2300 of every car made by Detroit is for healthcare, retirement funds and other uneccesary perks.

Toyota and Honda pay those too. They are far from unnecessary...as it is quite hard to build cars without workers....

[Riverwind]

Toyota and Honda pay those too. They are far from unnecessary...as it is quite hard to build cars without workers....

Honda and Toyota don't pay benefits to workers who were laid off/retired decades ago. Honda and Toyota are also not forced to keep workers they don't need. If they want to outsource part of the production they can do it and have no obligation to keep the existing workers on the payroll if they cannot be reassigned.

[M.Dancer]

Toyota and Honda pay those too. They are far from unnecessary...as it is quite hard to build cars without workers....

Honda and Toyota don't pay benefits to workers who were laid off/retired decades ago. Honda and Toyota are also not forced to keep workers they don't need. If they want to outsource part of the production they can do it and have no obligation to keep the existing workers on the payroll if they cannot be reassigned.

I suppose then that their retirement packages are figments of the imagination?.....but lets get back to those people who were laid off decades ago?

When exactly did the first Toyopta and Honda plant open up in North America?

[Riverwind]

When exactly did the first Toyopta and Honda plant open up in North America?

That is my point. The Big Three have been operating for decades and have downsized many times. This means the number of retired/laid off workers collecting benefits is extremely large. The Japanese makers don't have that legacy because they have not been around long enough and they have not been forced to downsize.

If you look at GM financial report it becomes clear than GM is primarily a finance company and health insurance provider. Making cars is a side operation.

[geoffrey]

If you look at GM financial report it becomes clear than GM is primarily a finance company and health insurance provider. Making cars is a side operation.

Your not mistaken by that analysis. It's not sustainable though, GM will eventually meet it's end. You can't run an operating loss for the better part of a decade.